Open 778: Nightless Vanilla [Game Over!]

[Elements]

VOTE: votata
your name clearly wants to be voted

[Elements]

VOTE: elements

Its votato lol

potato potata same diference

[Elements]

VOTE: humaneatingmonkey
I like this plan

[Elements]

Human vs Elements wagons, lets go

[Elements]

I son't like votata's "ooh look idk what a town role pm is i must be scum oooh look oooh" (read int Morty's voice)

[Elements]

I like isis although that coulld be just because they've expressed my play so far is town indicative

[Elements]

I'm thinking looker town atm and fire town

[Elements]

Votato do you have a red role pm?

nope. mine is blue, or whatever the town color is.

and im still waiting for people with the red PMs to out... would be very helpful for some outside research im doing

Who else got a red rule pm?

[Elements]

Who on earth is Albert B. Rampage and where have they gone

[Elements]

Norway were you town or mafia in haunted village?

[Elements]

cycle man seems to be being deliberately obstreperous which doesn't help anyone. Valid lynch option atm.
I've warmed to monkey but that could just be because he tr's me now.
I still don't like votata.
VOTE: votata

[Elements]

idk about crayola. I'm also not sure about all these town reads on me. I used to be very explosive and get scum read day 1 a lot so i'm not used to it. pls explain why I'm town

[Elements]

cycle man seems to be being deliberately obstreperous which doesn't help anyone. Valid lynch option atm.
I've warmed to monkey but that could just be because he tr's me now.
I still don't like votata.
VOTE: votata

What do you think about the human/votata interaction?

can you point me there

[Elements]

Y'all are legally obligated to tell me your main if this is an alt, and if I have ever played with you. Otherwise the FBI will arrest you.

I'm not an alt, but I watch you play in the living room every day.

Everyone who isn’t voting for one of the top three on the vc is playing wrong.

How insulting

---

• @humaneatingmonkey: Hopefully you're still capable of playing while being "annoyed". Also, define "better place".
  • Also, also, we won't all see things as alignment-indicative through your perspective - especially when your perspective is self-centered

VOTE: Elements

Don't mkae me call you out as scum day one again Looker. It'll look bad for you.

[Elements]

Elements is getting sketchier.

Green Crayons why do you think it's "playing wrong" not to be on a leading wagon in the early game?

[Elements]

in answer to your question crayola, i don't get much from it rn but will revisit it when one of them flips.

[Elements]

I'm thinking looker town atm and fire town

why is looker and fire town? tell me where your head was in post 82.

Looker is playing differently to the game I played with him when he was scum. His posts are more organic and there's generally a lot of contrast.
Fire feels the same as every other game I've played with him. And that feeling is town.

[Elements]

Fire feels the same as every other game I've played with him. And that feeling is town.

So you've had experience where Firebringer was scum?

Turns out I got Looker and ultimateplank confused, I've got no read on looker

[Elements]

half here

[Elements]

half here

wheres the other half?

Playing magic and putting up rock wool

[Elements]

I believe Elements was confused as I was that Isis was serious in her proposition.

What gives you that impression?

[Elements]

am i wrong?

yes

[Elements]

I thought it was a reasonable plan, still don't rlly see what's wrong with it tbh

[Elements]

where's this ide that I thought it was a joke coming from?
g

[Elements]

lmao

thank you, I like to think I'm funny

[Elements]

sometimes he even gets modkilled for not violating site rules, that's how fun scumteams think it is to kill him

I love you xx

[Elements]

I want to change my vote and I've decided on
VOTE: cycle men
for their atrocious entrance.

[Elements]

VOTE: Elements

took you long enough, why so hesitant?

[Elements]

You've been voting votata most of the game with me, that's the first time you've voted me. why you not keeping track of your vote?

[Elements]

so I can discredit your case against me

[Elements]

It's not your not keeping track of your vote, it's that you were voting the same as me despite thinking I'm scum and not changing your vote until I did

[Elements]

did you vote cycle men as a reaction test?

no, but it acted as one because you changed your vote

[Elements]

did you vote cycle men as a reaction test?

no, but it acted as one because you changed your vote

scrap that
no it was not a reaction test

[Elements]

I'm 100% sure Elements is scum

what do you think about votata?

[Elements]

Mislead town

[Elements]

but it's a lean not a strong read

[Elements]

Also, who do you think is misleading me?

Maybe blinded is a better way of putting it. I think you're misleading yourself

[Elements]

You said it was a reaction test, and then not a reaction test, so my understanding is your vote makes you think you got an alignment indicative read on me.

