Mafia 95 - Quick & Dirty - Game Over!

[BloodCovenent]

Vote: Lamont_Cranston

For being the first poster.

[BloodCovenent]

I need obvAlt-M to alt-claim first then I'll join that wagon in a heartbeat.

Whiskey Tango Foxtrot?

[BloodCovenent]

Also, you still haven't explained your weird comment on page 1.

What weird comment? About Phoebus having a better role than me? Zito, RVS is also = to the joke-vote stage. I gave a silly reason. Don't look too hard into it.

Unvote; Vote: Lamont_Cranston

Oh noes, is that the start of a bandwagon?

[BloodCovenent]

Also, you still haven't explained your weird comment on page 1.

What weird comment? About Phoebus having a better role than me? Zito, RVS is also = to the joke-vote stage. I gave a silly reason. Don't look too hard into it.

Unvote; Vote: Lamont_Cranston

Spends the whole post responding to Zito, then bandwagons on Lamont with no explanation behind the vote?

Yeah.

Vote Kise

.

Agreed. Seems scummy.

FoS: Kise

Oh, and Papa's playing differently than he did as scum.

is that really relevant at this point? i don't think at this point you can really tell.

[BloodCovenent]

woah! Hold the phone!

hell of a band wangon there!

why exactly are we L-3 on Kise? I don't exactly see him that scummy, of course, maybe i'm missing something. Lamon, Xyl, and IHSIB, just went up on the radar. Three consecutive votes on one player? I think we should still lynch Lamont. Did you notice that he already has voted four times! And as soon as four people are on one player, he jumps on him and sticks his vote!

of course, that also can go for Xyl too, joining the bandwagon.

both of you, will you please explain yourselves.

[BloodCovenent]

ok, well, you've convinced me. But wouldn't almost anyone at this point RC that?

Unvote.
Vote: Kise

[BloodCovenent]

Role Claim then?

[BloodCovenent]

Ok, since you guys are the know-it-alls, then what do you want from me?

Role Claim then?

^

[BloodCovenent]

inHimshallibe is mafia too.

ok... evidence?

[BloodCovenent]

EBWOP: Oh, there's a fifth page...

Kise's real claim is a bit odd to me. Even numbered nights? Okay, maybe... but this could also be a clever claim attempt by him to at least keep himself alive till D3, WHILE ALSO drawing Doc protection (assuming there is a Doc) for N1 & N2 due to his claim. He claimed I have a plain role... his original vote was that someone's role was better than his... etc. etc... and now suddenly he has an even-numbered investigative role?

Nah. Keeping my vote. Not convinced, nor do I think we're going to get another lynch going by 10pm.

yea... there isn't much plain about that type of cop role. It seems unusual to me.

[BloodCovenent]

EBWOP:

The role seems unusual to me.

[BloodCovenent]

Lynch all liars? I'm also not seeing how it can't be a scum role.

I forgot to mention that it seems inconsistant.

[BloodCovenent]

Anyone else not like BC looking for a claim so quickly? I feel like he was rushing the lynch. We do have a week still.

Granted. But he was at L-2. Scum could have voted and hammered and he'd be gone. But since we got the claim, people that believe it can unvote. It still seems fishy to me though.

[BloodCovenent]

My vote stands. I don't buy Kise's claim.

[BloodCovenent]

Phoebus: I'm not seeing the Kise-cateraction link, really. xRECKONERx's unvote of Kise while calling him "scummy" is much more suspicious.

No, i see a link as well with Cater-Kise. Just never pursued it that much. I think that Phoebus summed up my concerns towards him pretty well. Are you thinking of maybe a scum Trio there?

[BloodCovenent]

@BC - Theorizing is not the same as scumhunting. I applaud everyone who finagled me, because it was a good way to dig up who had a PR. But theorizing about connections (and going as far as a trio?) is not the same as scumhunting.

I disagree. I'm fairly positive that you sir are scum. There are, so far, only a few that have defended you. and their moves seem scummish also. I think it would be a safe bet to put pressure on Cater and Reck.

But, if we were to take some time away from Kise, and investigate others, and the day was dwindling, i would probably come back (if the consensus of the town agreed) to lynch you.

[BloodCovenent]

I will say, that if Kise is scum, BC is scum.

Howso?

