Mini 1566: Lunar Silver Star Story Complete (Game Over)

[Antihero]

reading the first 7 pages.
i'm guessing the most votes are on: aegor, aj the epic, highshroomish

if not, you guys suck

[Antihero]

VOTE: aegor

a million times

[Antihero]

aj... is so scummy....

nacho, are you awake?

[Antihero]

/raspberry...............

UNVOTE:
VOTE: aj

i'll also take a kdub lynch

[Antihero]

by the way, jake vs. hello kitty is pretty clearly town v town and scum are letting it rage on because they love how much it's smokescreening their scuminess

[Antihero]

/raspberry...............

UNVOTE:
VOTE: aj

i'll also take a kdub lynch

Vote smp. He's scum

eh

his inquisitiveness on question mark vote man is actually p town

suboptimal lynch

[Antihero]

I mean you could vote bro and make it a trifecta omgus since you voted the first 2 people to vote your slot

really? we're whipping out "omgus"?

but you did remind me that bro is pretty scummy

[Antihero]

Scum would question that too, especially if the person was new to this site. Which he sort of is.

I mean I've never seen a vc with a ??? Before on this site. Had it not already been brought up I probably would have. Asking is non alignment related

P.edit - I hardly doubt it's coincidence that there were 3 people voting you and you come out of the gate scum reading both of them

not getting sucked in to explaining townreads

it's not a coincidence at all. AJ just cobbled together a case that was complete bullshit that looked prima facie scummy when it really wasn't. and bro was more than happy to wagon based off the derp logic.

i'm actually now thinking aegor is wagon-happy and foot-in-mouth, especially given kdub's continuous stilted push on him

[Antihero]

hey mac.

so, is your vote out of frustration/anger? or is there something legit that you see that i don't?

[Antihero]

i'll stop you right there. there's no such thing as a "rock solid" meta case. it doesn't exist.

also, as far as i can see, sangres isn't voting you

[Antihero]

Btw mafia isn't about finding town. It's about finding scum. I don't need town reads. I need scum reads and only need scum reads

[Antihero]

hey bert or mara

so, would one of you mind pulling your fist out of your ass and vote scum or what?

[Antihero]

who do you have in mind?

and this is mara, bert hasn't touched booze I don't think

aj or kdub

[Antihero]

truth hurts?

suboptimal play hurts more

[Antihero]

... if your goal in this game is never to get burned by anyone. ever, you ... uh...

wow, you've got a rough time ahead of you

[Antihero]

... if your goal in this game is never to get burned by anyone. ever, you ... uh...

wow, you've got a rough time ahead of you

is this to me?

Pedi:uuhh... that was me, I was sitting at Mcdoanlds wating for my shifr at work

no, that was to jake. the hard ass who apparently doesn't need anybody else to win this game.

[Antihero]

people disagree, jake. and it's annoying sometimes, but unless you want to play with 12 AI's, that's that

...i'm a little surprised i'm having to go over all this with you

[Antihero]

I leave for a couple hours and come back to Jake and HKC blowing up the thread with their half drunken town vs town exchange.

I'm leaning towards Shroomish right now, mainly for his earlier push for Jake to claim. There was no reason for that so early in the day when he had all of 3 votes on him.

VOTE: HighShroomish

I like Anti's posts since coming into the game, though I'm not really getting the kdub read. Where are you getting that from Anti?

Interesting that the ??? vote move again. This time to Scar of all people. Not entirely sure what to make of that.

awful post, awful vote

[Antihero]

for kdub, i feel like there's a lot of questioning, but little connection to the big picture. in particular, the PhD parts are bothersome (what's the opinion, does he like the scar lynch or not?; he's not criticizing the wagon, but leaving the door open to join it).
the shroom vote is meh too.

[Antihero]

Why is the vote awful? It is not like there was any momentum on HS.

it's awful because the case on shroom is awful

[Antihero]

You don't find it even the least bit sketchy that HS asked Jake for a role claim at the point that he did? I could get into why his reasons for asking for the claim were crap as well, but let's just start on this point for now.

context: shroom was pushing jake and jake already softclaimed.
looking at the ISO, it looks a lot more like shroom thinks he's calling jake's bluff rather than just straight up role fishing out of nowhere.

fun exercise:
assume shroom is scum and jake's town. why would shroom ask for a counterclaim? he knew he wouldn't get one.

kdub's case makes a lot less sense considering the context.

