Mini 1434 - Flavorless Mafia! D4: Not quite so silent

[Zang]

/confirm

[Zang]

Vote: Bacde

For being a conformist.

Zang is a plague upon any game he joins
If he's town, scum will do their best to keep him alive because he's an easy mislynch.
If he's scum, his buddies will bus him in to oblivion and make figuring out associative tells hard.
He does nothing. He's inherently scummy. And I hate him

... You just admitted that this was from two years ago.

I would like to think that I have improved considerably since then. Especially concerning the do nothing part.

[Zang]

11 pages in two days is too much, especially when less than half of it is actual content. This game really has been a pain to read.

Unvote

Vote: Bacde

He has posted a lot of reads to make it seem like he is scumhunting but has actually explained nothing including his reasoning for voting or unvoting Venmar and hasn't really done anything productive for the town. Some of his meta was posted and I'll look at it later when I have time to read something besides this game.

I have a very slight town read on Venmar. I also have a leaning scum read on Kise and ArcAngel. I can't read sven. From majiffy, I've seen both incredible proscum and protown motivations throughout his posts. I'm getting a mixed read from BBmolla also.

ArcAngel- Do you have any actual content to add to the game?

You have just sheeped onto someone, accusing them of sheeping.

That is what is called a random vote.

The shitty vote, and the really pathetic attempt at disabling the argument of him-being-a-good-PL-by-reason-of-sucking.

1. I thought that vote was quite obviously random
2. I'm not sure what you're saying in the second part but I think it's quite unreasonable to base your opinion on someone's play from meta over two years old.
3. Are you actually saying that you want me to be lynched?

Town
Kise
BBMolla
Zang (Probably)

Probably Bacde's scum partners
Majiffy (chainsaw defense w/ toasty sheep)
Ms Marangal
Svenstagel stahl
Toasty (obv chainsaw defense)

Why do you give reasoning for two reads but not the others? What is your reasoning for the others? Also, why did you vote someone who you didn't even list as a scum read?

I don't have any clear reads on anybody else... Except maybe Parama who was actually pretty funny too

So then what is your read on Parama and why did you not include it with the others?

Majiffy might be town

Sven is town tho for being hilarious

I'm cool w/ Parama

Again, what is your reasoning for these reads? In case you didn't know, being hilarious is not a valid town read.

BEcause that wagon was a RVS wagon, Bacde's wagon is the first serious wagon and it has no base to it

What makes his wagon serious? I read kise's vote as random.

that sentence there where I said something about Venmar seems shifty meant that I do have a read on you, indicated by the word "and". The "and" was in reference to the previous keyword "except", meaning that Parama AND Venmar were exceptions to that clear read phrase

However, the capital "A" in "And" and the fact that it is on a seperate line indicate that it was a seperate statement then your exception to Parama.

If this is true though, then why separate Venmar from your other reads?

Kise and BBMola are likely town tbh.

why?

apparently I'm also impossible for you to read

This is based on the assumption that you are town.

^^Note that Venmar modded that game yet seems to think for whatever reason that I am scum this game

Meta is not a free pass to scummy behavior.

Bacde makes two very WIFOMy posts, Molla hops on the bandwagon reasonlessly after Kise starts it.

So your entire case is based off of his vote four pages before this post?

If you want real scum, look no further than AA9, Four & Monk. Classic scum lurkfucks.

Besides the fact that lurkking isn't scummy regardless of how long it's been, the game just started less than two days ago. How can you reasonably accuse anybody of lurking?

Already answered this.

Is there a reason why you could not quote it or post it again?

I don't think its likely scum will harp on people wondering why they are being townread

This is WIFOM.

Unvote

ok, who are we voting for then?

Why did you unvote?

^ Scum Molla wouldn't actually be interested in following up on something as inane as Toastyscum Meta. Shows he's actually trying to discern the alignments of others, and thus is town.

So, why are you unvoting now over 100 posts later?

Town Reads
{BBmolla, Ms Marangal, Toasty, Kise, Bacde, FourTrouble}

Scum Reads
{Parama, Zang, Venmar}

Nulls
{Lord Mhork, Sven, ArcAngel9}

That's some very good reasoning you have there.

VOTE: Parama

Reasoning?

[Zang]

So, I decided to replace out. 10+ new pages each day is far too much for me to keep up with, even if I wanted to. In addition to this, I think that my plastyle is too different from everyone elses and that this is leading to them reading me incorrectly as well as me reading them incorrectly and I think that this will just continue. So this will likely be the last wall that you see from me in this game, I wanted to respond to those who were calling me scum and give my final opinions before I replace out.

