In post 1998, Aristeia wrote:sorry I just don't think those things are alignment indicative for him
ii just can't see it that i way. i understand what you're saying but i don't think it's as bad for him as you say it is
but again you actually took the time to talk to me about it so i appreciate it it's datisi and skitter who have just ignored all attempts irrel and i had to make cases against mena and who the hell knows where NK15 is at
the fact that mena is being townread by both replacements is devastating because maybe i'm just wrong and i don't really know what to do from there
In post 2240, Save The Dragons wrote:I'm willing to do Mena still if that's an option but I dunno if theres enough desire there and I just don't know if I'm just wrong even though I agree with your points
I don't think I had no options left ari and mena just got into a huge fight and I pushed datisi by voting him instead of...you know...not doing that which is what I would have done if I were partners with him
In post 3076, Roden wrote:I said it earlier, it was more likely to be you than STD, but STD kept saying really scummy shit today that gave me pause. It's why I suggested hammer testing you.
and why did you think it was more likely to be me?
Because I scum read you early on, you were a null slot that I went back and forth on over the game. Yesterday I wasn't so sure anymore because I didn't think it was you or Ari, and if I was right then ELo would likely be a town loss and offered to get voted out then. I gave reasons earlier for what made me think why you could be town, but STD seemed to wrong with all of his reads to actually be scum so I thought he had to be town. I town read Ari more than you as well, you were just the PoE.
i want to hear the reasons you had for why you thought i was more likely. i know that im conftown now but it wasn't very long ago, you should be able to remember
the best i have so far is that i was poe scum because:
- std's reads were too wrong for him to be scum
is that all? please expand if there is more to it.
That's really all there was to it. The PoE was only because everyone else was townier. NK15 only got added later because I figured if I was wrong about a read, it was that one.
i have a very hard time not just treating this as a scumclaim
How?
because your entire reasoning heading into elo for which slot was scum is that one of them had too many bad reads and therefore had to be town? ive read your games now, you're not that bad at town
In post 3076, Roden wrote:I said it earlier, it was more likely to be you than STD, but STD kept saying really scummy shit today that gave me pause. It's why I suggested hammer testing you.
and why did you think it was more likely to be me?
Because I scum read you early on, you were a null slot that I went back and forth on over the game. Yesterday I wasn't so sure anymore because I didn't think it was you or Ari, and if I was right then ELo would likely be a town loss and offered to get voted out then. I gave reasons earlier for what made me think why you could be town, but STD seemed to wrong with all of his reads to actually be scum so I thought he had to be town. I town read Ari more than you as well, you were just the PoE.
i want to hear the reasons you had for why you thought i was more likely. i know that im conftown now but it wasn't very long ago, you should be able to remember
the best i have so far is that i was poe scum because:
- std's reads were too wrong for him to be scum
is that all? please expand if there is more to it.
That's really all there was to it. The PoE was only because everyone else was townier. NK15 only got added later because I figured if I was wrong about a read, it was that one.
i have a very hard time not just treating this as a scumclaim
How?
because your entire reasoning heading into elo for which slot was scum is that one of them had too many bad reads and therefore had to be town? ive read your games now, you're not that bad at town
You're right, I'm not. That's why I voted out scum.
But no I guess you think my master scum plan was to throw the game by voting out my town read scum partner than claiming scum
Throwing the fight is absolutely not against the spirit of the game. There's no obligation to pick the strongest thing you can think of, or even something that you think could win. I am not telling you what to pick. Rather, from a perspective of the game of mafia, if you think your death would be beneficial to town then you should try to lose the fight. I am telling you, objectively, your
death is beneficial to town regardless of your alignment.
Please go to whatever lengths you can to ensure you die tonight.
If you are town, and you win the fight, we will literally lose the game as a result.
Don't see how we lose. If we elim scum today and it does turn out to be Faerie, I'm likely fighting you tonight if you're town. If I win the fight, you can't tunnel me in ELo, and instead I'm going into ELo with Flea at the very least, who doesn't scum read me. Worst case scenario, ELo is Flea/Dwlee/me and Dwlee is town and death tunnels me, and scum!Flea just quick hammers once Dwlee votes.
Basically we only lose if town plays impulsively, which I don't expect anyone here to do.
why were you encouraging me and std to play impulsively at start of day, and criticizing us for taking our time and rereading? you were acting like you weren't even aware of that as a concept, but here you clearly are.
In post 3103, Save The Dragons wrote:I don't think I had no options left ari and mena just got into a huge fight and I pushed datisi by voting him instead of...you know...not doing that which is what I would have done if I were partners with him
Ari and Mena were not going, we know this and went over. Blood hard stopped eliminations there by self voting. You literally had no choice.
