Micro 953: Treestump Express [Game Over]

[Hoptic]

I have a survey for everyone to fill out - this is very important and vital for safe travel.

1) What is your favourite type of boat?
2) Should Shrek continue his RP? Please answer yes to this question.
3) Who would you throw overboard? Please pick the person you feel has the most to live for.

-Hectic

[Hoptic]

I have a survey for everyone to fill out - this is very important and vital for safe travel.

1) What is your favourite type of boat?
2) Should Shrek continue his RP? Please answer yes to this question.
3) Who would you throw overboard? Please pick the person you feel has the most to live for.

-Hectic

1) Model aircraft carrier
2 Yes. I'd prefer a Bostonian one but this works.
3) Between you and me I've heard that AliveRaider is an astounding swimmer, so I'll go with anyone else.

Oh the game hasn't started yet.
See you guys later.

So, after two long years we meet again.

I don't really have much to add in the pregame phase.

NSG you really needed a pagetop fix there didnt you?

VOTE: hoptic
im always scum in games with you, but this time im not, and so im assuming you must be scum.

-unicorn

I've never seen this unicorn before in my life.

-Hopkirk

[Hoptic]

VOTE: Pighawk

VOTE: Egix96

Classic Alice putting a vote on someone haha. I remember this sort of thing from her two years ago too.

Hello! My name is Y'shtola Rhul, and I am a scholar in aetherology and member of the Scions of the Seventh Dawn. I am present as an advisor to the hunting and termination of our mutual enemy, the Sin Eaters.

Feel free to ask questions related to this goal. I will remain on standby in the meantime.

How do you feel about the recent news that most Sin 'eaters' only really chew the sin a bit then spit it out?

-Hopkir

[Hoptic]

It's somehow even more magnificent than before.

Reads:
• Shrek and Donkey are probably unaligned.
• Sherlock Holmes is very kind for repeating out loud everything he writes.

FINGER OF DEATH: Misty

Your first mistake was assuming the finger of death was bound to your mortal rules of EV calculation. What would you like your final meal to be?

pighawk, why did 36 warrant a vote?

-Hecti

[Hoptic]

Among my other companions Watson, were strange melding of pig and hawk, a slightly insane English fellow (I believe he may have had some form of multiple personality disorder), what seemed to be a talking bear, a dog, and a scholar of the arcane arts. I was somehow able to communicate with all of them during the voyage but how I cannot say — but what came to pass Watson, well, it is more horrifying than you are perhaps ready to hear. For two amongst our number were responsible for a murder most foul— that of our Captain, northsidegal. I knew that it was, through use of my exemplary deductive reasoning principles, down to me to establish who was responsible for this awful crime.

I'm getting pretty concerned with how much this guy is stalking me. He knows I'm English and that there's a user called 'Doctor Watson' mentioned on me wiki page. Sure, I don't

think

the good ol' doc wouldn't betray us, but he does like money.

I'm surprised we're still on page 2

where is everyone?

[bostonian] Prably makin' wihad stradagis thahd don't really benefiyt the tahn and bahsed on what a've seen in the pahst usually cahm frahm scahm. We'll get 'em if we see any a those [/bostoanian]

It's somehow even more magnificent than before.

Reads:
• Shrek and Donkey are probably unaligned.
-Hecti

Am I the only one sick of people pretending hydras are two different people as part of a joke? FOS on Hectic.

Happy with my current vote though.

-Hopki

[Hoptic]

As Pooky walked across the decks of the ship deep in thought he heard the sharp click of heels behind him - the rhythmic pace of the heels landing at precisely the correct time - each step purposeful yet seductive. He took a quick glance over his shoulder and saw a stunningly beautiful guest walk to the railing behind him - her deep auburn hair matched the fiery crimson of her dress - the silky garment hung from her shoulders to the small of her back leaving most of it exposed to the chilly air but she didn't seem to mind - the gossamer material offered little protection from the elements.

She pulled out a stylish lighter and clicked it, once, twice, three times but the wind prevented her from lighting her cigarette. Seeing the opening to help the mysterious lady - Pooky walked over and provided her with some flames by snapping his fingers at a fast speed - a trick he had learned from his travels in the Ottoman Empire.

"Alice my dear, it's hard to focus on the crime when you walk around looking so stunningly beautiful - but could you please help me throw the fake Detective overboard? I think I have an idea who is behind this mystery"

Hopki disliked this.

yeah, the RP is officially getting in the way of scumhunting. it would be great if we could drop it and lynch some fools by playing mafia.

-unicorn

feels weird coming from you of all people tbh

The passive agressive whataboutism is strong here, and not in a good way like Superman. What was the point of this post Chemist?

If I were to force something out, Hectic seems sort of unmotivated to solve and I don’t really like Hopkirk being more banter-y than not

please only remember this read if it’s correct

Hmmmmmm

How come you haven't made a single comment on my scumread? There's stuff you could engage with here but you're choosing to ignore it in favour of posturing by saying 'there's nothing going on'. I have a read (two if you count an Alice townlean I'm not sure if I posted or just thought about), let's hear your thoughts on Pig.

No idea where Hectic is. I'll ask him later. So far I know he's played with one of the hydra parts when they were scum four times in a row, he kind of dislikes Pig, he liked the role pms, and I think something else that I was forgetting.

