Open 636 - Nightless Vengeful Mayhem - Game Over

[Postie]

Hi guys! I'm caught up.

[Postie]

I think I understand the town motivation behind what Severa's doing, but the problem I'm having with it is that it's a decent play for scum too; waiting until both daykills have been used means no one will question why Severa is still alive.

I'm more than content with being lynched and given a vengekill.

VOTE: Severa

I'm not sure I like the timing of the self-vote here because I doubt Severa would actually be okay with being lynched

right now

, even if they would later, so it feels more like it's for show.

[Postie]

VOTE: Postie

Reasoning?

[Postie]

VOTE: Postie

Reasoning?

I think I understand the town motivation behind what Severa's doing, but the problem I'm having with it is that it's a decent play for scum too; waiting until both daykills have been used means no one will question why Severa is still alive.

I'm more than content with being lynched and given a vengekill.

VOTE: Severa

I'm not sure I like the timing of the self-vote here because I doubt Severa would actually be okay with being lynched

right now

, even if they would later, so it feels more like it's for show.

idgi

[Postie]

By the way, are you bandwagoning acryon's reasoning?

Who's this addressed to? Also, what?

[Postie]

Guys, when we decide who we think is scum and needs to die, do you think it would be best to lynch the second scummiest player first and have that person venge our scummiest pick?

First pick is scum and we lynch our second pick and they're town and venge our first = we've basically brought the next day's lynch forward one to stop scum getting a free kill
First pick is scum and we lynch our second pick and they're scum and venge a townie = we're no worse off than if our first pick was scum and we lynched them
First pick is town and we lynch our second pick and they're scum and venge a townie = idk, that sounds bad and we probably want to avoid it
First pick is town and we lynch our second pick and they're town and venge our first = idk, but scum didn't get an extra kill so it's not so bad

[Postie]

Postie, who did TheDominator vote as judge on both times?

What?

[Postie]

Guys, when we decide who we think is scum and needs to die, do you think it would be best to lynch the second scummiest player first and have that person venge our scummiest pick?

First pick is scum and we lynch our second pick and they're town and venge our first = we've basically brought the next day's lynch forward one to stop scum getting a free kill
First pick is scum and we lynch our second pick and they're scum and venge a townie = we're no worse off than if our first pick was scum and we lynched them
First pick is town and we lynch our second pick and they're scum and venge a townie = idk, that sounds bad and we probably want to avoid it
First pick is town and we lynch our second pick and they're town and venge our first = idk, but scum didn't get an extra kill so it's not so bad

Nevermind, I just read the set-up and apparently only townies get a venge. I'm dumb.

[Postie]

HA feels super awkward. It's a gut read. it's prolly not a day 1 thing, or a page 5 thing.

I don't see it. Blue might have been a little awkward, but it doesn't strike me as the alignment-indicative kind of awkward.

[Postie]

Postie, do you have some games to link me so I can see your meta?

Sure.

Town: Micro 545, Micro 549, Newbie 1664, Micro 576, Newbie 1684, Micro 601 (not

technically

a town game, but can probably be treated as one)

Scum: Micro 558, Micro 566, Mini Normal 1772

Let me know if you need any more.

Any reason you wanted meta from me in particular?

[Postie]

@POSTIE

Postie, who did TheDominator vote as judge on both times?

I still have no idea what you're asking. I've never been in a game with TheDominator.

[Postie]

I know. That doesn't make your question make any more sense.

[Postie]

I just read the set-up and apparently only townies get a venge. I'm dumb.

[Postie]

Not sure how useful that would be though since there are no nightkills, so it's not like we're getting a free extra lynch in.

[Postie]

Welcome to the club.

VOTE: heuristically_alone

Part late RVS, part random gut scumread.

[Postie]

Revote and let's wagon him while we look for better places to put our vote.
I'm heading to bed so I'm really just quickly shoving my vote anywhere right now.

[Postie]

Not sure if I should say who it's an alt of, idk if they want that to be known or not.

