Mini 1438: Gonzo Mafia (Scum Win)

[jon_h61]

@ IAI I like your analysis, it coincides with mine. My plan for today ATM is to vote Kuror0 and investigate Remembrance tonight.

VOTE: Kuror0

(Obligatory Amish tell) I disagree with a lot of my predecessor's reads and opinions. I can't explain or defend any of them.

I've read most of the thread, and ALL of the last fifteen pages. I'm doing ISO's and looking things over to see what connections I can come up with. Any and all questions or accusations welcome.

[jon_h61]

Oh, hi all, glad to join you!

[jon_h61]

@ Remembrance Sorry for taking so long getting back to you. My wife and sis-in-law demanded an impromptu fishing trip this weekend. And I have a lot of tabs open right now trying to figure things out. I fell asleep with my laptop on my lap reading the thread.

The main thing I notice right now is that our dead Townies have been wrong on their reads a lot.

But to kinda answer your question, I don't mind being a sheep if it coincides with my reads ATM, and I tunnel when I think I've found scum. Labels don't make things wrong or right. Besides we can only lynch one person at a time.

I still want rope for kuror0, and I know I have to make a case for him. Being Friday, and having to pack for this unexpected trip to the lake is gonna slow me done, sorry.

I have stuck myself in confirmation bias before, and will try not to this game, but Kuror0 is definitely my main scum suspect.

If I'm gonna die, how does this association work? If I was scum, wouldn't that kinda clear you? Who should I investigate, since you don't want me to investigate you?

I promise, I'll have more time, and try to make more sense later when I'm not so rushed.

[jon_h61]

I'd like mollie's input on this present conversation. I'm pretty sure she's Town, and I'd consider her a Mafia veteran.

I'll take anyone else's opinion into consideration, if they want to give it.

Remembrance, the thing is, I was reading the thread most of the night. IAI's opening posts were really close to what I was leaning toward anyway. Mostly on Kuror0, I was gonna ISO him first, but I'll do you first. I don't know anyone but mollie, and her just briefly. I have no biases or vendettas, so I'll be as objective as possible. It'll have to wait a while, this running in and out and posting has gotten me messed up once before.

I hope there's an unclaimed doc that'll protect me, so that I either catch scum or confirm Town and live to tell about it. And waste scum's NK!

[jon_h61]

oh god why the hell did we lynch mantis over rubicon what the fuck was I thinking at the time

jon you subbed into a seriously scummy slot and you are not making it any better

Just got back in from a lot of running around. A little more explanation would be helpful, I haven't really looked much at rubicon's play. I'll say the standard "don't lynch me I'm Town speech". But I really am.

Haven't Iso'd Kuror0 yet, just now getting to set down and really look at the game. I'm serious, p_m, I want your input, even if you think I'm scum. If I'm going to go, I'm going to go scumhunting. If I need to defend something, at least give me something better than "you're not making it better", please.

Remembrance is right, Rubicon was joining another game as he was abandoning this one. Not a kosher move for any player of any alignment.

I'm going to triple ISO kuror0, Remembrance, and IAI and see what I can.

[jon_h61]

I am innocent is a jerk. I'll be gone for a bit.

Is this game related? I looked on the whole page and didn't see a post from IAI, and didn't want to go back farther. If it's not game related, I'll leave it alone.

The rest of the reads were just opinions with no case to them. From that post.

They're specifically told how many doctors and how many cops there are. This happens in their QT and/or role pms.

Shit, I didn't read right when I glanced over the wiki. I think I might just be NK'd tonight. I wish I realized it sooner, another sliver to watch for.

my for sure town reads that I will not get weird on ever and will be clinging to like a burr are borky, hd and buldey.

I guess Rubicon really screwed up this slot then, huh? I guess i might have to look at his play sometime in the near future. But not tonight, I have a lot of notes written down, but Deb (my wife) is making me load up the truck. Sleeping bags, fishing supplies, cooking equipment, etc... I'll put them into a readable format later tonight if I'm lucky.

When I look at my notes it makes me wonder why I suspected Kuror0 last night. May change my bote later tonight.

[jon_h61]

I'm going to need a v/la, there's no wifi at the campground we'll be camping at. And my wife would kill me if I tried to slip away to McD's or some other free wifi spot while we were out fishing!

