Mafiascum.net

Alright, this is a setup based on a setup I made on Epicmafia. I have little experience in forum balancing. It is a semi-open. idk if theres mafiawiki equivalents for some of the roles I'm listing, if there are pls lmk.

The King's New Robes

Base town:

3 Vanilla Townies

1 Oracle

1 1-Shot Bride

2 mafia, consisting of:

0-2 Mafia Actress

0-2 Mafia Tailor

For every Actress, add a

Vanilla Townie

. For every Tailor, add an

Oracle

.

Special mechanics:
Infiltration Start.
The game starts on n0. Actions may be performed as normal during this night, other than nightkills.
Vengeful Mafia.
Instead of a nightkill, the mafia are able to shoot 1 player upon their own elimination.

as for what the unorthodox roles do(ill write up something more official looking later):

Oracle: On death, reveals the role of the person they chose the previous night. This will be announced via a mod message in thread. The night action does NOT count as a visit.
Bride: During the day, has a day action to propose a marriage to another player. That player may choose to accept or deny. If accepted, both the Bride and the chosen player's roles are revealed. If denied, the action is not used up and neither role is revealed.
Actress: Every night may choose a player. The actress gains a suit that corresponds to that player's role. That suit will be what is shown when the actress' role is revealed. This suit may be updated every time the action is used. (i.e. actress goes on a vanilla townie, and is chosen by an oracle who dies. They will be revealed as a vanilla townie instead of actress.) Learns the role of the suit they take via system message. (i.e. You learn that Player is a Vanilla Townie!)
Tailor: Every night, may choose to give a player a suit. This is not able to override already existing suits. (once you have a suit you cannot receive a 2nd one). The suit may be of any role that exists within the setup. (this effectively gives tailor the role list, but not how many of each role there is.) The target will be informed of receiving a suit, but not what the suit is. That player will reveal as whatever the suit is.


Possible setups:
3 VT, 1 Bride, 1 Oracle, 2 Actress
2 VT, 1 Bride, 2 Oracle, 1 Actress, 1 Tailor
1 VT, 1 Bride, 3 Oracle, 2 Tailor


I'm open to adjustments to make this workable! Also the original concept for this setup was not a semi-open, and instead just this setup but only with 1 tailor and 1 actress.
Edited to add the vengeful mafia varient.

I am open to adding another VT + Oracle to add another ML to the setup. However I think that this itself may be balanced for forum play.

Ego.

I'm tempted to say this is scumsided. If we ignore the PR's, then scum know the exact claims to make to avoid giving anything away-- actress always claims oracle, and tailor always claims VT. Since oracle is confirmed on death, actress's power matters only for the bride.

But I'll think about it a little more in depth.

worth noting that Oracle and Tailor are already roles on MS with different mechanics. but like u said it being an open, probably fine. there aren't mafiawiki equivilents are far as i know because reveal mechanics haven't really been toyed with too much here.

not sure if im just misreading but it doesn't look like you specified that actress learns the role of their target at the end of the night as well. is that intentional?

as for balance, i imagine it's scumsided with only 1 misexecute. the bride's reveal is only effective if it hits a tailor or an actress that targeted them so usually, all it does is make the bride an IC.

ill also just say that i generally caution people about designing setups like this. this is effectively borderline no reveal, which is already extremely difficult to pull off in forum mafia. not saying just throw it out, but be aware that it's the kind of setup that will only be run successfully if you have a very committed and invested playerlist.

fixed the actress part.

what is the benefit in having the mafia roles be variable

In post 5, BBmolla wrote:what is the benefit in having the mafia roles be variable

Fun (:

An "Oracle" is a bit like a Ninja Vengerolecop, although that wouldn't trigger upon being nightkilled. Your "Tailor" is actually pretty similar to our Tailor, adapted for the setup mechanics (although it's Loud).

As a mechanical note, you need to work out what should happen if someone fakes a Bride action. The ability to refuse it doesn't do anything interesting unless it's unclear whether the Bride action was faked or whether the action was real but refused (otherwise, town will just pressure people into accepting on pain of being voted out). This may end up having a balance impact on the setup. (In particular, you want to specify whether the action is public, or whether it's taken by private message; day actions are usually public here but either could be reasonable.)

