Micro 447: Shameless Mafia -- Game Over!

[Aneninen]

As if noone else had done shytty things in the history of MafiaScum.
By the way, calm down there, I'm not a Vig this time.

VOTE: Toon Fighter
All of his posts have been blatantly scummy so far.

[Aneninen]

I hear anen's scumgame is good, though.

Tiershift saw my town-play twice. Why would he have meta-ed my scumgames on Page1, when I had only one single post?

So, someone must have told that to Tiershift.

I've never played with these players before: Toon Fighter, shos, This Christmas, estival.
Alchemist saw my

town

game, he even linked it. (I'm afraid I'll be even title-fairied because of that shytty move lol.)
ArcAngel saw two of my scum games; one of them was very,

very

far from good (Street Racers: London), the other one was fine (Open 573: C9++), but it wasn't good enough for winning the game.
I met Dodgy in Open 583 JK9++. I was scum and our team did a great job indeed.
I was scum in a Newbie too, I did it well, I think, but none of these players were there.

That's four games, two of them are good: one is maybe okay, one is terrible. My scum-meta doesn't show that I'd be a remarkably good player as scum. In addition, I'm neither a famous, nor a particularly significant player at all.

The only player who could have told Tiershift that I was good as scum is Dodgy. The one who has direct meta only on my best scumgame so far.
The only place it could have happened is the scum QT.

Tiershift slipped. This was unfortunate; had that sentence had been posted about a player with more completed games, it would have been much harder to backtrace the information listed above.

Tiershift and Dodgy are scum.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Tiershift

[Aneninen]

Why would anyone have been talking about your scum meta in the scum PT if you're not scum?

Sorry to say, that question made no sense. If I were scum, why would anyone need to talk about my scumplay in the PT?

lol can we lynch dodgy first?

As for this,

22 makes me think you're scum, and know Anene is wrong but you want to use Anen's theory to try and get Dodgy lynched before yourself.
Seriously, if you're not scum you need to give a serious response to Anen's post instead of asking to lynch Dodgy first.

Both of those are possible. Although I still think I was right in 20.

I also think Tiershift's avoiding answering Alchemist's posts and also misrepresents him. Eg. in 37 he posted

"You're avoiding my question. Did you or did you not believe I was admitting to being scum with dodgy?"

– however it was clear that Alchemist didn't believe that I'm right.

Where
Is
Tiershift's
Slip?

20 – this explains it.

yeah so tier is likely scum. (anen why would i talk about your scum meta, i was alive for 1 day in a game in which you were scum and i barely read the rest of the thread? Also note that in that game i read you as scum and jailed you n1)

The part in the brackets is true, I think. You indeed jailed me at Night1; I don't remember your read on me but I assume you wouldn't have jailed me if you had thought that I'd been town.
But, calling Tiershift a likely scum in this situation, without any explanation is scummy.

Hi . Who is familiar with the source material? I've seen every episode :p
Who thinks a massclaim can be helpful to town? Should we try to break this game D1? I support this motion. Carl Gallagher here
Also, Tiershift's wagon seems a bit too big for the size of the game. Will abstain from voting for now because RVS seems over and I don't know where to put my vote for now.

I don't think claiming the roles would help. Either they won't tell us who the scums are or the scums have safe-fakeclaims in their PM.
As for the Tiershift-wagon: read the thread and you'll find the answer. It's not RVS at all.

I used to be against flavourclaiming but as of recently I don't really care for it anymore either way.

Sorry, Tier, because I know that I'm "Regardless of Card"-ing right now. (I scumread everything about you because of that slip, regardless of everything.)
But, this post seems as if you had (have?) given up it.

[Aneninen]

Do you believe I slipped being scum with dodgy? Why are you then not treating dodgy as scum?

Just because a part of his post was true (and a null-tell in itself), I think he's too scum. I wrote that too in 55.

I also think Tiershift's avoiding answering Alchemist's posts and also misrepresents him. Eg. in 37 he posted "You're avoiding my question. Did you or did you not believe I was admitting to being scum with dodgy?" – however it was clear that Alchemist didn't believe that I'm right.

except in 23 and 24 he

does

imply that he's believing your story because of my post.

And he posted eg. in 31 and in 34 that you want to lynch him because you know that he's town. You still asked the thing above in 37.

[Aneninen]

I know your scumgame is good because I saw it nominated for a scummy. I (closely) follow the nominations, as is evidenced by my egopost in that specific thread. That is the reason I knew it; it would be nonsensical to talk with a scumbuddy about every townie's scum meta.

My problem is that I simply can't ignore your 12, and I don't think I'll ever be able to drop the idea that it was a slip. So I examine all of your posts assuming that you're scum.
For example this one. Yes, we were nominated, I was in an excellent team (Wicked and Heartless). It

is

possible that you saw that but if so, you would have mentioned it

right after

my post about your slip.

So, everyone: here's my idea.
I can't imagine anyone as scum but Tiershift and Dodgy. Because of this, I don't think I can do anything useful Today.
So, let's lynch Tiershift. (Eg. Alchemist thinks that my read about the slip is wrong but Tieshift is scum because of his other posts.)

If he flips town, it's clear that my reads were wrong (and I'm really sorry, of course).

But

in this case you may think that I'm scum who has set up a clever mislynch and it would be risky with an unconfirmed-me in the town. (I'm town but I can't proove it.) So, fire away any kind of investigation you have on me at Night1. (Yes, I might have some kind of immunity, eg. Ninja, but because I have no idea about the Setup I can't have immunity against everything. Jailkeeper doesn't work, it would proove nothing, I suppose. Even a town-Vig shot would be useful, I think.)

If he flips scum, there are two players to be investigated: Dodgy and me. (Why me? Even if Tiershift flips scum, I could be his buddy, who tries to get away with a shrewd Day1-bussing.) Hopefully, by Day2 either Dodgy or me will be confirmed in either way.

Of course, regardless of the flip DO NOT CLAIM any PR prematurely; only if you have a sure read on anyone.

Discuss!

I'm adding this prematurely: Tiershift, if you're scum (especially if you're scum with Dodgy) but my read is wrong and there was no slip at all, I'm really, really sorry for spoiling your game. I don't think it's fair to catch a scum merely by sheer luck instead of good scumhunting.

[Aneninen]

Alchemist, here is the explanation you wanted.
In this game (http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=60039), I decided to progress RVS quicker by going along with the obvious gambit, essentially lying up to page 3/4. That turned out very well. I got some reads off it, RVS ended quickly and it was a perfect town win.

I was pretty content with how I played that RVS there and tried to do something as to elicit a reaction from anen. I was under the assumption anen's case would not be followed (as it is pretty ridiculous), so I felt safe to portray myself as 'caught scum', posting throwaway remarks instead of responding, in the hopes of egging anen on and seeing what would happen. From town-him, I'd expect outrage over how I obviously avoided his case. From scum (I don't say scum-him as I don't have meta on that), I'd rather expect a somewhat grumpy response as others laughed at his case (which incidentally is part of the reason I'm townreading you, alchemist).

In the end, it did not turn out this way, as I am being wagoned. I do think my 22 was fruitful, though; I'm reasonably confident in my townread on you and I've found probable scum awkwardly jumping on my wagon. I also feel somewhat happy about the guy with the weed avatar.

As for why I shouldn't be voted for my #22: I could have very, very easily just outright said why I heard anen's scumgame was good. Attracting attention to myself instead has no scum motivation.