Apologies Majiffy (and everyone else), but sometimes you just gotta say yes to the women. Besides, I don't mind catching a load of crappies.

V/LA until sometime Sunday evening.

As promised UNVOTE: . I didn't even get to finish kuror0's ISO, actually the triple ISO. But I change my mind for now and don't think he's scum.

[jon_h61]

There is yet another thing that bothers me about it. While I've been lazy lately in this game, I have read more or less every post made. Yet, I have to read IaI's analysis carefully to really understand what he's saying and which assumptions he's making. You somehow managed to understand his analysis well enough to assert that it coincides with yours based on the 15 latest pages? I'm not sure I buy that.

This is quite wrong, I had like five tabs open the first night, I actually fell asleep with my laptop on my lap. But that first post was like right after I woke up. Like Solomon said (paraphrase) The first person to speak sounds right, until you hear the second person's testimony), from Proverbs. No, I'm not a religious nut, but I

have

read the Bible. And I had read a

lot

of the first hundred pages. This is how I knew that our dead Townies were wrong so often.

I had gotten through enough of my triple ISO to completely change my mind about my reads on kuror0. I kept having to click on posts to see what was being talked about, then going back to the ISO, that in what time I squeezed out the day to do it I didn't finish it. I made a lot of notes, but unfortunately I won't be able to do anything with them until Sunday. The bad thing is my thoughts on them will no longer be fresh.

I'm being yelled at, so I won't even get time to preview this, but I

will

be back Sunday evening (CST) ready and willing to fully participate in this game as it's the only game I'm in. I think anyone wanting me dead can wait at least that long!

Good gaming everyone, and barring any disasters, CYA Sunday

[jon_h61]

Either way, lynching Rubi today over either of Kuro and IAI is terrible, so todays lynch options are IAI and Kuro.

Really? Well, I'll probably have a lot more posts to go through, that I'll just have to close this thing and get on the road.

[jon_h61]

And I had read a lot of the first hundred pages.

You have not previously pointed this out.

It's moot, but

I've read most of the thread

, and ALL of the last fifteen pages. I'm doing ISO's and looking things over to see what connections I can come up with. Any and all questions or accusations welcome.

That reading was a straight through, not going off on tangents reading, though.

You have already stuck yourself in confirmation bias by deciding whom to lynch prior to finding reasons to lynching that person.

I'm looking for a good lynch, but I'd consider it confirmation bias if I came into the thread looking to lynch a certain player, then trying to make the evidence make them guilty. Trying to make the evidence meet my preconceived ideas.

I'd read threads lately (I'm saying I read them lately, not that they're new threads) where players have accused other players of joining games just to get them lynched, or just to give them a hard time. So I guess it was still fresh on my mind.

I initially thought he was the cop tonight because I'm stupid, which is why I wanted to postpone lynching him for a night. Still, I think we should postpone lynching him another night for the same reason I thought it was a good idea yesterday.

I agree, at least let me get my investigation in, and hopefully be saved to report it. Then you can determine if I need rope.

It does seem as if you don't really have any analysis at all

and that you're avoiding having to account for that by sheeping IAI's vote and asserting that your supposed analysis coincides with IAI's. It's not necessarily a scum-tell, but I don't like it.

I agree with the bold, this is a lot of pages to speed read and analyze in less than 24 hours between starting to read and the start of Day Four.
I'm not avoiding anything though. If I were, that would have been one of the worst ways of attempting it IMO. Maybe I should have added a disclaimer that they were initial reads, and were very fluid at that time, but I just wanted to see what happened with them worded that way.

[jon_h61]

I don't really like the fact that mollie had her vote parked on bork and then on Nacho while intending to lynch neither of them. I think town-mollie usually makes her vote jump around in attempts to read people better - in this game it feels like she isn't really interested in doing so.

But it's true that almost nobody can have confident scumreads this game. I still don't know who to lynch either.

I don't' like that when I asked p_m for her input she

just

voted with no explanation. Using this

jon you subbed into a seriously scummy slot and you are not making it any better

as her only explanation.

gut says IaI and jon

then two hours later

VOTE: buldey

I'm kinda lost on what's going on here. I need a lot more work done to catch up. Gonna have to ISO p_m too.

[jon_h61]

OK, I'm pretty sure I'm dead tonight, no doc for me if I got it right, so it all depends on today. At least for me.