Probably best not to, out of courtesy.

[Postie]

I'll post more thoughts soon but

I'm more than content with being lynched and given a vengekill.

VOTE: Severa

You need to talk to me about this vote, Severa. What was it supposed to accomplish?

[Postie]

Severa is obv arrogant newb town, POstie knows this

That seems far from the case to me.

[Postie]

Yeah I can't realistically keep pretending that I don't know who Severa is at this point.

[Postie]

I was hoping if Severa didn't know I knew they might let down their guard a bit and slip into their scum meta if scum.

[Postie]

Maybe Severa was trying to do the same thing with me?

[Postie]

What I'm thinking is that pulling a gambit in the way Severa's doing could be helpful if they're scum because they don't need to find an excuse for not being daykilled, but on the other hand, Severa doesn't seem to be doing anything to get themselves townread so I'm inclined to think they're serious about being okay with getting themselves lynched D1 for the vengekill, which wouldn't make sense for scum. But then there's that self-vote so erghhhh.

[Postie]

I still feel like Severa is my best candidate for mafia. The less information mafia give, the harder it is for town, and Severa has come up with the perfect excuse for not giving information.

That's true but it also seems like a pretty shallow interpretation of Severa's play.
Severa has a history of getting N1'd on their main, if that changes anything for you.

[Postie]

I'd doubt they'd keep their vote on themselves at L-2 if they were maf, even if they had a lot of faith in their wifom.

This is where you're wrong.

[Postie]

Well I have a history of being lyched on d1. In fact I'm hoping this will be the first game that doesn't happen.

That doesn't answer my question.

[Postie]

That's true but it also seems like a pretty shallow interpretation of Severa's play.
Severa has a history of getting N1'd on their main, if that changes anything for you.

I just realised I didn't actually ask a question. Consider the "if that changes anything for you" to be an implied question.

[Postie]

So I'd like to get more into this game, can someone please ask me something?

Are you scum?

[Postie]

I thought we agreed you were bussing N_M before I bussed you. D:

[Postie]

Yeah, reads would definitely be a good place to start, duppin.

My vote on HA is now 100% serious, btw.

[Postie]

Not sure I'm following. It's more just a really bad feeling I'm getting at this point; I sort-of have reasons but I'm finding them hard to put into words.

[Postie]

Alright, I find their 'obsession' with Severa a bit suspicious. Don't get me wrong, there's nothing wrong with them discussing the slot especially considering they're suspicious of him, but the issue is that they haven't really done anything else. It seems like really lazy scumhunting and if Severa is in fact scum I would definitely expect to find at least one scum just focusing on Severa because it would be an easy attempt at scumhunting.
It is however still early on in the game and Postie has just entered and her vote is on someone else (on HA actually).

Severa quite often becomes my main point of focus, because knowing whether or not I can cooperate with them or not is pretty important to me. It usually ends in disaster or at least suboptimal play when I get it wrong.

[Postie]

I see, but how are you going to cooperate with him if he doesn't want to anything until the daykills have been used?

I guess right now it's more just seeing if I can trust them not be pulling some weird scum gambit again. >.<

[Postie]

Knowing Severa's main I find Postie even scummier, because she wants the slot at arms length if she can use Severa

What do you mean by this?

[Postie]

Hi, yay, bye.

I'll post more thoughts soon but

I'm more than content with being lynched and given a vengekill.

VOTE: Severa

You need to talk to me about this vote, Severa. What was it supposed to accomplish?

Answering my question isn't scumhunting so I doubt it'll get you dayvig'd for it. Please answer?

[Postie]

Not liking postie too much.

?

[Postie]

When I saw duppin ask that someone ask him something, I wanted to ask the same question. Town are generally more likely to give a simple no answer while scum tend to deflect the question in some way or not answer.

For the record, while this is somewhat true, I don't think it applies to joke answers. I also think town are actually at least slightly more likely to throw out random jokes about being Mafia, but that's anecdotal.