[Antihero]

Anti-hero's posting certainly hasn't clarified anything at all.

haha, is that right?

here's the original PhD vote: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 6#p5815906
and a few iso posts later...
here's the bail: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 8#p5821468

first off, the "case" is complete bullshit. catboi never "reversed" his read on phd, he simply asked BRO the reason for his vote. also, the timing of catboi's vote was scummy... how...? we don't know, so i guess that's left up to the imagination.

second, there's no attempt to analyze phd or

his

response to the wagon AND/OR the wagon in its

entirety

(aegor, BRO, and actiondan). when it looks like phd's about to get lynched, aj makes sure to hurry up and peel off the wagon and waste no time in incriminating someone on the wagon

he

started.
^that's because he's scum. he's not worried about actually analyzing what happened with the phd wagon; he's only interested in thinking 3 moves ahead and who he's going to attack next

[Antihero]

yes, it's because he's scum, mara

vote him

[Antihero]

you know things are fubar when you're giving scum a townread based on your tunnel

[Antihero]

yeah, still awful.

tell me when you're ready to leave your tunnel of stupid emotion and start lynching scum

[Antihero]

was wondering when scum would show up revving the chainsaw

[Antihero]

don't let it distract from lynching aj the scumbag, though.

he's scum. and very transparently scum at that. lynch him.

[Antihero]

so... what?

i'll take aj, kdub, or aegor

[Antihero]

A "few posts" on my iso equate to over 100 posts in thread. Please don't act like it was sudden. I never claimed to make a case on Scar OR catboi. I voted Scar on gut, and made it pretty damn clear it was exactly that. Catboi, I also said I was "Uncomfortable with" Catboi's timing. He voted right after me, made no real case and followed his pattern of having nothing thought out other than these short, unhelpful and frankly bad posts.

didn't say anything was sudden. the timing was calculated pretty well for when the phd wagon came to a peak.

And please. Read my scum games. I'm arguably a better player when scum. You stating anything of mine is "scum logic" is incredibly dangerous because I know and use that to my advantage. I'm not sure anyone here can actively attest to having played a full game against me when I was scum outside of Jake, who died N1. Sangres has at least read some of mine, including an SK game so can probably give some insight into my meta to verify this.

yeah, self meta is crap.
sangres hasn't piped up about this so far.

Oh jesus. He's obviously my buddy because he votes you, right? Not like your shitpost tunneling could possibly warrant a vote...

i'm tunneling?

jake, what would you call this^?

[Antihero]

I don't want to push it, Mara, because I want you two to calm down and stop storming this thread. Longer posts are better for me, so if you could get some word counts over 100 in some of the posts, that would be fantastic. I'm simply NOT reading you, as your posts have nothing good to glean from them.

so mara, still think this^ is town?

"he's shitposting because i said so"
and the vote parker is calling me for tunneling)

classic scum 1v1ing.

[Antihero]

oh, so the self-meta

was

a bunch of shit?

who could have known?

[Antihero]

oh, so the self-meta

was

a bunch of shit?

who could have known?

I don't think I debunked his self meta particularly.

meta (especially self meta) is inherently a bunch of shit

you didn't give us any information that gives any insight as to aj's alignment

therefore, the meta

remains

a steaming pile of shit

[Antihero]

i dismiss your reads because i don't agree with them

it has nothing to do with fairness

[Antihero]

prodded /bleh

no time right now

[Antihero]

because i had an overdose of this game when i replaced in and i had to get the hell away from it for a bit

[Antihero]

VOTE: kdub

the shroom lynch is suboptimal

[Antihero]

because i had an overdose of this game when i replaced in and i had to get the hell away from it for a bit

AJ isn't getting lynched. Vote SMP.

smp...
what for?

[Antihero]

well, no. and i now remember how much i hated 822

VOTE: SMP

[Antihero]

#metaiscancer

jake, were you and shroom in the same off-site game in question? are you two talking about two different games? what exactly are the circumstances?

[Antihero]

so how would you know if shroom lied or not?

[Antihero]

re: six prizes; flicked through the game you linked. i didn't count posts, but compared to posters like mr. spamalot shroom, the cat thing, GIF, the triangle guy, and the bird creature, SMP seemed like a relatively infrequent poster. also his posts tended to be one-liners contrasted to the walls/quote stripes of the game.

so... what are we talking about now? and why is meta involved?

[Antihero]

I have no problem with an SMP lynch, I am just very leery that a last minute scramble is taking place to save shroom. Both of them are on my scum list so i'm really confused by Sangres's scramble

you should be a lot more leery of wagon company like kdub, who belabors the same tired, awkward "rolefish" angle to push the shroom lynch.

unlike smp, shroom seems to have a non-survivalist mindset (e.g. - the painful attempt at slayer's gambit just now). while ultimately feckless, shroom's play lacks scum motivation.