I think Buldemar is Town.
P-M is iffy Town.
Leaning scum on IAI
Same on Kuroro0.
Unsure on Remembrance, but wanting to lean Town.
Confused as all get out on SE Asians.

Our dead Townies aren't much help unfortunately.

The only thing directing the investigation does is implicate me in his death via guilt by association, a logical fallacy. Not that, that actually means anything either. @IaI, why did you even ask I be investigate if

you're assuming Jon is town

.

Scenario 1: I get nked: they would use my death to create more suspicions on his slot leading him to get lynched tomorrow. The reason being is that just because he announces he will investigate me is not a guarantee he will. If he investigates someone else and finds them to be scum, they risk losing since the rest of the town would be motivated to go back through their whole iso to confirm the veracity of this fact. Which is why I don't want to lynch that probable scum slot.

He could very well investigate anyone else, so if he is town he will die tonight.

I just realized IaI was right, it makes absolutely no sense for Rubicon to vote with me instead of Mollie or HD or IaI. He never listened to anyone but me. And I think he hid behind me.

Could you save me some time and point me to where you're talking about?

The question why would scum do X, you know is pure wifom. But if you want an answer I can think one: You didn't reveal who was your night investigation and when HD claimed cop you had the perfect time not only to not reveal a new town but to get super easy town cred.

This is true, and at the heart of my suspicions of IAI.
The conundrum is you did it too.

Pff I did my pool before it was an idea. Leaving IaI aside I will either investigate Nacho, Mantis or Remem. So IaI can choose freely among the other players.

From what I remember:

Day 1: Nacho(doc), Rem(Doc), Mollie(cop).
Day 2: Rach(cop), buldermar(doc), Kuror(cop), IaI (cop)
Day 3: Wisdom (doc), HD(cop)
Day 4: Rubi (cop)
Day 5: Se-Asians(?)

Mantis(?)

If SE is claiming a N-5 PR, one of our cops is lying about being a cop. It also means I won't get an investigation tonight. To keep from getting too big a headache outta this mess, I may just lend my vote to my biggest Town read (Buldemar). Would prefer IAI or koror0.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
OK After reading HD's ISO, IAI is my main scum read, and SE Asians a close second. Why did SE get so much defense early?

[jon_h61]

From what I remember:

Day 1: Nacho(doc), Rem(Doc), Mollie(cop).
Day 2: Rach(cop), buldermar(doc), Kuror(cop), IaI (cop)
Day 3: Wisdom (doc), HD(cop)
Day 4: Rubi (cop)
Day 5: Se-Asians(?)

Mantis(?)

Add in HD and you have seven cops, you can only have six cops max in this setup. So obviously someone is lying.

I have zero chance of a doc to cover me so I have no chance for an investigation to go through. We need to find scum today.

[jon_h61]

Well, then in that case you ought to try to get me lynched. But we are running out of days, so I'd be sure before you place your votes -this is to everyone.

P-M you keep saying that, but you leave me nothing to refute. I can say I'm not scum all day to refute you saying I'm scum but it gets us nowhere. Tell me something, anything that makes you feel I (independently) am scum.
By the way I never went back and read my predecessor.

I am actually entertaining the thought that p-m may have pulled the gambit when she revealed her guilty earlier. I realize p-m's play style is unique, but I'm really starting to wonder about her this game. I'm starting to lean scum on her.

@ p-m Can you explain why you keep voting Buldermar?

[jon_h61]

p_m definitely has a unique playstyle, and I'm trying to adjust to it. I'll bow to others' opinions who have played with her more.

This is where I stand
Town
Buldemar
pirate mollie
me

nullish
Remembrance
kuror0

scum
IAI
SE Asians

Believe it or not I'm still going through ISOs and trying to get better reads. Current conversations would probably be better for that though.

[jon_h61]

I thought you found me the scummiest. Would you mind explain what made you change your mind?

I keep on reading ISOs, looking for scum. There were 125 pages of info when I subbed in. Reading the game I'm not the only one to change my reads. Besides if you ISO me you'd see you are old news. I wouldn't be surprised if my reads change again before I'm completely through.

why did you address me twice in this post

jesus christ jon you have seen my scum game, pulling a gambit like you are suggesting would be stupid and besides I would have eaten bc's liver if he would have subbed out. your suspicions do not read as natural they look forced as hell and you are looking awkward and clunky.

