Mini 1741: Day 3
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Mathilda Goon
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 23, Zulfy wrote:In post 19, Zoronos wrote:VOTE: Zulfy
So, what made you change your vote immediately from one post to the next?
1. Wanted the wagon.
2. Curious to see who would call me out on it. Now I get to ask: What'd ya do that for?
That suggests to me that both you and Zulfy are playing pro-town, and you at least are more likely to be town (which isn't saying much at this point in the game when there is no information to go). Scum hide best in the long term when they are considered to be scum hunting but they try to avoid drawing suspicion on themselves and certainly won't do that in order to help town.
This theory of course relies on us actually believing your explanation though. Why did you wait 7 minutes before posting a new vote?-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 46, Elyse wrote:This is my first game in a while. Hey Garmr, RC, Aneninen, anyone else that I recognized from the player list that I can't remember off the top of my head.
In post 23, Zulfy wrote:In post 19, Zoronos wrote:VOTE: Zulfy
So, what made you change your vote immediately from one post to the next?
1. Wanted the wagon.
2. Curious to see who would call me out on it. Now I get to ask: What'd ya do that for?
In post 31, Zulfy wrote:In post 29, Keyser Söze wrote:What, you actually searched MafiaWiki for the definition? How cute.
I think you will find that trying to lynch someone based purely on what font they use is "bad town" and harmful to town.
Which obviously makes him town!
UNVOTE:
VOTE: RadiantCowbells
I don't buy this from Zulfy. If he really did want the wagon, then I find it highly unlikely he would forget (after a few posts) that he was already voting for RC. Plus, his second vote doesn't make sense.
VOTE: Zulfy
It is difficult to imagine the same person making a mistake so early in the same game as they make a make a keen strategic ploy, as described in #23. It suggests that he is not paying that much attention to the game and that his excuse is not to be trusted.-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 65, Zulfy wrote:[quote="In
If the RVS captain planet hatewagon ever gets to L-1 I will hammer.
Wooah! Intention to hammer already? I liked your effort to get us out of RVS whatever your motivation, but I can't see why you should be so sure of anything at this point to state an intention to hammer, even speculative.
UNVOTE: Keyser because I liked #53.
VOTE: Zulfy for above reasons.-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 70, Aneninen wrote:[quote="In
In post 20, Mathilda wrote:VOTE: Keyser Söze for having umlauts which require me to plug in my German keyboard everytime I write his name.
Kackendes Täubchen.
Oooh I like that insult. I shall add it to my collection. It's an ambition of mine to someday be able to rant in Bayrisch. It just sounds like a lot of fun
In post 70, Aneninen wrote:[quote="In
In post 49, Mathilda wrote:This theory of course relies on us actually believing your explanation though. Why did you wait 7 minutes before posting a new vote?
Aha.
In post 50, Mathilda wrote:It is difficult to imagine the same person making a mistake so early in the same game as they make a make a keen strategic ploy, as described in #23. It suggests that he is not paying that much attention to the game and that his excuse is not to be trusted.
Are you scum, Mathilde?
In post 52, Zulfy wrote:I'm almost offended! This town really assumes the worst, don't it?
Are you scum with Mathilde?
No. Are you?
Not convinced by your scum hunting abilities here. You were hardly trying to add pressure to me with a question like that. But it does display a certain confidence that you are town and can demonstrate it. Not something you'd want to advertise if this really was the case. And this confidence can also be faked to make yourself look more towny, which in itself is scummy.-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 102, TheLhix wrote:In post 101, RadiantCowbells wrote:Also, the flying fuck is Lhix doing?
Sorry. Was feeling a bit off and was trying to bait reaction out of RVS to actually get the ball rolling and have something comprehensive to look at and read/analyze/hunt/discuss. Was a bit of a risky thing to attempt, but it has worked for me in the past I suppose. Still feeling it out on this new meta though
But we're already out of RVS. Zulify did that waaay back, and then sort of continued to make himself look scummy when he should have stopped and could have looked town.-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 145, TheLhix wrote:[quote="In I honestly dont see much going on but loads of crap having spilled over from it for the last page or so. Basically RC, Frozen, Jake, Me, Keyser all went insane for a moment from the look of it.
