Touhou UPick 2 - [Game Over]
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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If flavor is alignment independent I don't see how this followsIn post 114, zMuffinMan wrote:he's not giving any thoughts on the game and he's claimed something that i don't think makes a lot of sense as a town rolebeefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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No.In post 123, GuyInFreezer wrote:Is this is the question you asked me?
If so, I dont have any special condition.
You know the flavor of my char, yes?
If so, you know there is some...affliction that makes my character unique.
Is anyone else in the game who has that exact same affliction?beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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That answers it. Thanks.In post 126, GuyInFreezer wrote:No one else in this game is from same game as you boss wise.
(fuck you FG )beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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I can see a scum role that does this too.In post 141, zMuffinMan wrote:on the other hand, given this is fakegod and role madness, i could def see a scum role who can multivote and knows everyone's flavour
But you can't see a town role that does this?
I'm just trying to be clear about where your read is coming from.beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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He didn't start out the game like that.In post 174, GuyInFreezer wrote:Muffin trying to figure stuff out looks town unlike that large game where he spent his majority of time trash talking and discrediting.
I'm not thrilled with his angle on you - it's simplistic, not based on play, and it's ONE ROLE in a HEAVY role madness game.
I don't like anything ns has posted either.beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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I don't understand the question.
That's kinda pedestrian for you at this point.ns wrote:consider this post an OMGUS of you not liking anything I've postedbeefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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Sure.In post 189, Varsoon wrote:@Bork: I want to know why you don't like things.
I think I've explained what I don't like about the muffin thing pretty adequately but if you need more elaboration I can give it - I just don't want to reiterate crap that can be read.
For ns I didn't really like 1) the immediate (what occurred to me as an) overreaction to the vote related roles and b) I don't see why a miller claim should be invalidated by not having a cop in the last game.
Anyway he's engaging me decently (that is, the way I expect town-him to do it) so that's kind of tempering the read.beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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Eh, that's fair.In post 201, zMuffinMan wrote:i was basing my read on play, though (mentioned in 99 and 114), it's just the questions that keep coming up about my read were asking about gif's role. and there's only so much you can say about someone who hasn't provided contentbeefycheese-
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I don't really have a good one yet.In post 216, pieguyn wrote:@bork: what's your read on GIF?beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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Can pretty much already confirm this, unless GIF lied to me or doesn't know everything he thinks he does.In post 241, notscience wrote:I'm pretty sure most of the things in this game are here just to fuck with usbeefycheese-
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Hey I am rather proud of my spur of the moment decision to cop you coming back from McDonalds when GIF Pmed me and was like 'hey gaiz you got 2 hours to figure out your second shot" and mollie and majiffy were asleepIn post 245, zMuffinMan wrote:i am obvtown every game.
It really helped the game out a lot toobeefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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I guarantee you will, but I had something I needed to clear up and it's cleared up to the best of my ability at this point in the game.In post 332, notscience wrote:I don't get where GIF is getting his bork-obvtown read, I don't see anything really great coming from bork yet
I'm liking your opening, tonally, even if I didn't like the original points you made.beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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Do you actually think it is more likely that:In post 343, pieguyn wrote:this is a BLATANT MISREP. NS was voting Gaiden (who he was scumreading) when he pointed you out, and now he's, guess what? VOTING YOU.
1) RB saw NS was voting him and decided to attack him anyway for not voting him in the hope that nobody would see it
2) RB just didn't read aheadbeefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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GIF has actually already hinted that it's not a pure protect.In post 370, pieguyn wrote:bork how do you like the chance GIF's spellcard on Sakura doesn't actually do what he said it does (especially with him not bolding Sakura's name)?
As for the bold thing - if I were the mod, I would adhere to my own rule that 'if it appears to be a [day action]', it will be treated as a day action.
