Mini 2332: A Mid-scummer Nights Dream II | GG

[Kyoko Kirigiri]

have a good night. I'll go take a shower too. will help with my anxiety. maybe others can show up and end this duel one way or another by when we come back.

[Kyoko Kirigiri]

I do not believe:

- that they thought it in first place. it was just them developing a "hidden risen" for having catgirl neighborized as I questioned what was its purpose. the theory makes no sense in first place neighter design wise, nor even semantical wise. a fucking mass public neighborizer jail keeper?
- that they didnt think of asking mod for clarifying their own role if this was a true suspicioun
- that they thought to get catgirl if they thought it has protective aspect.
- that they thought to get their first town reads sunflower, suggest second townread aureal and then prism and catgirl their town leans in it if they thought it will block them
- that this was a hydra thought and they really put any thought in such theory and possible targets for it together

plus they put out that protective part later out as people started questioning the ridiculousness of the role block part and the target choice for that alongside me, to make their targets make more sense.

how can not one see how that story got adopted in three pages to get where it got? completely out of hands

this in addition of that aureal public neighborhood call in night 1 which is a fucking scum tell and I dont know why no one else but me sees it

please vote von.

Vote me or von today.

if you vote me and I flipped green please get von and catgirl.

if you vote von and they will flip red get catgirl.

bye

[Sunflower]

I have conflicting feelings about sunflower. on one hand They are the only one solving in public neighborhoods, yet they are stuck to a single read and barely talk about anything else in game. I wonder what they think about von and current game state today

for ravens, they are just not in game almost at all and I dont vomit reads that I dont have.

If by any chance 2% I was wrong on you, I think its one of them, but I very so slightly scumlean both of them

how is having an almost null read so wierd for you? Whats your current reads on every single slot that is in game?

pretty unmotivated from game and i'm currently trying to reread and reforumlate stuff but tbh the early pages are a serious drag to get through

[ActionDan]

Adjacently related I would unequivocally deem both the dream revealer and the dream reuser as town

[Sunflower]

Also i have been evaluating them. Thats why i was questinjng why they chose the people they did fo neighborhood. I was slowly warming up to the idea of them just being town with very complicated or meh motives with them and still that qureal call out felt super fake and out of place to me. I pressired that question and this came out of it.

I am sure they are scum. You say what would scum gain from saying this. Its not like tgey volunteered the info out of nowhere. Their choice of catgirl was already wierd even before the thory and i was pushing it. They acted as there was a hidden motive and this was made to explain that.

You say why i cant see a town doing it. What kind of question is that? Why would a town fake having a theory to justify their neighborhood?

Before the theory contradictions the action of choosing catgirl could have been explaine by a town having a meh logic. But now it cant be. They are just scum

i don't think they faked a theory if they're town, i just think they didn't explain it very clearly or think about it very hard, and it's pretty visible that the two heads have different mindsets about it and also different reads which affected how they answered. if you track through what they say i don't see much inconsistency

your pressure about them recruiting catgirls not making sense is another point where it feels like you're being very selective with what you look at and are choosing to ignore the things that don't support your point. you say their recruitment of catgirls doesn't make sense but you are not really taking the next step of natural inquiry into "well, okay, who should they recruit instead?"

- us, they townread but already recruited
- ydra, said she wouldn't be a good choice for the hood
- you, they suspect
- silver ravens, they don't townread and also are pretty absent
- enchant uhhh would be an interesting choice
- actiondan, i don't think they townread
- prism, mixed reads between the heads but she said she'd be busy and unavailable. initially you said she asked for it but she did not, see 1641

basically idk who you think would have been a dramatically better choice for them? they have no strong townreads that want to be in the hood or aren't already in there, and then there's several players that are closer to nullish or they want to sort, and catgirls is probably one of the more likely to be talkative among them

and even if you say they should be grilling a scumread, if they scumread you then giving you a platform during the night is probably like actively anti-town

kind of relatedly i actually think the fact that catgirls choose didn't use the hood much when they had the opportunity to is more likely to come from town from them even if at the time i found it somewhat frustrating

[Sunflower]

all that said i do think drew being like "oh yeah?? well who's our buddy??" is bizarre when kyoko has been like very clear on that

[Kyoko Kirigiri]

so catgirl was their strongest next town read after prism? They town read any of the other slots?