The second time I addressed you in that post was because I noticed you'd voted Buldemar again, and I was curious of the reason.

I'll agree with the awkward and clunky part, this is a lot of pages to sift through to try to get reads. I've noticed almost everyone has been really off on their reads (including our dead players), so there isn't anyone's reads I can rely on being right. This is mainly why I'm offering to lend my vote to my biggest Town read, and another part to my question of why you're voting him.

[jon_h61]

In P898 I agreed with most of his reads. In 1302 his WKing of Nacho sounds sincere, from a Town's point of view. His willingness to admit he may have been wrong in P1348.

And reading back over him, I feel his reads progressed naturally. So maybe he is more Town than null to me.

[jon_h61]

One of the main things I didn't like was his night investigation. He said he picked Nacho, who to me seemed obviously Town. He was also the NK. I can kinda understand his explanation, but it was a main factor in my calling him scum when I first entered the game. It seemed a good scum strategy, claim to investigate the Night Kill.

Bjork replacement seems as weird as it gets. It is the first time I see a night phase extension due to a replacement, which makes me suspicious of that slot.

Majiffy offered me an extension to catch up too.

kuror0 (L-3): I Am Innocent
I Am Innocent (L-3): kuror0
buldermar (L-3): pirate mollie

Not Voting: buldermar, SE-Asians, jon_h61, Remembrance

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.
Deadline is on Thursday, May 30th, at 10:00 PM EST.

[jon_h61]

mollie, why do you want to lynch jon now as opposed to tomorrow? I don't see any drawbacks in postponing lynching him a day (assuming that we were otherwise going to lynch him today) - do you?

I see it as a waste, because I don't see scum letting me investigate tonight. Why waste a lynch on me as I'm most likely going to be NKd. I don't think they want the chance that I might find a guilty.
I'm still willing to lend Buldemar my vote.

[jon_h61]

stupid computer....only the last quote should have been on there.

I had quote boxes magically appear in my posts yesterday.

Why just these 3 players?

When I started reading the game (last pages) it seemed there was some common thread running through, and I wanted to unravel it. Also three's the max and I wouldn't want to try to ISO more anyway. I ISOd Buldemar, p_m, and someone else I can't remember after that too.

And why did Kuror only have 1 scum suspect in his pool to investigate, and not investigate that person (Mantis)?

A good question that I think deserves an answer.

Please tell me his reads then....cause I only see 1 scum read, the OMGUS vote on me.

He had mantis, IAI, and SE-Asians as scum, and voted SE-Asians in that post (898). He also gave a brief reason each read. I hate reading a game from both ends, I get conflicting reads on the same person. And I get a scumspect to later find out they're dead.

On asking about my read list, I'll do that later. It may be a big post.

[jon_h61]

I thought you found me the scummiest. Would you mind explain what made you change your mind?

I came across this in your ISO again. I'm changing my mind again, you're moving back up my scum list.

About the fency read on Remem.. well yeah, that's how it is for now, it is not something i can help. He does stuff I don't like at all, like sheeping too much and weird changes on his reads and does a lot of AtE but this is the 3rd game I have with him and I have seen him do exactly this as town, so that's why i have a conflicted read. For now i am giving him a slack and the benefit of doubt, but it is only matter of time before can get a solid read on him.

Are you maybe giving your scum partner excuses for scum slips you think he may do later?

Remember is giving me a pain in the ass. I really don't share most of his actions but i learned the hard way he can be town even playing like that.

was the original read.

Huh so I'm not a N1 PR. There are already 3 N1 PR. If anyone is fake claiming it is more likely to be the first ones, so ye Remember is most likely town.

Still pushing Remembrance as Town. Not pushing SE, but thinking he's the best lynch(?), that's a bit contradicting isn't it?

Why you haven't changed it? You know that play style made us lynch you and it was very distracting. You even promised it the dead QT you would change it so.. why haven't you?

Coaching, for better or worse.

I only made it about a third of the way through his ISO, but one thing I noticed is he is always insinuating something about our dead Town players. He attempts to make them look bad. Go back and check it out yourselves. I think he is scum.

[jon_h61]

@Jon Your argument is primarily based off associative tells. And then you say iso him for the actual scummy things he did. You seem to have gotten this hunting thing backwards. @_@

I can quote each time he tried to make a known Townie look bad if you want, but his ISO makes it obvious. With only seven players left, associative tells mean more than they would earlier in the game. I still don't like that he was SO Town on you, but made our dead Townies look suspicious.