Is this usual? This is only my third game on this forum, my other two games were newbie games and they were so deadly serious that a single sentence introduction could ping people's scumdar if it was slightly unusual in tone. To be honest it kind of put me off the forum at the time but I'm glad I stayed, especially if it's looking like people are allowed to be more human.-
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Mathilda Goon
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Mathilda Goon
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The way he took the pressure in his stride. But particularly the comment out of breaking us out of RVS.
If I had to explain the first day to someone who does not play Mafia the very concept of it seems ridiculous.
Player: You see no one knows anything so we accuse each other in the hope of getting them to slip up. That's why we start off with random votes which obviously don't mean anything.
Noob: But why react at all if no one can take the random vote seriously and you know that they don't know anything? And how can you recognise if someone has slipped up if you yourself don't know anything?
Player: Yeah well it works once you get past the random vote stage. A random vote is the gaming equivalent of commenting on the weather.
Or maybe I just don't explain things very well.-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 170, Keyser Söze wrote:
By the way, I won't be making a roleclaim unless the mod confirms the rule regarding claiming scum with another player. If I do roleclaim, we will likely be lynching someone on my wagon.
Well if it comes to that, then for future reference, ignoring random votes the wagon is / has been:
TheLhix #45
RadiantCowbells #79
TheLhix #83
RadiantCowbells 140
TheLhix #143
InputPrimary #160
Jake from State Farm #167
Although I do note that you are now effectively soft claiming something more important than a VT which is suspicious. There hasn't been that much pressure on you yet.-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 185, Aneninen wrote:In post 165, Mathilda wrote:The way he took the pressure in his stride. But particularly the comment out of breaking us out of RVS.
Why is breaking the RVS a tell? As for the pressure on him, I don't think I agree.
In post 180, Mathilda wrote:Although I do note that you are now effectively soft claiming something more important than a VT which is suspicious. There hasn't been that much pressure on you yet.
Whut?!
The way he took the pressure (see above) first and "something more important than a VT which is suspicious. There hasn't been that much pressure on you yet" ???
NoNoNONONONO.
It's in scum's interest to spend longer in RVS because it is not possible to hunt scum when no one can take your vote seriously. This is because it does not assert any pressure on the recipient. The more time that is spend on scum hunting the harder it is to avoid suspicion. So someone who breaks us out of RVS is in my opinion playing pro-town. Now you can argue that scum could go about hiding by play pro-town but in my experience people remember suspicious behaviour more than they remember how other people played pro-town.
With regard to pressure, you have to take things within context. At the beginning of the thread there is very little to go on because there is very little information available. So there is only so much pressure that can be applied. This limits how confident you can be with your reads. My initial impressions were that Keyser handled the relative pressure that was available reasonably wellconsidering that the game had only just started.
Soft claiming though, which is quite a major step to be done much later in the game when you think that there is a real danger of being lynched, was premature.
Are you suggesting that I should be utterly confident in my reads this early in the game and unwilling to entertain all possibilities or to change my mind?-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 187, Zoronos wrote:@Anen
Hmmm... that is not what I was seeing from Math that was making me suspicious.
I was wondering / hoping if you saw the same thing I did, which would give me some confidence I wasn't keying onto noise. But you did not.
I would be interested to hear what you found suspicious about me.-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 188, Jake from State Farm wrote:In post 186, Mathilda wrote:It's in scum's interest to spend longer in RVS because it is not possible to hunt scum
people still think this?
Well it's certainly in their interest to hamper town's ability to scum hunt effectively, however they do it. Keeping town in RVS for longer is just one method at their disposal, admittedly not necessarily the most nuanced or effective.-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 191, Zoronos wrote:
I disliked this post:
In post 49, Mathilda wrote:That suggests to me that both you and Zulfy are playing pro-town, and you at least are more likely to be town (which isn't saying much at this point in the game when there is no information to go). Scum hide best in the long term when they are considered to be scum hunting but they try to avoid drawing suspicion on themselves and certainly won't do that in order to help town.
a) Those pronouncements of pro-town play seemed out of line with actions. I don't think Zulfy was playing pro-town, so coming up with a town read on him / her at that juncture struck me as not in line with the facts (aka maybe scum with bonus info).
b) I find 'Scum would play like x' posts made in a vacuum to be mildly suspicious. Speculation about play vs 'Scum play like X and person Y is doing that ergo Y is scum'. The later is towny, and the former scummy. (I hope I am communicating this well, if it is confusing let me know.)