Alchemist, will you join me on dodgy? He's quite dodgy.
P-edit: wow that's quite a lot hehe

I know that I'm biased but I can't see why the game you linked and this one are similar.
I simply don't believe that you wanted to reaction-test me either.
I would believe that you acted like an obv-scum. I know this behavior from at least two Agatha Christie novels, where there are too many and too obvious things against the murder – who knows pretty well that his/her case is collapsing sooner or later. Another case is emerging soon instead of the first one. (Of course, because they're Agatha Christie-novels, the murder gets caught in the end, obviously.)

Anen, ask yourself this:
1. How likely is it that I talked with my scumbuddy about a random townie's scum meta pre-game?
If you're having trouble answering this, take a look at a few scum PT's and look what pre-game discussions entail.
2. How likely is it that I regularly check a thread that I proved I subscribed to?

So far whenever I was scum, we discussed our knowledge about the other players.
As for your 2nd question, I don't know the answer. How on Gods' Green Earth would I know that?

@Anen, I've seen scum talk about their own scumplay with each other in a scum PT, but not about the scumplay of the Townies in the game.

Such info might have occoured as a side-info as well. Eg. "I met him once, he was scum, they were good".

But... I'm thinking and...
...yes. What if my idea about the slip was wrong and Tiershift was telling the truth?
And there was a

different kind of talk

in the QT... not about my scumplay, but about my townplay...
between Tiershift and ALCHEMIST?
It's easy to imagine that Alchemist brought up Pick Your Chocolate Power, where I indeed mis-killed MathDino as a N3-Vig. It makes perfect sense to talk about others'

townplay

there!
In 8 Alchemist refers to that game, in 10 Tiershift asks back, the link arrives in 11 (10 minutes later, he says:

"Not sure where the post is."

) and in 12 Tiershift says

"That was one of the most blatant crumbs I've ever seen, lol."

– there was 12 minutes between those posts.
In this case it might have been a coincidence that Tiershift was hanging around in the nomination thread independently.

I also know that I've had a bad reputation for analysing the posting times (basicly, since I arrived to MafiaScum). Okay, let's say, I'm wrong again.

But, who unvotes Tiershift, says that his reasoning seems to be right, and FoS-es Dodgy (whom Tiershift is voting right now)?
Alchemist!

[Aneninen]

Aneninen seems like he's highly paranoid. If he were scum I don't think he would call attention to himself with that kind of gambit of assuming that the scum were speaking of his scum meta in a PT.

Paranoid is one of my middle names, you know. Another one is "VigTheConfTownie". ^_^
Actually I'm paranoid as scum too. So paranoid that once I deathtunnelled Wgeurts and by the end of my post I completely forgot that he was town and I was scum. ^_^
But now I'm town, so you needn't worry.

Some general questions:
1. If you could pick, town or scum?
2. Best scum hunting moment in a finished game?
3. Most dangerous player of either alignment in the player list and why?

1. Town. Much more interesting.
2. Making exciting a game by shooting a conf-townie? ^_^ Okay, here's something else. Realizing that a scum was fake-claiming at L–1 by analysing his parallel online activity.
3. I don't know everyone... if Alchemist is scum he's doing it very well now........

[Aneninen]

Don't ignore my other idea.
By the way, you started to discuss a townie's scumgame on Page1.

And I have f-cking no idea how often you check a subscribed topic, because I use the View your posts page for following everything.

[Aneninen]

As soon as I have time, I'll summarize everything about Tiershift. There are too many things.

[Aneninen]

Or you all can do me a favour. ISO Tiershift and post your opinions.
It's clear that I won't be able to lynch him

alone

so if everyone but me thinks that he's town I'll try to move on. At least for Today.

[Aneninen]

Reading, posting tomorrow. Or at least I hope so. Okay?

[Aneninen]

As I promised, I'm summarizing everything about Tiershift.

(1) I still think his 12 was a slip. There are two possibilities:

(1.1) He's scum with Dodgy, as I posted in 20
(1.2) He's scum with Alchemist, as I posted in 88

Earlier I thought the first version is true. Later I started thinking that the latter one is true, because of his and Alchemist's gameplay.

(2) His instant reaction in 22 was absolutely scummy, just as 30 and 32, 33 and 37. For me it was clear what Alchemist was thinking. There are other scummy posts on those page eg. 56 (assuming that I wasn't treating Dodgy as scum.)

(3) In 54 he seemed to have given it up.

(4) From 60 he started talking about the nomination thread. That

might

be true in itself, but if he were town, he could have brought this topic up instantly!

(5) His explanations in 63 about his previous gameplay could be fabricated and it's easy to imagine a post like this coming from a scum, trying a gambit to save his aß.

(6) Attempts to misrepresent me. Eg. in 94:

"There is no such thing as a possible scumslip; something is either a scumslip, or it isn't."

– I made it clear before that I thought (and think) 12 was a scumslip.

________

I'm pretty much aware of the fact that I can't imagine any possibilities withouht a scum-Tiershift. (I'm not sure whether it is called conf-biasing or tinfoiling or something else.)
I also understand that some of you are scumreading me because of that.
Regardless of your reads on me I don't think I'll ever be able to townread Tiershift in this game.

So, for me it's a kind of "either you or me" situation.
Therefore, if most of you think that I may be right about him, let's lynch Tiershift. If you think I'm a scum deathtunnelling him, lynch me.

By the way, both lynches have utility reasons too. If Tiershift gets lynched and he flips town (I don't think it'll happen but what if I'm an idiot in this game?), I'll be able to move on and start doing something useful. If I get lynched, I'll flip town (yes, you can't be sure about this but this will happen) and two things can happen later. If Tiershift's scum, he still can be caught later (via investigation, confirming townies, interaction, whatever). Maybe together with his partner. If Tiershift's town too, by lynching me the town can get rid of a player whose presence is detrimental.
Either lynch can reveal plenty of things about others too (VCA, interactions, etc.)

[Aneninen]

ArcAngel, your read on me is wrong.

Estival: the problem is that I can't imagine a town-Tiershift here. So, I'm speculating about Tiershift and Dodgy, Tiershift and Alchemist... that'swhy I posted that second part in my 157.

[Aneninen]

Can't answer.
However, it happened before that I had a scumread on someone but lost focus later and let them go – and it turned out that I was right. Remember eg. the TSO/Csareo pair in Masquerade!

And yes, I know that I've deathtunnelled townies more than once as scum in other games. In spite of this I'm going on.

[Aneninen]

I'm actually mad because I wanted to /out of this game but thought playing with you would be severely cool

I'm unsure whether this post was for me but if so, the feeling is mutual. Scumreading someone who's fun to play with spoils the game more or less.........

I know this feeling well. Unfortunately it doesn't always mean your first instinct is always right. I recently had a game offsite where I deathtunneled a player for this same reason of not wanting to lose focus on scum. I never truly gave up my suspicion on him but he turned out to be Town.

Mm-hmm, I know.
But I'll never be able to lynch someone

alone

, so if noone believes me, does it really matter? I mean, on Day1? Sorry if I'm not understandable I'm a bit tired now.

[Aneninen]

I'm reading but I don't have too much to say right now.

[Aneninen]

Reading.
I don't like the general inactivity of certain players.

[Aneninen]

What's the case against Shos? I don't have a scumread on him.

[Aneninen]

What this game has to do with Whomping Willow? Isn't he an alt already?