I'd like to hear what he has to say about it.

[jon_h61]

Now that you have a scum read are you still going to sheep Buldermar's vote?

That depends on what Buldemar thinks of the current posts.

Maybe

I'm barking up the wrong tree. Time will tell.

pedit OK I'll do it. My wife has some chores she wants out of me, but I'll post what I get, then come back to it later.

[jon_h61]

Thank you. It seems weird to put those associative reads up there for scum you. Since essentially, you'll be alive tomorrow and none of that will matter.

Chrome just went weird on me, so I switched to IE.
Why would you think I'd be alive tomorrow??? Cooking up a scum ploy to make me look bad by leaving me alive? If so, I'd watch it, it just may backfire!

[jon_h61]

No, the risk, reward isn't worth it. I'll be dead tomorrow.

[jon_h61]

Spoiler:

About the fency read on Remem.. well yeah, that's how it is for now, it is not something i can help. He does stuff I don't like at all, like sheeping too much and weird changes on his reads and does a lot of AtE but this is the 3rd game I have with him and I have seen him do exactly this as town, so that's why i have a conflicted read. For now i am giving him a slack and the benefit of doubt, but it is only matter of time before can get a solid read on him.

Huh so I'm not a N1 PR. There are already 3 N1 PR. If anyone is fake claiming it is more likely to be the first ones, so ye Remember is most likely town.

Well, not auto-towned. Just "probably" town. I get too much shit for saying it that way.

Why you haven't changed it? You know that play style made us lynch you and it was very distracting. You even promised it the dead QT you would change it so.. why haven't you?

In post 736, Remembrance wrote:
@Kuror0 it's just a habit. I'm not interviewing people. I'm trying to change. Give it time. I'm still a newbie, and trying to get better.


Not interviewing but the base behind it still remains. Don't worry I just wanted to know if it was intentional to keep the base or just a die hard habit.

Remem: Leaning town. I really dislike some of the stuff he does, it throws me off really hard as i said before but, due to being the 3rd N1PR claim and that his latest stuff is not so shady i am going to put him here.

Because he gave up and it pisses me off. That is the only reason I am tempted to.

Your first post doesn't reflect why you were tempted to. If that's really your only reason try to be more clear next time because at least, I perceived it as a lot of flip floping.

I do believe Remem is town but I don't think that interview was any helpful to determine if he is town or not. Those interviews are more related to his play style than alignment related, so null there for me.

kuror0 Town reading or coaching, with a little distancing, Remembrance.

Spoiler:

Mantiz: Slightly scum. Am I the only one surprised on so many town calls already to someone who just came in? That's a bit scary and weird. Also the soft suggestion on wisdom to vote the only remaining inactive out of 13 people is scummy.

His last post is about a scum bussing his partner. Why this puts him as town? especially when both of his scumreads are your town reads?

about wisdom

Gives me the vibes of: "Well I would like to lynch him but I am not sure, so anyone care to go first to encourage me?".

Kuror0 saying mantis is soft pushing a scum read on Nacho.

Let me add my pov before more stuff hapens. While I understand one may have problems finding scum(specially on D1) you stated an intention to lynch nacho for no other reason than: "Others look more townie", I don't find that stance any good for town because you are not trying to lynch scum but anyone on your null zone. Also what I got from some of your posts is that you find scummy people not sharing your reads which is quite disturbing. So I guess wisdom is just trying to get a better read of you because some of your reasons seems kind of weird to say the least.

about mantis

Seems like you want to lynch him for no good reason. You are just supporting the idea but not voting because you don't have a reason to call him scum, so you are just waiting for someone else to vote him to join the wagon which is quite a poor play.

To mantis, a little buddying to Nacho above this (I cut it out for the length of wall's sake).

I do believe Remem is town but I don't think that interview was any helpful to determine if he is town or not. Those interviews are more related to his play style than alignment related, so null there for me.

If this is the reason to accuse someone of being scum, why you are not also threatening the others that had voted you? Also please tell me the others reasons of why you think Nacho is scum.

To Wisdom

I had wisdom as strong town in my reads, since I posted my list my read on him has changed a lot yet not enough to make him my first scum candidate. So my vote remains on what I think it is the best lynch for today.