-Hopk

[Hoptic]

Hectic slowly reclined in his chair as he heard the kerfuffle ring out below him. It was loud and was causing Hectic a fair amount of distress. At times like these, there was only one thing that could ease his mind and block out the noisy surroundings. Cracking open a bottle, he poured himself an ice cold drink of Ribena Blackcurrant. He took a careful sip, relishing it and allowing the berrylicious flavours to wash over him.

He sighed in relief, feeling significantly better with the Ribena in his system, and leaned over to have a look at what was going on below him. He was of course sat in his Boeing AH-64 Apache Attack Helicopter, hovering over the ship's deck and viewing the events from a reasonable distance. He would be safe up here from the train conductor's murderer - at least providing they weren't some kind of seasoned javelin thrower. Hectic frowned, and closed the door of the chopper - he would prefer to avoid a Night King scenario.

Speaking of Kings, he was a little disappointed at the Hawk's performance thus far. He had been informed that the Hawk was a feisty creature when it had good intentions, and there was a proven track record to demonstrate this. Hectic wondered why the Hawk had decided to take a more lax approach on today's voyage. Perhaps it was breeding season?

[Hoptic]

So you're going to ask me a question instead of responding to my question?

Who would do something like that?

I said it was serious.
They're pretty scummy (arguably)
Let's hear your thoughts.

-Hop

[Hoptic]

UNVOTE: pighawk [/unvoke] because Ev

-Ho

[Hoptic]

UNVOTE: Pighawk UNVOTE:

This isn't good

-Hec

[Hoptic]

I'm drunk, Hectic isn't and might pretend to vote wrongo

UNVOTE: Pighawk [/pighawk]

-H

[Hoptic]

UNVOTE: Pighawk ]/unbvote]

ughhhhh

-Ho

[Hoptic]

It's okay, it's okay, I got this

[pighawk]unvote[/pighawk]

-He

[Hoptic]

Hectic is going to do votes because apparently I actuall can't.

The issue is mafia can hammer and skip d1 if Pig isn't bad. That gives them 66% EV if they kill that mafia

-Hop

[Hoptic]

UNVOTE: pighawk

-Hectich

[Hoptic]

Now it looks likemy unvoteds were on purpose. Thanskd hecitc

-hopk

[Hoptic]

I feel like there's some good nuggets here so far, I haven't had a chance to digest yet. I will be signing my posts for those who are keeping track. Thoughts to come later, but wanted to make an entrance, Pork's got it rollin.

~Hawk

I had this post as showing a mindset I'm in ~relatively commonly as town

lack of follow-up is kinda eh but we're still on page 5

but the excitement about it from alice was the scummiest.

Can you tell me why? One sentence is enough.

Speaking fur donkey 'ere, bit a ill plan kin come fae toun or scum, bit happily supporting a ill plan feels even worse.

One o' thae part plays doesn't cop lik' th' ithers, yin o' thae part plays juist doesn't belong. (One of these role plays doesn't feel like the others, one of these role plays just doesn't belong.)
VOTE: Alice

I'm nearly 100% sure alice is town

[Hoptic]

Honestly we both feeel like Pighwak is scum but we want more content befiog we lynch.

I feel like there's some good nuggets here so far, I haven't had a chance to digest yet. I will be signing my posts for those who are keeping track. Thoughts to come later, but wanted to make an entrance, Pork's got it rollin.

~Hawk

I had this post as showing a mindset I'm in ~relatively commonly as town

lack of follow-up is kinda eh but we're still on page 5

That's npot an answerr.

but the excitement about it from alice was the scummiest.

Can you tell me why? One sentence is enough.

Speaking fur donkey 'ere, bit a ill plan kin come fae toun or scum, bit happily supporting a ill plan feels even worse.

One o' thae part plays doesn't cop lik' th' ithers, yin o' thae part plays juist doesn't belong. (One of these role plays doesn't feel like the others, one of these role plays just doesn't belong.)
VOTE: Alice

Hectic didn"t get this so gtranslating. Btw, i fixed spelling errors in translation but nowehere else because eioregt

Speaking for donkey here, a bad plan can come from town or scum, but happily supporting a bad plan feels even wose
one of the (part?) plays doesn't work out like the other, one of the (part) players just doesn't belong

I'm nearly 100% sure alice is town

Agreed, i like your reads friend

I think voltato might be town
yeah but he's donkey slash unicorn this game
ok, i;ll just write this

Actual transcript of our discussion

-Hopki

[Hoptic]

Hectic light townreads you chemist aND I get my name back almost whooooooooooooo

Do we like pooky, who knows. He pinged me and hectic feels like he's not like, you get what i meant right, yeah sure. MAkes sense.

Alice you're online . Interact with us! Well be good cop drunk cop
-Hopkirk

[Hoptic]

not fully upgraded ugh, i'll switch this with the last one

Actual quote from hectic
'This is townspew I think'

-Hopkir

[Hoptic]

Alice has actively chosen not to engage with us here. WOW

- Hopkirk

Should I quote that from you?