Throwing the fight is absolutely not against the spirit of the game. There's no obligation to pick the strongest thing you can think of, or even something that you think could win. I am not telling you what to pick. Rather, from a perspective of the game of mafia, if you think your death would be beneficial to town then you should try to lose the fight. I am telling you, objectively, your
death is beneficial to town regardless of your alignment.
Please go to whatever lengths you can to ensure you die tonight.
If you are town, and you win the fight, we will literally lose the game as a result.
Don't see how we lose. If we elim scum today and it does turn out to be Faerie, I'm likely fighting you tonight if you're town. If I win the fight, you can't tunnel me in ELo, and instead I'm going into ELo with Flea at the very least, who doesn't scum read me. Worst case scenario, ELo is Flea/Dwlee/me and Dwlee is town and death tunnels me, and scum!Flea just quick hammers once Dwlee votes.
Basically we only lose if town plays impulsively, which I don't expect anyone here to do.
why were you encouraging me and std to play impulsively at start of day, and criticizing us for taking our time and rereading? you were acting like you weren't even aware of that as a concept, but here you clearly are.
I criticized you two for sniping at me and saying it's just me and doing literally nothing else. I wanted scum to vote so we can just get to the part where we have a conftown, because I know town won't actually vote there because they don't actually know who's scum.
std has done far more game analysis and consideration of reasoning for who is scum than you this day so i wouldn't recommend playing the "doing literally nothing else" card either, because you lose that one too
In post 3105, Roden wrote:
You're right, I'm not. That's why I voted out scum.
But no I guess you think my master scum plan was to throw the game by voting out my town read scum partner than claiming scum
this is entirely irrelevant to my point. all three of us voted out scum. you can stop playing that card now.
Why do I keep having to repeat that I came into the game with fresh reads that changed the game state
I'm so fucking over this
your reads did not change the game state. you made no push on datisi and were happy to continue the game state by voting irrel. bloodhail's reads changed the gamestate, and you followed him.
Fire I seriously don't understand why you think I would give an honest answer that sounds scummy and will probably piss you off instead of just telling you what you want to hear if I'm actually scum
You're even reading my games right now, have you seen me do that?
In post 3105, Roden wrote:
You're right, I'm not. That's why I voted out scum.
But no I guess you think my master scum plan was to throw the game by voting out my town read scum partner than claiming scum
this is entirely irrelevant to my point. all three of us voted out scum. you can stop playing that card now.
Why do I keep having to repeat that I came into the game with fresh reads that changed the game state
I'm so fucking over this
your reads did not change the game state. you made no push on datisi and were happy to continue the game state by voting irrel. bloodhail's reads changed the gamestate, and you followed him.
This is just, blatantly false. Elephant and Mena were set up to die. Skitter was getting set up to go next. I halted that momentum.
In post 3114, Roden wrote:Fire I seriously don't understand why you think I would give an honest answer that sounds scummy and will probably piss you off instead of just telling you what you want to hear if I'm actually scum
You're even reading my games right now, have you seen me do that?
i haven't seen you do what you're claiming to have done as town, either
In post 3111, fireisredsir wrote:std has done far more game analysis and consideration of reasoning for who is scum than you this day so i wouldn't recommend playing the "doing literally nothing else" card either, because you lose that one too
All he said was "idk it's probably Roden" over and over and occasionally sniping at me. He barely made any attempts to read either of us.
In post 3114, Roden wrote:Fire I seriously don't understand why you think I would give an honest answer that sounds scummy and will probably piss you off instead of just telling you what you want to hear if I'm actually scum
You're even reading my games right now, have you seen me do that?
i haven't seen you do what you're claiming to have done as town, either
In post 3111, fireisredsir wrote:std has done far more game analysis and consideration of reasoning for who is scum than you this day so i wouldn't recommend playing the "doing literally nothing else" card either, because you lose that one too
All he said was "idk it's probably Roden" over and over and occasionally sniping at me. He barely made any attempts to read either of us.
you were entirely focused on defense and making weird callouts of how we were playing and gave little to no reasoning as to why you town or scumread either of us. std clearly reread and reassessed things and gave his thoughts
I literally did everything I could and you just want to tunnel and ignore every point I've made and pretend they don't exist
If you want to believe my only option is bussing and STD just made a good vote despite having literally zero projection towards wanting to vote out Datisi, then fine. I can't convince you if you're that far gone.
I take zero responsibility for this town loss
I fucking worked my ass off just to get shat on all game