What is it?

I don't think you 100% think I'm scum. Did my change of vote increase how scummy you think I am?

[Elements]

hasnt elements now on two occasions answered a question one way and then immediately backtracked?

when was the other time?

[Elements]

I believe Elements was confused as I was that Isis was serious in her proposition.

ooooooooooooooooooooooooh
I read this wrong, my bad. I read it as "Elements was confused with the idea" rather than "Elements thought it was serious".
This is fun. I should learn to read.

[Elements]

Lots of abrasive questions, nitpicks, and snark — but he doesn't feel like he's actually solving the game

I don't agree.

Neither do I.

[Elements]

VOTE: cycle men

[Elements]

someone hammer without warning, it'll be funny

[Elements]

VOTE: fire
now we got twoooo wagons

[Elements]

VOTE: fire
for now mostly to try to make EoD more interesting

VOTE: fire
now we got twoooo wagons

within two minutes we get these two shit votes? jeez wtf is this

I wanted to make it spicy
I'm more than happy to go back to cycle men

[Elements]

VOTE: norway

[Elements]

why are you starting a new wagon this late?

[Elements]

if you do that it's just going to be an inevitable cycle men lynch. Everyone wants a lynch and cycle men has the most so the people on it are most likely just gonna leave their votes there adn wait for everyone to panic move onto him.
I'm happy for a cycle or human lynch but i'd prefer the latter
VOTE: human

[Elements]

scrap that, human is pretty locktown for me now
VOTE: cycle

[Elements]

scrap that, human is pretty locktown for me now

this swing happened because i've just looked through the votecounts and human has been the only one to vote me so far this game. If he were scum I'd have expected him to get his buddies to at least push me as I've so lynchable. that hasn't happened even slightly so human = town

[Elements]

scrap that, human is pretty locktown for me now

this swing happened because i've just looked through the votecounts and human has been the only one to vote me so far this game. If he were scum I'd have expected him to get his buddies to at least push me as I've so lynchable. that hasn't happened even slightly so human = town

what
you've been considered a scumread by multiple people for a long time this game

but no one has voted me or rlly pushed for my lynch except human.

[Elements]

ok i don't like Alisae anymore after those reads they seem as fake as Donald trumps hair

[Elements]

unless we gonna flashwagon Elements
Im down for that

why do you think I'm scum?

[Elements]

unless we gonna flashwagon Elements
Im down for that

why do you think I'm scum?

ur lolcatting with ur vote and not solving

and scum would do that because?

[Elements]

VOTE: Notwegian

nah i don't agree
i don't think norwee thinks im scum but also thinks im annoying at the same time
those are conflicting thought processes

now who's flip flopping

[Elements]

unless we gonna flashwagon Elements
Im down for that

why do you think I'm scum?

ur lolcatting with ur vote and not solving

and scum would do that because?

there's no town motivation lmao

that's not why scum would do it

[Elements]

like there is NO town motivations to your actions

there's even less scum motivations.
Is there a way i could possibly be drawing more attention to myself.
There was a pretty much confirmed lynch on not me before i started posting.
Why do I, as scum, come in like a beyblade bashing around everyone getting my opinion out there as scum when I could easily have just sat back and watch a lynch.

[Elements]

YEP YEP we're killing Elements boyz

Elements is panicking because I 180'd on Norwee and decided to call them out for being scummy, mostly because calling me fake and shading me is their first reaction instead of trying to ask questions to get an opinion.

my reaction has nothing to do with norwee.

[Elements]

you are not solving or trying to form reads

except that I nod reads on both you and human I didn't have before

[Elements]

if cycle flips scum we get gc town, ail scum, norwee town

[Elements]

Cycle as scum doesn’t really have a motive to challenge the validity of a counter wagon to his lynch.

wait, is this pro scum!cycle?

[Elements]

Cycle as scum doesn’t really have a motive to challenge the validity of a counter wagon to his lynch.

wait, is this pro scum!cycle?

i believe it's a town!cycle consideration

in that case scum!cycle =/= town!gc

[Elements]

if cycle flips scum we get gc town, ail scum, norwee town

lmao ur scum dude
cycle men as scum with me votes you by now

is this a scum slip?

[Elements]

ok so I'm thinking Ali, cycle, someone not currently active as the scum team.

[Elements]

Don't want to comment on your scum slip Ali?