[Aneninen]

Hi, Druuge!
It has been a long time since we last met ^_^

[Aneninen]

I'm still not feeling the Shos-wagon, especially because of the names on it.

I also don't like that none of the players since ToonFighter's vote has pointed out that it's actually an L–1...

Druuge, have you caught up yet? What are your reads?

[Aneninen]

I don't know, shos seems more like he's busy and not fully invested in the game.

Maybe you're right.

Christmas and droog have been trolling so I'm not a fan of that.

Druuge is just being Druuge lol.

I don't know, shos seems more like he's busy and not fully invested in the game.

I dont think it is just the shos.. Everyone in this game are not invested into the game. This game is stalled completely!!!

You're actually right and I don't like my gameplay as well. I still think TierShift is scum and I don't get that Shos-wagon at all. I ran out of new thoughts long ago, I know.

Could town switch over to one of the trolls?

No.
There are better ideas. Thanks for the alt-slip, by the way.

Also, I'd like to see everyone's reads on Alchemyst.

[Aneninen]

I'm sooooooooo glad that I'm on a vanity wagon right no. (No. Not at all.)

Need I choose between Shos and ToonFighter?

[Aneninen]

I've genuinely LOL-ed now ^_^
Maybe I'll use this in the quote section of my Wiki. (Which is hasn't ready yet. If it weren't for my laziness, you know...)

[Aneninen]

Wellshyt, I think I dislike ToonFighter. Here are the reasons:

– 53: the nameclaim is null in itself, but it's weird, because in 133 he said that he hadn't had time for the game (yet he

had had

time for that claim) and he started reading at that time (136... It's okay if someone doesn't read anything but how could he miss a case which had started on Page1?

– 136: First part: TierShift and I could be scums together. (Lololol...) Next part, this:

"Even if you are correct in your theory, even if you had a 100% guilty read on those players, you'd need much stronger arguments to convince me to vote with you, to block and/or investigate you at night, and to basically follow you everywhere. [...] Anen, do you still believe town should follow everything you suggested here? Has your opinion changed in any point?"

Then finally, ends the post with a vote for me.
It's possible that he's scum with TierShift and wants to make a compromise read on me. But okay, let's forget about TierShift now.
He says that I'd need stronger arguments – but how those things after that (vote with me, block me, investigate me) add up at all? Also, he asks questions, but before getting any answers from me, votes. Whuttafuk?

– 145:

"I voted anen because I didn't like his attitude, acting like he knew the entire game by page 3" – since when has been an attitude-tell an alignment tell? By the way, the last sub-sentence is a kind of discrediting. (I must be wrong because it's only Page3...)

– 146: too defensive. Just check why ThisCristmas voted for him. ^_^

– 160: voting for Dodgy.

" Looking at it again, I think he is the most likely scum in the interaction, joining the TS bandwagon for bad reasons and overall being a dead weight in the game so far."

– at that point my wagon was not moving and Dodgy was the leading wagon.

– 198:

"There are usually 3-4 times more town than scum. And D1, with little information, favors scum a lot more than town. So, probability really"

– everyone knows that. But, posting this might be a "safe ground" for performing a mislynch later.

– 284: unvotes Dodgy because he replaced out. Or because that wagon was not moving...?

– 301: votes for Shos. Yet again, he ends up on the leading wagon!

– 310:

"That is why I was only considering the top wagons."

– oookaaaay but he was doing that all the time, regardless of the time we've left!

– 336: that was simply pigeon poop.


UNVOTE:
VOTE: Toon Fighter

Also,
(1) it's possible that he's scum with TierShift (first TS is "scum with me", next, when those wagons are not moving it's a "town-vs-town") and
(2) I really don't like those names on the Shos-wagon, as I said before.

[Aneninen]

Shyt I've messed up the formatting, sorry!
I've still not fully got used to my glasses. You know, it's weird that I don't have to make additional efforts with my eyes to read the monitor ^_^

[Aneninen]

I've just arrived home and haven't read the latest pages thoroughly but as far as I can see the Tiershift wagon is back, therefore

UNVOTE:
VOTE: TierShift

By the way, I'm Lip.

[Aneninen]

Same thing Aneninen for you, why are you voting TS? Has his recent play changed his mind for you at all?

I still think he slipped on Page1. Unless someone gets a conf-town read on him, I don't think I'll be able to townread him.

[Aneninen]

Need to sleep now. I'll drop by in the morning, just before the Deadline.
Can someone summarize the claims 'till then?

[Aneninen]

One hour left.
As I promised, I've dropped by but I'm already on the TierShift wagon which is L–1. I can do nothing constructive this time, sorry.

[Aneninen]

(1) Both ToonFighter and Shos were at L–1 after VC1.13. (After my 353)

Shos Wagon: Alchemist21, TierShift, This Christmas, Toon Fighter
ToonFighter wagon: shos, estival, ArcAngel9, Aneninen

(2) The sequence of events from that point.
– Estival unvoted. (Estival is confirmed townie)
– ArcAngel unvoted.
– Estival re-opened the TierShift wagon.
– VC1.14: Shos at L–1 (unchanged), ToonFighter with 2 votes, TierShift with 1 vote. The VC said

less than 12 hours

.
– ToonFighter voted for Aneninen. (Estival voted for TierShift but she had already been voting for TierShift at that time.)
– ThisChristmas votes for ToonFighter. (Both Shos and ToonFighter are at L–2, 3–3 votes.)
– ToonFighter votes for TierShift.
– Aneninen votes for TierShift.
– Estival unvotes.
– ThisCristmas votes for TierShift.
– Druuge votes for ToonFighter but he votes for TierShift in his next post. TierShift is at L–1.
– Day ends.

Conclusion #1. Estival's vote moving seems as if he'd been trying to sabotage the Lynch. Assuming that a NoLynch is bad for the town, it was very scummy – yet he was Nightkilled!

He must have done or said something which was detrimental to the scums!

(3) Between VC1.14 and VC1.16 (final), so, in the last 12 hours the following players were here:
– ArcAngel, ThisChristmas, Estival, Shos, ToonFighter, Alchemist, Druuge, Aneninen
(In the order of appearance; last post closest the Deadline comes Last.)
corresponding TimeTags are

Mar 06, 2015 11:27 pm

and

Mar 07, 2015 11:09 am

; CET

– before ToonFighter's vote for Aneninen (386) the Shos-wagon was L–1.
Conclusion#2: if Shos's scum, ToonFighter derailed his wagon. Although he could have done so earlier too.


(4) All-around site activity of players getting close to Deadline (only the fact that they were posting somewhere, without mentioning anything about the certain posts, games or whatever) – we get no new info here. Everyone'd been active in this thread for the last time before the Deadline.

Conclusion#3: I can see no players directly sabotaging the Lynch, it could have been an unfortunate coincidence as well.

[Aneninen]

@Anen: I can see scum trying to kill estival because he claimed Ian, and they thought he might be a power role. Related to that...

Who suggested it and where? I don't remember.

[Aneninen]

I bet there will be no TierShift wagon now...

ToonFighter: I've never watched Shameless "thoroughly" but I've seen some episodes, so the story isn't a "complete one" in my mind. (I usually watch series while doing housework, playing Mafia, etc. you know.)

So, I'm examining Estival's reads now. (In order of appearance.)