- Hectic

Yeah, can do

- Hopkirk

Cool

- Hectic

Want me to give you any more quotes? - Hopkirk
You can quote that too

- Hopkirk

-Hectiche

[Hoptic]

'Sometimes it feels like I never came back from Vietnam.'

Also said you could quote this, but I appreciate you not saying that to everyone here. Probably not a good idea.

-Hopkir

[Hoptic]

Yeah we ain't giving townreads imo now. Pig's a good vote. The bear avatar guy that might start with a p pinged both of us too.

-Hopki

[Hoptic]

'Oh uyeah Egix is in this game' - Hectic

I'm not really caring if the donket head is meh.

We see you, nice to see you here
-Hopk

[Hoptic]

How would Alice respond to my posts as town?

- Hopkirk

Uhhhh

- Hectic

Closing mafiascum for the night

- Hopkirk

We've done some great work here. Content for everyone

- Hectic

We can be proud

- Hopkirk

-Hectichec

[Hoptic]

you skippedsome of our reads but that's good imo -Hopkirk
we discussed more but that's hidden -not said, implied

You can quote the final final closing arugmets if you want -Hectic
we need to hire a better laywer - Hop

(Silence) - Hectic
Cool -Hectic


-Hop

[Hoptic]

Is this Hawk or Porkens speaking?

I skimmed over the last one, and Hawk, didn't you mention you were in people's faces and aggressive as town? I hope 184 is you. Fair point about Egix. He did defend me earlier with meta in a way which he didn't need to, but it doesn't count for much.

We got some great RPers in here btw. I'm still watching from my chopper, so dw, I'm not done yet either.

-Hectichect

[Hoptic]

Hectic awoke with a start. It seems he'd fallen asleep at one point or another while hovering over the deck. It's a good thing Hopkirk was here to take the wheel while he slumbered. Hang on a second... why were they so far above the ship now? They'd risen past the clouds and the ship was barely a speck in the distance of the sea floor. Hopkirk informed Hectic that they were flying towards the sun, as he had seen in a dream once that the sun would provide all the answers. Hectic could smell the alcohol on his breath as he spoke.

He patted Hopkirk reassuringly on the shoulder, and told him to fly down once he had found all the answers, and with that,

jumped

out of the helicopter. Hectic checked if he was wearing his parachute and was relieved to find he was. It would be a shame if he met his untimely demise due to abruptly jumping out for style points.

As he plummeted through the air, he thought on the events that had transpired on the ship. He was still unhappy with the Hawk's contributions thus far; he seemed rather demotivated, and Hectic had been expecting a little more enthusiasm from him. Pooky and Sherlock Holmes seemed like fine gentlemen, but had not divulged much in helping with the case. Shrek had a fantastic accent and was doing good detective work, and his pet unicorn-donkey wasn't bad to boot. Despite her name, AliceRaider was also rather helpful in the investigation. Meanwhile, Egix and the Chemist were both on his radar, the Chemist particularly for his latest vote which felt quite lazy and lacked any reasoning. Hectic hoped he would amend this.

The ship was zooming in closer and closer, and so Hectic released his parachute to start steering it towards the deck. He'd heard the rumours of Misty's yellow companion being able to summon lightning bolts out of the sky, and shuddered at the thought. He hoped Misty didn't have any nefarious motives, as this would be the perfect time to strike...

[Hoptic]

pretty sure if we lynch pighawk we win outright as town

Hectic keeps sending me vaguely threatening letters reminding me I haven't posted in a while. That's probably because I still agree with this.

-Ho

[Hoptic]

Hey Shrek, how are you feeling about Alice now- post 110? It sounds like you both at least somewhat scumread her and she jumps out more as obvtown to us and I think a few other people.

Pooky I've moved from vague suspicions to a reasonable townread. Post 80 is what did it which is kind of odd since it was all RP, but it I liked the smell of it anyway.

-H

[Hoptic]

Let's VOTE: Hoptic

For pushing weird angles and still not having a vote out. Also for worrying about a lynch on us while simultaneously calling us scum which in theory should end the day in a win, doesn't seem like that's coming from a town-mindset.

~Hawk

We can think you're scum while not wanting the day to end right that instant if we're wrong. As previously explained, if you're town and on L-1, scum can can hammer and treestump themselves.

You don't remember Tuxedo Mask being pushed as scum for this exact same argument in the last game? (he was town). I can smell the bad faith even from up here as I parachute down, pighawk.

Also, you may have your desired vote since you're no longer on 3:

VOTE: pighawk L-2

~Hectic

[Hoptic]

Egix, what would you say is your strongest scumread at this point and why?

You seemed more inquisitive and proactive in your last town game regarding reads.

~Hecti

[Hoptic]

Let's VOTE: Hoptic

For pushing weird angles and still not having a vote out. Also for worrying about a lynch on us while simultaneously calling us scum which in theory should end the day in a win, doesn't seem like that's coming from a town-mindset.

~Hawk

This is such a weird vector of attack. You're acknowledging that I'm not voting you (despite you being my top suspect) because I'm concerned about the hammer while

also

complaining I don't have a vote out? You clearly understand my vote here is/was at this point for all intents and purposes on you - since you quoted me saying I want to lynch you still.

Only scum hammer me. Town has no reason to

even if they think I’m scum

.