[Elements]

human suddenly defending elements makes me feel like he never intended to push that way in the first place and is just doing it for the sake of hiding associatives

the exact same can be said for ali and norwee yet you're not commenting on that

[Elements]

ok so I'm thinking Ali, cycle, someone not currently active as the scum team.

Why Ali?

so vehemently against a cycle lyncch

[Elements]

ok so I'm thinking Ali, cycle, someone not currently active as the scum team.

Why Ali?

so vehemently against a cycle lyncch

How does that make her scum?

sees an opertunity to derail the cycle wagon and goes straight for it to save eir scum buddy
There's also the post I think still think is a slip. Frustrated ali is all like "if we were both scum we'd both be voting you nah nah ne nah nah" when in fact they are both voting me but e doesn't realise it

[Elements]

it's assosiative, if one's scum the other's scum. At this point if cycle flips scum it's a death sentence for Ali so es tying everything to prevent the flip

[Elements]

idunno who ur talking about but I like Cycle Men because as scum this is a push that doesn't really make sense if norwee is town, and if norwee is scum it doesn't make sense to support him on a bad theory, also he would probably be hesistant to considering he is also a lynch and the person being lynched by isis and monkey, so if he flips scum then norwee would probably just get lynched anyways.

who is this directed at

[Elements]

VOTE: ali

[Elements]

gc is very convinceing

[Elements]

that's never gonna happen
VOTE: cycle men

[Elements]

your lynch gives so much inforemation at this point

[Elements]

remind me who you're claiming the scum team are cycle

[Elements]

if there's people willing to wagon
VOTE: alisae

[Elements]

why not join us and make it a high votecount wagon?

[Elements]

if i vote is that the hammer or are we still one short?

[Elements]

VOTE: cycle men

[Elements]

if i vote is that the hammer or are we still one short?

I wanna see the VC and I wanna hear ABR's thoughts.

VOTE: cycle men

what a progression lol.

>>>am i hammering if i vote? dunno...
>>>dont vote, lets give it some time, theres some stuff that needs talking about
>>>ok, voting now! (no indication that he was aware it wasnt a hammer).

this is too stupid to be scum, but this combined with prior scumminess makes this a good case for a lynch regardless of alignment. Plus theres lots of info gained from the lynch.


pedit: at least inflating page count wont lead to a game recession

i had just made this

Element's 100% accurate ad hoc votecount

Cycle Men - humaneatingmonkey, Green Crayons, Firebringer, Deimos, Isis - 5
Elements - Norwee, votato, Alisae, cycle men, Looker - 5
Alisae - Elements, ABR - 2

then checked to see if nsg had doen an updated votecount so didn't post it

[Elements]

(no indication that he was aware it wasnt a hammer).

how is the fact that I voted not an indication I knew it wasn't a hammer

[Elements]

Cycle men, votato, alisea are scum
and everyone on cycle is town

[Elements]

We do have an L-1 so why are you not voting?

[Elements]

or hammering rather, what changed your mind

[Elements]

Are people calling me scum because I wanna hammer something to make sure we have a lynch?
Lmao alright sure whatever

But we have something you can hammer but you're not

[Elements]

Let's see what this flip teaches us

VOTE: Cycle Men

Are people calling me scum because I wanna hammer something to make sure we have a lynch?
Lmao alright sure whatever

It doesn't matter if we no lynch its nightless.

we needed a lynch, it was bought about by it being the end of the day but it wasn't needed because it's the eod

[Elements]

no, i didn't point it out because it looked like a reaction test

[Elements]

VOTE: alisea

[Elements]

my solve is looking pretty good

[Elements]

I was just wondering why scum!alisea hammers cycle there. I think e realised e's backed into a corner with views on cycle and I and eir deceleration to hammer whatever got to L-1. Whoever was lyched e'd have to "re-evaluate" eir entire readlist but the hammer on Cycle maybe gives some town cred because cycle was scum. I think whatever alignment Ali has to hammer there though.

Spoiler:

lmao thats unlucky for me

LAMIST

im not scum and i feel like if I was scum with Clemency here, he doesn't try to align himself with Norwee when Norwee thinks that I'm cordinating votes on him. That whole interaction just doesn't make sense.

pointing out of a plan to distance?

Later I will take a look at votecounts and stuff but I think if we look at votecounts we should be able to find a 2nd one

"town effort"

also in general we have a lot more room to mislynch now so thats the good news

LAMIST

I think I'm more confident about votata right now

VOTE: votato

[Elements]

VOTE: ABR

I can see this

[Elements]

Atm I don't think we lose anything gamesolveing wise from an ABR flip at all

[Elements]

VOTE: ABR

[Elements]

I think its possible they say my Elements CW as an opportunity to save a buddy so they took it

Does this mean you townread me now?