TierShift kind of lean scum but town later.
Votes for This Christmas, 233.
Townreading Shos, 230.
Disliking This Christmas and Druuge because of trolling.
Voting for ToonFighter, 335, because he didn't read Shos's claim.
Unvotes in 359.
Scumreading TierShift in Aneninen, voting for Tiershift in 374.
Saying that This Christmas slipped, in 405.
Townreading ToonFighter and ArcAngel in 415. Lean town on Shos (419).
Saying that he wants to lynch Druuge in 433

________

These players may have gained something by silencing her: This Christmas, Druuge, TierShift, (Aneninen)
These players may have lost something by silencing her: ArcAngel, ToonFighter, (Shos)
No read on: Alchemist
(Less significant-looking names in brackets.)

Is there anyone else who thinks ThisChristmas slipped?

[Aneninen]

Estival posted that. I want to know whether anyone else thinks the same thing.

[Aneninen]

I've already told that I'm Lip.

(I haven't read the recent posts; I've just only spotted this above.)

[Aneninen]

Everyone,

I think the whole Character claiming is pigeon poop. We're not getting anywhere by this.
I'm explaining it now.

(1) scums may have a fake-claim. (Eg. if I were scum, it would be possible that my role PM would say something like "you know that Lip is not around at all".)
(2) being a Gallagher means nothing. There could be a scum-flavour for everyone. (Eg in my case, something like "recently you've realized that it's your family that holds you back and you're clever enough to get rid of them one by one.)
(3) there's NO direct correlation between PRs and names. (Eg. I could be a JOAT, "being able to find evidences (Cop), use xxxx-skills to my advantage (Tracker, Watcher), anything... or I could be a VT because "you've just arrived home and you know very little about the recent events, soooo...")

See?
I've just explained that because of having a role I could be any alignment, I could have any PRs.

Stop this and start scumhunting.

________

Post-edit
I'll respond everything else too but I'm off becuase I'm Lip. No, because I have to work IRL. ^_^

[Aneninen]

*because of having a name
(Shyt.)

[Aneninen]

TierShift, 534 – are you fence-sitting here, as for your Shos read? Also, you wrote this:

Everyone, even a tunneller, can evaluate other stuff. Anen obviously doesn't want to.

I don't regard him very highly as a player

, but based on previous games, I'd expect him to be able to evaluate a bit more objectively.

– aaand you posted on Page1

"I hear anen's scumgame is good, though."

... sooooo, putting these two things together it means... you know that I'm town. Because of...
By the way, you disliked my Day1 post about ToonFighter. You think that I'm tunnelling you. In fact I haven't tunnelled you for a while and anyone can see this in my ISO.

And Aneninen have been continuously avoiding sharing his name.. This one needs to die today

vote: Aneninen

What sort of pigeon poop was that? What have I been avoiding?! I've already posted that I'm Lip twice or three times or so! What the f-ck do you want? Name my Night1 Target, abilities, etc? Nnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnot happening.

half the group doesnt want to claim
why anen

Also, THAT!

out of everyone Anen reaction is been most scummy.. disagreeing someone point of view is okay but he slightly insulting it means its affecting him more than others and moreover I have been read him as scum anywayz!!!

Wait-oh, you've just contradicted yourself!

Ian is not scum
I don't think Carl is scum
I don't think Frank is scum
I don't think Fiona is scum
I don't think Debbie is scum

and other characters may be scum or fake claims

.. I am going by this point.

mickey and jimmy could be possible scum claims..

Lip i think could be scum claim too.. i thinking this through Mods perspective because that's what i do if i made this setup

(at least give 1 Gallagher for scum to claim)

And ANOTHER contradiction!

Shos, You need to be in my shoes to understand my point of view. You may continue to babble from your end but it is not helping to me. I told you this before. .I get your point. And I think anen is scum not becuz of his claim but because of his behavior and postings. If Anen claimed as frank, I would have given a second thought of lynching him. So try thinking from my point of view

And AGAIN!

That's enough outta you!

VOTE: ArcAngel9

[Aneninen]

Why don't you believe in your slip story anymore?

I still think you slipped.
The problem is that I was unable to convince others about it.
I explained my reads on ArcAngel so it's not a hop.
Shos, if you've meant me in your latest post: your read on me has changed quite quickly, hasn't it?

[Aneninen]

Now I think I have too many scumreads. I have to get rid some of them.

[Aneninen]

(1) I didn't like Alchemist's vote.
(2) I didn't like This Christmas jumped on both wagons.
(3) There's one thing which suggests me that Shos is not scum. I'd be dead by now.
(4) I didn't like ArcAngel's claim, more precisely the lack of it.
(5) Especially since ArcAngel was the one who wanted all of us to name-claim and she told her name

after

ours.
(6) Needless to say, I don't like TierShift at all. (That means the fact that I still think he slipped, not the player of course.)

[Aneninen]

(3) There's one thing which suggests me that Shos is not scum. I'd be dead by now.

I don't get this. Please explain.

I cany believe Lip jusy claimed. Holy fuck

Lip is pronably some kind of joat; wanna bet he dies/os blpcked?

This.
He wouldn't have let me live.

[Aneninen]

Tiershift,

I've explained a couple of times that I stopped pushing you because noone seemed to have agreed with me about the slip you made.

On Day1 everyone suggested me stopping talking about the slip and starting to get other reads. I've been doing so since the late-phase of Day1. I've been called scum because of my case against ToonFighter. I've been called scum because of joining the ArcAngel wagon – no matter that I posted the SAME about his name-claim push as Alchemist and TierShift.
It seems that I'm scummy regardless of my posts and actions. What's that? A collective Regardless Of Card?

Post-edit: I haven't read Alchemist's recent post.

[Aneninen]

Tiershift,
the only player who knows for

sure

whether it was a slip or not is YOU. I can only guess and there's

always

a chance that I'm wrong. If you're scum, there'll be other things against you, sooner or later.

By the way, here's a little tell.
Your logical fallacy in 645 is: Loaded Question (and also False Dilemma). I'm voting for ArcAngel because of the reasons I explained, not because of joining the biggest wagon. As for the slip, see above in this post. You tried to explain that there are only TWO possible behaviour in my situation which is also wrong.

[Aneninen]

so you're saying that my slip wasn't, in fact, a slip.

A blatant misrepresenting.
I think it was a slip =/= I'm 100% sure that it was a slip.
I'm not 100% sure that it was a slip =/= I don't think it was a slip.

I wasn't saying

why

you were joining the biggest wagons, just that you were doing so. You are in fact ignoring me and voting the biggest wagons. It's a fact, with nothing to change about it. That is not what a false dilemma is.

Another misrepresenting. Eg. I've never been on the Shos-wagon.
I've posted it many times that I'm not ignoring you; I'm trying to find the other scum, or the scums if I'm wrong about your slip.

The fact that you want to remove me from the game makes me think that you're scum

Regardless of the slip topic

.

[Aneninen]

@Anen, I do feel I need to point this out though. The only way what Tier said was a slip is if he's scum with the Dodgy/Droog slot. You're considering AA9 and TF scum possibilities, so you already have some belief that you could be wrong. I need you to take a step back, clear your head, and ask yourself if you can still keep pushing your point against TierShift knowing that the slip only makes sense in a highly specific situation. Remember how I deathtunnled Siv in our last game together? I feel like you're doing the same thing to TierShift, and it could potentially be just as damaging to the Town.

lol can we lynch dodgy first?