[Antihero]

I explained how meta got involved already, I used it as a way to pressure smp and shroom's defense of smp despite attacking him earlier was strange.

not to mention i don't see any obviously pro-town motives from him

you're confusing "optimal play" and "town play"

smart =/= town
dumb =/= scum

[Antihero]

yeah I am but I already said I will just take a long shower if shroom does flip town.

you haven't done a good job convincing me why kdub was scum anyway, i am more leery with smp/mac being on the wagon than I am with kdub

alright

keep truckin', then

[Antihero]

bert, if you think kdub is scum, the shroom wagon is toxic

...which it is

[Antihero]

you just confused me with this post

i'm confused about your whole case

so... shroom backs out of a push on his buddy...why? what's the idea behind that?

[Antihero]

You don't find it even the least bit sketchy that HS asked Jake for a role claim at the point that he did? I could get into why his reasons for asking for the claim were crap as well, but let's just start on this point for now.

context: shroom was pushing jake and jake already softclaimed.
looking at the ISO, it looks a lot more like shroom thinks he's calling jake's bluff rather than just straight up role fishing out of nowhere.

fun exercise:
assume shroom is scum and jake's town. why would shroom ask for a counterclaim? he knew he wouldn't get one.

kdub's case makes a lot less sense considering the context.

[Antihero]

what's the point of bussing in the first place then?

the newb bussing "old school" fantasy is that one scum will lead the lynch on the buddy and then that's enough town cred to carry them for the whole game

[Antihero]

ask people who bus what the point is

it's to get town cred from pushing a buddy's lynch. the whole idea being that the buddy will flip (which requires them to ... you know... die).

in the end I see no town motivation behind any of his actions, including the whole asking me to claim thing which you keep trying to brush off like that isn't a big deal

separate your ego from the situation and it becomes easier

town motivation: the person you think is scum softclaims. you call bullshit because it's easy for a scumbag to diffuse a wagon with a vague softclaim.

[Antihero]

separate your ego from the situation and it becomes easier

by the way, this is why kdub is scum. i can see you getting wrapped up in "he's asking me to claim, ROLEFISHER" because it's against you and it's hard to be objective about people attacking you.

kdub continues to pull this thread even though sangres and i have repeatedly talked about this and it's really not that hard to understand. it's an untenable position, kdub knows it but he's pushing it anyway because he needs those mislynches

...and guess who else is using the "rolefishing" angle?

[Antihero]

3. plus the lack of attempt to get a smp wagon started before deadline day is very odd, where was this push yesterday or wednesday? it's odd

why is it "odd"? we've been talking about shroom for a while now so don't act like this shroom townread is something new

[Antihero]

right but town cred from a day 1 scum lynch only lasts so long and that expiration date is before lylo

right. which is exactly why i called it a fantasy. newbscum (and some not-so-newbscum) don't seem to agree, though. don't believe me? go to mastin's MD thread about bussing and see how many pooh-poohers he got (spoiler: it's not zero)
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=31660

[Antihero]

well day 1 I don't lynch any PR even if I think that person is scum so if my top scum suspect soft claimed i'd probably keep calling him scum and leave him be til day 2 but I'm literally the only person I know who has a do not lynch a claimed PR on day 1 rule since I see so many PRs being lynched day 1.

that's

you

that's

your

personal style

town tunnelers can blow through softclaims (even fullclaims) if their suspicions are strong enough

[Antihero]

why is it "odd"? we've been talking about shroom for a while now so don't act like this shroom townread is something new

cause it feels desperate

that's because it is

we're watching scumbag kdub completely get away with a mislynch and it's maddening

[Antihero]

what does "easy target" mean, and how is SMP an easy target?

edit: yeah, because that wagon's not happening because... well, i don't know why. i'm kind of lost on that part myself.

[Antihero]

fucking really?

you've completely enabled scum to hide in the midst of your shit storm with bert/mara. i am not the one who gets to hold the shitbag of shame in all this so you can take all the little jabs and redirect them at yourself.

[Antihero]

fucking really?

you've completely enabled scum to hide in the midst of your shit storm with bert/mara. i am not the one who gets to hold the shitbag of shame in all this so you can take all the little jabs and redirect them at yourself.

^this was reply to jake, btw

[Antihero]

SMP is lurky, and while seemingly experienced, has been posting fairly bad throughout this game and blatantly anti-town at best which gives me similar rings to how I ended up pushing the milkshake wagon in Cephs game

i'm not following you

what exactly is bad or VI-ish about SMP's posting? i don't get VI vibes from him at all.

[Antihero]

fucking really?

you've completely enabled scum to hide in the midst of your shit storm with bert/mara. i am not the one who gets to hold the shitbag of shame in all this so you can take all the little jabs and redirect them at yourself.

