Mini Normal 2285: GM [game over]

[Val89]

I kinda have learned not to do that as setups are not balanced usually in my opinion.

If I have to guess I would go strongman.

There may well be a range, and it might be your opinion that setups usually land in the not balanced side, but I am not about to ignore a significant piece of the puzzle completely - there needs to be at least

something

feasible.

I don't see how strongman fits. The kill was stopped by a JK.

In fact, was it not yourself who argued on an earlier day that the lack of night kills indicated Skitter was most likely not being sent?

[Val89]

@fb Why did you lie to KT about being out of shots?

I'm struggling to see what positive that achieves, as a gambit - jails resolved before kills, no?

[Firebringer]

to shut him up tbh.
i internally justified it to myself that scum wouldn't have to night kill me and allow me to get a free save in on math later or a possible full clear once we elimmed him

but it was really to shut him up about his plan that i didn't agree with.

[Val89]

It was a pretty weird plan, to be fair. I didn't see the suggestion until after thread lock, and my thoughts when I did was "why me over IV when scum are never in a million years planning on shooting me tonight".

Your argument as to why you didn't go along seemed fine to me, and I probably wouldn't have in your shoes either, I'm just struggling to understand the lie - which came the day

after

kitty proposed the plan and was pushing you for not following it.

[Firebringer]

i was annoyed and wanted him to shut up.
not much else to explain on it.

[MathBlade]

did kitty ever explain why he didn't watch u NIght 2?
it was kind of obvious u would be a target.

I think I was outed ninja doc at that point.

I forget when I stopped memeing exactly and went more serious.

[MathBlade]

I kinda have learned not to do that as setups are not balanced usually in my opinion.

If I have to guess I would go strongman.

There may well be a range, and it might be your opinion that setups usually land in the not balanced side, but I am not about to ignore a significant piece of the puzzle completely - there needs to be at least

something

feasible.

I don't see how strongman fits. The kill was stopped by a JK.

In fact, was it not yourself who argued on an earlier day that the lack of night kills indicated Skitter was most likely not being sent?

There’s a lot possible. To me what’s most likely is a setup that is imbalanced and Skitter is scum.

If it’s not then it’s not and I just die and others can solve it. I have a work project I have been up for a long time on and brain juices just aren’t gonna fire for some complex world.

[Val89]

I'm not asking for you to list the lot; just one or two possibilities out of that will do, and you aren't the only person I'm asking.

There is imbalanced, and there is "no chance in hell it ever passes review", and I'm not prepared to handwave it if the evidence strongly suggests a mislim.

I'm sorry work has you busy, but there is no need to rush here - if its skitter, fine, but if it isn't, let's be honest - one the points of a fake inno is exactly so Ydra's partner can rush through a mislim on skitter the day after she flips.

[Firebringer]

if u want to vote in the PRs.
Go for it.

This is a waste of time.

[Val89]

What I would like to do is have these discussions today, while we are all still alive. I don't see the rush to vote to end the day at all.

I think you should ask yourself why its turning into such as issue to give me one sensible suggestion that matches your Skitter trying to kill while jailed theory?

[Firebringer]

i don't see this as an issue.
i see it as a waste of time.
i have the game figured out as far as im concerned.
could it be wrong? sure.
But i feel like the chance of being wrong is 2%.

u apparently are lost or confused.
i am cool with that.

but like if its not skitter, its you or math.
we can have this fight tomorrow if its u or math imo.
What do we gain by having the discussion today?

Unless u want to talk this out with possible town!skitter. This has zero utility today since skitter dies always today in my mind.

i don't see how u could convince me otherwise to move my vote, and u would need to move like 2 votes onto me if u wanted me gone. Likely could get skitter to go anywhere else not her so probably 2 votes anywhere else besides me as well.

So what we doin. Why we doin this?


i don't care what the setup looks like.
Ill just flat out say if skitter is just informed mafia ninja. I would not be shocked.
What role do u think she has?
We should know at this point that scum probably don't have any blocking actions unless u think its me i guess.

What role are u suggesting?
I am suggesting nothing. Skitter is POE scum

[Val89]

What we are doing is, in the event of town Skitter (something I consider quite likely at this juncture), is making sure we've had some discussion prior to allowing scum to chose which of the rest of us does not get to participate tomorrow.

Math is right in that, in the event he is town, he

should

be the kill, but Im not convinced of that at all. You've cleared Herta, regardless of alignment. IV is concensus town, I think in scum!math world, I might even be the target.

I mean, if I am not around tomorrow, having you say in thread "I don't give a shit what Skitter is, I just want to rush the lim today" has had some value.

[Val89]

What role are u suggesting?

I'm not suggesting any role either - I think shes VT and one of you or math are faking, and the setup looks a lot more reasonable when you move one or the other of you to the red side of the scale.

I think you know 3x ninja goons is absolutely ludicrous, to the point Skitter can't make sense as scum.

[Firebringer]

if ur trying to convince me its math.
ur failling.

i don't care about setup spec. He is town by play.