THIS

is why I've always been unsure whether it was a slip or not.
What if it

wasn'

but TierShift is scum? In that case, his partner can be anyone... but right now, I can see two possibilities.

[Aneninen]

No.
Check my Day1, there are many things about him. A brief summary can be found in 157.

[Aneninen]

Give Druuge time and he'll solve the game. Unless he's scum because in that case we're f-cked. ^_^

[Aneninen]

Mobilpost. I'm on my way to a birthday party of a friend of mine. If ArcAngel flips town Tiershift and Alchemist are scum.
Partly because of the hammervote partly because it happened after druuges case. And I had this idea before.

Of course if ArcAngel flips scum ignore that part above.

Why must everyone finish a Day when Im fcking not here lol

[Aneninen]

Hundebaum.

[Aneninen]

Before anyone does anything, keep in mind that it's most probably a MyLo right now.

[Aneninen]

Community decision is needed.
Must I claim first?
TierShift, you're not the player in this game whose orders I want to follow. You must understand it.

[Aneninen]

Okay.
I'm 1-shot Commuter, because "you can attend classes at university". (That was a short paraphrase.)
I won't tell whether I've already used my ability or not.

That's all.
Now I'm off to work. Later.

[Aneninen]

Mod: I'm no LA for a couple of days, sunday tops.

My posts may be infrequent and short.

Reasons: (1) plenty of IRL things to do and catch-up with and (2) making my Setups compatible for the competition is a priority (it has a Deadline too).

Sorry, everyone!

Noted. ~insanity

[Aneninen]

I'm a voyeur. I've targeted shos both night one and night two. He was blocked for both of those nights. Nothing else happened to him.

Shos is confirmed town, by virtue of that.

That doesn't confirm anything. These are also possible:
(1) TierShift is Mafia Goon and his partner is a Roleblocker, blocking Shos twice.
(2) Both TierShift and Shos are scum (with any PRs) and they're both faking.

So, I could check if anen's claim is true, I think? Let me check the wiki. If he hasn't used his shot, at least.

No, you can't. You could see if anyone targets me but that's all.

There's something that I don't like.
If all claims are real, it'd mean that the town has (1) a 1–shot Tracker (confirmed), (2) a Voyeur, (3) a Gunsmith and (4) a 1–shot Commuter. The scums have in this case a Roleblocker.
Wouldn't it be a bit unbalanced?

Something is not right here.

Why do we have a Gunsmith instead of a Cop?
A Voyeur can confirm the action of the 1–shot Tracker or the Gunsmith, but that's all.

Either TierShift or Shos is lying. Aren't both of them telling that we should choose lynching Today instead of NoLynch?

Also, has anyone examined whether ArcAngel hinted her Tracking?
I guess (according to her posts)
She didn't track ToonFighter, Aneninen, Shos (?), Alchemist.
She definitely didn't have a positive result.
It's possible that she didn't use her ability at all.

[Aneninen]

I'm unsure.
If we don't lynch, there won't be a mislynch, will there? Shos (if he's telling the truth) will be blocked again, most probably. Unless he gets killed.
On the other hand, the lynch pool won't get narrowed. TierShift or Shos (or maybe me?) gets killed – but that won't confirm that the other one's scum. Or they kill someone else so as to create a WIFOM. Or they don't kill anyone.

Maybe we should examine the gameplay of all of the PR-claimed players, whether the gameplay has been consistent with the claimed PR. Before someone points it out I'm telling that I made a single, but intentional "contradition" to my PR yesterday. If anyone finds that and asks about it I'll explain it.

________

Post-edit: Shos was blocked twice. Scums must have a Roleblocker. If town had a Roleblocker it would be WAY unbalanced. 5 PRs for the town? I can't imagine any PR combination which could compensate that in a Micro.

Also, I can't see why it is proven that either or both of you are not lying.

[Aneninen]

Voyeur can confirm you by you commuting and him failing to get a result.

I haven't read anything else since my last post but you may right.

Mod: is that true?

After all, TierShift doesn't know whether I still have my ability or whether I'm commuting Tonight...

[Aneninen]

By the way, I'm on LA because I'm in

x

games and I can't promise that I'll be able to read all of these

x

games until next week.

[Aneninen]

shosgunsmith, Mickey
TFVT, Carl
TCVT, Jimmy
AnenCommuter, Lip
AlchemistVT, Sheila
TierShiftDebbie

Dead:
Fiona, 1-shot Tracker (AA9)
Ian, VT (estival)
Veronica, VT (droog)

Hasn't TierShift claimed Voyeur?

(Mind that I'm still on LA)

[Aneninen]

Well.
investigation shows that by mi soopir sikrit tell, Aneninen is actually scum.
..which means I'm going to have to go through ALL his games to make sure I'm correct.

WTF?!?
I'm not scum.

[Aneninen]

No. I simply don't understand it at all.

[Aneninen]

One mislynch would be enough for you, Tiershift, wouldn't it?

[Aneninen]

Handypost. Ich erzähle später warum Tier ein Scum ist.

[Aneninen]

Shiiiiiiiiiit!
I'll explain later my case against Tiershift. It's not the slip now. I'm from mobile and sorry I know I'm close to a warning now.

[Aneninen]

I've been trying to read the game meanwhile, but it's clear that I've missed quite a lot of things.

Can someone summarize the questions adressed to me?

[Aneninen]

Even if I'm from mobile, your post has been a blatant an intentional misrepresentation. Check my last post, everyone!

[Aneninen]

So...In like 10 of anen's most recent games, he posted a picture of a pidgeon if and only if he was town. he didn't this game.
but it seems that there is at least one game in anen's meta from far longer ago in which he was scum and posted that picture.
this sucks.

The pigeon is not an alignment tell. You can check my previous games (they're on my Wiki too), I post pigeons regardless of my alignment.
In this game, I started focusing on TierShift very early, and I simply forgot about the pigeon. Also, I've never suspected that anyone would ever try to figure out anything out of the pigeons, or the lack of them.
By the way, I'm alive in many games now. Why on Gods' Green Earth would I even try to keep in mind my fluff-posts?

The other answers are coming soon.

[Aneninen]

As for ThisChistmas.

Plenty of nulls, for a long time. Maybe that Toon-vote is a null too? (140 and around).
Promises a change in 167 but nothing really happens.
The Shos-vote in 232 is without any reasons.
The ToonFighter vote in 395 is similar. Just as 431 for TierShift. And Alchemist in 600... (Need I go on with this vote-analysis?)
Dodged Estival's question in 407.
633 is a "readlist". Yet again, no content with it.
Having read 756 again, I don't understand the question. (Shos was the one who talked about getting roleblocked first.)
760's

"anyways whats my fate for today?"

is another post which makes no sense.
Also, 801's

"I don't know what the plan is. But scum are in total control. They are earning this win. I'm not doing enough. End of"

– ???!
867 – and now he has internet problems. He was shopping before. And being busy IRL before that. Isn't it weird?

Summary.
Surprisingly very little content. Basicly nothing town-ish. The only problem is that I've seen such useless townies before, just as lurkscums. If it weren't for our bad situation I'd join this wagon (if we still didn't lynch TierShift) but now I don't know what to think.

[Aneninen]

As for Tiershift.

(1) He acts as if there had been only the Page1 slip about him. He's been posting many times things like

"either you think it was a slip or not and if not, you have nothing against me"

. This, in this form hasn't been true for a long time.