[Elements]

for all the respect people are give ABR I don't understand why. His posting is less helpful than mine is most of the time and that's saying something

[Elements]

we respect him because reputation

I get that but this is my first experience of him and I'm not seeing it.

[Elements]

VOTE: ali

[Elements]

I can see firebringer scum

[Elements]

I can't see monkey scum

[Elements]

Isis is either town or doing the best job of budding me ever

[Elements]

I don't think fire is scum, but atm I have an overwhelming number of townreads on teh ABR wagon so I feel I must have something wrong there so I can entertain the possibility of fire being scum

[Elements]

Monkey is town because of the wagon on me. When monkey was sring me, no one joined him by voting me and he was left on his lonesome. Then towards the end of the day I started being accusative and throwing stuff around then more people started voting me and wanting my lynch, at that point monkey stopped wanting my lynch. My wagon was the counter wagon to cycle. Scum!monkey could've easily voted me instead and had a mislynch day one but didn't. Monkey is town.

[Elements]

Looker has no reason to townread me in this game because we were recently scum together and I feel like he should be able to identify the differences between this game and that game where we were scum together and I defended him even though he was under a lot of pressure.

This looks contradictory:
You were scum with looker => Looker knows your scum play
Looker has no reason to townread me => You are playing how you play scum
He should be able to see the differences => You are not paying how you play scum

[Elements]

Because right now you are not pushing a read.
You are pushing a fact.

So you being scum is fact?

[Elements]

VOTE: norwee

[Elements]

VOTE: votato

[Elements]

VOTE: norwee

[Elements]

Elements what do you think about monkey after reading my case on him

I don't see how lynching me first would have changed anything except an extra mislynch.

[Elements]

Elements what do you think about monkey after reading my case on him

I don't see how lynching me first would have changed anything except an extra mislynch.

It makes my slot a mislynchable slot.

Surely lynching me before cycle doesn't change that though

[Elements]

Elements what do you think about monkey after reading my case on him

I don't see how lynching me first would have changed anything except an extra mislynch.

It makes my slot a mislynchable slot.

Surely lynching me before cycle doesn't change that though

It doesn't but its harder to do.
He has to justify switching onto you and off Cycle then back onto Cycle after lynching you, and its likely during this transition period that he gets called out for it considering how he's willing to support me to lynch you but not support me lynch Norwee

He could have just kept his scumread on me from earlier and no one would have questioned it

[Elements]

If human is scum why did no one help him in his initial push against me?

[Elements]

Can I interest you in an Elements wagon instead?

[Elements]

@humaneatingmonkey
We're in 2020, we should be working with scum to make them see the error in their ways and repent before we brutally kill them

[Elements]

If human is scum why did no one help him in his initial push against me?

no one helped him because I screamed at him to vote Norwee

then why did he decide to townread me when a wagon on me was emmerging?

[Elements]

In other words Elements
He knew that scum was pushing you, so he positioned himself to defend you, because the person he wanted to bus was pushing you

but they have a scum chat so they can organise this.
They gave me town cred by bussing. I can't think of a less optimal play

[Elements]

In other words Elements
He knew that scum was pushing you, so he positioned himself to defend you, because the person he wanted to bus was pushing you

but they have a scum chat so they can organise this.
They gave me town cred by bussing. I can't think of a less optimal play

How is Monkey going to justify voting with the scumread he’s trying to push after you flip town and Cycle Men flips scum?

would they not have just told cycle not to push me?

[Elements]

and you were the second

[Elements]

have you justified why you were pushing me?

[Elements]

anything else?

[Elements]

I voted you at the time because I didn’t feel like you were trying to solve with how you were voting
You were changing your votes pretty rapidly.

He could say this. That he was scum reading me first and cycle saw that and took the easy counter wagon that had some town support already.

[Elements]

Do good do you think this scum team has played?

[Elements]

How well do you think this scum team has played?

EBWOP

[Elements]

How well do you think this scum team has played?

EBWOP

I can’t answer that question because I would need the Norwee and Monkey’s flip to rate their play.

if we assume monkey and norwee scum

[Elements]

how planned was the bus?

[Elements]

Deadlines do matter.
You want to save your no lynches for when you absolutely must be correct.
Day 1 is not a day where you must absolutely be correct.

