Micro 1070 | a micro normal | Endgame

[Gimli]

@aureal there is one thing I can do to help you townread me, actually. I noticed you received my suspicion of you positively, but argued that it looked premeditaded and like I already had that card to play and was waiting for the right moment. your ideas make a ton of sense but if you have time, I'd like to show you how my read on you developed throughout the game and especially in d3 after that changed. it's gonna be a little long, but I think if you do read through you're gonna figure out what to do next and we're gonna win, so it's worth the effort!

Spoiler: why I TRed you and how I started to SR you

I'll combine my thoughts on you and on alisae because that's really important in this stage of the game. I started my read strong townreading alisae, I felt e was participative and enabling positive conversations in the thread. I was also townreading you to some extent, but that was like 60% sheeping klick if I have to be honest. that started to change when in the catchup I saw alisae putting you in E-1, for a reasoning by myko that I don't think alisae, as town, would agree with. that made me go from locktowning er to putting er similarly to you. these are my thoughts after catchup:

I just played with aureal in a newbie and this just feels like it. I expect her to close down on people scumreading her, especially if it's for reasons she dislikes, and I view her reactions to myko as making a lot of sense for her and not scum posturing.

I was quite strong townreading ali and I still am, but putting aureal on E-1 and then going over mech the way e did was alarming to me. I wanna interact with the posts of er hardclaim because it might help me figure out what's going on, which I'll do in a bit.

then I started to investigate alisae. are my ideas about it potatoes? yes they are potatoes. but I was ignorant to the setup I'm a VT.

so I'm reading into alisae's claim with more attention now:

I’ll claim in full just to make things easier
Informed JOAT w/ w messenger shots and 2 fruit vendor shots.
I’m informed that if someone can perform a misc action, they have my role. So not only is this the JOAT shots but ALSO they are informed.
It’s the kind of role one looks at in this context and can easily go “yep, both wolves have this role” and I think writing said conclusion off entirely because my pm states that just because many exist with my role but it’s not necessary the same alignment is naive. Just considering the pov of a designer here and I can see someone wanting to design a game of this nature and call it complex.

alisae is an informed JOAT. if there is another JOAT, then it's also a JOAT with messenger and fruit vending shots. @ali if I understand this correctly, if there's another JOAT in the game then it has your EXACT role, right?

alisae goes on to modguess that this means there's a pool of informed JOATs and in this pool there's scum, right? the first idea is already a guess, because you might as well be the only crap JOAT in the game.

from town!alisae perspective, I think it might make sense to out all this information as you hunt for other JOATs. being a 9er, it could not be horrible. what I really don't get is how you go from your role card to guessing there could be 4-5 JOATs. no one else claimed JOAT as of yet, so it might as well be the case that the only JOAT is alisae.

idrk what to make of it, I don't agree with ali's takes but I might not be understanding them.

myko has focused artificially on aureal as well, I think. like that scumread that scum never drops cause it's a safe place to go push so myko never felt like reevaluating there. this post from d1 I didn't like (didn't say it at the time cause I was trying to kill aristeia):

hardomgusing his primary pusher is literally the easiest move for a scum under pressure to do.

Oh my. Do I have a wagon for you.

Can I interest you in Aureal?

I think this particular scumread is concerning when there are a few people in this game strong townreading aureal and some of us might have meta with her, so I don't feel like mykonian was acting in good faith around this scumread.

at this point I'm writing you off as a townie basically because there are weird pushes against you on top of you acting a way that felt like your town game, on top of klick strong TRing you.

then there's the andante flip and we wave kill and the claims.

I start to think of your slot again here:

I don't think myko is lying about the lazy psychologist part

so the POE is now me or aureal actually and aureal is townier

I'm offering my head and aristeia is arguing we should flip myko. we do end up flipping myko, but at that point I'm leaning more towards ali.

then I ask us to massclaim:

so we have
gimli - vt
aureal - vt
klick - vt
alisae - informed fruit
enchant - mason
ari - mason
myko - JOAT

that's it we have successfully massclaimed

I think all vts are vts

I think scum is in (alisae, myko)

It's completely different from here where she goes into a vote on me without talking about me at all till the vote, then coming up with logical reasons from the posts where I accuse her without actually calling out why I'm stupid to even think those reasons could apply to her here. She's not calling out the evidence, but calls out that I don't talk about andante when asked and instead talk about her.

