Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2022 7:30 am
Your first few posts felt like you were trying to understand where people were coming from and then taking it a step further and working with them to make sure if they were town making genuine statements they were on a correct thought process. Examples:joqiza wrote: @SA what did I do to be your strongest TR
No. There's context around that. The post being called fluff was basically me expanding on the discussion to say I didn't buy his explanation. Being so concerned over post count already seems off.Umlaut wrote: 33 is explaining a read? You're reading Dwlee as scum for... being more concerned about the post limit than you? That's novel
It would be pointless if I knew he was scum, sure. But it's early and I'm not entirely confident and as I acknowledged a few times, my confidence even weakened after that point. So yes, I answered his question. A discussion can help me get a stronger read on him and it also helps him and others to read me if they know where my head is at. I was surprised you saw it as fluff because I was answering a question about a read. That's kind of how you play mafia lol. While I do make posts that aren't entirely game related and can be seen as fluff posts occasionally from time to time especially in slower games, I really don't think I have been doing that here.Umlaut wrote: 46 is pointless/fluffy because (1) explaining to Roadkill that he's scum is a fundamentally pointless exercise, and (2) it doesn't go anywhere, just sort of peters out with "I could see it as maybe opportunistic/scummy but also maybe not
i mean, i did quote it, yeah. on a reread, i couldve (perhaps, shouldve) got that same point out of umlaut's summary; but i didnt, seeing it stated directly and plainly is what made it click for me.In post 97, joqiza wrote:Does this imply you found andante's posts convincing
When in doubt, vote to set up competing wagons.In post 103, Andante wrote:I'm not even sure who I want to vote here tbh
This is a misrep because I expressed my suspicion of Andante long before anyone outed any kind of read on me. Also, I fail to see how anyone actually reading the game critically could propose that this is what's happening when I basically made clear that I was waiting for her to come back rather than immediately condemning her. Asserting that someone has not towntold to you yet is not equivalent to calling them scum.In post 78, Andante wrote:like there are definitely joq posts I looked at like "I really don't tr joq" and him being fascinated by me here feels like maf trying to take advantage of the fact I've put 0 effort into this. it's like "Hey look!! yall may not tr me, but andante over there? looking like a real good vote!" like, just chill, it's still D1, I was busy IRL, here now... thus I'll be working on reads. Umlaut town is something I feel good about though, also have only skimmed so far.
I actually kind of agree / like this post, although it feels hasty.In post 79, Andante wrote: 2/10 - doing 1 post per person I think, just gotta figure stuff out
wh4t has less content than me?? an rvs vote + this?? It genuinely doesn't feel like there's any effort even here, like "you said something was bad? bad isn't a reason to SR, what about it is bad" that's kinda the vibe I get, 4 TRs and no reason for any? "I'm on my phone so I cant" like, you could give post numbers "I liked post 21 from SA" or whatever, like, yes I know we have limited postcount, but it's not an excuse to not give reasonings for reads, - just realized joq said the "bad part" I hated, so like, are you agreeing that joq had the bad post?? either way, for this being your ONLY post of anything. this is terrible, looks like maf posting once a day to avoid prods.
If you're calling 4 people town, I want something, or an immediate followup. "I'll explain later" ok, it's a new day now and still 0 explanation.
It is absurd that you phrase this as "wasting posts" when, as you ended up doing, you can just link the game along with another post. Given that Andante did eventually link me a game I will forgive the initial deflection here.In post 83, Andante wrote:4/10
has the highest postcount here - that alone means nothing, but I did notice that
ok, most of these posts are saying nothing, like you're all "go show me where town lolhammers" like what? do you want me to waste posts on that? waste time talking about something that barely applies here? I've had plenty of games recently, E-1's just got yeeted cause why not? and honestly, I'd probably yeet an e-1 for lols, depends, but that's besides the point.
Rereading this again makes me lean wolf on it because she's trying to characterize my request as something out of the ordinary. I feel my request was reasonable and this feels like it could be gaslighting.In post 83, Andante wrote:then in 23 you go on to talk about whatever lolhammer related thing, that again, REALLY doesn't matter here
When I look at my question here I think it's actually quite a good one. Esther's 35 was not at all straightforward, and as I look at your post here, I actually get the sense that you read my 40 with my ISO open without any regard for what esther's post actually was and whether it made sense for me to ask that when I did. It's true mafia often ask questions just to look busy, but to call it meaningless is wrong... we derived meaning from esther's response in 55. I think if you were considering my alignment genuinely, you would have included some reference to 35 here.In post 83, Andante wrote: 40 is asking a meaningless question, feels like you're just trying to look busy, like I don't get the point of it
No real comment here.In post 83, Andante wrote: 60 is all "the word bad can be used so many ways!!" like, an essay over using the word bad? how is that even relevant? who cares? you're the only one caring/trying to make a thing out of it
See above re: initial deflection.In post 83, Andante wrote: 61 yet another post telling me to link games, I'm not reading my past games, but there has definitely been speed hammers where town and maf hammered an e-1 like, a full DAY lasting a few hours? yeah.