It's a bit thin, so I was wondering if anyone else was seeing the same thing, or if I was jumping at a shadow.
Well all I can talk about is experience of what works from being a mediocre fish in a rather small pond. Different strategies evolve in different forums. This forum is certainly different to what I am used to and I am still finding my feet.
Zulfry quickly became scummy after those posts, but performing his first random vote and then changing it 7 minutes later when he didn't need to right at the beginning of the game to get the conversation started in my own personal humble opinion is a pro-town move. Regardless of where you play, town always starts day 1 with very little or no information and needs to generate it by whatever means necessary.-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 195, Zoronos wrote:
I was afraid I was communicating poorly, and I think that fear has been realized. I think you'ved missed my point. I'm not saying your experiences are wrong, I'm saying how you used / expressed them was scummy.
To give an example to make this clearer:
"I have seen scum lurk before, because it means they don't have to post / scum hunt, and Input is lurking. Ergo, Input is scum" <- This is a towny comment. (Disclaimer: I chose a random name, please do not construe this as an actual judgement).
"Scum tend to lurk!" <- Scummy comment; it's active-lurking. It looks like scum hunting, but doesn't identify specific scum in this case, so is a good way to appear to scum hunt without actually doing so (hence scumminess).
Ah fair enough. Like referring to town and mafia rather than them and us. And talking about generic game mechanics rather than scum hunting. It's just how I think of the game, in terms of mechanics. I love designing my own games and thinking about strategy. I pay attention to how I express myself when I am scum because I know that that's what really alerts people. In this game I'm just out to enjoy myself. I've been scum in the last four games I've played (three on another forum) and it really wore me down so I'm just happy to be town this time round and trying to figure things out.
His play since that consecutive vote is not consistent with his excuse for getting us beyond RVS. He hasn't really been analysing what people say and looking for any tells, which he would if his initial excuse for two consecutive votes was genuine. And above all, stating an intent to hammer at this stage of the game when someone isn't even at L-1.-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 197, Zoronos wrote:In post 196, Mathilda wrote:His play since that consecutive vote is not consistent with his excuse for getting us beyond RVS. He hasn't really been analysing what people say and looking for any tells, which he would if his initial excuse for two consecutive votes was genuine. And above all, stating an intent to hammer at this stage of the game when someone isn't even at L-1.
What did you think about what Lhinx wrote about KS scum slipping?
143 / 145
Could you explain what exactly the scumslip is please because I didn't pick up on it. Thanks.-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 213, Zoronos wrote:In post 207, Mathilda wrote:Could you explain what exactly the scumslip is please because I didn't pick up on it. Thanks.
I don't know what it is. That's part of why I'm trying to get the players involved to talk about it.
I'd very much like Elyse to weigh in, since her questioning provoked the exchange.
Hmm, glad I'm not the only one then!-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 242, Zulfy wrote:
To anybody who ever plays with me in the future: When an RVS wagon gets to L1 I will always hammer.
If that wagon goes away and comes back with some essence? Then yea, that's called playing mafia.
Why?
The whole point of the wagon is to create pressure. Scum are more likely to slip under pressure. There is more pressure if the recipient is at L-1.
You are also assuming that an alternative wagon wouldn't also be for completely arbitrary reasons.-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 74, TheLhix wrote:P.S I am scum and so is CP. I am taking him to hell with me
@Lhix, what was the best possible scum tell that you were hoping for in saying this if Keyser is scum?
How would this differ from his reaction if he is town?
If Keyser had reacted in a way that clearly told you that he is scum, how likely is it that town!Keyser could also react like that?-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 278, Zoronos wrote:
What are your thoughts on our less-active participants? Scorpious, Input, and Jake (who is talking more, but doesn't strike me as super substantive at the moment). Opinions? Disagree on my bucketing of them? Have others you think need to be in this grouping?
Jake was in the last game I played in and he was very talkative back then. He was heavily involved in a lynch wagon against me and then against someone else.-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 301, Jake from State Farm wrote:we played together? I don't remember
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=63145
I had a different avatar.