I would acccept that as an explanation if it was coming from them, I cant accept the explanation that they were a null read that they were suspecting might be pocketing them and both heads town lean on. in comparison to having you as their highest town read chosen night 1.

But this was just me questioning to understand where they were coming from

They said they had a hidden risen for choosing catgirls and upon asking more black went "to role block them" then " to protect them" to make it make sense, which made absoloutly nothing to make sense. what they said afterward was fake, made no sense with actions they took and was a bunch of contradictions and them trying to fix their story as it was getting questioned.

[Kyoko Kirigiri]

My main reason for scum reading them before them going full obv scum in those three pages, was the bit where black said they want aureal on night 2 neighborized. while they were porttrayiong having aureal as their second town read, there was no need to make such announcement if they didnt have any ulterior motive/didnt think they need to set the game state and tone for it

The whole bit they had about town reading aureal, the read they made and that part mentioning it was scummy.

Now they are just blown out obvscum for that pack of contraditions.

[Kyoko Kirigiri]

I do not believe:

- that they thought it in first place. it was just them developing a "hidden risen" for having catgirl neighborized as I questioned what was its purpose. the theory makes no sense in first place neighter design wise, nor even semantical wise. a fucking mass public neighborizer jail keeper?
- that they didnt think of asking mod for clarifying their own role if this was a true suspicioun
- that they thought to get catgirl if they thought it has protective aspect.
- that they thought to get their first town reads sunflower, suggest second townread aureal and then prism and catgirl their town leans in it if they thought it will block them
- that this was a hydra thought and they really put any thought in such theory and possible targets for it together

plus they put out that protective part later out as people started questioning the ridiculousness of the role block part and the target choice for that alongside me, to make their targets make more sense.

how can not one see how that story got adopted in three pages to get where it got? completely out of hands

this in addition of that aureal public neighborhood call in night 1 which is a fucking scum tell and I dont know why no one else but me sees it

please vote von.

like read these. how any of these can make sense as a town? how can you believe that it was a real thought process what they posted?

[Von Payne]

all that said i do think drew being like "oh yeah?? well who's our buddy??" is bizarre when kyoko has been like very clear on that

Admittedly I was being a bit snarky, I was gonna keep the big going by saying Chipotle was too easy of an answer lol

[Kyoko Kirigiri]

so catgirl was their strongest next town read after prism? They town read any of the other slots?

I would acccept that as an explanation if it was coming from them, I cant accept the explanation that they were a null read that they were suspecting might be pocketing them and both heads town lean on. in comparison to having you as their highest town read chosen night 1.

But this was just me questioning to understand where they were coming from

They said they had a hidden risen for choosing catgirls and upon asking more black went "to role block them" then " to protect them" to make it make sense, which made absoloutly nothing to make sense. what they said afterward was fake, made no sense with actions they took and was a bunch of contradictions and them trying to fix their story as it was getting questioned.

hidden reason*

[Kyoko Kirigiri]

all that said i do think drew being like "oh yeah?? well who's our buddy??" is bizarre when kyoko has been like very clear on that

Admittedly I was being a bit snarky, I was gonna keep the big going by saying Chipotle was too easy of an answer lol

I dont wanna developed linked reads. but I individually hard scum read catgirl and they make sense as your partner

yes

But we are 100% scum though, right?

You can still lim us, but wouldn't finding out buddy be more helpful to town now?

I cant see how would that be a legit question or concern you would post if you actually read past 3 4 pages

Why not?

You apparently have the game solved, finding our buddy should be easy since they allowed us to drop the ball like this, right?

Snarky you say?

You asking this repeatedly is being snarky how? This was legit discrediting as far as it can go

[Von Payne]

My main reason for scum reading them before them going full obv scum in those three pages, was the bit where black said they want aureal on night 2 neighborized. while they were porttrayiong having aureal as their second town read, there was no need to make such announcement if they didnt have any ulterior motive/didnt think they need to set the game state and tone for it

The whole bit they had about town reading aureal, the read they made and that part mentioning it was scummy.

Now they are just blown out obvscum for that pack of contraditions.