Because of how fast i jumped on the bandwagon? When reading Kise's original RC, i didn't understand that it was an actual role claim. When I did, it made sense.

So what do you guys think? Overly emotional townie with a power role? Or pissed-off found-out scum?

I'm leaning towards the former. The fuck-you venom in kise's rant about how lynching him serves mafia seems real. I know it's good meta to lynch all liars and self-voters and all, but should we put that above scum-hunting?

I'll trust kise in Day 1 so he can give his power a whirl. Let me look at the bandwagon and find possible scum now.

I don't necessarily believe it. If he does however flip town, i will be interested to see what others reactions are. If he flips scum, i would like to hear yours, caters, and Conso's honest opinion.

Vote: Kise

Nothing like a, "i'll vote myself, becuase i'm innocent" post.

#8: I did not misquote Lamont. That quote was something I said, NOT Lamont, but ME, NOT LAMONT< BUT ME WHAT THE FOOK DON"T YA UNDERSTAND ABOUT IT< BUDDY?

o_O

Vote for me.

why are you campaigning?

Btw kise-Phoebus scum buddies possibility here.

I'm about to disprove this...
Zito, just vote for me now, please.

ok...

[BloodCovenent]

a post with a vote is coming by this afternoon.

I take it you missed the part where OGML said you were being replaced,

Lurker

Lowell?

LOL. Well he did post one line yesturday. I think. It was just really dumb. But bravo.

[BloodCovenent]

Lightning just blew up my post. Will do it again when it stops.

[BloodCovenent]

Care to explain why?

Here is why i would vote you as well.
1. Post 88, you didn't like the claim, yet you wouldn't vote. you "weren't ready to vote."
2. Post 97 - you appeared to be more worried about the speed of the Band Wagon (which is true, i was as well), rather than the actual scummy post.
3.107 - Black marked me (?) for pushing a claim. which in return almost negated his "plain role," claim. i think pushing hard was the right move.
4. 212 - your gut says lynch him, but you don't want to vote for him. You say that if he is scum, I have to be scum, howso? I think i asked already, and you never responded.
5. post 250 - you said that you've seen two townies play like this before. I'm presuming one was your first game, and the other was Newbie 734, Exalt was a crybaby at that point in the game. not to mention you've only played a small handful of games. i don't think you have enough experience to claim this statement on post 250.
6. Post 253 - "I'd rather leave a crappy town alive than scum." What the heck does this mean?

There is definitely scum in this list:

Kise
ConsoM
Sam
Lazarus
Cater

My list is about the same, i would put cater up to spot number three though.

Unvote, Vote: Xylth

And why? Here's why!!!!!! /BillyMays

1.

Expressing confusion is scummy.

No.

Just because you don't agree with him, does not make his argument fallacious, and does not automatically make it scummy.

2.

Something does seem off there

vote: Lamont_Cranston

Votes Lamont based on Kise's "he's acting like a crackhead" argument.

Thats why i still had my RVS vote on lamont, well why i kept my Random vote, and i didn't change it. It seemed that Lamont was on steroids, but in recent posts, he seems very pro town.

3.

Townies are normally confused at the start of the game, scum are more surprised when they're confused. Good enough tell for a first vote

What? He states that expressing confusion is scummy, then says that townies normally ARE confused? What? What what what what what?

I'm pretty sure he explained this, and it made sense.

4.

I wanted to kill Lamont

unvote, vote: Kise

at that point, so did I.

My, what a bandwagon. Oh, and the whole reason he wanted to KILL Lamont is because of Kise's "he's acting like a crackhead" post.


Now, let me be clear: I kind of see the logic in what Kise is saying. He claimed a power role, and maybe we should give him the chance to actually prove it instead of auto-lynching just because of some... scummy play. Here, look, it's Xylth: scummy play, and no power role! >.>

But having to wait until day 3 to actually know, may not be the best idea. And you know, he'll beg for protection until D3. If he gets protected, N1, and N2, how do we know that mafia won't kill Nk some one else. Its a very risky plan. it saves his ass for three days, and it could turn around to hurt us. I don't find Xyl scummy at all, i think he's one of the most valuable pro-town players at the moment, with Lamont.

So he's a crappy scumhunter, that's not inherently scummy. I'd rather leave a crappy townie alive than scum.

wait.... what?