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 305, Jake from State Farm wrote:oh i replaced, out, that's probably why I don't remember
Sorry but I'm not buying this.
Our argument was dominating the thread on day 1 until I got to the point where I was seriously considering replacing out and leaving the forum for good.
But my main concern is that your play style is so different in this game. Far lurkier.
VOTE: Jake from state farm-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 320, Zulfy wrote:
In post 283, Aneninen wrote:In post 186, Mathilda wrote:It's in scum's interest to spend longer in RVS because it is not possible to hunt scum when no one can take your vote seriously. This is because it does not assert any pressure on the recipient. The more time that is spend on scum hunting the harder it is to avoid suspicion. So someone who breaks us out of RVS is in my opinion playing pro-town. Now you can argue that scum could go about hiding by play pro-town but in my experience people remember suspicious behaviour more than they remember how other people played pro-town.
I don't think it's working in that way.
Actually this reasoning reminds me of my first scumgame. I used another kind of generalization there ("scums are lurking early-game") so as to avoid picking up fights and draw too much attention on me.
In post 186, Mathilda wrote:Are you suggesting that I should be utterly confident in my reads this early in the game and unwilling to entertain all possibilities or to change my mind?
No.
But your posts were typlically "one step forward, one step back". This is a good way to look as if you were doing something whilst avoiding direct conflicts with others.This is true Mathilda, have you replied to this?
I started to then decided not to. I do understand why you and Aneninan say that. This is Day 1 so all we have to analyse is behaviour and tone. They're things to look out for but they don't build a case. I'm not interested in trying to appear town, I'm just interested in hunting out scum. If that means that I attract attention then I don't mind. It's ultimately all information for town.
In post 320, Zulfy wrote:
In post 191, Zoronos wrote:
a) Those pronouncements of pro-town play seemed out of line with actions. I don't think Zulfy was playing pro-town
Do you think I'm playing anti-town? What is your read on me right now?
In post 298, Mathilda wrote:In post 242, Zulfy wrote:
To anybody who ever plays with me in the future: When an RVS wagon gets to L1 I will always hammer.
If that wagon goes away and comes back with some essence? Then yea, that's called playing mafia.
Why?
Not relevant to this game at all now. We can talk about it some other time if you'd like.
Except it is relevant because you brought it up #65. It rings LAMISTry to me and now you're evading giving an explanation. I'm not interested in getting bogged down in a conversation of generic game mechanics, but I do want to know that you had a good reason to policy lynch Keyser in the event of reaching L-1 from RVS.-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 363, Aneninen wrote:
In post 346, Mathilda wrote:I started to then decided not to. I do understand why you and Aneninan say that. This is Day 1 so all we have to analyse is behaviour and tone. They're things to look out for but they don't build a case. I'm not interested in trying to appear town, I'm just interested in hunting out scum. If that means that I attract attention then I don't mind. It's ultimately all information for town.
That's even worse. It sounds like a kind of appeasing in my mind.
Or nonchalence Hmmm ... need a more appropriate smiley for nonchalence ...
It's interesting though, how could I have answered your accusation perfectly so that you went away thinking "yeah that Math, she's one of us, she's town to the core y'know ..." ?
Second question, assume for now that I am telling the truth in that last paragraph, what should I have said instead so that it didn't sound like it was appeasing you? Should I have lied?
Because if there was no way for me to properly answer that question then what you're doing is throwing shade rather than scum hunting.
You're throwing out a lot of questions in a scatter gun approach and keeping everyone on their toes, but has anyone done the same to you? Is this a case of the best defence is offence? From what I can see you're not actually pursuing any line of questioning that far.
In post 363, Aneninen wrote:
Then there were a couple of screwed-up quotes which I can't comprehend.
The quotes afterwards were in response to someone else.-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 385, RadiantCowbells wrote:The back and forth with Adenine interests me and I want more from this.
VOTE: Mathilda
What do you find interesting about it and how does voting for me encourage more dialogue between Adenine and myself?-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 388, Aneninen wrote:In post 368, Mathilda wrote:It's interesting though, how could I have answered your accusation perfectly so that you went away thinking "yeah that Math, she's one of us, she's town to the core y'know ..." ?