Still don't know what mindset is required to post a comment like this. It's pretty hard not to see this as an attempt to belittle my concerns / make me look ridiculous in order to discredit my suspicion of her.In post 83, Andante wrote: 62 "Meh whatever. I'm thinking about it more and getting after people on language use is pointless. Y'all can talk how you want to talk." wow. pointless to go after how people talk? who'd have guessed?
I still have no idea what the Dwlee turbo mode game comment here means, and it's weird to me that she typed this up and posted it as if I would have any kind of understanding as to how whatever she is talking about should influence a teamread on them.In post 83, Andante wrote: 64 "I really need Andante to come back. My train of thought is unresolved there and I feel like everything will click once I get a read on her." Is this to just buy you time to actually put any effort into this? "Oh I don't have to try till she shows up and links games" like, I'm pretty sure Dwlee was there for turbo mode game, and you're all " they ain't partners"
No further comment.In post 83, Andante wrote: so that is the entirety of joqiza's ISO, and I don't like it, most posts here, and wh4t put more effort into the actual game... wh4t gave "reads" there is NOTHING of that sort in joqiza's ISO, joqiza probably maf
isn't using weird here the same as using bad?In post 110, joqiza wrote:I still have no idea what the Dwlee turbo mode game comment here means, and it's weird to me that she typed this up and posted it as if I would have any kind of understanding as to how whatever she is talking about should influence a teamread on them.
Why does the first half of 72 "scream" maf to you? That part of the post seemed fine to me. I think I agree with your take on 55. Note this is mc esther's response to the post that Andante accused of being a meaningless question. Rest here seems okay to me.In post 85, Andante wrote:5/10
I wouldn't necessarily say mc esther's ISO is bad, but it's also not great, first half of 72 screams maf, but 2nd half I can see town saying and actually kinda like. I can see 55 being town that just realized "oh wait I was wrong in that thinking" I've definitely had arguments like that where I go "wait it's not how I thought?"
I'd like to just see more in general from mc esther, I know overall it's a lower postcount situation, but still, not a whole lot given for TRs/SRs on people, voting wh4t without saying why? like, as I mentioned earlier about someone, a simple reason is good enough. "I'm voting wh4t now cause they're not talking" ok cool, a reason is better than no reason.
overall - need more from mc, basically agreeing exactly with 70 from Three
I guess I don't really have a problem with anything here. The conditional TR of sleepless is a bit of a complex thought, actually. This is the first post where Andante seems to go back and forth at all on my alignment.In post 87, Andante wrote:6/10
LOL I love the Dwlee/Roadkill stuff, it honestly feels like something I'd do as town, like, none of that feels forced, it's like a natural "haha got you both, vote your partner" whether or not it was a serious sr doesn't matter, it feels like something more likely to come from town. 31 is awesome the reasoning feels like genuine town to me, not maf stuck in a "oh no. must explain what I said. uhhh" only exception to me loving 31 is if joq and you are partners, cause it's either a town response, or maf talking to a partner, with 0 fear of being SRed for reasons. - which is awesome news that I don't tr joq. making life so much easier!
rest of your ISO is alright. it's like, if joq is town, I have no doubt you're town.if joq is maf, you could be town or maf. So I guess I'll go with town lean here, not as strong of a TR as Umlaut,Three, and mc esther might be above you, or yall are equal right now, thinking about it, I'm a tad paranoid of Sleepless/joq team, but I'm sure as there's more content, I'll be ok with a TR or I'll SR you, I need either more from you, or just need to let time go by and see
63 is "Umlaut, how is explaining my reads on Dwelee and Roadkill fluffy? Also your reads are about opposite mine so... yeah. This game could be awkward."
like, you're acknowledging opposite reads? you don't want to try and explain why a sr of umlaut is town? or why an umlaut tr is maf? instead of just calling it awkward, you could work with umlaut? just an idea. another perspective can sometimes help with reading people. Actually, this post is just telling me I need to revisit my read here later, we're gonna go withSleepless not town, but I'm also not entirely sold on Sleepless maf yet, so just in the middle, definitely want more in terms of content
Something caught my eye here. Let me get this straight: you're saying that upon your return to thread, your method of catching up was to ISO slots one by one.In post 88, Andante wrote:7/10 LOL ok, I have an ISO pulled up, and I type, I've realized not all my posts seem super clear with who I'm talking about. each person has their own post, and no I'm not concerned about post count, burn 8 catching up/making my thoughts clear on each person, leaves with 2 left, and there's 10 more soon
~ This post is on Dwlee (see, super clear! post before this was Sleepless) ~
lol Dwlee trying to pocket me I see... also if you know pony? idk you XD (maybe I do... idk lol)
I like 21!! it's like, kinda sticking up for me when I wasn't here "yeah it's not AI" like, thank you!! lol me getting hammered there was a genuine concern, cause I feel like I'm definitely the kind of person to get lolhammered
ok, thoughts on dwlee!