VOTE: aureal

klick, what do you think of alisae putting aureal on E-1 here?

the vote and what e is quoting. I think it's an extremely unconvincing case by myko, and he seems to believe it, but I don't believe alisae believes in it

I’ll claim in full just to make things easier
Informed JOAT w/ w messenger shots and 2 fruit vendor shots.
I’m informed that if someone can perform a misc action, they have my role. So not only is this the JOAT shots but ALSO they are informed.
It’s the kind of role one looks at in this context and can easily go “yep, both wolves have this role” and I think writing said conclusion off entirely because my pm states that just because many exist with my role but it’s not necessary the same alignment is naive. Just considering the pov of a designer here and I can see someone wanting to design a game of this nature and call it complex.

both wolves have this role

VOTE: alisae

then we flip myko, enchant dies, come this gameday. what's my POE now? I'm locktowning klick, so it's either you or ali.

then I started to check your interactions. it wasn't premeditated or anything, I said what I was doing in the thread.

I started by pushing the narrative with alisae/andante partners. it made a lot of sense.

then I checked your interactions and they also made a lot of sense.

well my poe is alisae and aureal and I don't think aureal can fool klick so it's alisae

I wish she didn't dump a vote on me and left with a 'i'll take a nap' but I think her vote on andante looks fairly non partner-y?

I might have to re-read but really it's probably just alisae.

@ari: what was datisi's read on alisae before he subbed out? did enchant leave anything reads wise in the pt?

aureal's posts are pretty bad today

where's klick

there won't be an f3...

this is so annoying that if you're town you're throwing the game over arrogance. you're not attempting to sort me, you're not even reading back the game. I'm ISOing you and aureal and andante to see what jumps to surface, then I read my notifications and it's this crap. over an associative that's wrong you're tunneling me. how do you expect me to think you're town and catch aureal instead of just tunneling back?

andante was strong tr'ing aureal for most of the game

at some point they were both E-2 and she(andante) was really annoyed with it

then she started to walk back from that aureal townread

IDK what it means.

alisae spoke A LOT with andante. like, more with andante than with anyone else but datisi. and it wasn't for a scumread, it was for 'parsing out' andante, but all the questions were really softballs and could be construed to make it seem like they're unaligned and to help andante find her foot itg.

I wish aureal became obvtown at some point so I could be sure it's alisae but I guess that's not happening

it took me a while and I started to think you were scum, but you did start to obvtown in the last page or so, and I'm glad you did that cause I now I feel the only way we lose is by letting alisae endgame.

[Gimli]

I hope that helps.

[biancospino]

Votecount

VC 3-VIII

Alisae (2 = E-1):

Klick, Gimli

Gimli (1 = E-2):

Alisae

Not voting (2):

Aristeia, Aureal

With 5 alive, it takes 3 for an execution.

Deadline:

(expired on 2023-03-06 00:11:00)

Mod notes:

• I'm counting by hand, let me know if there's anything wrong.
  
• The combined mod ISO can be found here.
  
• Edited to fix an error.

[Gimli]

Votecount

VC 3-VIII

Gimli (1 = E-2):

Alisae

Aureal (1 = E-2):

Gimli

Not voting (3):

Aristeia, Klick, Aureal

With 5 alive, it takes 3 for an execution.

Deadline:

(expired on 2023-03-06 00:11:00)

Mod notes:

• I'm counting by hand, let me know if there's anything wrong.
  
• The combined mod ISO can be found here.

Me and klick are voting alisae

[biancospino]

Yep, sorry. Most likely what happened is that I saw there were no differences with the latest VC, but then copied the wrong one. Should be fixed now.

[Aureal]

Re: who started being emotional itt, I only started acting out when alisae told aristeia to vote me cause she owed er for voting myko on D2. There were some parts of D3 I felt unheard and like I'm chopped liver.