Yes, you could. I'm not performingRegardless of Card.
You mean the best way for me to have answered your question was to not answer? I did but Zullfy asked why I had not responded.
In post 388, Aneninen wrote:
However, one thing bothers me a lot. That "one ofus". Why are youthatsure that I'm town? No townie could be sure about my alignment.
Fair enough.
Are you town?
Obviously you're going to answer yes to this regardless of your alignment. That's a safe assumption to make for the purpose of having a conversation. That doesn't mean to say that I necessarily believe that you actually are town. The only one who I think is town at the moment is Zoronos although because of your questioning I am starting to put you in the town camp.
In post 388, Aneninen wrote:
In post 368, Mathilda wrote:Second question, assume for now that I am telling the truth in that last paragraph, what should I have said instead so that it didn't sound like it was appeasing you? Should I have lied?
The tone, Mathilda, that's it.
Tone is subjective and is only an indicator based on how you play yourself as town or scum and have experienced other people playingon this specific forum. Different people play in different ways so it is not a reliable indicator.
I paid far more attention to tone in the last game I played on mafiascum when I was scum. I ended up in lylo with two townies convinced that the other one was the remaining scum. In this game though I don't really care if my tone attracts attention. It acts like bait and allows me to see who is actively looking for tells and who is being opportunistic.
After all, you are picking up on tone, whereas RadiantCowbell's vote could be seen as being opportunistic #385-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 391, RadiantCowbells wrote:Don't you think that that pigeon is adorable?
Even cooler when you think that all birds are dinosaurs.-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 395, Aneninen wrote:Providing it was on MafiaScum, show me that game, Mathilda.
Same game that Jake can't remember playing #302. I started out really badly because it was the first game I had played on mafiascum from the beginning and wasn't familiar with the culture. I was also suffering a really bad cold that made me take days off work sick, which is extremely rare for me. After day 1 though I played it more carefully. I was doing the back and forth weighing up all possibilities thing on that thread that you have accused me of doing on this thread, but I spent a long, long time crafting each post to be careful about tone so I got away with it.-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 396, RadiantCowbells wrote:Well Mathilda, you said that my vote COULD BE SEEN as opportunistic.
Do you think that it's opportunistic? Where are you at on my alignment?
Well you didn't answer my question in #390 about your vote so I can't really see why you voted the way you did. At most all I can see it being is a pressure vote to encourage me to respond to Anoneneninenen.
I need to iso you before saying what I make of your alignment. I've been concentrating on other people for now but I'll pay more attention to you next.-
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Mathilda Goon
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 405, RadiantCowbells wrote:
Yeah, but I could easily be scum. Are you gonna do something about it?
Any of us could be scum. Blatent dodge of a question.
So I will repeat my question from #390 which you have refused to answer twice now.
How does voting for me encourage more dialogue between Adenine and myself?
From what I'm seeing it's just an arbitrary vote thrown out where-ever you see pressure being put on someone to make you look town.
That's not scum hunting. That's opportunism. Scum hunting is looking out for any potential tells (like Adenenine has been doing), or any mistakes and querying people about them.-
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Mathilda Goon
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ISOing RadiantCowbells right now.
After a random vote, she votes Keyser for his font (basically another random vote because it's not based on his opinions about Keyser's alignment) #22. He claims it's a policy lynch, but because it's nothing to do with his win condition it's equivalent to a random vote. That resulted in 7 posts.
He then votes Elyse because her scum game scares him #68. So this is again a random vote because Elyse hasn't done anything to warrant being voted for in this game so it's completely random whether a vote for her will move RC towards satisfying his win condition.
But before Elyse actually posts changes his vote again to Keyser just over two hours later #79 (note: there seems to have been some deleted posts). This time for a supposed scum slip which is tenuous at best. Then a fluff post.
We get another vote for the same person but using a different name #103 (Captain Planet is Keyser right?). This is then was followed with 5 more posts of fluff.
Back then to a naked vote on Keyser #140.
Then back to voting for Elyse #261. But this time it's not a random vote, but because "Elyse literally has not managed to make one post that hasn't triggered my scumdar."
@RC can you please specify exactly what Elyse has said that pings you as scummy?