It's three consecutive days. Each "day phase" could theoretically be three times longer if we wanted.

[Elements]

Deadlines do matter.
You want to save your no lynches for when you absolutely must be correct.
Day 1 is not a day where you must absolutely be correct.

It's three consecutive days. Each "day phase" could theoretically be three times longer if we wanted.

Just checked back
So we effectively have 21 day deadlines

Got it.

Are you sold that Monkey is scum?

I would prefer to lynch norwee over monkey

[Elements]

Deadlines do matter.
You want to save your no lynches for when you absolutely must be correct.
Day 1 is not a day where you must absolutely be correct.

It's three consecutive days. Each "day phase" could theoretically be three times longer if we wanted.

Just checked back
So we effectively have 21 day deadlines

Got it.

Are you sold that Monkey is scum?

I would prefer to lynch norwee over monkey

And if Norwee flips scum?

then i'll have to do a big rethink

[Elements]

@Demios are you not convinced on scum!ali enough to vote?

[Elements]

intent to hammer
say your think ali

[Elements]

tick tock

[Elements]

I have the better read accuracy then most players that are actually playing this including you Elements.

That's mean

[Elements]

not that I'm denying it

[Elements]

VOTE: ali

[Elements]

it is done

[Elements]

lets lynch norwee.

I'm onboard

[Elements]

I'm sad now

[Elements]

I feel like a deflated balloon

[Elements]

VOTE: norwee

[Elements]

I will sheep whoever hammers Alisae tomorrow.

I have decided to give my vote to Deimos for this day.

Excuuuuuuuse me!

[Elements]

@demios can you vote norwee to see if hem will sheep you because I don't think he will
UNVOTE:

[Elements]

I will sheep whoever hammers Alisae tomorrow.

I have decided to give my vote to Deimos for this day.

Excuuuuuuuse me!

Sorry I lied, Elements.

LYNCH ALL LIERS!!!
VOTE: HUMANEATINGMONKEY

[Elements]

UNVOTE:

[Elements]

I'm not salty

[Elements]

Demios, if you vote norwee and hem doesn't do would that make you consider them as a scum team?

[Elements]

Alright there's actually a caveat to the "I'll sheep people" and it's I need to understand your read and agree with it.

so it's not rlly sheeping

[Elements]

so you're gonna let other people do the work and not bother scum hunting

[Elements]

isis and fire are both town

[Elements]

@human what happedned to your norwee sumread?

[Elements]

could've spoilered that...

[Elements]

intent to hammer norwee whenever they reach L-1

[Elements]

anyone got matches?

[Elements]

I don't understand this golden group thing.

if we have 4 people who are 100% town then everyone else can be lynched and we win. That's the golden group.

[Elements]

Because gc unvoted before i could hammer

[Elements]

intent to hammer norwee whenever they reach L-1

intent

VOTE: Norwee

Go ahead and hammer GC

L-1

Let me post a reply to GC's case FFS.
This isn't democracy, it's mob rule.

UNVOTE: Norwegian

you unvote

[Elements]

okay?

keep reading the thread.

he wasn't L-1

can you not count?

[Elements]

Votecount 4.4

Target	Wagon
NorwegianboyEE (3)	Green Crayons (2005), Isis (2012), votato (2082)
votato (1)	Deimos27 (2055)
Not Voting (5)	humaneatingmonkey, NorwegianboyEE, Looker, Firebringer, Elements (2059)

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. The Day 4 deadline is in (expired on 2020-05-17 07:52:59).

L-2

VOTE: Norwee

Go ahead and hammer GC

L-1

[Elements]

of course silly me
talking about my not being able to hammer couldn't possibly be referring to around the time i declared intent
goodness I'm clearly overestimating your intelligence

[Elements]

coz im annoyed about hammering ali

[Elements]

and i don't like it when people say im wrong when im right

[Elements]

it's the thing that annoys me most

[Elements]

Elements is right and not wrong

you can stop buddying me now, you've done enough.

[Elements]

itd be cool if NSG showed up...

You're not town?

where did this jump come from?

[Elements]

okay sheep earned. god damn.

What earned the sheep?

[Elements]

the scum team is either norwee, hem, gc or isis, fire, looker
If it's the latter we've lost and there's nothing we can do about that so it has to be the first three.

[Elements]

VOTE: norwee

[Elements]

isis do u think elements is with Norwee and thinks bussing is gonna make him look good?

I think that's what gc is doing

[Elements]

isis do u think elements is with Norwee and thinks bussing is gonna make him look good?