[Postie]

Weakly, but moreso from his original question than his answer. I feel like scum would be more likely to just go ahead and try and generate content rather than straight-up asking people to ask them stuff, because people perceive taking initiative and being proactive as towny.

[Postie]

Scum ass it to try to pick out who they should read as scum.

Can you go into more detail on this? I don't really understand.

[Postie]

If we're townreading them and agree with their reads why would we lynch them?

[Postie]

Oh, you mean lynch a townread so they can venge someone scummy?
But why wouldn't we just lynch a scummy player? Or do what I suggested earlier and lynch the second scummiest player and have them venge the scummiest if town?

[Postie]

Yeah, that. I think my issue with your plan is the second scummiest player wont be in the 'loop' so their reads might be kinda shit?

That's why we tell them who to venge. I guess we have to trust they'll actually do it though.

Wheras if a bunch of us agreed on a 'probably town with good scum-reads' player, we might be safer?

But then... why not just lynch the person that that person wants to venge?

[Postie]

Oh! And if we get lucky and hit the Day Goon, they won't even have the opportunity to use their shots!

[Postie]

Okay.

Well I have a history of being lyched on d1. In fact I'm hoping this will be the first game that doesn't happen.

That doesn't answer my question.

That's true but it also seems like a pretty shallow interpretation of Severa's play.
Severa has a history of getting N1'd on their main, if that changes anything for you.

I just realised I didn't actually ask a question. Consider the "if that changes anything for you" to be an implied question.

Care to comment on this?

[Postie]

It seems to me, Postie, that you are trying to get me to say something scummy so that you have good excuses to vote me and convince others to vote me, if you were scum.

I'm scumreading you so I'm trying to get you to say stuff that will help me sort you.

[Postie]

I feel like Severa will end up being the second scummiest in the end, so either way Severa gets what they wanted.

Could you answer my previous question so I have a better idea of why you're still scumreading Several?

[Postie]

Oh! And if we get lucky and hit the Day Goon, they won't even have the opportunity to use their shots!

This feels fairly fake.

Why?

Suppose I should also move my vote.

VOTE: duppin

Why's he scum again?

[Postie]

BTW, I have a townread on Blue Yoshi so I'm not going to get behind a lynch on him today. I got pretty strong townvibes from his questions near the start of the game.

[Postie]

Of course a scum like you would doubt my logic.

H_A, why is everyone who questions you scum?

[Postie]

lol.

Okay heuristic can be town.

[Postie]

93: Faux-content. Everyone obviously already agreed on Severa's play, so no point in overexplaining about it the way he did. Then he asks Ari a fluff question, which he knew would likely give a fluff answer considering how he later responded to a similar question from Postie.

Why is fluff alignment indicative?

235 finds us an indictment for focusing on Severa but not really doing anything else, and this basically describes dupppin's play up to that point.

Why is hypocrisy alignment indicative?

240: Seems weird to base your reads on a single slot's alignment especially when you

don't know that spots alignment

.

Why is something being "weird" alignment indicative?

[Postie]

Also, can you explain your Blue Yoshi scumread?

[Postie]

Isolated incidents are not. But the fact remains it is faux-content.

So is it scummy or isn't it?

Because he evidently thinks that kind of play

is

scum-indicative, but if he is town, then it's clearly not.

He doesn't have a whole lot of content yet so I'm really sure it's fair to compare the two situations in that way.

"Weird" is more something that pings than something which is clearly scum or town. When I put the pieces together, it makes the weird things look a little worse.

If it doesn't "ping" as scum or town, how can it be alignment indicative?

[Postie]

Faux-content is anti-town at best, but scum can use it easily to hide. Very few things are "scummy" or "townie". Gotta view them in the context of everything else. And what I see from dupp is faux-content, calling people out for doing things he is doing, and trying to appear to be doing things.

Okay, so, in the context of everything else, is it scummy or isn't it?