Hey, at least you mattered enough for people to care about you on D2. I woke up to talk about masons and claims and stuff and so I claimed as asked and speculated a little bit about the setup, went to look up some more info on what exactly those roles people had were, got tired and took a nap and came back to the day being over.

And all of his posturing about how it's so obvious he's town doesn't do anything for me. I know, I'm not very good at this yet, I don't need lectures about it.

Idk if it's that smart to respond to this, cause it won't necessarily help you with my alignment (and like I said in D1 I fully expected you to never townread me this game). But I would never call myself obvtown. I said I played a great d1 cause that's what I feel about my D1. I took a slot that was sussed by the masons and not TRed by anyone and helped us getting a scum flip.

That would also be what you needed to do as scum though, since Andante was already getting heat from a good few people and just didn't seem likely to be able to make it through the game. So I guess you're right, it was a good day 1 for you, whichever alignment you are.

What triggered emotional responses from me was people talking over me, not reading what I'm saying and not taking me into consideration. I feel like I'd be equally upset with that if I was scum. I've been upset with that as scum.

I offered my flip both d2 and this gameday as a reaction to alisaes tunnel. Is that good mafia playing? No it's not. But I don't mean to be manipulative or LAMIST with it. Everytime I said my flip would be good I meant it.

Of course, I don't need to flip. We can just win at any point now. Game's pretty much over imo.

It does feel kind of manipulative, especially when you follow it with stuff like the last line, lol. I just don't have the experience to tell me what to make of it. It's supposed to be anti-town for town to be self-voting/hammering, per mafia theory such as on the wiki. But in my first game back, I was tunnelled on Elements all of day 3 and she offered to vote herself so I could hammer if that would help me look beyond her. I took it as manipulation and of course didn't do anything with the offer, went into the f3 still tunnelled on her and of course was wrong there. I look back at that and realize I could've won that if I'd taken the offer. Well, figured the actual scum out, anyway- actually hammering her there probably would've made sure I got pinned as the scum in the f3.

[Aureal]

@aureal there is one thing I can do to help you townread me, actually. I noticed you received my suspicion of you positively, but argued that it looked premeditaded and like I already had that card to play and was waiting for the right moment. your ideas make a ton of sense but if you have time, I'd like to show you how my read on you developed throughout the game and especially in d3 after that changed. it's gonna be a little long, but I think if you do read through you're gonna figure out what to do next and we're gonna win, so it's worth the effort!

You are telling me to vote Alisae, yes, I get it. I don't think Aristeia is satisfied with that yet (well I mean yeah, she can hammer anytime if she is obviously ) so I don't think I'll be doing that. I guess I'm finding a little more reason to lean back that way, thinking about things more. I remembered thinking you seemed an awful lot like you were being very buddy-buddy with Klick on day 1 and maybe that was making me more wary of you, especially after just seeing you manage to pull off a mutual mega-TR with skitter. Reading back through stuff though, maybe that sensation was just all coming from the post where you agreed to vote Andante with him.

Also, I realized that if Andante was actually intentionally doing the stuff where she townread me early to set me up later as a possible partner, given her erratic style and lack of reading the game it might well have been a partner's idea. And that wouldn't be so likely from Gimli's slot given Herta's lack of presence. I dunno though, maybe someone who's more familiar with Andante has a better idea about whether she makes plans like that.

[Aristeia]

I'm fine with it tbh. Hope I am wrong and it just ends with Alisae

[Alisae]

VOTE: alisae

[biancospino]

Votecount

VC 3-final

Alisae (3 = HAMMER):

Klick, Gimli, Alisae

Not voting (2):

Aristeia, Aureal

With 5 alive, it took 3 for an execution.

Deadline:

(expired on 2023-03-06 00:11:00)

Mod notes:

• The combined mod ISO can be found here.

[biancospino]

A victory condition has been achieved.

Spoiler:

Alisae was shot with a silver bullet. E was a

Werewolf Informed Jack-of-All-Trades (FruitVendor, FruitVendor, Messenger, Messenger)

.