I was just trying to challenge Mara on what I felt was a lazy townread

THAT WAS TO JAKE GOOD GRIEF

and you wondered by i needed a break from this shitfest, jeez

[Antihero]

fucking really?

you've completely enabled scum to hide in the midst of your shit storm with bert/mara. i am not the one who gets to hold the shitbag of shame in all this so you can take all the little jabs and redirect them at yourself.

so I am supposed to drop MY SCUM READS for someone that

1, you only voted for once and that vote lasted 6 minutes and that only happened after shroom was at L-1
2. you have made absolutely no case for nor provided any solid reasoning other than

for kdub, i feel like there's a lot of questioning, but little connection to the big picture. in particular, the PhD parts are bothersome (what's the opinion, does he like the scar lynch or not?; he's not criticizing the wagon, but leaving the door open to join it).
the shroom vote is meh too.

GTFOH

ego check

take one

[Antihero]

I think everything SMP has done so far has been fairly VI-ish especially in his approach to the secret voter and I can kinda see why a townie would be tempted to do some set-up speculation on something new, especially one who fairly new on site

what exactly is VI-ish, i honestly can't wrap my head around it.

yeah, my gut feeling is that the set-up spec is kind of town too, but you're not reading him in a vacuum. and it's not like a scum player wouldn't be curious about a secret double voter. and set-up spec isn't really something that's likely to draw criticism, so i'm not exactly sure what you think is VI-ish about that behavior.

bottom line is that i don't think SMP is bad or a VI or really blatantly anti-town

[Antihero]

not me because I don't have an ego

no, it's pretty obvious you do. and i can handle disagreement, but don't act like this is some weird inconsistency that i'm scumreading kdub. you're being obtuse just to get at me and "win" the argument.

i've been saying why i think kdub is scum pretty well beyond the one thing you very dickishly quoted and you're acting like sangres and i are some sort of weirdos for ... i don't know... i guess having the audacity to disagree with you.

[Antihero]

right, that was the first two posts of SMP's iso. the rest of the posts are not devoted to that and ... i still don't think he's a VI.

i... i don't really know how to explain why i think that at this point.

VI's tend to make really bad faux pas and it'll be... i don't know... wikitell kinds of shit. quickhammering. mealy-mouthing. fencesitting. stuff that's frowned upon by site meta because nearly everyone thinks it's scummy.

not seeing that in SMP's posts. aside from the first two posts, i don't think SMP has really said anything really controversial or egregiously "bad".

[Antihero]

Saying someone is scum but never voting him implies no conviction. You are trying to berate people for letting kdub slide but you never voted him in a serious manner. You never actively pushed his lynch.

It certainly wasn't my ego that stopped you from doing that, so enlighten me why you didn't actively push your top scum read?

no, it implies that i only have one vote: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 4#p5840094

read ISO from 873 down: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... er_sort=Go

no one besides PhD actually ended up voting for AJ. PhD gave me some hope that an aj wagon would take off, but it never ended up materializing

[Antihero]

don't think SMP has really said anything really controversial or egregiously "bad".

so why are you voting him?

also you thought his post 822 is bad, does that not apply anymore?

HOLY FUCK ARE YOU KEEPING UP WITH BERT/MARA + I'S CONVERSATION?

i'm saying this because i disagree with the assertion "SMP is a VI", which is bert/mara's argument.

read the context

, something you seem to have trouble doing

[Antihero]

/mechanics of the fucking game are a "cop out"

i'm fucking done

[Antihero]

show of hands - who's willing to vote kdub?

/hand

@jake:
1. realize

you

assigned kdub as my "top scumread", not me
2. look back at my ISO
3. ???
4. i'm still fucking done

[Antihero]

Why did you not try to lynch kdub if he was one of your top lynch candidates? And don't give me the bullshit about you only having 1 vote.

i don't even know what you're talking about.

you

make no sense.

"town vote

all

their scumreads"? is that the premise? how does that even work?

what alternate dimension are you in?

[Antihero]

i'm making the point that you're splitting hairs. aside from explaining the case for my scumread, i don't know how i was supposed to "try to get others to vote him".
no one besides sangres and mara seem to agree and it takes more than 3 to lynch. that's the bottom line. i decided to use my vote to push an aj lynch, but that was the same story. it seems only phd agreed. and it's quickly becoming the same story for SMP.

if 5 people come in and they read the thread and agree with me, i'll happily take an aj lynch. but it's likely not going to happen in the next 9 hours.
if 5 people come in and agree to a kdub lynch, i'll happily take that too. again, not likely to happen.

now, if you're saying it's because of my lack of trying to explain the cases to people, you're wrong.