I think it is. Don't think it's ok to criticize someone for a certain way of playing but then say the other is fine because they don't have enough content.

These are all of the posts duppin made about Severa before he made the post you linked to:

Alrighty, VOTE: Severa

Agreed.

I thought Severa was doing it for reactions at first, but seems like he/she might be serious. If you truly are, please reconsider. It's disrespectful and I don't understand why you would sign up if you aren't going to play the game.

So... Aristo, are you town? pls be honest

Two posts. I'm not going to go and count how many posts I've mentioned Severa in, but I can tell you it's a heck of a lot more than this.
Tell me how the situations are comparable again.

Well it pings as one or the other, but it's not clearly scum or town. Ping tends to be gut-driven, which isn't based on norms of "town" or "scum"-indication.

If you don't know if it's scummy or towny why are you listing it as a reason to scumread him?

[Postie]

I believe it is.

Why?

Because it was about the only substantive post he had made all game.

It's not really what I'd call substantive at all. I guess I see what you mean about us arguing semantics here.

If you don't know if it's scummy or towny why are you listing it as a reason to scumread him?

You never know what is townie and what is scummy. At the end of the day, every non-informed player is to some extent guessing. His body of work, including this ping, makes me feel like he is scum.[/quote]
Ah yes, [string of words that mean exactly nothing].

That

answers my question.

[Postie]

Ugh quote fail.

[Postie]

I feel like I'm asking questions and you just keep throwing out incoherent bits of waffle and running me rounding in circles.

[Postie]

rounding

I need preview my post more. ;-;

[Postie]

*need to preview my posts

ffs

[Postie]

I get you don't like my posting style, but I play the game like I see it, which is fluid and from an imperfect perspective.

Summary:
-Most things that people would call scummy, especially D1, could very well come from newb/unhelpful town.
-It's our job to use our gut and the tone of posts to discern intent, which will help us differentiate between the scum or one of the town cases above.
-I did this, which leads me to believe duppin is scum.
-Since this is a gut-read in large part (as most reads are D1), I don't expect you to 100% agree with me, but I'm sure you can see where I'm coming from.

That being said, I think you and I are largely done talking about this and I'd like you to let duppin address what I've had to say, because I think at the very least we can all agree we'd like more actual content from him (as well as other players).

Even this, I'm not really following and can't understand. You gave reasons for scumreading duppin and tried to answer my questions about them and now you're saying you've been doing things by gut and he's gut scummy even though you said some of the reasons you gave didn't ping you as town or scum (but he's still scum for them) and...???
Nothing you're saying is making any sense to me.

[Postie]

NM is still being useless instead of minimalist

Can you explain this more? I'm not sure what you mean.

[Postie]

Do you have any reads, Aristo?

[Postie]

You know he's scumreading me.

Well, updated reads.

[Postie]

Not yet, but as town he always townslips all over the place and I think that's something he'd have trouble replicating as scum, so I'm just sort-of hoping he'll obvtown himself in that way as the game progresses.

[Postie]

That's what I remember from playing with him. I should probably go stalk his meta.

[Postie]

I don't understand what you mean?

[Postie]

Oh, right, no, I wasn't talking about what you described but what I said in the post before.

[Postie]

BTW, I have a townread on Blue Yoshi so I'm not going to get behind a lynch on him today. I got pretty strong townvibes from his questions near the start of the game.

I generally don't like to read too much into questions asked by players at the beginning of game. It is way too easy for scum to shine off town vibes.

Why do you think that?

Posts 31, 45, and 54 feel very much like frustrated town to me.
It's not just the questions in those posts though, but the general tone of everything.

[Postie]

I agree with pistachi0n. I still have heuristic as a townlean though for that everyone-pressuring-me-is-scum stuff; feels like weird towny paranoia.

[Postie]

Idk why I'm still voting heuristically_alone.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: SnarkySnowman

Snarky, come out of hiding pls.

[Postie]

Not liking postie too much.