@FG: are you allowed to comment on whether or not GIF's action on Sakura is correctly formatted?beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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I agree with this part.In post 367, pieguyn wrote:if you're scumreading me, why aren't you voting me?!?!" is an easy angle for scum to push to discredit ppl voting them, so I wanna look into itbeefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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Yeah I see.In post 374, zMuffinMan wrote:uh, i asked about that post specifically and he said he found it from ISOing the people voting him, so yeah
I still think it's more of a derp and less of a scum.beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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How would you describe my play (separate from majiffy and mollie's play) in that game?In post 411, zMuffinMan wrote:i dunno. i don't really have much experience with him but he's playing a far safer game here than he was in gif's game
I'm surprised you even thought to compare the two considering
1) I was actually pretty absent D1 in that game
2) My other two heads are much more forceful personalities than I.beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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Tone and connotation suggests that you're warming up to calling me scum for this.In post 414, zMuffinMan wrote:ebwop: and by that i mean he hasn't really been creating any waves and he hasn't really expressed any controversial opinions on people, he's just kinda sitting back and observing and inserting questions here and therebeefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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If you really just 'don't know what to make of it' then fine. (I can tell you what to make of it: due to the preponderance of role speculation stuff, which is really easy to talk a lot about without really saying anything meaningful, I'm not getting a plethora of strong play based reads yet.)In post 422, zMuffinMan wrote:and you're not really doing anything similar in this game so i don't know what to make of it
I'm not gonna fake that when I don't have it yet.
I will say that I don't really get scumreads on GIF. I've seen him fluff the fuck out of game openings before as town and it's pretty lacking in scum motivation to just come out with 'hey guys I know all y'alls characters'beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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This isn't really how I recognize TNE scum. It's not really indicative of his HunterxHunter play at least, which is the only scum game of his I really remember.In post 478, GuyInFreezer wrote:TNE scum is a epic lurksack, even lurkier than Gaiden.beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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I seriously can't get over how willfully antitown you're willing to be every game.In post 504, SXTLHGaiden wrote:I will control myself. Grudgingly.
But, I get to hammer myself if the time comes dammit.
Give that to me at least.beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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Don't worry your little head I will be back in short orderIn post 675, GuyInFreezer wrote:Where is bork and what did you do to him? D:beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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GIF what did you find here?In post 612, GuyInFreezer wrote:Had my vote on him
remembered the suicidal element from his claim and moved him to townlist
and then just found something.
my vote never moved from him.beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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I feel like we should be attempting to confirm RB (if possible) rather than lynching him. A potential town RB becomes a liability for scum late in the game that they will be forced to NK.
If that fails he can be a policy lynch the day prior to lylo, but I see a fair bit of 'RB's role is likely a scum role/too powerful if he's scum' which on D1 in a role madness game should be at odds with the fact that there are tons of mitigating factors that you can't possibly know about yet.beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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Couldn't you make that argument against any vote that sakura made, considering precedent?In post 721, Raging Bull wrote:Its as if you tried to be on my wagon without being on my wagon because you know gaiden was being your vote.beefycheese-
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1) Why is sakura scummy for what gaiden is doingIn post 726, Raging Bull wrote:Dont understand what it means. Sorry.
2) Why is the fact that she pseudovoted on your wagon relevant (as opposed to somewhere else)beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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Depends how we leash it. If we keep it at 2 (or reset it to 2) then it's normal lylo - 1.
beefycheese-
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Your answer doesn't make any senseIn post 730, Raging Bull wrote:p edit. i just answered it. Please read.beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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So what does hypothetical town!sakura that wanted to vote you do in this situation?In post 733, Raging Bull wrote:She's scummy to me because due to Gaiden's behavior of already being her vote for like pretty much everything she did made it almost obvious that her pseudovoting me would result in Gaiden voting me. Her pseudo vote on me also makes it look like an opportunity to vote a wagon and not be involved at the same time.beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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it's shorthand for 'if sakura were town'In post 739, Raging Bull wrote:Town!Sakura? What is town!sakura mean?
that'd have been a better argument to make from the getgo "sakura is voting me for a dumb reason" than dancing around it with the gaiden thing.RB wrote:she would have had a better reason than a "FFS I WANT TO KNOW MORE" thing on me.beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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Hi Kagami,In post 936, Kagami wrote:I'm only not-townreading bitmap, bork, and feirei right now, excluding those who we'll have additional knowledge about tomorrow.