[Firebringer]

like i will worry about if my town by play analysis is wrong tomorrow of skitter flips town.
I already said im living in a world where i think there is a 2% im wrong.

ive stated multiple times, i don't scumhunt by setup spec nor take it into high consideration or value.
if ur going to convince me math is the scum i should be on.
Probably going to have to point how scum math is by play here. I don't see it. Ridiculous? Sure. Thats town math. What scum moves has math been doing?

[MathBlade]

What role are u suggesting?

I'm not suggesting any role either - I think shes VT and one of you or math are faking, and the setup looks a lot more reasonable when you move one or the other of you to the red side of the scale.

I think you know 3x ninja goons is absolutely ludicrous, to the point Skitter can't make sense as scum.

Or maybe just maybe Skitter isn’t a goon.

There are possible worlds Skitter isn’t scum. I already highlighted them.

They’re just so far improbable as to not be a concern.

If Skitter flips town and I live (both worlds I doubt) then I will care.

[Firebringer]

i also don't see a world in which u die val89
like i would think scum shoots in one of me or math clear on IV or Herta.
Probably herta? I don't see why scum shoot u. Like at all.
Maybe explain that one while ur envisioning this wacky world where it isn't just skitter

[MathBlade]

What if it is 4 scum but just Val and Skitter? And Val is acting on inside knowledge?

[Firebringer]

Like if i am scum.
Why would i kill u?
I would just kill herta who i cleared cause he is already out of the lim pool. Ur not.
IV is also out of the lim pool so is a target.
Math and you are the ones i would never kill here as scum. Ive already been stating if im wrong on someone its one of u 2. Why do i flip that around and kill one of u, that leaves me crazier arguments i would need to 180 to convince people to say flip math and only math in a 1v1 situation. Also u heavily sus math, why wouldn't i keep u alive to make that easier and or side with math against u.

It makes zero sense for me to kill u.

Now look at mathblade:
if math kills u, would need to get both herta and IV to align on just me cause from his perspective it has to be me in that world. Wouldn't it be better to have u around for more options? Why limit it to just me? I cleared Herta, he cleared IV. One of those two needs death for both of us in this world ur imagining where one of us is scum.

BEcause its far riskier to kill u and just have confirmed town sitting around arguing between 2 choices instead of 3.

IF either of us 100% think that we could just get both herta/IV on our side and ur a wild card then i guess? I mean looking at it from that lense math has more reason to kill u than me.

But all this hypo talk is pointless. Vote skitter lets end the game.

[Firebringer]

What if it is 4 scum but just Val and Skitter? And Val is acting on inside knowledge?

honestly just dont see the point in all this discussion or how val89 comes to the conclusion that for some magical reason if skitter on the 2% isn't just scum here. He wouldn't just be here tomorrow to discuss this with u or me. how does Val89 think both:
a) it isn't just the extremely solution of skitter
b) that scum would kill him over the 2 clears.

He is taking setup spec as gospel but ignores basic mechanics while doing so.
Mind blowing

[Datisi]

skitter30,

mafia informed ninja

, has conceded.

Firebringer (

town informed 3-shot jailkeeper

), MathBlade (

town ninja doctor

), Val89, innocentvillager, and Herta (

vanilla townies

) survive and win.

[Datisi]

links will be edited into this post tomorrow, as i am about to go sleep.

thanks all for playing, especially to those that replaced in. i have received... valid criticism for the setup, i'm sorry the game turned out this way. as always, feedback is still encouraged.

the game is now unlocked for post-game discussion.

links:

main thread ~ viewtopic.php?f=2&t=90137
mod pt ~ viewtopic.php?f=90&t=90139
scum pt ~ viewtopic.php?f=90&t=90140
dead pt ~ viewtopic.php?f=90&t=90141
freedom pt ~ viewtopic.php?f=90&t=90152

events will go here:

d1: geraintm is a vanilla townie
n1:
- kittytacky watches pooky
- unwnd protects innocentvillager
- pooky kills innocentvillager (fails)

d2: enchant is a vanilla townie
n2:
- kittytacky watches val89
- mathblade protects innocentvillager
- firebringer jails mathblade (1/3)
- skitter kills mathblade

d3: pooky is a mafia ninja
n3:
- kittytacky watches toto
- mathblade protects firebringer
- firebringer jails skitter (2/3)
- ydrasse kills firebringer

d4: freedom is a vanilla townie
n4:
- kittytacky watches val89
- mathblade protects innocentvillager
- firebringer holsters
- ydrasse kills toto

d5: ydrasse is a mafia ninja
n5:
- kittytacky watches innocentvillager
- mathblade protects kittytacky
- firebringer jails herta (3/3)
- skitter kills kittytacky

[Firebringer]

thanks for modding datisi.
Now time to ban u from mini normals.

(i joke)

[skitter30]

I'm at a thing but i will have a lot to say later
Gg town, you played well
Thanks dats for modding

[Firebringer]

skitter the only critique i have of ur play is ur tunnel on herta became more unbelievable as time went on. especially today but other than that u got POEd scum and there wasn't much u can do. I think u played extremely well despite that and u handled my semi-guilty well enough that it made me question and reconsider it.

Idk what u and ydra were thinking though on that inno on u.