PIGHAWK IS AT L-1

if you were town you wouldn't put yourself at L-1 because scum can just come hammer you

ergo you are scum.

Scum you knows that there's no risk that you'll be hammered by scum. Town doesn't.

If you're town scum can hammer unless both scum are on your wagon already.
If you're scum then scum don't hammer.
Am I missing something (question @anyone) or does not being hammered just make you a lot more likely to be scum?

Who does this kind of thing without discussing it with their hydra partner. It feels really odd you'd do something that you know substantially reduces our EVs without mentioning it to them.
-Hop

[Hoptic]

is your attack on me motivated by anything other than OMGUS?

I'm just curious because it's pretty obvious I'm town since it doesn't make sense for scum to put himself out here like this and attack esp in this setup- you can wifom it but imo I think it's pretty obvious I'm town here.

Does it make sense for scum to do what I’m doing?

Yes. It doesn't make sense from town to do it though because unless you think it's exactly 2 of me/Alice/Pooky because scum can just raise their EVs by hammering.

on second thought, pighawk wants to not be alive in lylo. this gambit all but assures that they will be alive in lylo. at this point i dont think scum would hammer regardless of pighawk's alignment, the wifom is too great. so maybe we are better off just lynching pighawk at this point. i think the self-vote was an awful play. and i still think you're town. but... you kinda need to die because otherwise you've made a huge mess for us tomorrow.
-unicorn

No, we can lynch scum today.

-Hawk

how about you fucking do it then

-Hopk

[Hoptic]

Egix96 96 pinged me really hard for scum just hanging out and taking potshots that won’t go anywhere.

Egix96 seems like a strong candidate for scum to me.

Egix96 is 4 for 4 scumposting. Each one is reactive to inquired in the game - no original content. They all do that thing scum do if “comment on the game but not make any waves whatsoever” and stick to the facts. Like look at 96 where they ^^^^^ at the comment “this game is slow”. Yeah it is...AND?

I bet a dollar on this being one of the scum.

I don't understand how when you had 3 votes on you and Egix had 2 on them you went into fatalistic death spiral mode instead of voting someone you said many times you scumread - and make them an equal leading wagon. You haven't mentioned them with any kind of opinion on alignment recently.

-Hopki

[Hoptic]

Either Chkflip is really sharing a wavelength here readswise (Alice, Pooky, Shrek, maybe Chemist) or they're setting things up for later.

@Chkflip- what are your thoughts on the people you haven't townread?

-Hopkir

[Hoptic]

I feel like there's some good nuggets here so far, I haven't had a chance to digest yet. I will be signing my posts for those who are keeping track. Thoughts to come later, but wanted to make an entrance, Pork's got it rollin.

~Hawk

I had this post as showing a mindset I'm in ~relatively commonly as town

lack of follow-up is kinda eh but we're still on page 5

How about now?

I advise you unvote, PH

I think you're town based off this and you've gotten the gamestate warp you wanted

Wait what?

-Hopkirk

[Hoptic]

@Chkflip- what are your thoughts on the people you haven't townread?

If I haven't mentioned them, I've yet to pile them one way or the other tbh. This is my first game back after a bit of a break. To be clear I haven't town-piled Chemist yet. What's your reason to do so?

Chemist isn't in what I'd call a town pile. They're slightly better than neutral based on current gamevibe. Mostly concerning pairings.

-Hopkir

[Hoptic]

So you're going to just completely ignore the mechanical benefits for scum hammering town here? Workings below, but these are my two questions based on them.

1.) Why has scum chosen not to hammer you yet?
2.) Why would town quickhammer in this scenario, factoring in general understanding of what L1 means and lack of incentives?

tldr of the observational argument
-Mafia have a mechanical reason to quickhammer so someone who gets quickhammered is very likely to flip town
-Nobody has a mechanical reason to quickhammer a mafia member. Town have no reason, mafia have a counterincentive
-You are equally likely to have a quickhammer on either alignment from a town player who just likes quickhammering
-If someone is not quickhammered in this scenario you are more likely to observe them flipping scum than town

The argument that not getting hammered at L-1 means one is scum doesn’t make sense to me. If that’s the case how does scum ever get hammered? You are all leaving out the part where town could hammer at any time with no fear of instant loss. I’ve explained that I perceived the tide off public opinion turning against me. It wasn’t about votes.

But you know what? Fine. I can’t control how you read it. Moving on.

I’d really like to engage Alice on their post from yesterday.

P. Edit: egx, my man. good, please do.

Why scum hammer town

When town is on L1
Scum win % by EVs goes up if they lynch town day 1.
Scum can freely hammer town if the town is on L1.
You not being hammered means scum have chosen not to take this boos.

why do you think this is

Why town wouldn't hammer scum here

The only reason to quickhammer as town is if you're sure that person is scum (base chance being 25%).
By the time a quickhammer is a risk it means that

4 town are already voting you

(unless the scumpartner is already bussing).
Factoring in a self vote this will require 3 town voting to put you on L1. A fourth vote will be required to lynch.
The only way you get a town lynching you here is

1.) they're sure you're scum AND
2.) there's 3 other members of the town already voting you KNOWING how this works

For scum to get quickhammered it requires 4/6 of the town to be actively saying they're happy for a lynch on you right now. That's AFTER a selfvote and it's 5/6 required if you don't selfvote. A quickhammer from town only happens in this setup from a townplayer who is actively inclined towards quickhammers. There's no mechanical benefit.

and add that to the fact that town have

no incentive

to quickhammer someone whereas scum have a clear mechanical incentive

Honestly, the funniest thing is if you're saying that town would hammer you here then you're saying you think you deserve to be voted off as multiple town are happy for you to be on L1 knowing the risks.