[Antihero]

VOTE: kdub

come on, shroom, he's in your "nullscum"

[Antihero]

i changed to kdub since i thought sangres was still on him (that would have made it 3 votes to my ineffective one), but i moved again when i realized they moved over to SMP (that would make it 3 votes to my ineffective two on the kdub).

and i've been calling kdub scum since i replaced in so i'm not sure how it "makes literally 0 sense".

and i'm bitching that you're giving kdub the mislynch he's going for. the one

he's

pushing (that you are an accessory to)

i'm confused about why

you're

confused.

[Antihero]

that's 3 for SMP, i'd switch so effectively 4
2 on kdub, but we have sangres, so effectively 3

both are a pretty long way off.

phd, mac, actiondan. are you here?

[Antihero]

here's the post in question:

why is it "odd"? we've been talking about shroom for a while now so don't act like this shroom townread is something new

cause it feels desperate

that's because it is

we're watching scumbag kdub completely get away with a mislynch and it's maddening

i'm calling kdub scum
i'm calling shroom town

i'm trying to reason with you and bring you to my side, and i think it's frustrating because you're personally invested and i think it's clouding your judgement of shrooms and (consequently) kdub.

kdub wasn't (and still probably isn't) a viable wagon which is why i'm not voting him, but with what i thought was the most viable counter, SMP.
if you're wondering why i wasn't voting kdub before, it's because i was trying to push an aj lynch. this is now completely not viable.

if you think it's a personal attack
if you think i'm somehow way out of line by questioning you
if you're butthurt at this post

...take a reality and/or ego check

[Antihero]

The last part of your post is seriously out of left field. I don't even know why your brain gravitates to those 3 possibilities.

I think you are suspicious for this switch and now you are in my scum pile. That's it

there never was a switch

i've told you that
bert/mara told you that
nacho will probably tell you that if he posts

you're still not listening because ... i don't know why, i can't figure it out

but i quit because you're impossible to work with

and fine, i'll get the kdub lynch without you

[Antihero]

well then boggle on, jake. you seem to be the only one.

have fun.

[Antihero]

oh please, shroom's at L-1 and there's 4 more hours

[Antihero]

we still have mac, broseiden, shroom, and question mark guy

there's hope

[Antihero]

I'll vote Kdub, but I don't know why. I'm really out of this game, sorry.

do it

2 more

[Antihero]

^liar

lynch this

[Antihero]

VOTE: SMP

[Antihero]

How so?

you're lying. am i being unclear?

to jake: bork knows the role name "vanilla cop" which is what SMP is fakeclaiming. http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 4#p5420414 click on the spoiler that says "stone"

[Antihero]

mara

revote

[Antihero]

maybe i'm not being clear enough with you

i know, for a fact, that SMP did not obtain those results. SMP is fakeclaiming scum.

[Antihero]

HOLY SHIT, ARE PEOPLE IN THIS GAME ALLERGIC TO LISTENING?

my action last night directly conflicts with SMP's claim today.

[Antihero]

tick tock, SMP

if you were who you say you are, the obvious choice would have been kdub

[Antihero]

jake actually would have been a better one

@mara: because kdub already claimed non-vanilla. but actually, now that jake mentions it, he would have been better; if SMP got a "non-vanilla, no action" result, that would have cleared jake.

p.edit: well, wait a second, doesn't your "result" just say that he's vanilla? according to that, he could still be a scum goon and just not have done the kill.

[Antihero]

fwiw i don't think anti actually has anything that conflicts with SMP's claim and is just doing a dumb gambit because he thinks SMP is scum

there are also only a few people i could see him being scum with if he's a scum rolecop coz lol who the fuck targets someone who just replaced in?

/still haven't read shit prior to p48 outside of mod ISO

no, i don't do fake guilties

clarification: at least a blocking component of action.

[Antihero]

... no he didn't

and why do you think he's a vanilla cop, and not the rolecop he is claiming to be

because he's claiming "vanilla or non-vanilla" results. rolecops get roles. vanilla cops get "vanilla or non-vanilla".

[Antihero]

yes

[Antihero]

one in a frickin' million

the only one i can think of is scum redirector, but what are the odds that scum redirected

from

a town SMP to someone else? approaching zero.

[Antihero]

Please confirm that there is basically no chance whatsoever your action failed for any reason.

i didn't get anything indicating that it did.

[Antihero]

one in a frickin' million

the only one i can think of is scum redirector, but what are the odds that scum redirected

from

a town SMP to someone else? approaching zero.

What about a scum roleblocker, or a second town blocking role? There are more common reasons to why your block didnt go through

bad game design form.

not with a mod like bork.