Talk to me about some of your reads:
me (your 'not-townreading' read on me is incorrect)
muffin (mostly a tonal/gut thing but I'm not townreading him and #477 doesn't really make it very clear that you are, either)
RB (hard to tell if you're townreading him or not I guess? Is he one of the 'additional knowledge' people? Because otherwise you've barely mentioned him)
gaiden (townread? why?)
Varsoon (having trouble following your progression on Varsoon; is #580 a town endorsement?)
Let's start there I guess.beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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It's been a minor gut scumread that I couldn't quantify very well.Muffin wrote:is not town reading me equivocal to scum reading me
What if I'm town and I awaken the beast?In post 938, zMuffinMan wrote:some friendly advice though; let sleeping beasts lay dormant, because if you are scum and you awaken the beast, i am going to make this game thoroughly unenjoyable for you
VOTE: Muffin
This reeks of posturing on a read on me before I actually answer you/bullying me out of pushing you rather than actually trying to figure out why I'm thinking what I think.
What do you know about scum me, exactly? Because youMuffin wrote:coz i don't really know how town-you could think that, and i can see scum-you trying to capitalise on certain players' paranoia about me here.haven'tplayed with it, you've played with town me what, once? and you were scum and didn't even have to really analyze my thought process there because you knew I was town the whole time. So how the hell do you think you know what either version of me might or might not do?
Yeah, uh, the elephant in the room that you're ignoring was that it took a fucking cop guilty on you to really know that.Muffin wrote:and you played in/followed gif's touhou game where you correctly identified me as scum
I think I've been pretty forthcoming in various places (this game, gif's dead thread) that my thought to investigate you was pretty spur of the moment.
You know damn well that my scumread on you in that game was 1) pretty nebulous D1 and 2) reliant on the reads of two other people (something you also quoted here!)
And yeah, you've been in a few of my modded games (as both alignments). One of the things that is interesting about modded games is that I don't have to form a read on you becauseMuffin wrote:because i've played in three of your modded games start to finishI already know what you are(and even if I am reading the game, I'm not analyzing it to the point where I have solid meta on your game) I seriously don't understand when people use this as an excuse for why I should know you better than I do.
This game:
I didn't like your opening on GIF (89)
I don't get your trajectory on RB.
Your claim (don't target me with anything) isn't as specific as it should be (you can argue I'm trying to 'rolefish' or what the fuck ever, but if I were negative utility I'd be screaming to the high heavens about exactly what that negative utility is)
Has it been a strong read so far? No. I haven't tried to pretend it is.
But the way you're engaging me now is kinda garbage.beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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A specific person, if in the game, is 100% scum, according to my role-PM. I was trying to figure out whether or not that person is in the game.In post 945, Kagami wrote:GIF looks to have a townread on you for flavor/flavorspec reasons, so I've been trying to work out what that is.beefycheese-
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I can't really object to that too strongly if you do feel that way (even if I don't agree with you, my posting has been sparser than usual in this game). I'm going to try to focus a little more on this game now, but I really am town.In post 945, Kagami wrote:I haven't gotten that same feeling, or really any especially pro-town feeling from your playbeefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
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And I'm of a few minds on the mechanic.
1) If GIF is scum, he's probably going to lie to me about it in combination with scum possibly has a pool of unused characters that they can try to dodge the mechanic with
2) If GIF is town, it's possible that he's been given faulty information about it, cause if that person were in the game and GIF has all the info it's the easiest scum lynch ever.
3) It's incredibly likely that FakeGod put it in to fuck with me.beefycheese-
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Did you not see me doing exactly this earlier?In post 951, Sakura Hana wrote:Well GiF knows every single person's character so why not talk with him about this?beefycheese-
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Honestly, on a bastard level of 1-10 that ranks about a 2 for me.In post 953, Kagami wrote:mafia doctor
Cabd does it
I do it
I haven't seen FakeGod do it but the only completed game of his I've been in is Frozen which didn't have anything super crazy, just neighbors out the assbeefycheese-
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Lots.In post 955, Sakura Hana wrote:What i saw was something like "someone being afflicted by the same as you" or something like that. How much touhou flavor do you know?beefycheese-
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I have a scumread on your slot and I am voting you because I have a scumread on you.In post 954, zMuffinMan wrote:is this your reason for voting me?