(2) He keeps misrepresenting me, I pointed out it eg. in my last post.

(3) As I explained a couple of days ago, he can be scum with our without Shos.

(4) He launches a Setup speculation. Scums usually do that.

(5) Despite he said many times that I was scumhunting by finding the team before getting a scumflip, he's been doing the same with ThisChristmas and me.

(6) His style. I saw that in a game where he was scum. He's much more "grumpy", eg. suggesting ThisChristmas to replace out.

I know that I could have written more about this but (1) I'm tired IRL and (2) I'm a bit frustrated because it seems that noone takes my case against TierShift too seriously.

[Aneninen]

I don't have time to respond everything now, but I must point this out: the scums are lining up so as to get me lynched.

Everyone, who's town: assume for a short while at least that I'm town and check who thinks that I'm scum. Check their ISOs next. The scums are there.

(And I'm pretty sure that TierShift is one of them.)

Remember: it's almost sure that they're only ONE single mislynch from winning.

[Aneninen]

From Friday I have more time and I'll be able to catch up with this game.

[Aneninen]

You'd lose your money, ToonFighter because I'm not scum.
Scums need a viable mislynch and it seems that they've found it in me.

Posting more soon.

[Aneninen]

Also, what is your current opinion on Toonfighter?

It'll turn out as I catch up with the game.
Since it's a MyLo I'm sure at least one scum is pushing my wagon hard, maybe both.

(1) He acts as if there had been only the Page1 slip about him. He's been posting many times things like

"either you think it was a slip or not and if not, you have nothing against me"

. This, in this form hasn't been true for a long time.

I cannot remember doing this. I also can't remember you putting up any sort of other case earlier. Only if both these things are true, it's a valid point. I need quotes.

94, 224, 645, 651

(2) He keeps misrepresenting me, I pointed out it eg. in my last post.

This is bullshit. You said you missed a lot of things and I took that as not being caught up, which it IS.

...and the things I responded to had been read. Yet another misrepresentation from you.

Actually, I could go on with that post but I point out the style instead. He's over-explaining everything, reacting everything and scums are much more likely to be that cautious (to do so).

Any more shyt you wanna throw up against me?

And that's another style-element I remember being done by scum-Tiershift.

In general

, he's very far from getting lynched – eg. I'm much closer to that point. Yet his gameplay is full of longing for survival.

anen, what is you opinion about TS's claim? Does that make him more or less scum in your POV?

Null in itself. Although, it may be easily faked by a scum.

I have no idea what shos claimed but the surprise surprise I've been blocked makes me want to vote him

first post on D2.
close one, TS. close one.

vote: Tiershift

And I've completely forgotten about that one.
Frankly, need we doubt that TierShift is scum?

Shos, that was my crumb. Really?

I don't know how that could have been a crumb. 934 is pigeon poop as explanation.

But basically. I ROCK AS SCUM
AM I ROCKING? NO

Actually, yes, you rock. There are still more players scumreading me than scumreading you. Your long post about crumbing means nothing.

TS <3
we should be scum together sometime
or HYDRA OMFG
but until then
FFS I guess you're town :/

Oh well WTF?!

(To tell the truth, I've just checked it and the Day1 VCA either refutes the possibility of a TierShift/Shos team or I've missed something important there.)

Why I think anen is a good lynch? Well, the fact that both shos and TS are supporting it, that the claim does not work well in the setup after my analysis this afternoon, my previous scum read on him came back, and, damn, am i not allowed to change my views? Also, have you looked at the way anen reacted to the (building of interest in the) wagon? It raised some scum-radar hairs in the back of my head. Mostly that.

I'd rather support a popular lynch that I actually believe might be scum than a player where I am not so sure and has no popular force behind.

????????

Anen, gimme a scum gaMe of yours where you fakeclaimed please, will ya

No such thing. (Apart from Street Racers: London, but that was not a real fake-claim. By that claim I had f-cked up the game and I wanted to generate as much WIFOM as possible.)

Has anen claimed yet if he used the commute already?

No.

________

In general, I've been thinking a lot why I find it hard to defend myself. Then I realized that the whole case against me is... not organic at all.
Logically, Shos can only be scum with TierShift but ToonFighter's push may also be a "going for the easy lynch".
If so, the other scum is townreading me, hoping that there will be another player joining the case against me. Or hoping that there will be a panic-wagon as the Deadline gets closer... if so, This Christmas just started shadowing my wagon a couple of posts ago...

[Aneninen]

I have been thinking.

As a townie, I'm not lying. So, I'm telling the truth, even if noone will believe me.

Put it in this way. I posted about his slip on Page1. What if I've been wrong about his slip? If so, there are two possiblities. Either he's town or he's scum. I think if he were town, the whole "slip-case" would have died out by now. However, if he's scum, he's been in a terrible situation all the time.
Or at least, according to my experience one of the worst thing to defend myself against as scum is a "non-existent case". I mean, I always had problems when someone posted a case against me which was based upon totally wrong things. There's something which strengthens this: TierShift has always been over-defensive, even in game phases where there was no general FoS on him at all.

But, I don't think this lynch would happen Today. If I've failed to push his wagon to lynch so far, I'll be failing it later too.

As far as I noticed, Shos and ToonFighter are scumreading me, ThisChristmas is unsure, but I strongly think he'd vote for me if my wagon gained momentum. I'd say that the other scum might be here...
...but, I've seen it a lot of times that scums tend to townread generally wagoned townies so as to get some town credit.
The question is: would it be useful from a scum at MyLo? Maybe yes, if their partner is in danger. But who's in danger? Apart from me, TierShift. Or is there anyone else?

Would it be bad if we went for a No Lynch Today?

________

Post-edit: well, well, that's an observation, Alchemyst.

[Aneninen]

Anen, is there a reason you failed to answer the question about whether you commuted yet?
This is what I meant by your posts being deliberately obtuse

I've already answered that question.

No.

[Aneninen]

What do You think of a no lynch today???? Since you're asking others the same Q

I can imagine much more than two players as scum. That'swhy.

[Aneninen]

btw I'm okay with a No Lynch as shos is being a poopyhead.

So, a No Lynch is okay as soon as you get voted...

VOTE: TierShift

(And I'm really, really sorry if I'm misreading this whole game and acting like a real aßhole all the time. Especially because I'm doing this to a player who I think it's fun to play with.)

[Aneninen]

Hey if either you or TF is wanting to hammer, please wait. I'm going to give you a nice long and detailed post how I got to anen and alch scum and why they're scum apart from the sole fact they're voting me. I'll also show you that I'm not scum.
Maybe it may even pull shos's head out of his ass, but that's not even what I'm hoping for at this point.

I'm not scum. Even if I can't proove it.

[Aneninen]

You know, I can easily imagine an Alchemist/TierShift team. Or a ToonFighter/TierShift team. Or a ThisChristmas/TierShift team. Or a Shos/TierShift team. I can even imagine that there are two TierShifts in this game and both of them are scum. ^_^

And you needn't point it out that I s-ck in this game. I should have replaced out on Day1 because I do more harm than good, even if I'm right about TierShift.

[Aneninen]

Neither ToonFighter nor ThisChristmas hammered. This means, no scum team is possible without TierShift and with one of them.
Shos may be scum only if TierShift is scum too.

TierShift named the only possible scumteam which would be possible

not

including him. Isn't it strange?