?

Explain please?

[Postie]

Oh hi Severa.

[Postie]

Why am I scum?

[Postie]

Please can you explain your read on me? I don't really know what I'm supposed to do in this situation.

[Postie]

Give me something to work with? I don't understand how you could have such a strong read on me so early on.

[Postie]

If you're serious then please engage with me.

[Postie]

I'm not sure how we're supposed to move forward then.

[Postie]

But Postie's still scum for reasons regardless of my getting dayvigged.

Then please can you go into those reasons?

[Postie]

Because that's the easiest way for me to engage with you and try and improve this situation. If you have questions for me, that works too.

[Postie]

I want to think this is all a reaction test but even that would require you to have some level of suspicion of me so

please please please

just say something that helps me understand what's worrying you about my play.

[Postie]

Postie is 2-Shot Day Goon

????????????

[Postie]

I'm guessing you're serious from the talking about possible partners thing.
That's no good.

Ughhh

[Postie]

idgi

[Postie]

No

Why would I fake a scumread of this calibre in a game where I can be daykilled right in the middle if I thought you were town?

Come now.

^ I don't get what you mean

here

.

[Postie]

I knew you would pop up eventually Severa

Last page makes me think Severa is close to 100% town. I can't say I'm nearly as confident as you in your Postie-read, but I did have my suspicions. Still just popping in for a second and will be gone for the weekend, so I'll take a look back over Postie this game when I get back and see if I feel as good as you do about her as scum.

Oh bullshit

[Postie]

Oh, true, I guess. Idk.

[Postie]

Because keeping you alive means you'll push a mislynch through on me anyway?

[Postie]

What is? That Severa is town or that you're scum?

No, all this crap about how you "knew all along". You're being opportunistic af.

[Postie]

I can live with that.

[Postie]

Or, you know, die.

[Postie]

I don't really see a you-acryon scumteam, Severa.

[Postie]

Part of it is that I think I might have some idea of why you could be scumreading me. Hold on while I dig up some past games.
The other part is that I thought if you're actually town making a serious push with already developed reasons, expressing my suspicion wouldn't be as helpful as just trying to see your side of it.

[Postie]

Yeah, I figured you'd say that. If it's what I think it is, I didn't notice it because I've done it as scum, I noticed it because I did it a lot as a newbie and then didn't so much for a while.

[Postie]

I don't know if you're bullshitting about your criteria things or not. Part of me wants this to be true just because I'd see it as like a compliment.

But anyway
I just checked some of my scumgames and I think I might have been wrong about the thing I thought you thought. I thought it was to do with the way I phrased questions because I did that a certain way as a newbie and did it the same way in at least one scumgame because it's what I do when I'm unsure of myself.
If it's anything like that then I'll just leave my first newbie game here for you: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=63045
My newbie play was a bit different to what my play is now but I slip back into some of the things I did back then sometimes.

[Postie]

I'm gonna go eat food and then come back to this. But yeah read that newbie game I linked please. I feel like I've definitely been a bit like newbie-me in this game, and that happens sometimes. I'll try and find more games that showcase that.

[Postie]

Then can you at least go answer my question from earlier in the game?

Also, please go into your other reads in as much detail as possible because if you're town and scum do end up shooting you to frame me then we need as much information as possible from you right now.

[Postie]

Is Severa Frozen Angel?

Lmao

[Postie]

Did postie just claim scum?

In what world does that look anything like a scum claim?

[Postie]

You did (post 451), but it was about mine, not yours.

