Mini Normal 2119 [game over]

[Iconeum]

I'm sorry for not getting there, Micc. There's a bunch of reasons why, some of which are blatantly wrong and some that I still think: yeah i'd probably do this again

I really enjoyed playing with you and everyone tho.

[Alisae]

ok i win

[Alisae]

btw Micc, if you haven't caught up with the dead PT yet.

Full setup when it comes ot things you don't know
icon ofc was a tracker/follower

mena was a 1-shot strongman
encrypter was informed of a roleblocker
doc was informed of a cop

cop was informed of a doc

[Iconeum]

Let's all blame Datisi for forcing her menal!townread upon us all

[Alisae]

can't wait to begin the hazing ritual!

[the worst]

grats scumteam. thanks for playing everyone.

there's a tonne of general commentary about Things That Went Wrong in the dead pt. if you have any specific questions which aren't aired there, please @ me.

in short
this was a fun game to watch

there were some really solid mechanical plays and really interesting misplays
this setup was Complicated - huge s/o to MathBlade for basically guessing 75%+ of it - and the suggestion to just solve based off reads was almost completely optimal

i kinda thought town would win after micc was 1) very towny, 2) inno'd by ico who held the hammer, but, i'm realistically even happier that the setup was mysterious enough that ico didn't realise he had an inno and people just dropped mechsolving

[bji]

Well I thought this town was actually very good and scum win feels a little unjustified to me. I feel that I played pretty much the worst scum game I have ever played. But part of that was that it was not easy to shake this town. So many good town players it wasn't even possible to take out enough of them to not leave strong town players in 3p LYLO. I thoroughly enjoyed the game despite feeling like it was almost hopeless sometimes. You should read the scum thread it's like a tale of woe and constant gnashing of teeth in there. I also really appreciated how civil and good natured everyone was (except for UP).

[bji]

Which is not to take anything away from Menalque who was a great scum partner and really helped me through a lot of self doubt and also played well enough to bring home the win. I really hope Menalque is OK. Get well soon man.

[bji]

Also thanks to Ceejay/Bugs/Chem for their contributions to the win!

[bji]

I'm not going to try to take credit for Menalque's final NK and final day play but here was my final thoughts in scum pt about why to kill Math:

"I think probably Icon/Micc is better for you. Ico might be convinced by emotion, all of you seem to just love Datisi for some reason, and Ico might just want to believe Datisi's read on you. You can probably find more things to scum read about Micc than Math."

[Micc]

I can kinda see how icon could be telling truth here given the worsts answers to my questions this game hasn’t given me confidence about his understanding of normal guidelines. But it’s way more likely that shakyness comes from answering questions about roles that aren’t in his game.

Indeed my knowledge of normal guidelines is fairly limited. I like researching etc. but I'm far from authority on it. I'm fairly surprised the roleblocking issue in this game wasn't noted in review but it was extremely explicit and it was suggested to me to proceed (paraphrasing) as though this game is a semi-open and roles Just Work the way I interpret them to Just Work.

So I'm kind of

actively aware that the rb issue should have been picked up in review

but also not keen on contradicting role PMs

and also want to make sure my answers to questions are consistent with the way this game works, at cost to conforming with normalcy (if necessary only obviously; as opposed to the inverse)


hesitancy in answering some questions was a misunderstanding about the breadth of the semi-openness of the setup, moreso than issues with roles which aren't in the game. given post review there seemed to be some ambiguity in the way roleblockers/ascetics COULD interact with investigatives I didn't think it was appropriate to answer. it's now been made clear that the intention is for there to be no ambiguity & for approach to be consistent

but basically yes
I'm definitely not a Normal Game Pilot. unfortunately I'm just behind the wheel of Mini Adequately-Normal 2119.

Just want to say, I have absolutely no hard feelings about how any of this went down. If any of my posting came across as criticism of your moderation it was really just frustration at the situation I was in. My hope is that with a little bit of work the NRG can clear some stuff up to lessen the frustration of normal players and mods going forward.