The Werewolf threat has been exterminated. The

Village

won.

Aristeia, Aureal, Gimli, Klick

survived and won.

mykonian, Wavelength, Enchant

won posthumously.

[biancospino]

Actions, PMs and links incoming.
The thread is now open for post-game discussion.

[biancospino]

Here was the setup:

VILLAGE
1 Mason Informed [all miscellaneous roles are identical]
1 Mason Inspector
1 JOAT (personal Reporter, SG, lazy Psychologist)
4 VTs

WOLVES
1 Informed JOAT(FV, FV, Messenger, Messenger)
[There is a Village Informed who knows...]
1 Informed JOAT(FV, FV, Messenger, Messenger)
[there is a Psychologist]

[Alisae]

lmfao

[Aristeia]

yay ty for modding biancospino

glad I was wrong ^_^

[Klick]

Gg Alisae! I'm sorry if my approach on D3 was slightly frustrating, I was feeling really confident that everyone else was town and didn't feel confident that a fully open 1 on 1 conversation with you would end well for town.

I feel really good about my reads this game. I had Andante/Alisae as the solve in my head on like Page 3.

[Alisae]

Gg Alisae! I'm sorry if my approach on D3 was slightly frustrating, I was feeling really confident that everyone else was town and didn't feel confident that a fully open 1 on 1 conversation with you would end well for town.

I couldn't do anything lmfao

[Alisae]

I also felt like I didn't have a partner.
Posted in PT multiple times push me for massclaim idea
they just didn't

[biancospino]

All role pms:

Alisae

Welcome to Micro 1070!

You are a

Werewolf Informed Jack-of-All-Trades (FruitVendor, FruitVendor, Messenger, Messenger)

.

You know that the Wolves' faction is composed of you and Andante.

You have the following factional abilities:

• Wolf chat
  — you can talk with the other members of the Wolves' faction at any time here.
  
• Wolf kill
  — each night, if no other member of the Wolves' faction use this ability, you may target a living player. Assuming no interference with your action, your target will die.

You have the following nonfactional passive abilities:

• Informed
  — you know that there is a Psychologist.

You have the following nonfactional active abilities, but you may only use one of them each night:

• two-shots FruitVendor
  — each night, but only twice during the game, you may target a living player. Assuming no interference with your action, your target will receive a piece of fruit.
  
• two-shots Messenger
  — each night, but only twice during the game, you may target a living player and compose a message. Assuming no interference with your action, your target will receive from the moderator the message you composed.

You win when at least one member of the Wolves' faction is alive and all members of the Village's faction are dead, or when nothing can prevent the same.

The game thread is located here.
Confirm by replying to this PM with ta summary of your role, or by posting the same in the Wolves' PT.

Andante

Welcome to Micro 1070!

You are a

Werewolf Informed Jack-of-All-Trades (FruitVendor, FruitVendor, Messenger, Messenger)

.

You know that the Wolves' faction is composed of you and Alisae.

You have the following factional abilities:

• Wolf chat
  — you can talk with the other members of the Wolves' faction at any time here.
  
• Wolf kill
  — each night, if no other member of the Wolves' faction use this ability, you may target a living player. Assuming no interference with your action, your target will die.

You have the following nonfactional passive abilities:

• Informed
  — you know that there is a Town Informed who received the following information:
  "All players who can perform a Miscellaneous action have the same role, but not necessarily the same alignment."

You have the following nonfactional active abilities, but you may only use one of them each night:

• two-shots FruitVendor
  — each night, but only twice during the game, you may target a living player. Assuming no interference with your action, your target will receive a piece of fruit.
  
• two-shots Messenger
  — each night, but only twice during the game, you may target a living player and compose a message. Assuming no interference with your action, your target will receive from the moderator the message you composed.

You win when at least one member of the Wolves' faction is alive and all members of the Village's faction are dead, or when nothing can prevent the same.

The game thread is located here.
Confirm by replying to this PM with ta summary of your role, or by posting the same in the Wolves' PT.

Aristeia

Welcome to Micro 1070!