[Postie]

Severa, is one of your reasons for scumreading me that I don't have any strong scumreads right now in this game? Because I know that's something I've definitely struggled with as scum in the past (unless those scumreads were my partners, lol). If that's one of your reasons, I can understand, but it stopped being alignment indicative recently and if you keep scumreading me for it you're going to misread me in every game I'm town from hereon out.
As town, sometimes I make pushes for stupid reasons because I don't think to take a step back and consider how what I'm reading as scummy could also come from town if I think about it properly, whereas when I'm scum, I naturally do that because I know the player I'm "reading" is town. My town meta's recently shifted a bit though to the point where I now do what I do as scum as town, probably in part

because

those scumgames have taught me to do it, and focusing on building up a townpool and then PoEing the rest of the players is just sort-of becoming how I play the game now.
That's pretty much all I can say without mentioning ongoings. I don't know what the rest of your reasons are but like this is super frustrating and unfair because I'm having to defend against reasoning that's not only horribly wrong but hasn't actually been given. And I feel like if you're scum you can just out your main after my lynch and go "whelp, I was wrong I'm wrong sometimes you guys have seen me be wrong let's move on".

[Postie]

can someone summarise the case on postie in like....four bullet points for me?

• Severa thinks they know my meta, apparently
  
• Severa is wrong
  
• Severa won't explain anything so I can't explain where they went wrong
  
• Everyone is sheeping because ???

[Postie]

Oh, true, I guess. Idk.

Uhhh I would be absolutely floored if sevra got dayvigged

What?

[Postie]

Postie to be completely honest I'm not really a fan of your defense. I think your focusing a bit too much on Severa, but seeing as he doesn't want to explain his read you can't really defend yourself against it and you're getting nowhere.

Yeah, sorry, me and Severa have... history.

Could you talk about the other players on your train?

You mean the ones on my wagon? Pretty sure at least one of them is scum. It's probably acryon and/or Not_Mafia, but I can see heuristic as scum again after that jump onto me. I know heuristic was suspicious of me before but his reasoning is even more opaque than Severa's here and I'm getting a really bad feeling from the way it happened. It's hard to explain but I'm just finding it really hard to see a natural thought process behind what he's doing.

Your vote is also currently still on Snarky, is he your top scum?

No, I was trying to engage him because I wasn't a fan of his lurking and wanted to him to go into more detail on the little he'd posted.

I'll do you a Ranger-style list so you know where I'm at.

{Bellaphant, Flubbernugget, BlueYoshi} - weak town
{duppin, Severa, pistachi0n, Aristophanes} - nullish
{SnarkySnowman} - super null
{heuristically_alone} - scummish null
{Not_Mafia, acryon} - die pls

[Postie]

Actually, move heuristic next to Snarky. I feel like my suspicion may be tainted with OMGUS from assuming the naked vote meant "postie should die now" rather than potentially just being an attempt to get the game moving along.

[Postie]

Talk to me about acron, postie? They are pretty near the top of my town list.

452 is still opportunistic bullshit.
How come you're townreading him?

Why is Bellaphant town?

Right now, gut, sorry.

Won't the vig be outed once they do it? (I assume it's a public Dayvig?)

Oh man if only.

[Postie]

I'm thinking scum would actually be more likely to try and justify their jump onto my wagon than not, so that's making me lean more towards acryon being scum as well and less heur/Snarky. On the other hand though, I really hate the fact that Snarky is just lurking and putting in the bare minimum, because it's starting to feel like coasting.

[Postie]

VOTE: Not_Mafia

[Postie]

Hi Ranger!

[Postie]

Care to reply to 467?

It's opportunistic because although I was #2 from the bottom on your list, you said yourself that none of your scumreads were particularly strong, so for you to come in as soon as Severa says they think I'm scum and go "oh cool yeah Severa is totally town and also I've been suspicious of Postie this whole time yeah she seems like a good vote" feels really terrible.

[Postie]

gives the most info

[Postie]

Can you explain the Blue Yoshi read? There's been an undertone of Blue Yoshi being bad somehow in the thread for most of the day and I don't really understand it?

[Postie]

Am I actually at L-1 without anyone on my wagon having given a reason for being on it?
Scum have some fucking balls this game.

[Postie]

Time to re-evaluate my Bella and Yoshi reads I guess, since I'm not buying scum would blow a shot on framing someone who has a good chance of being lynched anyway.