I am slightly disappointed that the dead thread had been spoiled going into 3p lylo. I would have liked to see where people would have landed with respect to understanding the mechanics and also just natural reads. I'm not sure what I could have done differently here, besides maybe get to the correct solve a little quicker. I always agreed that my eventual lynch was probably necessary, but am I supposed to just roll over? The only thing I would do differently in hindsight is stick to my bji vote D4, which is another way of saying I standby everything I did this game while sober

I did enjoy this despite it being absolutely agonizing knowing I was being setup for a later mislynch for the entire game. Thank you everyone for the game!

[bji]

Micc good to play with you. You were mod on my second game ever (which I will never forget because I was so excited to be town cop and to have a guilty and then about to get a second guilty when the game was thrown by a loser who posted role PM in game thread). Until I got into the dead thread I thought that what happened in this game with Eddie Cane was a similar thing, we were going crazy in the scum thread with rage about a "mod townfirmed player" being allowed in the game. Kind of embarrassing for me really to be so enraged about something I was wrong about.

[bji]

BTW I agree that the mechanics section of the wiki could be a lot better. Nobody except the mod expected that roleblocking situation to work the way it did. Which is not to say the mod was wrong, really I just want to highlight how much clearer the wiki should be about this stuff.

Also thank you the worst for moderating, this was a complex setup and could not have been easy to run. Much appreciated!

[bji]

And thanks Alisae for giving us an epic and very educational setup!

[Micc]

same to you bji. This game was full of people I've enjoyed having in my modded games but never really played with. In your case it had been quite some time between meetings but I'm glad we crossed paths again.

[bji]

I slipped when I said that I was one shot lynchproof to balance two investigatives. I basically right there confirmed ico as town. I felt so embarrassed by this that I tried to quit the site, wrote to an admin and asked them to delete my account. But they never responded and here I am still ...

[Alisae]

And thanks Alisae for giving us an epic and very educational setup!

hey duckie came up with the idea of an informed cop.
I just built off of that.

[Micc]

viewtopic.php?f=90&t=82253

my notes can be released. my favorite post upon reread:

Hmm if I was scum here I’d be playing such a good game

[Alisae]

oooooooh micc
you have no idea how many times I think that in games

[the worst]

@micc, no problems at all - i didn't feel unfairly criticised at all. just wanted to make sure that i was clear on the scope of my normal game knowledge, for posterity. (i.e. very limited, but avoiding modspew as much as possible!)

i actually think you played really well. it's one of those situations where ico reaches the correct conclusion in a parallel universe; if you reread his posting through that last phase there were a few flashes of cognisance where he *nearly* had the solve. your self-defence and casing on menalque was really sound imo. ico's NKA was correct, menalque set up this f3. his mechanical solving was correct, you proooobably didn't perform the nk last night. unfortunately, (and i'm sure you noticed as well, but for the audience) there was very consistent confirmation-bias towards micc!scum through iconeum's d6 posting. but even when all the logic points a certain way, there's always the decision between voting with head or heart, and that's a lot harder to make a call on.

i suppose this is a really wordy/pretentious way of saying i also think your play was good this game and that was a surprisingly hard f3 for you to win.



pedit: lmfao sameee!

[Looker]

Damn. Got distracted by poor players, but, otherwise, my votes were pretty good.

[bob3141]

i never got invited to the dead thread

[bob3141]

Shame menal managed to talk himself out of being found guilty.

well played menal

[bob3141]

in lylo i was thinking its got to be menal.

Ico sorry for being abit mean to you but i did get a little frustrated how badly scum had got you pocketed. At that point bjj was so obvously scum for trying to widen teh scum pool to include looker. A near confirmed player from his role claim and actions

[MathBlade]

Gg everyone well played It’s like 4 am here and off sleep schedule

It’s really hard to be in that spot Ico. <3

Glad you gave it your best shot.

Well played everyone