So far it's looking like you are focusing on people to make it appear that you are applying pressure but without actually scum hunting.
Ironically despite performing a multitude of completely arbitrary votes RC now tells someone in no uncertain terms that we're out of RVS #273. So hypocrisy from RC despite him later having to defend himself from calling someone else a hypocrite #285.
We then have a few posts of single line rants. Followed by this:
In post 272, RadiantCowbells wrote:Why are you so resolved to defend Elyse?
You didn't hear my reasons and you were already dead set on defending her.
Yet RC hasn't actually given any reasons yet for voting Elyse, not backed up by any specific details or references to posts. Just one post from RC saying that Elyse pings his scumdar.
We finally have a partial scum read from RC #289. So at least something of substance but no explanation as to why.
How is this supposed to help town?
Two more fluff posts, followed by two posts containing a single line each. Then he diverts his attention to me.
So all in all, a fluff poster that has been making arbitrary votes that do not further a town!RC win condition and very little or no explanation at all. I see an opportunistic voter bouncing around making a lot of noise but not actually scum hunting.
VOTE: RadiantCowbell-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 432, RadiantCowbells wrote:I'm sorta not in the mood.
My immediate interpretation is that she's scum for it but I'm not positive.
That means nothing considering that you first picked on Elyse because 'her scum game scared you' and then later tried to justify voting for her again with "Elyse literally has not managed to make one post that hasn't triggered my scumdar." This demonstrates that you are picking targets you want rid of because you're scum, or if you are town then you only going by feelings and can't explain yourself to other people because you're not putting in the investigative work.
I'll make sure that you do.-
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Mathilda Goon
- Goon
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- Posts: 439
- Joined: July 31, 2015
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
In post 446, RadiantCowbells wrote:Vote me or Mathilda today.
If you lynch me, lynch Mathilda tomorrow when you see I'm down.
I'm positive she's scum but I don't have the energy to push it through.
That sounds defensive to me in order to get me to back off.-
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Mathilda Goon
- Goon
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- Posts: 439
- Joined: July 31, 2015
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
In post 434, Yimmy wrote:
(2)— Aneninen, RadiantCowbellsMathilda
(3)— InputPrimary, Jake from State Farm, TheLhixKeyser Söze
(1)— MathildaRadiantCowbells
Your defensiveness is also rather premature RC. There is only one vote on you.
Keyser is in the lead with three votes. There are two votes on me.-
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Mathilda Goon
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- Posts: 439
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- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
In post 450, RadiantCowbells wrote:
This is about expressing the sincerity of my scumread on you and trying to get other townies to figure out how to understand you the way I understand you, instead of having to spell it out for them.
And what's wrong with spelling it out for people? Are we all meant to be mindreaders?
Here's your chance then. State your case. With post numbers. Feels are not enough. Explain why certain posts are scummy. Let us see your reasoning like Adenenin did.
Also while you're at it, state why you thought Elyse was scummy. Refer to specific posts to give us a chance to agree or disagree with you.-
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Mathilda Goon
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Mathilda Goon
- Goon
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- Posts: 439
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- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
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Mathilda Goon
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- Posts: 439
- Joined: July 31, 2015
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How so?-
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Mathilda Goon
- Goon
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- Posts: 439
- Joined: July 31, 2015
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
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Mathilda Goon
- Goon
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- Posts: 439
- Joined: July 31, 2015
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
In post 459, Frozen Angel wrote:
counting day 1 votes as evidence of calling someone defensive? please ... no one is in L2 / L3 its just about 1 - 2 - 3 votes ...
That'sexactlymy point! Which is why RC's post pings my radar. The following is something you say when you are at L-1 near the end of the day, not when you have one single vote against you early on day one.
In post 446, RadiantCowbells wrote:Vote me or Mathilda today.
If you lynch me, lynch Mathilda tomorrow when you see I'm down.-
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Mathilda Goon
- Goon
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- Posts: 439
- Joined: July 31, 2015
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
In post 464, Garmr wrote:
Keyser has a behavioral pattern as scum were he stops providing content when in certain situations and the content he provides is lack luster and doesn't provide any push.