You are a

Village Mason Informed

.

You have the following passive abilities:

• Informed
  — you know that all players who can perform a Miscellaneous action have the same role, but not necessarily the same alignment.
  (Note: Miscellaneous actions are those of Neighborizer, FriendlyNeighbor, Hider, FruitVendor, Visitor, Messenger, and Checker)
  
  
• Mason
  — you know that Datisi is a Mason and is aligned with the Village, and you can talk with them at any time here.

You have no active abilities.

You win when at least one member of the Village's faction is alive and all members of the Wolves' faction are dead.

The game thread is located here.
Confirm by replying to this PM with a summary of your role.

Datisi

Welcome to Micro 1070!

You are a

Village Mason Inspector

.

You have the following passive abilities:

• Mason
  — you know that Aristeia is a Mason and is aligned with the Village, and you can talk with them at any time here.

You have the following active abilities:

• Inspector
  — each night, you may target a living player. Assuming no interference with your action, you will discover whether or not any player other than you targeted your target this night. If this action fails, you will get a "no result" PM.

You win when at least one member of the Village's faction is alive and all members of the Wolves' faction are dead.

The game thread is located here.
Confirm by replying to this PM with a summary of your role.

mykonian

Welcome to Micro 1070!

You are a

Village Jack-of-all-Trades (personal Reporter, SecurityGuard, lazy Psychologist)

.

You have no passive abilities.

You have the following active abilities, but you may only use one of them each night:

• one-shot personal Reporter
  — each night, but only once during the game, you may target a living player. Assuming no interference with your action, you will discover whether or not your target used a nonfactional active ability this night. If this action fails, you will get a "no result" PM.
  
• one-shot SecurityGuard
  — each night, but only once during the game, you may target a living player. Assuming no interference with your action, your target will discover which players other than you targeted them this night.
  
• one-shot lazy Psychologist
  — each night, but only once during the game, if at least two anti-Village players were alive at the start of the night, you may target a living player. Assuming no interference with your action, you will discover whether or not you target has an unused active killing ability. If this action fails, you will get a "no result" PM.

You win when at least one member of the Village's faction is alive and all members of the Wolves' faction are dead.

The game thread is located here.
Confirm by replying to this PM with a summary of your role.

Herta, Klick, Wavelength, Aureal

Welcome to Micro 1070!

You are a

Villager

.

You have no passive abilities.

You have no active abilities.

You win when at least one member of the Village's faction is alive and all members of the Wolves' faction are dead.

The game thread is located here.
Confirm by replying to this PM with a summary of your role.

[Alisae]

Don't feel like it was worth the energy tbh
I can't win by myself in these conditions, too much.
I needed something catastrophic to go wrong today but that never ended up happening and the longer the day phase goes on the more likely it is that I just die

[Alisae]

also ig ari being informed does make more sense than me thinking aureal lied.
I thought the person who was informed also had my role but it seemed like my idea just made me end up be a fish out of water but I think I played it fine

[Alisae]

no wonder Datisi thought it was pointless lmfao

[biancospino]

All actions:

N1 actions:

Alisae KILL: Wavelength ⟶ Wavelength dies.
Alisae VEND: Aristeia ⟶ Aristeia receives Fruit
mykonian SG: Aristeia ⟶ Aristeia receives SG report (Alisae, Enchant)
Enchant INSPECT: Aristeia ⟶ Enchant gets positive result

N2 Actions:

Alisae KILL: Enchant ⟶ Enchant dies.
Alisae MAIL: Aristeia ⟶ Aristeia receives "you have received some strawberries."
Enchant INSP: Gimli ⟶ Enchants gets negative result

[Alisae]

I shot wave because I thought he was my psychologist and also I could leave Klick alive for 1 more day.
turns out I was wrong because I did not identify masonry

[Alisae]

honestly to win I feel like I had to play perfectly + a better d1 + something has to go wrong in village
maybe under those conditions I could take Ari to F3 with Klick and Ari votes Klick there.

But given how this day phase played out I think that happening became slimmer and slimmer

ya idunno it's really hard