While I agree with you that the first case he made on you was weak, the reaction we got from it was pretty strong, you contradicted in a couple of answers and overall your answers had holes on them. It greatly helped me to develop my read on you so I find it useful and it was early in the day so I don't have a problem with it not being a super refined case. About "he suddenly finds another weak reason and votes me again". I do think trying to lynch a lurker with 13 people alive is a weak move. But more important is that this tells me you find his tunneling on you scummy. I was in a game with you where we had some strong tunneling from a couple of players yet you never mention you find that scummy.

Right now I'm reading wisdom as scum. Very inconsistent lately.

A lot more to this post, I cut it for wall's sake.

So you are saying that Nacho is scummy for trying to push lynches? Or because they were all mislynches? But it can't be because you were voting Fate aka Bacde till a few posts ago, so are you willingly voting for a mislynch?

If you don't think Fate is a mislynch then you find Nacho scummy for pushing for lynches. Which is kind of silly imo. OR did I terribly misunderstood your post?

About Wisdom

This kind of posts are what makes you think you are scum. When pressured you stop being logic as you usually are and start just trying to fight anything that has been said.

-As i said when you get unde rpressure you stop posting the logic behind your actions and seems you do things in a rush just to fight any accusation.
-I'm not saying we should all sheep HD, but I do agree whit some of his reads. The thing here is that you said that his reads were completely wrong as an absolute, which means you either know more than us or you are just saying things without anything to support it which is why I am not liking your comments at some points of the game.
-Your reads are not the absolute truth either. You complain about sheeping HD reads but you want us to sheep yours. Kind of hypocrite. As i said I find mollie scummy but Nacho is town to me.

Wisdom

Why you brought this up? I mean it is either fence sitting or a fluff imo. So I wonder if you had anything in mind by posting that.

About mantis

Seems like you want to lynch him for no good reason. You are just supporting the idea but not voting because you don't have a reason to call him scum, so you are just waiting for someone else to vote him to join the wagon which is quite a poor play.

About Wisdom

If this is the reason to accuse someone of being scum, why you are not also threatening the others that had voted you? Also please tell me the others reasons of why you think Nacho is scum.

I had wisdom as strong town in my reads, since I posted my list my read on him has changed a lot yet not enough to make him my first scum candidate. So my vote remains on what I think it is the best lynch for today.

While I agree with you that the first case he made on you was weak, the reaction we got from it was pretty strong, you contradicted in a couple of answers and overall your answers had holes on them. It greatly helped me to develop my read on you so I find it useful and it was early in the day so I don't have a problem with it not being a super refined case. About "he suddenly finds another weak reason and votes me again". I do think trying to lynch a lurker with 13 people alive is a weak move. But more important is that this tells me you find his tunneling on you scummy. I was in a game with you where we had some strong tunneling from a couple of players yet you never mention you find that scummy.

About Wisdom.

If you find Nacho scummy for not doing much this game, why you find IAI town? Imo he has done A LOT less. Actually all he has done in my eyes was bringing stuff back and some reviews which were also outdated so...

Wisdom

Checked. You are right, you did called Zaicon scum for tunneling you but you were much slower to do so than here. Anyways this proves you tend to believe anyone tunneling you is scum(So your case against Nacho has grounds, at least for you) yet it doesn't help me believe you are any townier.

This thrown in from Fate's ISO, his only mention of kuror0 I found.

IS THAT A MAD SCUMBUDDY I SMELL?

Breaking the game open from one page

See: reading's for chumps

kuror0 scum reading dead Town.

This is where I stopped. I chopped up quotes so everyone will have to determine my motivation on their own.

This

may

not mean Remembrance is scum, but it looks pretty damning to me.

tl;dr Fate mentions kuror0 only once, I really think kuror0 is scum

[jon_h61]

I meant Remembrance. I wanted to hear his counter-argument.

[jon_h61]

Remembrance, say I buy that you're Town. What do you think about the posts where I pointed out kuror0 scum reading our dead Townies?

[jon_h61]

I'd like to hear what he has to say about it.

I screwed up, I did mean kuror0. I was reading back over the last page and caught that. Sorry for the confusion.

[jon_h61]

Good luck, hope I am right about Kuror, cause if I am not, he is going to be the easy mislynch D5. And don't automatically believe jon D5 either, in LyLo fake scum can go for broke in that situation.