[Antihero]

pedit: and a scumulative blocking role would be bad because...?

because then you have the possibility of chain roleblocking and it's a nightmare to resolve (i don't think there's a "standard" way of doing it)

[Antihero]

bad game design form.

not with a mod like bork.

stop trying to guess or out guess the mod and play the game, that's twice now and it never works.

i'm trying to play the game, jake.

i blocked SMP because i figured scum would send their most heavily suspcted scumbag to do the kill (so that they wouldn't lose much if they were caught out by a tracker/watcher/roleblocker).

assuming 10 town vs 3 scum (standard for minis), there was a 1/9 chance that a hypothetical scumroleblocker targeted me (additionally, we have to assume that the scum's roleblock resolves before mine).

SMP is scummy and, even assuming a mafia roleblocker, i like my 8/9 odds. i'm going with it.

[Antihero]

antihero

do you think smp is what he says he is (or is at least an investigative role of sorts)? if yes, why do you think he lied about getting a result? if no, why do you think he fake-claimed that specifically? (keeping in mind bork gives actual fake-claims that make sense for whatever role they actually are)

he could very well be scum but i do not think he is lying about his role (or at least not lying about being some sort of investigative role), so i think some funky shit went on last night

1) you're his scum partner
2) he has a scumbuddy feeding him results (i don't know what bork does, i'll go look at that in a sec; but i post mafia rolecop results in the QT; daytalk would also enable this).
3) he figured he was going down anyway and wanted to either out you as a PR or vanilla

there's 3 plausible explanations off the top of my head

[Antihero]

Anti, you suspected me pretty heavily yesterday, and I believe more people suspected me than SMP, so why not block me instead?

partly, it was because of what i perceived you "claimed" yesterday.

also, the popular opinion swung pretty rapidly in your favor yesterday. i figured that even if you were scum, you would want to keep this new-found good standing and not risk blowing it to a tracker/watcher/roleblocker result.

[Antihero]

Anti, since your claiming a blocker role, why SHOULD we believe this is any more than a ploy to get him lynched? All I've gotten from you so far is you'll do anything you can to get the people you have the slightest suspicion on lynched. Why wouldn't you have RB'd me or Kdub, the two you were vehemently against?

because i've never faked a guilty on someone just to get them lynched and faking guilties on people just because of "suspicion" is stupid. and given that i've never done that in my time on the site, it's scummy you would suggest that.

and yeah, i was debating between rb'ing you and SMP, but i went with SMP because i thought he was more likely to do the kill (see: my conversation about this with kdub).

[Antihero]

i think AJ and mac are scum

should i read the first 48 pages to confirm this?

In the early part of day 1 we thought Mac was town. His late day 1 shook that.

AJ yeah. Everything he posts reads a little bit awkward somehow.

Aegor's lolnoreasons trolling on day 1 was pretty disturbing.

I think 2 scum in that bunch. Aegor is probably playing too dont-give-a-fuck to be scum though.

Aj bothers me because he posts every couple of days and says just enough to get by but doesn't really involve himself in the game or interact with anyone on a continuous basis. For example his last post looks like filler and I don't see anything pro-active from him.

i'd be ok with an AJ lynch for the simple fact that he doesn't look like he's helping anyone find scum

oh, so antihero's not totally full of shit and AJ is scum?

how shocking

[Antihero]

===[]

[Antihero]

mara, while jake is an honorary mafia goon, i think we could do better.

based on reactions to the claim yesterday, i think it's AJ and muffin.

VOTE: AJ

[Antihero]

Muffin has a point that if he was SMP's buddy, he would have locked himself into a claim with that interaction yesterday, so I can give him a bit of town credit for that.

yes... and...?

remember, this "locking in" took place when muffin was saying that he thought i was just bluffing.

in the absence of a solid counterclaim, backing up a scumbuddy's claim makes sense (especially when that scumbuddy is a PR and worth protecting)

[Antihero]

not to mention "i think he's faking a guilty as town" is a really awkward angle to take, considering i've never done that before

[Antihero]

Yes, I'm not saying Muffin is solid town, but it's enough for me to look elsewhere today.

it definitely shouldn't be. i think scum were riding the wave of indecisiveness generated by [jake's efforts to sew distrust / mara's indecisiveness] to see if they couldn't at least squeeze a few more days out of SMP.

and yeah, SMP could have been rolefishing on his way to the gallows, but a part of me still thinks he claimed results on muffin because he knew muffin would back him up.

[Antihero]

irstly, the "locking in" took place well after you clarified it wasn't a fake-claim unless you're asserting that he planned to out me from the beginning and this was something we planned, which seems like a really dumb assumption when telling the truth makes a lot more sense.

ah. i misremembered. scratch pretty much everything i said then

also, i mean, theoretically if you think i was trying to ride the waves of indecisiveness, the next most viable lynch was AJ (who i said i thought was scum, and you have no issues voting today) sooooo dunno where you're going with that.

what i'm saying about AJ still stands. he was more than happy to parrot your derp-logic (lolz, antihero's faking a guilty), even though there was no reason to believe it.

