Mini 2079 - Guns & Roses [Game Over]

[Alisae]

Pops is making some good posts he can be town ig

[FakeGod]

VoteCount 1.3

xyzzy [3] - Lady Lambdadelta, Cephrir, implosion
Pine [4] - Alisae, Something_Smart, hitogoroshi, popsofctown

Not Voting [4]

- cyanjet, Pine, Haschel Cedricson, xyzzy

With 11 alive it takes 6 votes to be chosen.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2019-06-16 21:00:00)

[Haschel Cedricson]

Cool. First of all, Alisae gave a garbage summary. Yes, it's true there was a lot of speculation about the setup. However, the page three argument with LLD happened, and leaving it out of the game like that is incredibly negligent especially considering I have never played a game with Alisae before and have no predilection to write off any of that as just "meta". And then xyzzy says "there's nothing I considered wrong there at that point in the game; like I said before, it behooves scum players to try to make sure their setup analysis is meaningful and accurate, so while talking about the setup is important in a game like this, I don't believe that most of it is usually alignment-indicative." when asked if it was a good summary? I didn't ask if anything was wrong, I asked if it was a good summary. And the kicker is xyzzy has been voting LLD for the whole game up until that point!

I don't like how xyzzy says " I feel a lot more confident about my town reads so far than my scum reads" while they list Alisae as a townread with no explanation for why it's a townread. I don't like xyzzy and Alisae treating the first significant event of the game -an event one of them was involved in for that matter- as not being worthy of being included in a summary. I don't like Alisae starting a Pine wagon for lurking when we are this close to the end of our deadline. There is a lot to not like here. Probably enough to vote!

Something_Smart is problematic too, though. His Pine vote is garbage, because he makes it very clear that he's voting for the sake of voting and is also voting for a player based on a meta reason that another player (a scummy player) is providing. He's asking a lot of questions, but they aren't hard-hitting questions and he's not doing anything with the answers. For the record, I have no problem with a player being slow to vote and slow to move their vote. However, if you're going to do that then you need to be actively looking for a place to eventually put it and I see no evidence that S_S is doing that.

I'd be fine with a lynch of any of Alisae/xyzzy/S_S right now.

[Alisae]

wrong but town

[Alisae]

tbh actually having read that post beyond the first sentence (I stopped at the first sentence and thought wrong but town because why are you asking for a summary on page 6 and then assuming that a garbage summary is scum indicative when you should just be reading the game yourself, its not hard to read 6 pages)
but the stance on the Pine wagon is interesting to make me think if Haschel is just attacking the wagon to defend Pine or if Haschel actually hates this wagon, because defending this wagon seems really weird

but hey, thats why I love this wagon so much!

[Haschel Cedricson]

I hate the timing of the wagon. Two days ago, sure. Now, when we have actual content from people and the deadline is in three days? Hell no.

[Pine]

Prodded yeah yeah

I've had a really busy couple of days. I'll read up tonight.

[Cephrir]

It doesnt seem weird to attack the pine wagon, the wagon is transparently garbage and/or purely for the sake of pressure

[Alisae]

I hate the timing of the wagon. Two days ago, sure. Now, when we have actual content from people and the deadline is in three days? Hell no.

you realize that his last post before his post just now was made on the 10th?
That was like
He just read his role pm and said he would get to the game later but he clearly didn't and now there's 3 days left.

[Alisae]

Prodded yeah yeah

I've had a really busy couple of days. I'll read up tonight.

oh ur not paying attention huh
well yeah please do read up ty

[Haschel Cedricson]

Cool. And on what day was the wagon created?

[Alisae]

Less then 24 hours

[Alisae]

Also why is like
a big point you have is that
its 3 days
thats a lot of time we can get a lot accomplished within 3 days.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Considering how long it took for my initial questions to get answered I'm skeptical that three days is a lot of time.

And pressuring a lurker without something more than "X isn't posting so vote X" kicks any momentum the town had on other avenues right in the groin.

You said you didn't want to play out your hand, but you need to show a few cards.

[Alisae]

you asked me
I answered right away
and then you asked someone who wasn't actively posting
you only have yourself to blame for that one bud.

Also I have actually showed one of my cards, LLD played it, I just didn't want to say it because
A. Other people on the playerlist also know Pine and if they could come up with a reason why I want to start this wagon, that tells me that they're thinking like I am and that they're probably the same alignment as me.
B. I don't think Pine knows what I want at the moment, and I want to avoid dropping as many hints as to what I want from him. Because if he's scum, he knows exactly how to give me what I want and to make me happy.