Again, neither of us took into account that having a hidden role would be bastard(and therefore next to impossible), so how can we ask the mod for clarification on something that doesn't exist in our role PM??

It was N1 that I had the thought that they might be a protective role, which I made a post in the Hood alluding to, and I had the town read on Aureal and we pretty much decided that she would be our N2 target for the hood.

After the start of D2 my town read on Aureal was challenged by pretty clear evidence that she was scum, and also around that time Black was thinking we might be more role stopping or jail keeping, which I believe was when we jokingly but not jokingly talked about targeting Chipotle for the hood

Black wasn't really around and Aureal was close to being limmed so I chose Prism as our target, but changed it to Chipotle basically last minute since Prism said they would be barely active at night(if there is anything big to criticize it would be this, I was more focused on having someone active).

Black also wasn't as sure as Chipotle being town as me so she thought if they were scum it could potentially her role blocking theory

This is how it all went down, there were some pivots that we made, but no real contradictions. Again you are just finding maybe some hydra dissonance and/or both heads responding to questions at the same time without talking about things as 'contradictions'.

And again, in what scum world where we.....with another buddy btw, would we play like this?

And I just alluded to it, I was being snarky asking about who our buddy would be......but I also want all your cards out on the table so if we are mislimmed you can't just say all 'oopsies, my bad everyone....no one's perfect right?'

[Sunflower]

sunflower, how can you see my push on von forced and alisaes push on me normal?

my push couldnt have been more elaborate and percise and based on actual detailed contradiction hunt of actions and claims. This couldn't have been even more baseless and snarky. They drop these one liners to discredit me and my attempts, shade me and my direction and rally people up without even stating a single reason for their reads.

this is kind of what i was saying earlier though

i think you're conflating "argumentatively correct" with "is town"

i think for example alisae's initial read on the von payne situation starting from 2064 as making no sense but then coming back around fairly quickly to thinking it doesn't happen if they're a wolf feels like a town evaluating and weighing both sides genuinely

i think alisae's push on you would look fairly similar as either alignment and it's not really factoring in to my read on the slot

detailed and precise doesn't necessarily mean town, i think you can do that well as both alignments. to me what i think is the difference is what you choose to ignore and whether your pushing is coming from a place of agenda or if it's coming from genuinely trying to look at the full picture and solve the game from a perspective of "is this something that is more likely for a wolf to do or for town to do?"

[Von Payne]

And yes I am discrediting you, because you are completely wrong, basically about everything.

And you have been discrediting us since basically the start of the day.

You haven't given us a smidgen of a fair chance here, and ironically doing exactly what Ali said you would do as scum(according to them)

[Sunflower]

My main reason for scum reading them before them going full obv scum in those three pages, was the bit where black said they want aureal on night 2 neighborized. while they were porttrayiong having aureal as their second town read, there was no need to make such announcement if they didnt have any ulterior motive/didnt think they need to set the game state and tone for it

The whole bit they had about town reading aureal, the read they made and that part mentioning it was scummy.

i still don't think there is a reason to do it as scum though

like what specifically is the ulterior motive

[Sunflower]

hmm wait a minute

[Sunflower]

oh nvm misread something

[Kyoko Kirigiri]

the ulterior motive was to answer a question that was being repeatedly asked of them in 4 pages and they made a tactical mistake on it to declare they had a hidden motive for going with catgirl as their choice. so they felt the need to make one and it made no sense, so they changed it and it still made no sense and they kept working on it to make a full story that makes a bit of sense.

yet it still holds many contradiction that I listed above.

I dont follow how alisaes push as town could be this baseless. I dont think they made any read on von or my slot and I think its been faked and they are sticking with this scum read on me and hope to brute force it to a conclusion and then get out of it on later days when there is no voice left in game pushing them/saying concerns for them.

and I have no ulterior agenda. I just probably never ever felt more confident of a scumread almost ever before and I think I already saw the the future and how von will flip red if we lim them. This is how confident I am.

[Kyoko Kirigiri]

And yes I am discrediting you, because you are completely wrong, basically about everything.

And you have been discrediting us since basically the start of the day.

You haven't given us a smidgen of a fair chance here, and ironically doing exactly what Ali said you would do as scum(according to them)

You are discrediting me having a read on other slots in game. Not even my read on your slot.