Have you been played in many games with Keyser in the past?-
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Mathilda Goon
- Goon
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- Posts: 439
- Joined: July 31, 2015
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
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Mathilda Goon
- Goon
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- Posts: 439
- Joined: July 31, 2015
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
In post 485, Jake from State Farm wrote:In post 482, Mathilda wrote:You're voting for yourself? That's such a scum tell. Complete LAMIST.
No it isn't.
Explain.-
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Mathilda Goon
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- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
In post 487, Jake from State Farm wrote:It's anti town. It's not alignment indicative
Sorry just read my question was already answered.
OK technically it is anti-town, yes, but in my experience the people that generally do lynch themselvesarescum. I can't think of many, if any, instances where town have voted themselves.
Can anyone suggest a reason why they would do such a thing?-
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Mathilda Goon
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- Posts: 439
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- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
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Mathilda Goon
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- Posts: 439
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- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
In post 491, TheLhix wrote:
Ah yes...surface level...very subjective dont you think?....especially with the shit I dug up against Garmr. I suppose i could try harder, but as I have run out of lotion, I think I will do that in a few mins after desert.
I thought your case against Garmr was convincing and put you in my town list.
@RC, what do you think of Garmr?
@Garmr, what do you make of RC?-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 515, RadiantCowbells wrote:Why are you trying to get away from this 1v1 as soon as you realized just how far crowd mentality was away from you?
Who is that question directed at RC?-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 517, RadiantCowbells wrote:
Why are you shifting focus to Garmr because everyone disliked your push?
I should still be scum, no?
Because if garmr is also scum, which could well be the case given TheLhix's analysis of him, then you two are probably scum buddies. So I want to know what you two are going to do when specifically asked about each other.
Are you going to bus each other? Be non-commital and read null? Or say that the other one is town?
When or if either one of you then flips red or makes a scum tell then it will provide useful information.
Several more questions for you though ...
Why shouldn't I focus on other potential scum?
How was I shifting focus? I was referring to you in every sentence.
Do you agree that looking at how people interact with one another is a useful way of spotting scum? (e.g distancing, consistent null reads etc).
Why aren't you answering any of my questions?
How do you read Garmr?-
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Mathilda Goon
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- Posts: 439
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- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
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Mathilda Goon
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- Posts: 439
- Joined: July 31, 2015
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
In post 518, Mathilda wrote:
Why shouldn't I focus on other potential scum?
How was I shifting focus? I was referring to you in every sentence.
Do you agree that looking at how people interact with one another is a useful way of spotting scum? (e.g distancing, consistent null reads etc).
Why aren't you answering any of my questions?
How do you read Garmr?-
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Mathilda Goon
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- Posts: 439
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- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
In post 537, Elyse wrote:
I'm not liking Mathilda much. It always pings my scumdar when someone decides to ISO someone else, calls out a few things as scummy, and then votes them. It reads more of "this person is scum -> let me try to back it up" rather than coming across a read organically.
The reason I decided to ISO RC was because he asked me what I made of his alignment #398.
In post 398, Mathilda wrote:
<snip>
I need to iso you before saying what I make of your alignment. I've been concentrating on other people for now but I'll pay more attention to you next.
Ironically, RC is now complaining that I am focusing on other people again.-
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Mathilda Goon
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Well considering that there's a real chance that I might be lynched, here's my read list:
Town:
Zoronos- scum hunting from the very beginning
Zulfy- I was dubious about him to begin with but he's started scum hunting. Has also questioned the witch hunt against Keyser whereas scum would prefer to encourage on the lynch wagon.
Aneninen- Has been looking out for tells and trying to spot tone and behaviour consistent with scum
Keyser- I wasn't reading scum on him and then he made a supposed scum slip in someone's paranoid eyes although I don't think it was. He then gave up posting and has asked to be replaced. He's always struck town me as town and I can empathise with getting tired of criticism for something that someone thinks is slightly out of the ordinary. I mean how are you supposed to react to someone saying that you and they are scum and you are the one that gets the shade? Yet the mob has collectively decided that he is the one who was suspicious with a single question regarding Lhix's crazy statement. I would have probably said something similar if it happened to me and the same thing would have happened to me. This is the worst thing about this forum. You all think that you're scum hunting but you're actually just comparing people against one particular way of playing and lynching people for it if they do not conform. This means that people start conforming over time. Players new to the forum (like me) then ping your scumdars when they express themselves freely. That's why I personally decided that you can stick your conformity where the compost is rich and continued playing as I want to. And that's why I am reading town on Keyser.