I think very likely the two scum will be in Rubi-slot, kuro and IAI. I think we shouldn't lynch Rubi-slot today for reasons already explained, so that makes it an option between IAI and kuro. I still have to look more into kuro as well.

Warning everyone to be wary of me seems more a ploy to keep yourself around. I don't think anyone who's posted lately are

automatically believing

me. This is especially worrying to me because I'm pretty certain I won't be around Day 5.

Remembrance I know you asked me some questions yesterday, but I didn't have time then. I'll get to them sometime today.

Buldemar Town
Remembrance Town
pirate mollie Town
me Town
Se-Asian Town???

That leaves IAI and kuror0. If we lynch one of them and they're not scum, and I'm alive tomorrow (doubtful), then I pray I get a guilty. I'll even investigate by consensus of my Town reads.
Does that worry you a little scums?

[jon_h61]

That leaves IAI and kuror0. If we lynch one of them and they're not scum, and I'm alive tomorrow (doubtful), then I pray I get a guilty. I'll even investigate by consensus of my Town reads.

This statement doesn't make sense, a brain fart, maybe? I think I'd probably be investigating one of them.

[jon_h61]

ATM I'm ready to vote IAI. Who should I investigate? Buldemar gets two votes, since he's my biggest Town read. Buldemar, you better not be scum!

[jon_h61]

@Jon : You better not scum Jon. I hate in LyLo.

Eh, just realize, wrong question. Why Buldermar more townier rather than Mollie?

I seriously considered p_m doing a gambit here, but buldemar said there was no way she'd do it in this situation.
He knows her way better than me, and I have to trust someone. Still he is my biggest Town read, and I'm leaning Town on Remembrance really strongly. Does it worry you if buldemar gets more of a say in an investigation that probably won't see the light of day?

[jon_h61]

I don't know, but if it were me, I'd probably say investigate kuror0.

[jon_h61]

2) If you are town, you are included in the group of people I do not care to play with in future games, yes.

Why all this hostility? Why are you threatening this? I almost feel it's a scum ploy to get votes turned away from you. I wouldn't mind playing a whole game with you sometime, if you didn't threaten people who don't agree with you that is.

When I flip town, you will see that the only living players were kuror and mollie to not be on the fate wagon. Unless you think this is the scum team, that means there is scum on the Fate wagon. And who jumped off, for no good reason at all.....Remembrance.

Didn't p_m do the investigation on Fate. She was the very first vote after the start of the day.

Is he "without a doubt is scum because of that", no, but factor in his poor vote for me today, his being on kuror's investigation list despite being very town in kuror's eyes, his quick analysis of Nacho's reads as soon as Nacho was NK'd (portraying himself and kuror in as good a light as Remembrance could make it...), he is pretty scummy in my eyes, esp in concert with kuror. Once again, many of this is dependent on kuror being scum too, hence why I think kuror should go first.

Buldemar, any feedback on this?

I've seen scum coach in thread before, yes.

So have I.

Are you scum mollie? Because if so, well played. You seem to be skating by, and your "why am I still alive" comments feel a bit fake. Like you really thought you would die before a N3 cop with no docs???

I've had my own doubts, and voiced them a couple of times. I've taken Buldemar's word that she's Town though. A main thing I especially haven't liked is she hasn't answered any of my questions, and attacked me with these vague statements that don't have any points to refute.

This feels fake.

I didn't quote my quote, but it's there for all to see. Which part? The bottom? Yeah, that was a little posturing I really didn't expect anything from.

"Due to scums night targets so far I still believe they are not that worried about night investigations."

I have to agree with this one. I wouldn't mind playing this setup from the start sometime. I bet it'd be fun.

KUROR, LIST OF PLAYERS FROM TOWNIEST TO SCUMMIEST, RIGHT NOW!

(OFF TO WORK NOW...WILL SAY THIS CAPS LOCK THING IS MAKING ME FEEL A BIT BETTER RIGHT NOW)

I'm getting the feeling you're not enjoying the game. I hope you feel better after you get off work.

[jon_h61]

@ SE Who do you think is most likely to be scum now. Your one top pick.

[jon_h61]

I'm going to die today by some means, so bring it on! Town will have to know scum was in on this kill. It just may be better if I'm the lynch. It may make narrowing the scum down easier. But I can't self vote, it's against my win condition.