-Hopki

[Hoptic]

how about you fucking do it then

-Hopk

Oh, I'll take your bait. Game on.

~Hawk

To clarify, this is intended as a 'stop talking about how good the dragons are going to be and bring on the fucking dragons' fuck, rather than an aggressive 'fuck you, I don't care what you have to say' fuck.

You've made multiple posts saying we need to do something while only talking about yourself instead of forming reads on other people.

Oh and I will also say this: town needs to have a strong wagon as time dwindles towards deadline. If there are two middling wagons, scum have a better opportunity to pick the elimination by plurality.

This is another example of what I mean. Saying 'we need a strong wagon' is generic posturing. Do you think you as mafia wouldn't want to have a strong wagon, or at least have people think they wanted that? Everyone knows that we want a good wagon and prefarably a pre deadline lynch, so there is no benefit to saying it in general terms.

-Hopk

[Hoptic]

Let's lynch pighawk please. It's very unlikely that the other two on the wagon (Alice and Pooky) are both scum, so everyone checking in and no one hammering them means they're probably scum. As Pooky/Hopkirk have said: This gambit makes absolutely no sense as town, and makes all the sense as scum to convince people with AtE - and it's worked on Misty somehow, unless he's just scum with them.

It just feels to me like Porkens saw the writing on wall and went for this all or nothing strat.

Other people I'm kind of sus of are Pooky because of how different he feels to Lovers Mafia, and Egix because he's less involved than he is as town. Alice and Shrek & Donkey are probably town.

~Hect

[Hoptic]

From what I remember, you were hyperposting and switching reads on a dime. You had a lot more energy.

~Hec

[Hoptic]

So I asked you multiple questions and you've actively refused to answer them (in my last post - why wouldn't scum hammer, why would town). You're not even remotely trying to engage in good faith here. You do realize mafia required teamwork right? We need 5 votes to lynch someone here. If you actively refuse to explain your viewpoint or say 'I was wrong' then what options do I have except assume you're just playing in bad faith?

Chemist did this same thing as town last game except he backed off as soon as there was pressure. That ultimately led to town misvaporizing him day 2.

If this move makes zero sense as town, why would scum do it? Where does this “all or nothing” gambit leave me tomorrow if I’m scum?

WIt leaves you as a treestump with your partner going into lylo. I honestly don't understand how you'd overlook, you're aware of the game mechanics.

-hop

[Hoptic]

yea there's no way scum leave town-chemist alive over alice or me imo

What do you mean? You and Alice were universal townreads as far as

stated

reads went.

-Ho

[Hoptic]

Pighawk actively decided to gamethrow with the selfvote. He always flips either scum or blacklisted town.

-H

[Hoptic]

We'd only ever be part of an endgame with two of (Sherlock/Chemist/Ckflip/Egix (remove Egic depending on your pov)) based on our reads. This endgame makes sense since any other combination I'd be happy who I'm voting.

-Ho

[Hoptic]

Chkflip being a stated scumlean and Chemist is a stated 'neutral because he's less likely to be scum with Pig and Pig has claimed scum already' that I've argued with a bit.

-Hop

[Hoptic]

Actually I agree with Pooky, Hoptic is even backing up his push after Pighawk flipped town.
Look at that energy!

This is a list of every game I've played recently. See if you can work out why most of them have several month long gaps between them.

-viewtopic.php?f=84&t=80729 - Featuring town self hammering AND the doctor getting themselves modkilled
-viewtopic.php?f=55&t=80850 - Featuring town self hammering
-viewtopic.php?f=150&t=81775 - Team mafia where one of our teammates gets themselves modkilled for trust tells 2 or 3 days into the event, instantly losing any possibility of us winning team mafia
-viewtopic.php?f=52&t=80757&start=2100 - Featuring an abandonment due to mod siteflake in lylo
-viewtopic.php?f=52&t=81655 - A good game since 5 of the people in it I knew irl and me or Hectic had played with almost everyone else

I'm pretty fucking sick of town decided to screw us over every single game. This was mechanically a self hammer/suicide. Has the whole site become this terrible now, or is it just unlucky that 4/6 of the last games I've played have involved town intentionally suiciding because they only care about themselves and want to spoil things for everyone else?

-Hop

[Hoptic]

*-Hopk

-Hopki

[Hoptic]

A trust tell is where you say 'I only ever do this as one alignment and I can prove it (or it's clearly true when you look through their games).

The annoying thing is it wasn't even a trust tell. He just phrased it so badly that he got modkilled for it since everyone (including me until I asked him irl what he was actually trying to say) interpreted him saying 'I've only done this as town so far ]i] because [/i] since I haven't rolled scum recently but I was planning to do it next time as scum' to be 'I only ever do this as town'.