By the way... Alchemist could have waited with his vote until someone votes for TierShift so as to hammer him. I could have waited with my vote too.

Also, TierShift, being in trouble tends to "reconstruct the past" by posting things like this: 63 or this: 956. The latter one came as an answer for Shos's 929.

[Aneninen]

Do you need a quick mislynch, ToonFighter?

[Aneninen]

Quickpost because I'm off.

ToonFighter is either a townie misreading the whole game or the other scum.

[Aneninen]

I have been working all day, check my site-activity.
Getting here soon.

[Aneninen]

Basicly nothing has happened Today so far.
Alchemist, what need I post?
Apart from voting No Lynch I have no other ideas.

I was right about TierShift but apart from that anyone of you could be scum. I don't think I'm a confirmed townie so I'm neither better nor worse Nightkill as anyone else.

[Aneninen]

VOTE: No Lynch

=====[]

[Aneninen]

The most important thing:

No votes until we've talked out everything

!

[Aneninen]

Give me some time and I'll ISO both of you, okay?

[Aneninen]

Meanwhile, try to summarize your cases against each other. (It seems that neither of you think that I'm the scum. This is a correct observation. But if you have a case against me, summarize that too.)
I'll collect everything about you two as well.

I think it'd be the best if I vote first. After all I'm not cleared and if I vote first I can't derphammer any of you.

[Aneninen]

First aspect. Let's see the VCAs!

Day1

(1) Alchemist joined the TierShift wagon instantly.
(2) But, he left it (for an Unvote) shortly after Dodgy joined it.
(3) Meanwhile ToonFighter wasn't voting, and later he started voting for me.
(4) ToonFighter joined the Dodgy-wagon.
(5) Alchemist started the Shos-wagon.
(6) At 1.8 both TierShift and Alchemist voted for Shos.
(7) ToonFighter joined the Shos-wagon to put him at L–1. (1.12)
(8) ToonFighter re-launched the TierShift wagon. (1.15)
(9) The wagon didn't reach lynch. Alchemist wasn't there. (After his last Day1 post he wasn't active on the site. So, we don't know whether he'd hammer TierShift.)

(1) and (2) : maybe a scumtell for Alchemist.
The fact that the Shos-wagon gained momentum as a counter for TierShift is another point against Alchemist. (5)
(6) could be either very dumb or very desperate from the scumteam if Alchemist is scum.
(7) may have come from a scum-ToonFighter.
(8) strongly suggests that ToonFighter is town. He could have pushed any other wagon but TierShift. (Okay, we can't rule out Day1 bussing entirely, but in a 7:2 Closed Setup it's very, very risky!)

________

Day2

(9) ToonFighter instantly voted for me.
(10) Alchemist voted for Druuge in (2.2) (that's the Dodgy-slot)
(11) ToonFighter appeared on the ArcAngel wagon.
(12) Alchemist joined the ArcAngel wagon and put it at L–1. The hammer came from TierShift after a long time.

This day is not too informative. According to these votes both of them could be scum.

________

Day3

(13) Nothing happened for a long time. Before 3.12 the only vote was TierShift's one on me.
(14) Alchemist started the ThisChristmas wagon.
(15) Then he joined the TierShift wagon.
(16) ToonFighter joined the Aneninen wagon (3.16)
(17) TierShift got lynched. ToonFighter was away from the wagon.

(13) is null, because we were afraid of voting.
(15) might have been bussing but might have been a genuine vote as well.
(16) is strange: it's not too likely that both scums were voting for me at that time. (If one scum is away, he/she can derphammer at L–1.)
However, (17) is against ToonFighter.

As for Day4, although Alchemist was for NoLynch, he never voted for NoLynch. (I don't know whether it is informative or not.)

________

Summary.
As for the VCA, Alchemist looks scummier, especially because of Day1. On the other hand, it doesn't clear ToonFighter at all.

I'll examine the interactions next.

[Aneninen]

Second aspect. Interactions.

Alchemist

(1) 28, 31 and some nearby posts – these seem to be genuine reads on TierShift. Although, a scum could have faked those too.

(2) 74 and the whole interaction with TierShift, on the other hand, might have been a "let's talk to him so as to clear him" thing. Also, the delay could be explained too. If a quicklynch had happened, he wouldn't have resisted. But in this case...

(3) In 96 he answered my idea about the TierShift/Alchemist scumteam... but only in correlation with the slip.

(4) In 180 he soft-defended TierShift while pushed the Shos-wagon. !!! 183 was soft-defence too.

(5) Was pushing Shos more in 319. In 327 pushed Shos and soft-defended TierShift at the same time.

(6) 479

"I actually kinda agree with you about the TS wagon. It makes sense scum would try to push a wagon on a v/la player since they wouldn't be around to defend themselves. I need to look back at those votes."

– !!!

(7) 496 – scumreading Druuge and ThisChristmas for being on the TierShift wagon... but, there was no TierShift flip at that time... It seems that he was exploiting the situation that TierShift was on LA...

(8) 402/407 – avoiding Druuge's scumreads... oh wait, Druuge was killed soon...

(9) 642 – Readlist. Shos, Tiershift and me are on the town-side. It's not only the soft-defence on Tiershift. There's this:

"Shos is a Townread of mine now, partly because of his gunsmith claim"

– hmm-hmm... didn't Shos mention on Day1 that he had a PR? In spite of that, Alchemist ended Day1 voting for Shos...

(10) A typical Alchemist-post about TierShift and me:

@Anen, I do feel I need to point this out though. The only way what Tier said was a slip is if he's scum with the Dodgy/Droog slot. You're considering AA9 and TF scum possibilities, so you already have some belief that you could be wrong. I need you to take a step back, clear your head, and ask yourself if you can still keep pushing your point against TierShift knowing that the slip only makes sense in a highly specific situation. Remember how I deathtunnled Siv in our last game together? I feel like you're doing the same thing to TierShift, and it could potentially be just as damaging to the Town.

It seems that he wanted me to get rid of my TierShift-read all the time!

(11) 782 Again, Shos, TierShift and me are town. This Christmas is scum because of being on the TierShift wagon. ...

(12) 866 Preparing a ThisChristmas mislynch?

"So far today, everyone with the exception of Anen has named TC as a scumread."

...and we were at MyLo at that time...

(13) 896 and nearby posts. He was changing his reads on me... at that time, as far as I can remember, ThisChristmas and me were the possible wagons. Was he preparing to be on either of them?

(14) 909 – More defence on TierShift. Trying to get me scumread ToonFighter or ThisChristmas. It happens later too, eg. 1008.

(15) Naked vote for TierShift in 1046. Explanation comes in 1078, 6 hours later. It's very strange that a single LINE from my posts was enough for him to change his TierShift reads, after my whole gameplay HAD NOT changed it!

________

Summary.
He was soft-defending and not-so-soft-defending TierShift all the time, except for the very early Day1. He jumped on him when it was rather sure that TierShift was getting lynched. His reasons were awkward. Meanwhile, he was preparing counter-wagons and counter-cases. First Shos, then Druuge and ArcAngel, and at MyLo, ThisChristmas and ToonFighter. I think he was buddy-ing Shos and me.

I'll check ToonFighter's ISO too

, but his gameplay looks very scummy and makes perfect sense as TierShift's partner.

[Aneninen]

It's late here, ToonFighter's ISO will come tomorrow. Until then, do not vote!

[Aneninen]

Okay, it's time to examine ToonFighter.