Lhix- I was very dubious about him outing himself as scum along with Keyser but it would be a very ballsy move as scum and he has been actively scum hunting and analysing people's play. It's possible that the outing of Keyser was WIFOM but he would have to be very experienced and ballsy to do that as scum. But he did admit to outing himself as scum in the past in order to scumhunt so he would know whether or not he could get away with it as a WIFOM. But I will lean town on him for his other play since then.
Scum:
RadiantCowbells- opportunistic voter who doesn't explain himself, doesn't answer questions and who decides beforehand who he wants to claim is scum and then finds a reason. All demonstrated in thread. I can't believe he's fooling anyone with his LAMIST. So maybe RC is just a regular anti-town player and you're all aware of that and I'm not. What happens with these people is that they get excused for being anti-town and no one really questions whether they are scum, even when they are scum. We each have an equal chance of being scum in this game. I firmly believe that we should lynch scum play regardless of meta.
Jake from state farm- Active lurker who does not explain himself, absolutely no scum hunting, posts the minimum possible, sometimes, single word posts. This is not the Jake that I played with earlier. Defends RC saying that it's anti-town and not scum play and just accepts this rather than sees that it's a cause for further questioning. This is Day 1! We need to generate information. You take what little tell you're given and exploit it like Aneninen did with me. You don't just ignore it.
Garmr- I liked Lhix's analysis, but this could also be just the result of Garmr not really being that interested in the game, so this is the weakest scum read that I have,
Null:
Everyone else.-
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Mathilda Goon
- Goon
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- Posts: 439
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- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
In post 539, Elyse wrote:What do you think about the keyser/lhix connection
Unfortunate. I think they're both town. It was a nice try and could have generated some good information if Keyser over reacted but he didn't. Instead it basically gave scum the opportunity to lynch town and get away with it.
Keyser did something unusual. Oooh! But it was an unusual question so of course what he did was only ever going to be unusual. Ask yourself what you would do if you were town and Lhix outed you as scum. Then ask yourself how other people could have made your response into a scum case against you. There was no right way to answer that outing from Lhix. There was only a wrong way.-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 545, InputPrimary wrote:
Right now I'm feeling Mathilda scum. I get bad vibes from her posts, they're overly defensive and don't seem genuine.
So forget all the evidence I put forward and just focus on tone so you don't have to backup your own accusation. Got it.
In post 545, InputPrimary wrote:
This especially pinged me.
In post 346, Mathilda wrote:I started to then decided not to. I do understand why you and Aneninan say that. This is Day 1 so all we have to analyse is behaviour and tone. They're things to look out for but they don't build a case. I'm not interested in trying to appear town, I'm just interested in hunting out scum. If that means that I attract attention then I don't mind. It's ultimately all information for town.
Not caring how you appear to others is cool. Declaring how much you don't care how you appear to others, thus showing that you really do care, is scummy.
Where did I show that I do care about how I appear to others? Demonstrate this or be shown to be lying.
In post 545, InputPrimary wrote:
Post 416 is what really cinches it for me. There is no conviction behind it. There is little analysis, just statements of fact with some slight spin to make them appear scummy.
BS.-
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Mathilda Goon
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In post 552, RadiantCowbells wrote:I note that both Keyser and Lhix are in Mathilda's town pile.
Well done. You can read a read list.-
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Mathilda Goon
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- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
In post 541, Garmr wrote:Post more tommorow spending this last day with my gf for a couple of months.
Fair enough excuse. This puts you as null on my read list and Input as third scum for his opportunistic vote basically parroting non-committal accusations.-
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Mathilda Goon
- Goon
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- Posts: 439
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- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
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Mathilda Goon
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Mathilda Goon
- Goon
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- Posts: 439
- Joined: July 31, 2015
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
In post 563, Elyse wrote:If lhix said I was scum with him then I'd ignore him because I know he's lying.
But then I could specifically ask you why you were avoiding such a significant post and state that it looked scummy. After all, this is what people do when they ask a question and it gets ignored.