[hitogoroshi]

I don't understand Haschel being so worried about deadline that starting a Pine wagon with 3 days left is a foolish breach of responsibility while simultaneously being nonplussed enough that he's not voting anyone himself.

Also, Haschel, what exactly is the scum motivation of Alisae giving a "bad summary", from your POV?

[Haschel Cedricson]

When one is involved with the missing events? The scum motivation is not drawing attention to one's self.

As for my vote, you can consider it to be on Alisae, xyzzy, and S_S.

[Something_Smart]

However, if you're going to do that then you need to be actively looking for a place to eventually put it and I see no evidence that S_S is doing that.

I mean, I'm going to eventually put it somewhere where five other people might also put theirs. If they don't, it hardly matters where it is.

When I start wagons they don't take off, this is a rule almost without exception. So it's likely I'll be looking at the wagons that are forming closer to deadline and supporting the one I'm most comfortable with.

My vote isn't worth very much right now. My D1 scumreads are probably no better than random, on average. That's why I'm being so reactive with my vote, and why I usually wouldn't have it down at all at this juncture.

[Haschel Cedricson]

I'm not asking you to vote.

I am asking you to scumhunt. Let's try this. Xyzzy has three votes right now. What are your thoughts on the votes on the wagon?

[popsofctown]

When one is involved with the missing events? The scum motivation is not drawing attention to one's self.

As for my vote, you can consider it to be on Alisae, xyzzy, and S_S.

Then flipping just vote one. Isoing the mod is a thing. Provable randomness is banned in thread but I rolled a d6, divided it by two and rounded down, and it says xyzzy.

[popsofctown]

However, if you're going to do that then you need to be actively looking for a place to eventually put it and I see no evidence that S_S is doing that.

I mean, I'm going to eventually put it somewhere where five other people might also put theirs. If they don't, it hardly matters where it is.

When I start wagons they don't take off, this is a rule almost without exception. So it's likely I'll be looking at the wagons that are forming closer to deadline and supporting the one I'm most comfortable with.

My vote isn't worth very much right now. My D1 scumreads are probably no better than random, on average. That's why I'm being so reactive with my vote, and why I usually wouldn't have it down at all at this juncture.

If you literally were born unable to snipe scum d1 you should focus your meta on trying to townspew and this close to the vest vote thingy you got going on seems like the worst strat for that ever. like play to your strengths. Whatever smash character Haschel played today. Whatever one it was. That one's too fucking fast I play a slow one. I'm too dumb for it. I gotta do what I'm good at.

Last hit with Annie Q, take bonus damage to minions masteries, wallow in the shame and own it.

[Something_Smart]

Xyzzy has three votes right now. What are your thoughts on the votes on the wagon?

The wagon has existed for so long and off the top of my head I really couldn't think of a reason why.

I went back and looked, and it's still pretty nebulous. LLD voted (59) for disliking a single apparent contradiction in a single post, in what looks to be confbias since she pointed out the contradiction and then said "this was a failed push attempt" as though that's the only explanation.

Ceph's vote (explained in 204) is based on a personal experience tell-- that players whom you don't seem to remember anything about are more likely scum. I myself have seen that be successful but it usually seems to just be a player thing to me-- some players I just have a hard time remembering their posts.

Implosion justified his vote after the fact in 261 which is pretty similar to the above only even less so-- dislike of a post (229) that is a lot of words to not say very much. Being the master of that myself, I'm not really compelled by that argument.

So, overall. Still confused by it, but not really surprised, because xyzzy hasn't done anything that would make people want to move off him. Not particularly keen on it myself.

[popsofctown]

ugh i guess sitting on your hands every day 1 probably lowers your d1 lynch rate and improves all your winrates too but it's boooooring

[Something_Smart]

If you literally were born unable to snipe scum d1 you should focus your meta on trying to townspew and this close to the vest vote thingy you got going on seems like the worst strat for that ever. like play to your strengths. Whatever smash character Haschel played today. Whatever one it was. That one's too fucking fast I play a slow one. I'm too dumb for it. I gotta do what I'm good at.

I mean, when I have been obvtown, it sure as hell was not for aggression. If I'm going to townspew, it's going to be through my words and not my votes.

And yeah, learning to sit on my vote early did wonders for my D1 mislynch rate. It's certainly not the best I could be playing but I don't have enough confidence in myself to correctly judge when I should have confidence in myself

[popsofctown]

Do you like submit no-kills as vig