[Postie]

Am I actually at L-1 without anyone on my wagon having given a reason for being on it?
Scum have some fucking balls this game.

The emotion and frustration here coinciding with the dayvig being used is no coincidence I'm pretty sure.

To be fair this is just as bad as Aristo's theory.

[Postie]

Severa, why the heck would I not kill you but kill Ranger as soon as she voted me?

[Postie]

Scum would NOT have diverted attention from an L-1 by shooting.

So then why am I scum for it? What?

[Postie]

NM is obvtown.

I thought you said he was scum bussing me?

[Postie]

My mind has changed.

Why?

[Postie]

Why are you scumreading me again, heuristic?

[Postie]

Why are you scumreading me again, heuristic?

Most people are scumreading you. You're going to die today.

So... you're voting for me because everyone else is?

If you don't vote Postie today, you will be my top lynch for tomorrow (provided Postie flips town)

H_A, explain to me how not mindlessly sheeping everyone else onto a mislynch makes someone scum?

[Postie]

Because there's no reason for scum to put any real effort into pushing a counterwagon when there's already a wagon on a townie built almost entirely on peer pressure to the point where people are criticising others just for not being on it (*coughheuristically_alonecough*).

[Postie]

I want to do ISOs first in case there's anything I've missed and so I can straighten my thoughts out a bit. I might end up voting with you, especially if there's no other option, but I think I need to get a better foothold in the game first.

[Postie]

If the scum team ends up being pistachi0n/duppin/Aristophanes I'll cry.

[Postie]

duppin and Postie--why are you not voting?

Want to do ISOs first, like I said. No hammer yet please.

[Postie]

Doing ISOs now! Idk how long it'll take me but expect something soon-ish.

[Postie]

Severa, can you tell me why you think Not_Mafia is obvtown?

[Postie]

Readslist

Blue Yoshi

Posts 31, 45, 54 feel like frustrated town.
The "I keep forgetting about the scum daykill." in 57 made me hesitate a bit because I can potentially see it as a bit forced, but I keep rereading it and not being able to make my mind up.
More recent stuff feels like newbtown too but I'm not sure I can explain why.
Overall I'm leaning town and I can't see how people are forming scumreads here. Feels like mislynch bait.

Bellaphant

Still can't explain this one beyond gut, but major townfeels here. The fact that Ranger had her as a scumread concerns me a little but whatever, I don't trust Ranger's reads as much as everyone else seems to.

Severa

Would probably try and provide reasoning if they were going to strongarm a mislynch on me, so as to not get as much heat for it tomorrow. Probably town for that reason. Meh.

pistachi0n

I don't think she'd go as far as she did to whiteknight a lynch that's probably going to go through.

duppin

Haven't seen much in the way of reads from him but my gut says he's genuinely considering things.

Aristophanes

Not a clue.

Not_Mafia

Picked me as a deathtunnel target as soon as I entered the game and I can't understand his POV at all. Need to hear from Severa before I can decide whether he's just a VI or if he's been tunneling me to first avoid providing content in other ways and then later because my lynch actually became a thing.

SnarkySnowman

Don't like his jump onto my wagon after having read 60. It seems a touch weird to chide others for rushing the Severa wagon but then get onto my wagon without so much as giving a reason.
575 and 708 are pinging me because I think they should be giving Snarky cognitive dissonance, but he doesn't seem uncomfortable at all.

acryon

452 is still opportunistic bullshit, and his jump onto my wagon seems like one of the most likely to come from scum because of what I explained in 537.

[Postie]

Actually switch acryon with Snarky.

Would anyone be up for a Snarky wagon or am I going to have to choose between gambling on N_M or self-hammering to venge SS?

[Postie]

Current guess for scum team is acryon/SnarkySnowman + one of Not_Mafia/Aristophanes/duppin.

[Postie]

Dammit. I knew I'd forget someone.
Slot him in somewhere around Aristophanes.