[BloodCovenent]

6. It means that I would rather lynch scum than a townie who is playing badly, which I believe Kise to be.

Now you explain to me how asking someone to Roleclaim so early in the game was a good move without referencing the result.

Roleclaims are at the very end to make sure you're not lynching a power role. They are reserved for this time because revealing roles before means that the scum have that much more info.

But there isn't anyone nearly as scummy as Kise at this point in the game.

I called him to Roleclaim because he was at L-2. It didn't seem too likely that anyone was going to back off, and by the way it looks now, he's still at L-2, meaning some others still find him scummy. I don't buy his claim, mainly because he said it was plain, and acted as if it was boring and he didn't really care for the game (this was my impression). Then he says he has some night actions on even nights. This sets himself up for safety for the next two nights, willing there is a doc, and willing the doc saves him. Not to mention, if he is scum, how do you know he won't just claim that his scum partner is pro town because of the "night investigation." This player seems very scummy to me, and i would like to see him lynched today. If he turns up town, i will be surprised, and then i would look into Lamont and Xyl, but i don't think he will. These players seem very pro-town to me.

[BloodCovenent]

I read the entire thing again, this time making little notes and observations. It took me 3-4 friggin hours.

And all of my misgivings about a kise bandwagon vanished upon a closer reading.

All I said was that my role is plain. Now, did anyone ever to stop to think that maybe that was a personal opinion of mine? What if I'm a Thief; someone who absorbs a NA if they target someone with a night ability, but could also target a non-NA player? Or what if I'm a bodyguard; a mofo that DIES when they protect someone?

I looked at my PBPA notes again and see a hastily-scribbled

WTF!

reaction to this post. I totally dint get this. At this point, Kise seems to be en route to overturning his "plain" role mention.

And he does:

If RC'ing is so vital for me to do, I'll do it.. L-2 doesn't scare me because I honestly don't think some of the sheep on my BW deserve me. Quick-bandwagons are annoying, but I'm not a quitter.

Then there's this:

The reason I wanted to give the impression I was "plain" is because I don't want to give scum a reason to NK me so early. And the way you guys are pushing for me to RC makes me think you're considering NK'ing me if I have an important role... and I do.. The cat is out of the bag.. And since you guys wanted me to RC, it's only fair that I'm protected during the 1st NP so I can investigate during the 2nd night. I hoped I didn't have to reveal it so early, but there it is..

Kise says he said he was "plain" because he was afraid scum would NK him.

I don't buy why he thought he was such a special target.

When he said he was "plain", the bandwagon wasn't fully-formed yet

So there's my vote. It's a good lesson for me to read and analyze every post on this thread instead of reacting to first impressions.

One of the other things I've flagged as scummy is this:
inHim - Implies he wanted to go with Papa, but Kise is better. Votes Kise.
Xyl - Implies he wanted to go with Lamont, but Kise is better. Votes Kise.
Lamont - goes back to Kise after saying the not-so-soft claiming vanilla has disturbed the hunting dynamic. Votes Kise.

All consecutive votes. There has got to be scum here too.[/b]

I actually liked everything from this point on in your post. Good work. you put a few quotes up there that i missed, thanks. As for the last part, i would have to say that if there is scum in the three consecutive votes, i would go with InHim. Why, because that was his second post in the game. His first post begins with - "Vote papa, here is scum." Then, on Page 4, his second post, he writes...

Argh, and I wanted to kill Papa.

unvote
vote: Kise

So, InHim is probably scum in that wagon. This doesn't sit well with me either. If we have a mislynch, i would look into him.

[BloodCovenent]

This player seems very scummy to me, and i would like to see him lynched today. If he turns up town, i will be surprised, and then i would look into Lamont and Xyl, but i don't think he will. These players seem very pro-town to me.

Look at this point its 50-50 he flips either way. 50-50 is GREAT odds for D1 lynching!!!

I don't think you can have it both ways: 1) Thinking he is scummy and wanting him lynched & 2) Wanting to suspect the main proponents of his wagon if he flips town

This is such a terrible case of fence sitting you need some assistance:

I just said i would look into you, not accuse you. i would reread the thread, and take not to you two. but at the moment, i think we're doing well. I'd rather go with option one at the moment anyways.