Your hypothesis seriously is that I'm trying to work the room with paranoia about you because I know it will work ahead of time?muffin wrote:you should, by now, have at least a vague understanding of the differences between my town and scum games, if not a pretty decent understanding. and i know you also know that there are certain players who are going to be extremely paranoid about me in every game we play (because even if they hadn't stated it publicly in this game, they have stated it in other games you've either modded or played in). what i don't really get is how you think my play so far is my scum game, and i would expect town-you to be using what you know of my scum and town games to be making a judgment here. on the other hand, i can easily see scum-you capitalising on the paranoia that is going to be surrounding me for as long as i'm alive to justify a shitty read on me.
Really?
That is a...farty point. That point smells like farts.
And you're basically demanding I use meta to judge you which I also find pretty
Not really true, but honestly, who cares? That was a different game, this is this game.muffin wrote:what? because i don't remember you having anything but a scum read on me D1 in gif's game (even if you weren't absolutely sure about it).
You're really flirting with a 'burden of proficiency' fallacy here, where since I read you correctly last time I should be able to read you immediately correctly every time.
Kagami's seen town me in at least two games and you don't see me jumping up her ass about not getting it right yet.beefycheese-
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yeah, we call that 'confirmation bias'.In post 960, zMuffinMan wrote:it's still far easier to notice habits, patterns, etc when you're watching a player play a game, knowing their alignment. and i refuse to believe you don't have a foundation for reading me from those games.
but go ahead and refuse to believe whatever you'd like.beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
- Xenophile
- Xenophile
- Posts: 10338
- Joined: April 3, 2012
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: Madison, WI
He's likely on the express bus to force-replacement (saying this because it's happened with pretty much every game I've ever played with him). I don't think pressure is really going to get him in here.In post 958, Varsoon wrote:VOTE: Bitmap
Please get in the game and provide some thoughts on things:
How do you feel about the swell and fall of the RB wagon?
What are your thoughts on GiF?
Thoughts about your wagon? Do you perceive scum on it? If so, who?
Where else might you vote?beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
- Xenophile
- Xenophile
- Posts: 10338
- Joined: April 3, 2012
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: Madison, WI
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
- Xenophile
- Xenophile
- Posts: 10338
- Joined: April 3, 2012
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: Madison, WI
I don't have any usable daycards.In post 966, Kagami wrote:The player would have to have no usable daycardsbeefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
- Xenophile
- Xenophile
- Posts: 10338
- Joined: April 3, 2012
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: Madison, WI
muffin wrote:what you're doing right now is looking exactly like what mollie did to me in xenosaga
Yes you can totally compare this to what a cornered last scum that is a different person from me did in a position where she had about no chance of winning no matter what she did.
But go ahead and qualify that if you'd like.
What doesn't make sense about it? You got all 'if you're scum and scumreading me imma kick your ass' and didn't even consider that I was town scumreading you even though I hadn't even said why yet.muffin wrote:"posturing" is such a shitty excuse for voting me that i really don't know how you can think it makes sense.
And then afterward you got into bullshit reasons on why town-me would never scumread you in this game.
That is awful.
Not really. You just seem a step off to me in all the angles that I've seen you come out with.In post 971, zMuffinMan wrote:i took that to mean you were making a meta judgment on me.
That's sometimes the best I can do early game.
p-edit:
fixedi'm just using what I am asserting that bork knows of mebeefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
- Xenophile
- Xenophile
- Posts: 10338
- Joined: April 3, 2012
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: Madison, WI
Why would I have to be scum w/ muffin if I were scum?In post 976, Kagami wrote:At this point it's hard for me to imagine bork being scum without either GIF or muffin being scum as well, and I don't want to lynch either of those two.beefycheese-
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borkjerfkin He/HimXenophileHe/Him
- Xenophile
- Xenophile
- Posts: 10338
- Joined: April 3, 2012
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: Madison, WI
I literally can't parse the point you're trying to make here.In post 979, zMuffinMan wrote:like this right here is not, and probably will never be, a good reason to think i'm scum
i could go through bork games i've been town and show where people have said similar things about me and accused me of being scum for similarly shoddy reasoning
so bork should know this is not a good reason for suspecting mebeefycheese