This makes no fucking sense.

[Kyoko Kirigiri]

both heads had aureal as night 2 addition suggestion and it was discussed night 1 or was it only the blacks read?

[Kyoko Kirigiri]

sunflower, how can you see my push on von forced and alisaes push on me normal?

my push couldnt have been more elaborate and percise and based on actual detailed contradiction hunt of actions and claims. This couldn't have been even more baseless and snarky. They drop these one liners to discredit me and my attempts, shade me and my direction and rally people up without even stating a single reason for their reads.

i think for example alisae's initial read on the von payne situation starting from 2064 as making no sense but then coming back around fairly quickly to thinking it doesn't happen if they're a wolf feels like a town evaluating and weighing both sides genuinely

I think that was anything but evaluating btw. It was such a performance that made me eek this morning. It was one of the reasons that heat me up on my scumreads this morning. Marias head acted lost questioned and dropped responsibility on alisae, cause THERE ARE THE CONTRADICTIONS no one can deny.

then alisae painted over it with there is no ulterior motive gag you also mentioned but has nothing to do with contraditions and went back on the brute force on me using it. completely ignoring the blatantly obvious adoptation that happened in story and all these glowing points that he should have caught upon reading.

It felt soooo performative.

[Sunflower]

I do not believe:

- that they thought it in first place. it was just them developing a "hidden risen" for having catgirl neighborized as I questioned what was its purpose. the theory makes no sense in first place neighter design wise, nor even semantical wise. a fucking mass public neighborizer jail keeper?
- that they didnt think of asking mod for clarifying their own role if this was a true suspicioun
- that they thought to get catgirl if they thought it has protective aspect.
- that they thought to get their first town reads sunflower, suggest second townread aureal and then prism and catgirl their town leans in it if they thought it will block them
- that this was a hydra thought and they really put any thought in such theory and possible targets for it together

plus they put out that protective part later out as people started questioning the ridiculousness of the role block part and the target choice for that alongside me, to make their targets make more sense.

how can not one see how that story got adopted in three pages to get where it got? completely out of hands

this in addition of that aureal public neighborhood call in night 1 which is a fucking scum tell and I dont know why no one else but me sees it

please vote von.

like read these. how any of these can make sense as a town? how can you believe that it was a real thought process what they posted?

yes ive read them

1 and 2) if it's so ridiculous of a thought for town to have then it's equally as ridiculous of a thought for scum to have. i think it's fairly clear that either way they thought it seemed possible, i don't see how that points to alignment

3 and 4) if they're not sure whether it might have protective or roleblocking aspect and it's just a theory that they're slightly factoring in to their choices (which is what they've said) then im not sure why this is an issue. there's some inconsistencies in the way they explain it but i think that mostly it comes from different heads responding and having different ideas/reads

5) it does seem like they did not put a lot of thought into it or talk to each other that much about it. that is true lol. i think that is something that's possible to come from town though

like idk i think these are not really the points that are worth arguing for me bc i read them as town for other reasons and so i am probably more generous in being able to see how these things could come from town. and if you scumread them for other reasons then you will see it as obvious signs that they're scum

thats why to me the more important point is the other reasons because i think that it's fairly understandable that if you are town you would be seeing things in this way

[Von Payne]

And yes I am discrediting you, because you are completely wrong, basically about everything.

And you have been discrediting us since basically the start of the day.

You haven't given us a smidgen of a fair chance here, and ironically doing exactly what Ali said you would do as scum(according to them)

You are discrediting me having a read on other slots in game. Not even my read on your slot.

This makes no fucking sense.

No I was discrediting your read on us, more specifically making fun of your 'this is 100% scum' proclamation. So snarkily(not a word lol) asking you to solve the rest of the game right now. Like I said I was going to continue and call you saying Chipotle is laughable, but I was busy at work and just decided to stop

both heads had aureal as night 2 addition suggestion and it was discussed night 1 or was it only the blacks read?

As I said before, I was convinced as Aureal as scum on D1 and was adamant to Black about it.

[Sunflower]

idk maybe im dumb and they should be obvious but i don't really see major contradictions that aren't explained by

1) the two heads having differing perspectives on things

2) them not being exactly sure whether they think their role would be protective or role blocking or neither and it more just being a vague theory