(1) 53 is strange. Name-claiming (also admitting being familiar with Shameless, though) and telling that the TierShift wagon is too big. I don't know what to think. This might have come from a townie or from a scum too.

(2) Starts scumreading me in 136. In the first part of the post he says that both TierShift and I are scums, but later he says (in the same post) that TierShift is much less scummy. This could have come from a TierShift-partner.

(3) Moves to Dodgy in 160. If he's scum he may have tried to move a counterwagon here...?

(4) Nulls and voting for Shos in 301. Maybe null.

(5) These! 310

"There would be no point in voting for a short wagon so close to deadline. That is why I was only considering the top wagons."

then 333

"Can we just lynch shos?"

and finally, 336

"I hadn't noticed the claim. Still, it doesn't make him $100% confirmed town"

– are definitely scummy!

(6) 386 Now he's not confident about scumreading Shos (because of his claim), and votes for me again:

"Looking at your claim, I don't feel comfortable lynching you anymore. I think you are telling the truth. However, TS is not here and can't claim, I don't want to vote myself and it's very late for starting a new wagon. I'll try that though. I prefer NL than lynching you, but Anen is my other option."

. He may have tried to sabotage the Day, but...

(7) 418

"Bah. I see Anen isn't happening. unvote, vote: TS (better than lynching shos, I think TS might be town, but it's better to lynch him rather than shos)"

– THAT wouldn't have made any sense if he were TierShift's partner! No real scumread on TierShift, so he wouldn't have earned a lot of town-credit if TierShift had been lynched. Also, he wouldn't have blamed more than anyone else if he had just stayed on my wagon!

(8) Quickvote for Shos because he's alive (459) than back to me (461). Even if he was wrong about me, what if he was genuinely misreading me? (By the way, he was answering my questions eg. 478, 488... might be a mild towntell?)

(9) Moving to ArcAngel in 509. Could be genuine, after all I too thought that she was scum.

(10) Also a note: at 719 everyone had claimed but TierShift (who only mentioned "having a PR") and ...Alchemist! It's obvious that it's worth for the scums waiting for the others to claim. So as to adjust their own fake-PRs to the existing ones.

(11) Naming ThisChristmas and Alchemist as a scumpair in 771.

(12) 820 – what was that reasoning?

"So, even assuming TS is lying, our lynchpool for today should be in [Alch/TC], as one of them must be his partner."

Hmmm-hmmm...!

(13) Also, 891

"TS is in a very bad light here. Wouldn't be upset if the wagon went down on him."

(at that point TierShift was going down, as far as I can remember.) Yet another post which may have come from the TierShift-partner.

(14) 916 – now his scumread on me is back. (Even if it hadn't appeared before this post for a long time...) Why exactly? Maybe this: 968, which is Setup speculation. May or may not have come from a townie.

(15) 976 It's my intuition but this post is a towntell.

"Anen, where the f-ck are you? If you don't post in 24 hours, I'll assume a scum claim and vote you"

– I can see a frustrated townie behind it.

(16) 998 Now he's talking about an Aneninen-Alchemist scumteam.

(17) 1093

"If I wanted a quick mislynch, I would have hammered TS"

– at that point that would have been very dumb from a scum-partner. TierShift was the most likely lynch, as far as I can remember...

(18) Moving to Aneninen in 1101, then to Alchemist in 1129. I don't know what to think. Maybe because of the Deadline. Maybe because of derailing the TierShift-wagon.

(Side-note. The latter might have been too risky if he were scum. TierShift gave instructions to his partner at Twilight. If scums had a Daychat, he needn't have done so. Does this mean anything? Maybe ToonFighter was trying to build a counterwagon but he couldn't talk to TierShift about it. Maybe he was about to achieve a lynch instead of a ...No Lynch, which he mentioned before???)

(19) Later, he went for No Lynch, just as most of us. In his last post he said that Alchemist looks scummier.

________

Summary.
I can easily imagine a scum here. There are plenty of things pointing towards being ToonFighter TierShift's buddy. The most important thing is the fact that he didn't scumread him at all before the flip. His scumread on me might have been a chainsaw.
But, certain points are contradicting this. The most important thing is his Day1 vote on TierShift. Also, he never scumread TierShift, but there are no strong signs of defending him.

Right now I think Alchemist is the scum.
Post whatever you think you need to. Unless my opinion changes, I'll vote for Alchemist.

[Aneninen]

According to the time stamps, you're telling the truth: you were typing meanwhile.

I'll read your post tomorrow because now I'm exhausted.

[Aneninen]

I've read your post, Alchemist.
And now I'm waiting for ToonFighter.

[Aneninen]

Will read more of the game tomorrow and do both ISO's but this votecounts (and pages 16-19 leading to them) knowing all the flips we know by know are the smoking guns for me.

Okay.

[Aneninen]

@Anen, now you have no excuse, this is literally the final game day, have you or have you not commuted by now? When and why?

I commuted at Night3. At that point there were 5 players alive. If the remaining scum had tried to kill me, Day4 would have started with 5 players and we could have an extra chance for lynching.
However, if I had waited 'till Night4, I wouldn't have helped at all. (With 4 or fewer players alive, a 1-shot Commuter is worth nothing; even if I got targetted, it still would be a MyLo or LyLo.)

[Aneninen]

I don't think I'd be able to salvage more information.

I've examined everything and Alchemist appears to be much more scummy. ToonFighter's reasoning sounds more town-ish. My intuition also says that it must be Alchemist.

VOTE: Alchemist

(ToonFighter, if it's been you, congratulations!)

[Aneninen]

No, it's not me.
And this is one of the rare occasions when I don't lie.

[Aneninen]

Thanks for modding, Insanity! We all had fun, I suppose.

Shos was great, he was the one who pointed out the most important evidence against TierShift.
ToonFighter did it well in Endgame too; I got totally convinced that he was a townie misreading the whole game.

Alchemist, I don't think your play was bad. You reached LyLo and before that you'd done a great job at explaining everyone that I'd been a paranoid townie tunnelling TierShift all the time.

I think my greatest strength and weakness was the same thing. Somehow I

felt

that TierShift's early interactions with Alchemist was fabricated. But, I couldn't collect enough proofs. He was right, I indeed misinterpreted his Day1 and I thought it was a slip. He burnt my case to the ground because it wasn't a slip at all... and I

felt

that he was doing it because he was scum but again, I had no proofs. Later I remember naming Alchemist as his partner but I lost focus.
TierShift did a good job, after all we were fighting for three Days (Oh My Gods, almost 40 RL days or something like that!) and if it hadn't been for Shos he wouldn't have lynched.
In short, my intuition worked but I wasn't able to back my reads with logical things – and the scums managed to turn it to their advantage.

Also, right now I'm allowed to tell that the endgame was very hard for me and TierShift knows it very well, why.
I was at LyLo in two Micro-s at the same time. TierShift was in and played a very important role in both games. I was afraid of mixing up the two games all the time but fortunately, it didn't happen.

Good game, everyone !

[Aneninen]

^^
One of my favourite players has spoken.
A decent comment after 40+ Days of fight. (And yes, I know that my case was weak.)

I wish everyone were posting things like that at post-game instead of throwing shyt on each other...

[Aneninen]

It didn't really hurt me anyway, Alchemist.
I don't think I'm the only player in Mafiascum history who made a silly move. And I don't think I'll never do any stupid things in my next games. ^_^