[BloodCovenent]

The Kise wagon is really really awful. I'm willing to bet there is at least two scum on it. Why in the world would anyone lynch a claimed cop on day one? Are you kidding?

I'd be willing to bet that it's Kise and InHim. Other than that, i would say Phoe. But those first two are my main hypothesi. (sp?)

[BloodCovenent]

inHimshallibe is still scum.

Ok, i made my own claim as to why InHim looks scummy, but you, you lack original evidence that you took the time to find. When some one like you (one that posts infrequently) votes on someone else's opinion (or quote), it makes it look like you don't really believe it, or you just want the wagon or lynch to be pushed forward. Either way, you look scummy. At the moment, i have difficulty believing the authenticity of your vote. At this point in time, if we were to drop the Kise bandwagon, and make a InHim wagon, i would question your vote, and your integrity towards the town. These random posts of peoples where they give no evidence and vote give the rest of the town suspicion, if your going to vote some one, give evidence. At least add your own point of view so that you add discussion to the thread. If you can't find your own evidence, look harder. Without original analysis, you lose credibility.

[BloodCovenent]

Rhinox needs to get in here and post something .

That's who we're missing... him and Cater.... Damnit.

[BloodCovenent]

inHimshallibe is mafia too.

ok... evidence?

This post is scummier than sam's, and is noted. Probably means nothing in the end.

Meh, if Kise were sticking around, I'd let him feed us results. No scum after Night 3 would merit a lynch, but since he has basically quit, I'm going to read him as defeated scum.

What part of that post is scummy?

You changed your opinion rather fast. I think this warrants a

FoS

. You don't post much in the thread compared to some, and what little posts you give, you change direction with your thoughts rather quickly.

Does anyone else share my suspicion?

[BloodCovenent]

Nice Lamont, i'll look into that too.

I've already said I'm against his lynch, why do I need to be here?

i guess not, i thought you might want to add something new to the debate, because of recent discussion. I apologize.

[BloodCovenent]

My analysis.

1. Kise makes "joke comment"

2. Then he says his role is plain, and blames Lamont for role fishing, when to me, it didn't look like he was. It seems that Kise just tries to shift the blame to some one else.

3. Kise gives examples of what he thinks is a plain role, but to a beginner like me, i don't think any of those are plain. He goes from his role fishing theory, to his opinion of what a plain role is. He says, "all I said was that my role is plain TO ME." Which is false, he never said that "To Me" until several posts after the initial "claim."

4.He labels unusual roles as "wack." Keeps saying it's all his opinion.

5. He gives a very interesting claim, he does not say what it is, but gives small details about it. Some action during even number nights. Seems like a fun role to me. Then he goes to say that he deserves to be protected Night 1, since he was "forced" to Role claim.

6. Although he initially claimed his role as plain, he's asking the question, "Why would you risk lynching a powerful ally to town." But isn't he begging the question? Is he really a powerful ally to the town?

7. Kise now says that he was originally trying to hide is role from the Nk. He's shifting the blame for his initial claim again. Saying that he didn't want to give himself away to Mafia. Acting like he planned it from the beginning, which I highly doubt.

8. "I plan to inspect Xyl on N2. " - This could be a scum connection (which i doubt), or a way to reason his way out. 'If you guys let me off the hook, i'll look into one of my antagonists.'

9. Brings up his other game with Phoe. Then why bring him up in your initial "joke" post. Treat each mafia game separately. Don't carry grudges over or anything. That's just bad play.

10.Then Kise yells at Diz and Xyl for being brainless bandwagoners... wait... i thought you would of investigated Xyl? what...?

11. Then there was this, "I lied about something else because I wanted to avoid being roleblocked during N1.. You'll see what I'm talking about soon. " why don't you tell us now? You are at L-1.

12.I kept an open mind Kise, that's why i've also looked into other people as well. you are just the most scummy right now. Not to mention that last bolded part of his post. About not clearing Phoe, what does that mean? are you trying to incriminate some one else?


Well, that's my analysis.

[BloodCovenent]

GG guys, GG!

Word, good job Conso and Cater! Wish i was able to stick around past Night 1 though. Thanks for modding OGML! Looking forward to another one? Yes, I am!

[BloodCovenent]

Dude, Reckoner, some awesome night actions there buddy!

[BloodCovenent]

oh gosh, that sucks. haha!

[BloodCovenent]

haha, good post!