Toasty is my largest townread with his recent posts. However, I'm also starting to think that Kise might also be town despite how horrible his vote against lurkers was. Venmar and Sven are also giving me a gut town read. I'm getting a slight gut scum read from BBmolla. I have no idea what Majiffy is. I still think that Bacde might be scum.

1. Sure didn't look random.
2. Depends. Have you played with him since then?
3. Yes.

1. Well, I intended it to be random.
2. I believe my last game with parama was about a year ago.
3. That's scummy if you want to lynch someone after one post.

You mean when I originally voted him, 4 pages earlier? Fancy that.

I'm not saying it was a bad reason to vote him 4 pages earlier, I'm saying it's bad that you have the same reasoning as when you first voted 4 pages earlier. Your reasoning should have developed and expanded in that time if you actually thought that he was scum.

You're a big boy. Why don't you read the context and figure that out.

I don't see it.

Cuz he's scum. But you know what? You're worse.

Oh yes, I agree. That is very scummy of me. It's not like you could be scum who's just voting someone without even having any reasoning or who may want to have very flimsy reasoning so that it could be easily changed later to fit a situation. It was completely unreasonable of me to try and ask you for the reasoning behind your vote.

No, town doesn't spend a giant wall basically discrediting any attempt at scumhunting or debasing early-game reads in the way Zang has.

I don't see how I am doing any of this.

lol I don't really know how to make my joke posts more obvious

So none of those reads were serious? What about your reads on Parama and Venmar?

My read on Parama is that he is pretty funny, and that he possibly feels insecure about me being funny too

No, being funny is not a read. Even if it was, the way you phrased that sentence makes him being funny being in addition to the reason for him being an exception.

Actually it can be

Regardless of whether it is or is not, you completely ignored my question for the reasoning behind your reads.

Yes, yes it is

And how is Venmar supposed to know that?

I guess every scumtell and towntell is WIFOM then

I guess you could say that, but you are using the WIFOM as a defence for yourself, which is scummy.

Basically, Kise was hilarious on p2, and it was completely out of the blue, and had no game-motivation except to be funny

This is something I see 9/10 times from town

I don't believe this at all.

And of course it's just a coincidence that you have constantly been trying to be funny throughout the game.

You also did not link to any games to show this tell working.

zang is also often lynched.

I'm not sure where you read this but in my past five games, I was night killed night two as a survivor, night killed night three as town, revived in Reverse mafia as town, lynched day five as town and survived a game as mafia.

Toasty feels like scum.

There goes my town read on Venmar.

AAnd yes, you lurkerfucks may not be scum but you're good candidates to look into. Typical scum, you ask about? Yeah those guys don't like to be cervix deep into D1 conversation, else they get held accountable for stuff! Best bet is to chill and let town make their move and direct conversation first. That'll do it.

Except that in your original post you clearly called them scum for lurking.

I agree that scum do lurk, especially day 1, but so does town and it is too early to tell the town lurkers apart from the scum lurkers.

Why do I ask rhetorical questions that I already know the answer to?

If mhork isn't lynched today, he gets insta-lynched tomorrow

no exceptions

Why are you this adamant for his lynch when he just posted yesterday? This combined with how many new pages of posts there are makes it seem pretty reasonable why mhork isn't posting.

[Zang]

So, I decided to replace out. 10+ new pages each day is far too much for me to keep up with, even if I wanted to. In addition to this, I think that my plastyle is too different from everyone elses and that this is leading to them reading me incorrectly as well as me reading them incorrectly and I think that this will just continue. So this will likely be the last wall that you see from me in this game, I wanted to respond to those who were calling me scum and give my final opinions before I replace out.

Toasty is my largest townread with his recent posts. However, I'm also starting to think that Kise might also be town despite how horrible his vote against lurkers was. Venmar and Sven are also giving me a gut town read. I'm getting a slight gut scum read from BBmolla. I have no idea what Majiffy is. I still think that Bacde might be scum.

1. Sure didn't look random.
2. Depends. Have you played with him since then?
3. Yes.

1. Well, I intended it to be random.
2. I believe my last game with parama was about a year ago.
3. That's scummy if you want to lynch someone after one post.

You mean when I originally voted him, 4 pages earlier? Fancy that.

I'm not saying it was a bad reason to vote him 4 pages earlier, I'm saying it's bad that you have the same reasoning as when you first voted 4 pages earlier. Your reasoning should have developed and expanded in that time if you actually thought that he was scum.

You're a big boy. Why don't you read the context and figure that out.

I don't see it.

Cuz he's scum. But you know what? You're worse.