-Hopkir

[Hoptic]

To be fair, there's a lot of rules that don't get enforced.

Do not attempt to play the same game under more than one name.

We're calling ourselves Hopkirk AND Hectic here. I'm not sure the mod even noticed lol.

Do not bring outside influences into the game - this includes threats, bribes, wagers, promises, "trust tells", alliances, etc. Using knowledge from previous games is perfectly acceptable, but try not to carry grudges from one game to another.

Hectic told me that if we don't win this then he's going to break my legs. It's pretty reasonable since I had to set him on fire after the last time we played together.

Do not edit/delete posts.

Sometimes I actually go back and fix the grammer in my posts. They don't stop us editing them before we make them
... actually you can tell I'm not being serious here based on the number of messed up tags and stuff. Nevermind.

Do not quote communications with the moderator (in particular, your role PM). Paraphrasing is usually ok.

Hey Hopkirk, how come you look exactly like a younger and far more handsome Brad Pitt?

I'm not saying that came with my role pm...

(Hop note - the above is a joke, I actually just wrote a quote and attributed it to North. Don't feel bad if you didn't manage to pick up on this, it was ingeniously subtle.)

Do not post in the game after you are dead or replaced. Some moderators do allow contentless "Bah!" posts, but you should never reveal information once you are dead.

WOW. YOU SHOULD ALL FEEL ASHAMED OF YOURSELVES. Other rules have exceptions where it says 'unless the game rules say otherwise' but not this one. I think it's fairly clear that the admin's intent was that treestumps are banned.

Don't kill your players in real life if they die in game. We've been really clear about this, but some people are surprisingly good at finding out where players live. Please note - if Flopz is modding your game and starts joking asking you where you live DO NOT TELL HIM

No comment, but I wouldn't say no comment if I had

no comment

if you get what I mean...

-Hopkirk

[Hoptic]

Let me rephrase, the rage could be real, but the choice to channel it here is distracting from the actual 3p that’s going on

You have an amazing grasp of my psychology.

I'm waiting for Chemist/Hectic/Chk to show up. I know who I'm leaning more towards at the moment.

-Hopkir

[Hoptic]

I don't get why either of you signed up (~) to this not wanting to be in the 3p? This setup is exactly like having a bunch of angry ghosts talking in your head that are forced to listen to whatever you say out of some ongoing sense of obligation. How is that not fun?

-Hopkir

[Hoptic]

Also, chemist doesn't kill everyone else off the wagon to frame themselves.

We also didn't get quick hammered as town indicating more than likely that both scum were on our wagon.

You/Alice/Pooky/Me had you on L1 and nobody quickhammered.

-Hopkir

[Hoptic]

notice how you said

both

, that would have actually been right

-Hopki

[Hoptic]

I'm kinda torn right now. On one hand I almost believe Misty in saying he wouldn't put himself through this lylo again but honestly it wouldn't be hard for him to replicate his play in the lylo from the previous time this was played.
Misty is perfect material for this LyLo - that is true, but the fact

we're

here specifically makes me sus. I was in the last treestump game, and we mislynched Misty in the final 3. He is aware of this and knows who I was in that game. Added to the fact Hop and I expressed a slight town impression of him: I think scum!him could easily have picked us and be banking on my paranoia from the last game.

Pighawk, you're kinda just tunneled on us for very biased reasons tbh. Your self-vote was game throwing as town and I don't know what you expected. Like:
>self-vote and put yourself on L-1 as town
>this is game throwing and only scum do this
>we obviously lynch you
>suprisedpikachu.jpg

~Hectic

[Hoptic]

Those are my first impressions anyway. I can't remember anything about chk. I'll reread and talk to Hop about it tomorrow probably.

~Hecti

[Hoptic]

Just a ~feeling~ that you're letting that be a big influence on your view.

~Hect

[Hoptic]

I advise you unvote, PH

I think you're town based off this and you've gotten the gamestate warp you wanted

Oh yeah, what was this? Did anyone else think Pighawk was town for whatever that was?

This disconnect from the consensus could be scum-indicative.

~Hec

[Hoptic]

I may have been an Umbreon in that game. I'll go back and check that now.

~He

[Hoptic]

Assuming the VC didn't have Pooky's vote when he hammered? Unsure but leaning towards it being legit simply because he doesn't really need to rush the day and hammer there as scum given the position you were in.

~H

[Hoptic]

Why do you think you were picked for your EoD rage, chk? Do people normally scumread you for rage? I've only seen people townread you for it.

~He

[Hoptic]

I think everyone in the game must've been mass prodded. I'm pretty busy today but I expect 20 pages of quality content by the time I return.

~Hec

[Hoptic]

Oh, that's a lot of pedits lul. My phone had the couple day old page loaded. Regardless, can't actually catch up until tomorrow probably. I'll see if I can tag Hop in.

~Hect

[Hoptic]

pighawk, you're confbiasing in that PageTop. That's perfectly valid scumhunting and not *pushing* your opinions and asking for votes isn't something that's scummy. Look for things that are scummy, not how everything could potentially be

interpreted

as scummy.

~Hecti

[Hoptic]

My lean is chemist sucm at 65-35 at this point I think.