[jon_h61]

How about this, I DARE YOU to vote me. Nobody can resist a dare.


I've done what I could for Town, now I'm ready to die for Town.

[jon_h61]

All I ever said was he was a N5 PR. I never, ever said anything else. If I even insinuated it, you'll have to show me, because I sure don't remember it.

[jon_h61]

@ SE tomorrow's the deadline, but we don't have to wait to the very last minute.

Fluff - I'm interested to see what Majiffy has for my flavor.

[jon_h61]

I'm sorry, did you ask me something? I'm tired right now and may have missed it.

pedit Well I don't really know what else to argue. And I know scum will have to be in on my lynch, but you all will have to figure that out. Good luck

[jon_h61]

No, no bluff, you'll see when I go.

[jon_h61]

This is a pretty awful, awful bluff because it's ignoring your POV.

Explain

pedit cool, I'm looking forward to the after game material

[jon_h61]

I actually grew up watching all the campaigning on TV. My family were big Nixon fans before Watergate. Watched that too.

[jon_h61]

Remembrance, I don't really want to be lynched, but I'm certain I'll be NKd. Maybe you can just call it resignation that I'm out of the game, by the deadline one way or another. I'd think the players that have a better chance of being here tomorrow would be on here trying to figure out what they're gonna do tomorrow. All I'll be able to do is cheer them on from heaven, or hell, which ever I end up in.

[jon_h61]

Second, why did you assume Se-Asians was a cop

I don't even know where you're getting this. there are only three claimed docs, so the only thing SE could be is a... N5 PR.

[jon_h61]

OK, more than anything else, right now, I think you and SE are actual Town. Other than that, I'm not even believing my Buldemar read anymore. That help you out any?


pedit HUH??? I thought there were only three for some reason. Sorry I screwed the pooch there I guess.

ppedit OK

[jon_h61]

I got into too many games, something I won't do again. Two at a time's enough for me. I get jumping back and forth when I come back to check them and screw up too much.

That's why I thought SE was a doc.

[jon_h61]

I've been up like 36 hours, so yeah maybe I'm not making much sense. I'm really tired ATM, and sleepy, but I don't want to go to bed now. I'll wake up and then be up all night.

[jon_h61]

I don't remember him ever saying he was a doc, but he may have.


pedit Yes, and you'll see shortly, I'm sure.

[jon_h61]

EBWOP MAjiffy's getting my flavor ready.

pedit I honestly looked, but I'm outta time, and ideas. I gave it my best shot. That's why I looked up all those posts the other day.

[jon_h61]

hey jon you never did address this!

I'm not pushing it, I just considered it. Buldemar said you'd never do it, so I dropped it.

[jon_h61]

whoops hydra slip

'sOK, I knew who you were.

[jon_h61]

I still have to say kuror0,and/or IAI.

[jon_h61]

@ IAI I told Buldemar I'd lend him my vote, he never asked me to place it anywhere. One place I won't put it is on myself. It's only one vote, should I jump up and down and yell for someone's death? You can make me look bad now, but tomorrow will be another story. BTW who are you pushing to be lynched? Where are you going to vote? I may be wishy-washy this game, but I replaced in late. You can't play the same way you would if you were here from the beginning.

I read the game from both ends into the middle. Something I'll try to avoid in the future. I actually at one time picked someone for scum only to find them dead later. Oh well, I'm just fluff posting now.

Was nice playing with you all. Maybe we'll play again sometime. LOL

I'll check back tomorrow before deadline to see what's happened, and to check if Buldemar still wants/needs my vote.

[jon_h61]

Sleep deprivation sucks

[jon_h61]

By the way, this whole practice is very bad. Jon, I want you to answer why.

Now that it so close to deadline, I was hoping it would bring out scum interactions that I could then discern their role by.

I just woke up, the longest sleep I've had since I don't know when. Still tired as shit though. Reading through everything now.

[jon_h61]

I still think IAI made a scumslip.

He's the most vocal about my saying I'd give buldemar my vote.

VOTE: I AM Innocent

[jon_h61]

But Jon is going to be here tomorrow. I have very little doubt.

Buldemar, you have Remembrance as Town, but I really don't like this statement. I'd take one for the team if it'd eliminate this WIFOM line of reasoning. BUT I still don't think they want to take the chance of me finding a guilty on one of them