Oh yes, I agree. That is very scummy of me. It's not like you could be scum who's just voting someone without even having any reasoning or who may want to have very flimsy reasoning so that it could be easily changed later to fit a situation. It was completely unreasonable of me to try and ask you for the reasoning behind your vote.

No, town doesn't spend a giant wall basically discrediting any attempt at scumhunting or debasing early-game reads in the way Zang has.

I don't see how I am doing any of this.

lol I don't really know how to make my joke posts more obvious

So none of those reads were serious? What about your reads on Parama and Venmar?

My read on Parama is that he is pretty funny, and that he possibly feels insecure about me being funny too

No, being funny is not a read. Even if it was, the way you phrased that sentence makes him being funny being in addition to the reason for him being an exception.

Actually it can be

Regardless of whether it is or is not, you completely ignored my question for the reasoning behind your reads.

Yes, yes it is

And how is Venmar supposed to know that?

I guess every scumtell and towntell is WIFOM then

I guess you could say that, but you are using the WIFOM as a defence for yourself, which is scummy.

Basically, Kise was hilarious on p2, and it was completely out of the blue, and had no game-motivation except to be funny

This is something I see 9/10 times from town

I don't believe this at all.

And of course it's just a coincidence that you have constantly been trying to be funny throughout the game.

You also did not link to any games to show this tell working.

zang is also often lynched.

I'm not sure where you read this but in my past five games, I was night killed night two as a survivor, night killed night three as town, revived in Reverse mafia as town, lynched day five as town and survived a game as mafia.

Toasty feels like scum.

There goes my town read on Venmar.

AAnd yes, you lurkerfucks may not be scum but you're good candidates to look into. Typical scum, you ask about? Yeah those guys don't like to be cervix deep into D1 conversation, else they get held accountable for stuff! Best bet is to chill and let town make their move and direct conversation first. That'll do it.

Except that in your original post you clearly called them scum for lurking.

I agree that scum do lurk, especially day 1, but so does town and it is too early to tell the town lurkers apart from the scum lurkers.

Why do I ask rhetorical questions that I already know the answer to?

If mhork isn't lynched today, he gets insta-lynched tomorrow

no exceptions

Why are you this adamant for his lynch when he just posted yesterday? This combined with how many new pages of posts there are makes it seem pretty reasonable why mhork isn't posting.

[Zang]

I know that my replacing is bad but it's been less than three pages and there has been 20 pages, I can't keep up with that. I'm trying to replace now before it get's worse.

1. Do you have any idea how illogical that sounds? And beyond that - scummy?
2. Then it isn't that unreasonable for him to be holding onto a PL if he hasn't seen a change in your meta.
3. Scum can be found with one post.

1. No, because it is true.
2. I think it is quite unreasonable to base anything off of meta a year old.
3. Yes, but not reliably. There is no way you can be that confident in someone's alignment after only one post to want to lynch them.

So your argument is that I'm wrong because I could be scum?

I was using sarcasm. I was pointing out the possible scum motivations for not giving the reasoning behind your vote.

Try re-reading your posts with a critical, objective eye.

Doesn't help.

[Zang]

Gather suspicion? sure. Be confident enough to lynch someone? no.

[Zang]

1. You can't INTEND to RANDOMLY do anything. And it looks scummy because what you said is about the equivalent of "I can't be scum - look at those towntells I dropped!"
2. Not really - meta doesn't legitimately change all that quickly.
3. What about scumslips? Or scumtells? What about a blatant lie? etc.

1. I thought it was still RVS. I have no idea how I used it to make myself seem town.
2. Clearly, I disagree.
3. In the case of really obvious scumslips, I suppose. However, even when it is a very obciouse scumtell or lie, I believe that someone should be lynched off of scuminess throughout a person's posts and not one very scummy post.

Well, sorry you suck at this.

Ok, then. You definitely shouldn't go through my posts and make an actual case against me or anything like that. (sarcasm)

[Zang]

you have no reason to make yourself "look" town as town. people tend to townread me more as scum then as town, why? because I know how to do it and I care more about it as scum then I do town. how people look at me as town means absolutely nothing because the inherent danger of losing isn't there, least not early on. a person can "look" very town, but they can mess up their entire act with a single post, hence why a single post can mean the difference in how one is read

I agree but looking town and having protown motivation in your posts are completely different.

Do you really find it suspicious that a (self-proclaimed) funny-man would be looking for tells based on humor?

Yes, because you could also apply those tells to yourself. For example, if I'm lurking as scum, I am of course going to argue that lurking is a town tell.

Uh, aren't ALL of my arguments going to be based on me being town, regardless of my alignment? I don't see what you are getting at here.

Your play should be based on it but not your defence. It is essentially saying that you can't be scum because you are town, this is circular reasoning and scummy.