I feel like Hectic meta makes our slot look fairly obvtown, not that I'm going to tell him what I think these are.

-Hopk

[Hoptic]

Taking a hydra to this lylo seems like a bad idea mechanically for a scum hydra to make.

Personally I'd say banking on wifom is such a bad way to win. No reason anyone takes Shrek/Alice/Pooky into the lylo. Several people have said 'scum would consider Alice' but she was a UTR except from I think 1 person? Shrek/Pooky also were scumread by nobody I think? Endgame was always going to be 2 out of what we've got/scum that died/sherlock. Feels fairly likely we're here just because scum know we'd be active if we weren't picked & nobody had expressed a townread on us d1/a few had expressed scumreads. We also have scumreads on both of the two other slots pulled in, so mafia know they can potentially sway us either way.

From that last perspective chemist less likely scum since didn't try to appeal to us?

-Hop

[Hoptic]

Egix dropped off on activity around when the Pig wagon became definite so it feels like scum were just banking on that then planning to kill Egix. Checking wagon for equity

-Ho

[Hoptic]

Oh yeah, neither on to that point. Chemist avoiding the wagon feels like it makes more scum sense.

-Ho

[Hoptic]

I feel like Egix knows they get lynched if they stump us or go into endgame with us so not sure how much value we get out of considering them killing the other partner.

Chemist Egix push is at a better time - putting on parity before the L1 throw happened.

-H

[Hoptic]

Either Chkflip is really sharing a wavelength here readswise (Alice, Pooky, Shrek, maybe Chemist) or they're setting things up for later.

@Chkflip- what are your thoughts on the people you haven't townread?

-Hopkir

A big part of my lean toward Chk town when I started was because I'm not convinced Chkflip would do exactly what I expected scum-Chk to do here and take us in.

-Ho

[Hoptic]

I'm still not sure about how quickly Chkflip townpiled my top 3 townreads, maybe he's just really good?

Either way they were killing Egix there imo, which explains the lack of quickhammer by either. Egix seems bad for scum to take into endgame for scum here.

Mmm gaslighting. That's cute.

Click my username.

Click to see my threads.

Pick literally any game I've been in this year.

Do you know what you'll see?

Chemist knows.

See you D2.

What was this talking about?

-Hop

[Hoptic]

Chem, what’s your current read?

If you were scum, who would you put in 3p and why?

Alice and Hoptic maybe just as the less townclear slots

Maybe chk instead of hoptic

You don't think Alice was obvtown then?

Does anyone else find it strange that a hydra keeps melding the Hawk and Pig opinions into one? Or the fact that a hydra with two players gets prodded?

~Hawk

The scum in this 3p is going to try and fit in as hard as possible. So if the two town don’t post the scum won’t. It’s incumbent on the two town players to set the pace. And of course more words are better.

yee

that’s why I’m inclined to lean towards chk town because he doesn’t seem like he’s trying to blend in

How exactly do we blend in? Went hard on Pig and were very visible in the thread because of 'humor'. Can't say we were remotely under the radar.

-Hopk

[Hoptic]

Have I said I hate how Chemist actively avoided engaging with the Pig wagon? That's a big bit of why he's leaning further scum.

How come you haven't made a single comment on my scumread?

how come you haven't made a single comment on your scumread?

you just voted and said you were happy without it without reasoning or even an indication it was serious

Refusing to comment on Pig here and trying to turn it around with a 'whataboutyou'. Whataboutism in generally is deflection and isn't a genuine way of engaging. My follow up wasn't responded to with any thoughts on Pig. Feels like Chemist made a very active decision not to take a stance.

VOTE: Alice

Post towards pighawk looks like a towncred grab given that they were already voting PH

Only other mention of Pig in any meaningful way. I don't see how town is semi-active in that gamestate and says absolutely nothing about it?

-Hopk

[Hoptic]

@Any stump request: I really don't have time for meta. Could one of the treestumps look through Chemist's games and see how they normally react to lylos? They took a pretty quick stance this game and it'd be helpful to know if this is alignment indicative for them.

-Hopki

[Hoptic]

I'm leaning 65-35 Chemist after the reread, but that's a higher 65 than the one I said earlier which was probably more like a 55-60. Still not enough that I'm super happy with it. Want to hear more from both and from the stumps

[Hoptic]

-Hopkir btw

-Hopkirk

[Hoptic]

Take a step back from the game Hawk. Come back when you're able to interpret things without bias. That question never mentions the last treestump game and refers to multiple games. It clearly involves looking at their meta in general. If you aren't able to get that then you should take a break from the game and come back with less bias.

Obviously I shouldn't need to explain why confirmed town are a good group of people to ask to do meta reads.

-Hopkir

[Hoptic]

You didn't ask a question. You attributed words to me that I clearly wasn't saying and attacked those.

No idea what the second half of your post was trying to say because you filled it with enough obscure buzzwords that it lost any meaning.

-hopki

[Hoptic]

I looked through your last posts. You haven't asked me any questions except that one where I very clearly told you that you've added extra words to the question that weren't there to (intentionally?) Misinterpret me.