[Antihero]

mara, while jake is an honorary mafia goon, i think we could do better.

based on reactions to the claim yesterday, i think it's AJ and muffin.

VOTE: AJ

Scum is scum, regardless of their role. you think there is another scum-PR, though?

muffin/SMP doesn't make sense. I'm thinking it's probably Kdub/Jake

jake's a tough nut to crack. he's playing to the scum win condition, but gut's still telling me he's not scum.

[Antihero]

The fuck I am

Btw prod dodge

yeah, you are

you're continuing to try to generate paranoia about me because... i don't know, you latched onto something on day 1 (i still don't know what it is). i guess i blew your mind because i was right about shroom and you weren't and you haven't recovered since.

and now aegor is scum because.... why? because he's not participating in your stupid tunnel of HKC? or... what, his "play's been shit"? there's a common thread. anyone who disagrees with you is either scum or shit or both. you're disrupting any synergy that might develop into a townbloc (see: yesterday with all your "antihero can't be trusted" horseshit noise).

you are playing to a scum win condition.

[Antihero]

Dude I did more to get smp lynched than anyone else in the game AND HE WAS SCUM.

Dude, what game are you playing? sangres and i were trying to lynch SMP at the end of day 1 and we were both getting all kinds of shit from you.

I'm skeptical about you cause you could have been bussing, if people want to say it's possible I buss'd it's absolutely possible you did too. I played a game where scum claimed they jk's their partner and that was why there was a no kill so you claiming you blocked smp who was already going down in flames for town cred is also possible.

was it the last day before LYLO and they were going for the win (they didn't have to keep up the provable claim in the long term)? what

exactly

were the circumstances? using incomplete meta to discredit me isn't pro-town.

But since I single handidly caught smp I deserve a little leeway and some fucking respect. Since I'm not getting either I'll sit back and say I told you so when you lynch a townie.

well you're not giving much respect so it's not that surprising that you're not getting any

[Antihero]

Yeah go fuck yourself

you're not in a position to demand apologies from anybody.

see you next prod dodge, superman.

[Antihero]

You and sangres coming in with less than 24 hours to deadline was the issue I had. It looked sketchy and duck from both of you and post game I'll tell you the same thing.

right, and post game you'll still be wrong. i guess that's a foreign concept to you, though.

But do you recall I went back to smp and you and sangres moved to kdub. I said smp or shroom were the only ones I'd consider. So yeah, I did more to lynch scum than anyone else including you and sangres. Truth hurts doesn't it?

we moved because hkc didn't get on board for an SMP lynch and we failed to get the required number of votes elsewhere.

As for the other game, no it wasn't anywhere close to lylo. It was like day 3 after I already got scum lynched day 2, scum tried to kill me but doc saved me. Scum tried to bus for town cred. I'll link you to the game if you want.

yeah, that's really bad scum play. for one, when the claimed JK didn't get NK'd, i bet their towncred evaporated pretty quickly. two, the doc either claiming or flipping should've dealt a lot of damage to the credibility of their claim. three, JK is easily provable/disprovable.

let me guess, town won that game handily.

[Antihero]

Blah.

While we're waiting for Mac to catch up and for an Aj replacement, I'm going to do this.

VOTE: Aegor

Aegor, in light of Aj's replace-out, are you still reading that slot as scum? Why or why not?

is aj's replace-out alignment indicative to you?

[Antihero]

also, @muffinman:

[Antihero]

guys

stop

[Antihero]

UNVOTE:

for a second

[Antihero]

alright, so here's my persisting issue with AJ's slot

this post yesterday

so, the first part of his post strongly implies he suspects SMP, but no votes follow from that.

the second part of the post calls my claim into question, but he approaches it from an "antihero is fakeclaiming a guilty

as town

", not that i'm fakeclaiming scum 1v1ing a claimed town PR. i don't have a meta of doing this, so that's a really weird way of approaching the claims. it's like he already knows the alignments.

[Antihero]

Do you think I'm nutty?

yes

[Antihero]

Anti, since your claiming a blocker role, why SHOULD we believe this is any more than a ploy to get him lynched?

All I've gotten from you so far is you'll do anything you can to get the people you have the slightest suspicion on lynched.