32 good reaction to the "bus your partner" also, did you just call out a bad read on you from Sleepless? like a forced read from sleepless? (ughh my brain doesn't work in ISO mode like this, but it's the easiest way to catch up.. Something there with Sleepless? who knows??)
I'm pretty suspicious of this read on Dwlee because I don't think Dwlee has been particularly towny. I think he has been more null and I'm not sure I believe how Andante is taking his posts here and reaching the conclusion that he's one of the towniest, unless she's just particularly partial to his defense of her. I think this could be a pocket attempt.In post 87, Andante wrote:
"My post was in reference to the fact that we only get 10 posts per day, but someone has to be the first to use one to get the ball rolling onto something. " like yeah, I think it was fin, even if it was a wagon on me, like, someone has to do something, and I fully believe maf was more likely to just blindly sheep a wagon than start one
My response to 38: Same. thus I signed up for this to litrerally just to show yall I can play off 10 posts a day instead of 100 lol
51 -LOL yeah! roadkill brings up a great point!! Why no wild spam this game?? suspicious.
57 are good takes, and the way you said them, you're not like trying to go "HEY WORLD HERE'S REAS!! TR ME!!" just a casual "thinking this"
Response to 74- what do you mean no memes?
uh yeah, so Dwlee is probably town, town lean, like, they're solving, but not solving for the purpose of being TRed (I think that makes sense) like, maf cares about appearance or coasts, there's no in between ever, So far my reads are looking like:
Town to Scum:
Three/Umlaut - tied for towniest
Dwlee
mc esther
Sleepless
Joqiza
and I need more from wh4t before I put them anywhere, I'm not putting someone in a reads list off 1 post
Very dismissive post tbh.In post 115, mc esther wrote:do you usually pbp someone so comprehensively just for scumreading you? idk, "comprehensively" is the wrong word because you no-commented about half of it, but the point is that you quoted (all of? a huge portion of?) a scumread just to say "no im not" and then omgus (okay, "omgus" is kinda uncharitable here, but i think your case is overall very unconvincing). i'll admit that i want to see an answer to "why did she evaluate a question she got information from as non-useful?"; overall though, your posts seem, idk, kinda overblown as a response to an [imo] thoroughly ordinary (if a little long and questionably-structured) scumread.
I'm not saying you're wrong, but I don't understand this. What was the "given game state" and why wouldn't scum try-hard in it?In post 116, Dwlee99 wrote:Andante has zero reason to tryhard like that given gamestate if scum. Don't understand the vote there at all
i dont think i understand what this means. the most obvious reading is that town tends not to eliminate maf d1 when the thread disagrees with you, but im almost certain that's not the intent. am i understanding the meaning of "resistance"? is there something specific about andante or her playstyle that's relevant to your meaning?In post 114, joqiza wrote:I am encountering a sort of resistance that, in my experience, has not signalled d1 wolf flip.
I was thinking the same thing.In post 107, mc esther wrote:? you seemed really damning on joqiza and put him at the bottom of your readslist, im surprised he's not your automatic vote? what's the hesitation, like, im assuming you have some reason to believe he might be town after all?
I don't think this is actually that strange (I did pretty much that to form reads on the players in my "that leaves..." category in my earlier post) but even if it were strange, how is it alignment-indicative?In post 113, joqiza wrote:Something caught my eye here. Let me get this straight: you're saying that upon your return to thread, your method of catching up was to ISO slots one by one.
Instead of... just reading the 5 pages of the game?
WTF?
Agree. Actually I guess I agree with Dwlee more than Dwlee does since they sort of walked this back in 119. I guess notIn post 116, Dwlee99 wrote:Andante has zero reason to tryhard like that given gamestate if scum. Don't understand the vote there at all
So what I'm getting from this is... you think there is likely scum defending Andante in the event that she's town? I can buy that. Whom do you have in mind particularly?In post 121, joqiza wrote:I'm in a position right now where I'm pushing a scumread and getting absolutely no traction. Perhaps contrary to popular belief I do not see this as a good signal. From my perspective all the points I'm bringing up are being ignored and Andante is being defended for reasons I don't think are particularly AI.
There are two universes in which this could occur. In the universe where she's a wolf, she has at most one wolf partner to defend her; in this universe there are multiple villagers who are just completely blind to her scumminess. The other universe is the one where she's town and in this one there are two wolves who could take the position to defend her, my scumread is based on my own flawed perception, and there are villagers defending her because they're picking up on the town notes that I'm unable to see. When I compare the two universes I need to ask myself the question, "Do I really think I'm smarter than everyone else?" And the answer right now is, not really, no.