-hopk

[Hoptic]

I didn't play it.
Hectic did.
I never mentioned that game.
I asked for their general lylo meta.
I just told you twice you completely misinterpreted this since I never mentioned that game and clearly said looking across their games to see if there's difference between their scum/town play in lylo. Any sensible reading of this would know I'm clearly talking about general meta since

-i say can people look at their lylo meta across alignments. That's literally what I said.
-youre the only one mentioning that treestump game

Now despite me just telling you repeatedly that you'd completely misread this you didn't even bother to read the post or either of those explanations. I honestly don't see how I can view you as anything except a brick wall.

-hop

[Hoptic]

Where's the cherry picking, Misty?

-Hectoc

[Hoptic]

I think Hoptic is cherry-picking into a push on me based off me pushing them over chk

Respond to my questions instead of dismissing what I'm saying as 'cherry picking'. This is just following the 'refuses to engage' pattern than I'd like someone to check if it's AI.

The second part of this is bad since it's basically saying 'I'm going to ignore anything you say because I think you're scum' which is actively avoiding responding to anything, and it's something Chemist could say no matter what we said.

Still waiting to hear Chemist's actual thoughts on both of us since he hasn't provided them in any substantial form.

Where's the cherry picking, Misty?

-Hectoc

you’re talking about the stuff I don’t have compared to the stuff I do (specifically re: pighawk push)

I can't work out what you mean here, can you reword it, unless I interpreted it right below ('stuff I don't have' is the bit I have no clue is the bit I can't work out unless have = your actions?)

If you mean 'I'm talking about things you didn't do', choosing not to engage with the wagon and actively avoiding my questions on Pig was an active choice so it's absolutely something you did. Choosing not to do something is a choice and you've ignored me asking you to justify it.

-Ho

[Hoptic]

Hm. No one is making this easy. Except I’m about 99% chem town here

then explain why...

-H

[Hoptic]

I was going to try and look at Chemist's meta to see if they avoid engaging with stuff as one alignment more than the other but Hecctic was in all four games I opened so I'm going to ask him instead.

-Ho

[Hoptic]

Misty does avoid engaging as scum as far as I can remember. There's a normal game he repped into a scumslot and mostly lurked it out that comes to mind, and the animals uPick game, I don't think he responded or engaged any of my suspicions on him until I prompted him (regarding voting votato vs Dr Easy Bake if you remember, Misty).

Now, the question is whether he does the same thing as scum... lemme check Treestump 1 to refresh my memory.

~Hectic

[Hoptic]

I see more unprompted engagement there than here actually. I'm leaning Misty as well but it's by no means confident.

~Hectec

[Hoptic]

Hm. No one is making this easy. Except I’m about 99% chem town here

then explain why...

-H

who do you think is the scum here Hoptic?

Chemist is more likely as I said, but it's hard to get a solid read when they both posted very little stuff yesterday that feels AI.

Misty does avoid engaging as scum as far as I can remember. There's a normal game he repped into a scumslot and mostly lurked it out that comes to mind, and the animals uPick game, I don't think he responded or engaged any of my suspicions on him until I prompted him (regarding voting votato vs Dr Easy Bake if you remember, Misty).

Now, the question is whether he does the same thing as scum... lemme check Treestump 1 to refresh my memory.

~Hectic

Second part is 'as town' right?

Did you have any experience of their lylo play?

-Hop

[Hoptic]

Yeah, as town. The last treestump game he was the final mislynch in lylo but I think he actually engaged people's reasons for scumreading him more there naturally. I believe him when he says he would hate to be in this situation again, and as scum, but if it's Egix+him, they kinda have to I think. Egix' play on D1 was so different from his usual townplay, I should've pushed that more.

~Hactac

[Hoptic]

I brought up that he was scummy by meta a couple of times. Maybe I would've pushed that more but I think another player went into death spiral game throwing mode which was just a bit of a distraction. Bit fuzzy on the details.

~Hictic

[Hoptic]

I honestly don't see how Pig's slot coming from any mindset other than 'Hoptic thinks we gamethrew and said they'd blacklist me so let's just troll them instead of winning the game.' It's not possible for anyone who can comprehend written language at a reasonable level to take the argument they did yesterday (irl time) where they completely misinterpreted that phrasing in a way that's impossible to reasonably read it four separate times. At best they're just trying to troll us.

Is there a way to block players because they're not trying to talk to us in good faith, they don't care about any other slots, and the ignorance or malice they're showing after they decided to gamethrow is pissing me off whenever I see them post in the thread.

-Hopk

[Hoptic]

I'm a bit fuzzy in general rn I should probably be getting more sleep

I'm also not convinced I'm ever going to talk myself into voting flip so intent to vote hoptic

Naturally ignoring every fucking post again and not a single player in the thread cares.

@North: can we get a Shrek replacement?

-Hopki

[Hoptic]

I’m gonna

VOTE: Hoptic

Because I don’t see myself ending up anywhere else and I don’t see the game progressing without votes

The game could have progressed if you actually engaged with us in any way by responding to any of the many points we raised rather than just saying 'I think Hoptic is scum so I'm not going to engage with anything they're saying.'

-HopkirkHopkirk

[Hoptic]

Thanks for modding as always, North! And good job, chk and Egix.

~Hectic