Anyway, I'm pretty sure that the Mafia have a huge advantage here. Town's only information advantage in that setup is that an Actress might not necessarily know which town role the Bride will reveal them as (so there's a chance that they get caught out by day action), plus one named role that's useful for PoE purposes (plus one possible red investigation if a lone Tailor can't self-target; in the two-Tailor setup this doesn't matter because they can just target each other). My first thought was to add an extra two VTs, but I don't think that goes far enough in terms of balancing the setup. Getting rid of N0 would help balance-wise but a) might still not be enough (compare, e.g., 2 Mason + 5 VT vs. 2 Mafia, which is close to balanced here and is comparable to the situation after two VTs are added and a Bride shot is used) and b) would make many of the special mechanics irrelevant (e.g. the Bride would simply always just trigger D1, before any suits had a chance to be added). So I'm not sure I can see a way to fix this at Micro size while preserving the unique mechanics of the setup.

It might work better as a Mini, or even a Large, if you limit the speed at which the Mafia can start interfering with the investigations (although I have a suspicion that it'd be better off Closed than Open). You might want to look at the Paint Mafia series for inspiration, which has similar mechanics (painting players various colours rather than using suits) but alters them to be a lot more townsided.

In post 7, callforjudgement wrote:An "Oracle" is a bit like a Ninja Vengerolecop, although that wouldn't trigger upon being nightkilled. Your "Tailor" is actually pretty similar to our Tailor, adapted for the setup mechanics (although it's Loud).

As a mechanical note, you need to work out what should happen if someone fakes a Bride action. The ability to refuse it doesn't do anything interesting unless it's unclear whether the Bride action was faked or whether the action was real but refused (otherwise, town will just pressure people into accepting on pain of being voted out). This may end up having a balance impact on the setup. (In particular, you want to specify whether the action is public, or whether it's taken by private message; day actions are usually public here but either could be reasonable.)

Anyway, I'm pretty sure that the Mafia have a huge advantage here. Town's only information advantage in that setup is that an Actress might not necessarily know which town role the Bride will reveal them as (so there's a chance that they get caught out by day action), plus one named role that's useful for PoE purposes (plus one possible red investigation if a lone Tailor can't self-target; in the two-Tailor setup this doesn't matter because they can just target each other). My first thought was to add an extra two VTs, but I don't think that goes far enough in terms of balancing the setup. Getting rid of N0 would help balance-wise but a) might still not be enough (compare, e.g., 2 Mason + 5 VT vs. 2 Mafia, which is close to balanced here and is comparable to the situation after two VTs are added and a Bride shot is used) and b) would make many of the special mechanics irrelevant (e.g. the Bride would simply always just trigger D1, before any suits had a chance to be added). So I'm not sure I can see a way to fix this at Micro size while preserving the unique mechanics of the setup.

It might work better as a Mini, or even a Large, if you limit the speed at which the Mafia can start interfering with the investigations (although I have a suspicion that it'd be better off Closed than Open). You might want to look at the Paint Mafia series for inspiration, which has similar mechanics (painting players various colours rather than using suits) but alters them to be a lot more townsided.

oh! bride would result in a mod message publically stating "The Bride has propsed marriage!"

I agree this is very scumsided as written.
What about running this as a 7:2 nightless with vengeful scum?

perhaps

In post 9, Isis wrote:I agree this is very scumsided as written.
What about running this as a 7:2 nightless with vengeful scum?

I think this is best

not nightless, bc there ARE night actions I want but not giving mafia nightkills would be the play then.

Yeah I meant no nightkills, you still need a nightphase for the night actions. I think of nightless as a mental shorthand for removing the mafia's killpower, sorry.

As usual, don't understand anything about the set-up but '/in' in confidence!

Be ready , you'll soon feel the rain of questioning from me
I can ask here, right?

In post 13, Salsabil Faria wrote:As usual, don't understand anything about the set-up but '/in' in confidence!

Be ready

DkKoba

, you'll soon feel the rain of questioning from me
I can ask here, right?

Sure.

Also role names will be renamed before game starts.

Maximum 4 scums?

'''': don't understand this (about )

Dont't understand this part:

(i) they can 'disguise' as any town player they choose?

(ii)'''' : when they will be eliminated?

(iii)'''' : don't get this

: will give suit only among their scum team members, right?

In post 5, BBmolla wrote:what is the benefit in having the mafia roles be variable

You're back!!!!

I'll answer when i get home
I'll start off by that there is no variable scum, only role distribution. (3 possible setups)

In post 0, DkKoba wrote:(this effectively gives tailor the role list, but not how many of each role there is.)

Based on scum roles they could deduce the quantities anyway?

In post 21, Gamma Emerald wrote:

In post 0, DkKoba wrote:(this effectively gives tailor the role list, but not how many of each role there is.)

Based on scum roles they could deduce the quantities anyway?

Exactly yeah.

Gonna be working on this tonight to clarify and create role pms for the setup so its much clearer to understand