Why wouldn't you have RB'd me or Kdub, the two you were vehemently against?

having genuine suspicion requires a town role PM.

that wording just gives me the gut feeling that he was fishing for a retraction (especially given the

context

; muffinman already suggested that he thought i was just gambiting).

i don't know, you could be right and i'm just not being objective about it, that's just what i see in the rorschach blot of the post

[Antihero]

VOTE: ActionDan

LOL

ah, that gave me a good chuckle

[Antihero]

Well we're neighbours, so there's that.

any insight from anything said in the QT, or are you just going to mill around and hide behind the "one of us has to be town" wifom smokescreen?

VOTE: mac

i think you were right the first time, jake

[Antihero]

squirrel girl, feel free to chime in about what's been going down in the neighborhood QT. also, are one of you a neighborizer or did you start out as neighbors? (i strongly suspect it's the latter)

[Antihero]

/shrug, i don't really see anything alignment indicative in there. but then again, i don't have access to the original QT so i'm not in a position to judge

what's your opinion, squirrel girl?

the thing that i'm hating in this thread is Mac's snipe-ish tone. i feel like he's kind of throwing suspicion on HKC and stirring the pot with jake without really saying anything to advance the game.

[Antihero]

scumread on kdub is back with a vengeance

[Antihero]

Am not liking KDub based on gut -- does anyone have a townread on him?

no

and the softclaim's not doing it for me any more.

[Antihero]

kdub, the aegor wagon isn't likely to happen. time to join the HKC wagon

I'd prefer Mac to HKC if there's still interest there, but I'll get behind an HKC lynch if that's the most viable option. Really, any flip of SG/Mac/Aegor/HKC would be useful IMO.

so what are you waiting for? people to not vote aegor?

i feel like you're milling around because you don't want people to think you're overeager scum.

[Antihero]

VOTE: Jake

boo

[Antihero]

we've reached the point when more discussion is hurting more than helping

someone hammer

[Antihero]

not buying the claim either

hammer can fall

[Antihero]

Protected BRO. Pretty obviously fferycho were one shot from the way they came out and claimed, so I thought the conf town would be more a target rather than the slot which can still have dirt thrown on it.

Lynch if you fucking want, but there's no CC coming and you're just being delibrately obtuse regarding it. I'm pretty sure Dan didn't claim his PR either so what the fuck are you going on about?

both fferycho and i were outed as PRs, why weren't you on either of us?

[Antihero]

Also I didn't claim my target originally because WIFOM with scum but fuck you all, you evidently don't know how to play that game.

Have you ever done this before as town?

No idea. Never had this type of role before but it's a pretty basic way to play it.

Maybe it doesn't really work when you're in the position I am, but I had fleeting visions of townies realising what I was doing for a second!

miller claims need to be in the first post. period.

that's mafia 101, so the room you have to act like a condescending prick is very small.

[Antihero]

No, it doesn't.

pedit: Jake, seriously? Have you even fucking played mafia before?

1)
yes, it does. otherwise, a cop claims a guilty on you, you claim miller, and we still power lynch your ass. the only way to head that off is to claim first post, which is what real millers do.
also, miller with a one-shot cop modifier? seems anti-town as balls.

2)
still haven't accounted for why you didn't protect me or sangres.

[Antihero]

1) cool. sometimes millers play different! SHOCK AND AWE. Why did I claim miller as scum then Ant?

no, it's a pretty standard thing here (see: any MD thread about millers).

2) sangres was one shot. I didn't think you were a threat to the scum. I didn't think Jake was a threat to the scum. I thought BRO would be, if he upped his game.

ok, let's just grant that you think i'm playing a shitty game

why would you protect someone playing a shitty game over someone playing a shitty game that has a blocking action?

[Antihero]

@Anti - serious question. Why would Mac fakeclaim a Miller in his roleclaim?

so he can use the wifom it generates to defend himself and say "scum would never do that".
which is.... exactly what's happening.

[Antihero]

the ONLY thing that makes me doubt this lynch now is I just saw a game where mac was in and it was modded by bork, it was a miller-tracker so miller-cop is possible (though it's possible mac is aware of this and think it's an excellent fake claim)

the only thing that's making me doubt this lynch is SG

[Antihero]

@mac: confirm yourself to jake.

otherwise, there's not enough rope in the world to describe what happens to you tomorrow.

VOTE: HKC

[Antihero]

down for the massclaim too (if for no one else, then kdub at least)

[Antihero]

oh for fucks sake

[Antihero]

you have a life?

what is this bullshit?

[Antihero]

/sigh

there's so many weird layers of his claim that i can't figure out if he's telling the truth or he just fucked up his fakeclaim and made it unnecessarily complex

non-consecutive doctor miller neighbor

... what the hell could have happened in the game design QT that resulted in ^that monstrosity?

[Antihero]

good luck, guys

I BELIEVE

/bah

[Antihero]

awesome we won







yay?