I think that's what gc is doing

Why is ur group also include HEM in that?

Hem is the most likely wrong in that group, i still don't see why scum him fails to lynch me day 1.
It's because of ali

[Elements]

who suggested slowing down momentum?

[Elements]

I'd prefer to play this day slower to kill scum momentum

Why is it scum momentum?

[Elements]

Fire let me know if you want me on the wagon again.

This is Fire, I've hacked Elements account. Put your vote back on we need this lynch.

[Elements]

Did you miss the part of the game where we instalynched three townies in about 5 rl days or less?
I think scum objectively has momentum.

what makes you think it's scum conducting everything thing and not town eviscerating each other?

[Elements]

Isis
Human/Fire
Looker
Demios
GC

[Elements]

I move my vote a lot as town
viewtopic.php?f=53&t=81277&user_select[]=32224
viewtopic.php?f=53&t=80818&user_select[]=32224
I don't as scum
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=80513&user_select[]=32224
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=80648&user_select[]=32224

pls don't mod kill me

[Elements]

@Fire, now you've cased me why are you not casing Demios?

[Elements]

Hem do you think I'm scum and if so have you looked at the contrast in my voting tendencies as town and scum?

[Elements]

Ya'll will feel real stupid when I end up right.

I want to put an image of an uno reverse card right here.

[Elements]

I still don't understand why I'm scum after day 1. Please explain.

[Elements]

And if Elements flip town, you can forever ignore my reads.

Let's do the latter first. There's no point flipping me.

[Elements]

And if Elements flip town, you can forever ignore my reads.

This is such a cop out thing to say and is hella scum indicative.
"Let's just get one more mislynch out the way then you can pretend I don't exist and I can hide."
Almost as if you know I'm flipping town.

[Elements]

VOTE: demios

[Elements]

• Because Elements linked some games where he moved his vote, he's town? Do the quality of the reasons in his town games match up to the quality of the reasons in this one?

If you mean lack of then yes

[Elements]

I even re-read with the bias that you'll be scum and Isis town but lo and behold you're town and Isis is scum.

stop buddying gc

[Elements]

hem and demios

[Elements]

gc is the towniest player in the game at this point

[Elements]

you can't say my reads are bad forever.

as sum you're not giving reads so I agree with this

[Elements]

keep defending me. definitely some bias but that's how my brain works. He could easily join the lynch elements train and get me lynched

[Elements]

softer

[Elements]

So your scumteam is Deimos/HEM?

hem and demios

[Elements]

define real read

[Elements]

hem and demios

[Elements]

so you think all the scum were voting scum day 1

[Elements]

i don't see how you can be town with how unbelievably wrong you are. You keep asking Isis about me and then ignoring her and calling me scum anyway. I have to assume you were doing some form of "reaction test" to re-affirm your "read" of Me and Isis scum without thinking about the alternate scenarios like "Isis can read Elements". I'd say Isis is probably the best at reading me of anyone on this site so either you are wearing glasses with a picture of me on one lens and a picture of Isis on the other, you are scum.

[Elements]

So what happened with the GC and the Looker read?

They changed. I'm much more fluid with my reads than anyone else I've encountered which people seem to view as scummy but I think it's the opposite. Scum know stuff and know what they want. Town know nothing and have to react to what happens. My town meta is very very much the latter.

"You can't see how unbelievably wrong you are?" Are you that overconfident that Isis is town?

I'm town. Isis' alignment doesn't matter for that statement to be true.

Is Isis the best at reading you if she fails to articulate why you're town/scum based on meta and if she admitted she didn't remember how to?

Yes.

[Elements]

and how confident can you really be in Elements' meta if he's self-aware of it?

Meta exists because of the intrinsic difference int one's mindset when play town or scum. There's also the face that I get lynched day 1 so much as town. Why would I want to emulate that as scum?

[Elements]

I'm town. Isis' alignment doesn't matter for that statement to be true.

So is Isis scum?

That's not remotely what I said

[Elements]

You don't believe scum can emulate their town meta, especially if self-aware?

I don't believe I can emulate my town meta

[Elements]

Oh I don't doubt that you're fluid. I just want to you to describe the process of change.

Gut and how I feel at the time. People attacking me makes me think they're more scum. People defending me makes me think they're more town. I do very little analysis.

[Elements]

Gut and how I feel at the time.

[Elements]

Why didn't you scumread Firebringer?

The word more exists in that explanation for a reason.

[Elements]

you still haven't defined what a real read is