Micro 1018: The King's New Robes | Game Over

[Pink Panthers]

Hey dude, why don’t you also vote our mason buddy T3 while you’re at it? No one believes you fake townslipped here. lololol

I don't think the Gamma hydra would make this slip
ActionDan seems to have noticed the same stuff i did here so is less likely scum since scum doing this strat then getting the other to point it out for towncred is super -ev

taking them out of the subsequent pool leaves (NM/VFP/Arc)

-Hop

VOTE: Panthers

It's quite strange that you conveniently leave out possible situations that involve town!me to push your confscum!rock narrative.

Assume the team is {actress, seamstress} for instance. Why don't you think a mystic could lie about their role to essentially become an activated innocent child or something of that sort? Dan seemed to have suggested the idea in his posts, but you just straight up discard it??

Even if it's just {actress, actress}, why would lying about having a seamstress suit necessarily point to me being scum?
It isn't harmful to town in any way and can help increase the likelihood of scum slipping up the way I see it (which I think is the case here).

Your case doesn't look like something that comes out of a townie mindset, since I'd expect town!you to actually analyze how sensible a lie would be from either alignment before jumping to such an extreme conclusion.

Are you open wolfing? We’re confitown.

ironically, Nancy was genuinely townslipping while talking about someone fake townslipping
i got several messages on the discord chat about how Rock was voting confirmed town and hard openwolfing and assumed she meant Rock was voting T3 until i checked the thread

-Hop

[Pink Panthers]

I don't think the Gamma hydra would make this slip
ActionDan seems to have noticed the same stuff i did here so is less likely scum since scum doing this strat then getting the other to point it out for towncred is super -ev

taking them out of the subsequent pool leaves (NM/VFP/Arc)

-Hop

VOTE: Panthers

It's quite strange that you conveniently leave out possible situations that involve town!me to push your confscum!rock narrative.

Assume the team is {actress, seamstress} for instance. Why don't you think a mystic could lie about their role to essentially become an activated innocent child or something of that sort? Dan seemed to have suggested the idea in his posts, but you just straight up discard it??

Even if it's just {actress, actress}, why would lying about having a seamstress suit necessarily point to me being scum?
It isn't harmful to town in any way and can help increase the likelihood of scum slipping up the way I see it (which I think is the case here).

Your case doesn't look like something that comes out of a townie mindset, since I'd expect town!you to actually analyze how sensible a lie would be from either alignment before jumping to such an extreme conclusion.

You lied in a massclaim and i still see no reason why you did. Outside of possibly 'not getting checked by bride' which you say below wasn't your main goal, i fail to see the motivation.

Scum!you here would have made a mistake and town!you would have done it genuinely and presumably with a good reason which i haven't seen
how would you expect scum to slip up as a result of it given they would know you didn't have a suit
the harmful element comes if you are scum as you can be doing it to attempt to avoid being checked or if you're town from this scenario where you're doing things scum have an incentive to do which makes you look very much like scum
i ignored situations where town lied as town should not have lied. it's very strange that you find this unreasonable, even though you disagree with the conclusion

The bride proposes marriage!

I did not expect this to happen this soon.
I obviously would have revealed that I didn't in fact have any suit after everyone claimed.

ERgo arguments that I was just fakeclaiming to avoid getting proposed are unfounded.

This is not in fact obvious as there was no incentive for you to do it in the first place. Who would you be trying to fool here, because scum know whether they gave you a suit or not. you're literally only lying to town there

These two posts overall read as very defensive (given the vote which happens again later) which does feel like caught scum more than dumb!town

-Hop

[VFP]

@VFP - what changed for you to go from NM town > voting NM there? There was no setup related reasons for him to be lying. Any of (town NM+town Arc, town NM+scum Arc, scum NM+town Arc, scum NM + scum Arc) are all possible.

Because Arc lying there and pushing NM outs them as scum if NM is telling the truth.
Makes no sense as scum, therefore NM was lying.

It's plausible NM is still scum right?

[Rockhopper]

Spoiler:

I don't think the Gamma hydra would make this slip
ActionDan seems to have noticed the same stuff i did here so is less likely scum since scum doing this strat then getting the other to point it out for towncred is super -ev

taking them out of the subsequent pool leaves (NM/VFP/Arc)

-Hop

VOTE: Panthers

It's quite strange that you conveniently leave out possible situations that involve town!me to push your confscum!rock narrative.

Assume the team is {actress, seamstress} for instance. Why don't you think a mystic could lie about their role to essentially become an activated innocent child or something of that sort? Dan seemed to have suggested the idea in his posts, but you just straight up discard it??

Even if it's just {actress, actress}, why would lying about having a seamstress suit necessarily point to me being scum?
It isn't harmful to town in any way and can help increase the likelihood of scum slipping up the way I see it (which I think is the case here).

Your case doesn't look like something that comes out of a townie mindset, since I'd expect town!you to actually analyze how sensible a lie would be from either alignment before jumping to such an extreme conclusion.

You lied in a massclaim and i still see no reason why you did. Outside of possibly 'not getting checked by bride' which you say below wasn't your main goal, i fail to see the motivation.

Scum!you here would have made a mistake and town!you would have done it genuinely and presumably with a good reason which i haven't seen
how would you expect scum to slip up as a result of it given they would know you didn't have a suit
the harmful element comes if you are scum as you can be doing it to attempt to avoid being checked or if you're town from this scenario where you're doing things scum have an incentive to do which makes you look very much like scum
i ignored situations where town lied as town should not have lied. it's very strange that you find this unreasonable, even though you disagree with the conclusion

The bride proposes marriage!

I did not expect this to happen this soon.
I obviously would have revealed that I didn't in fact have any suit after everyone claimed.

ERgo arguments that I was just fakeclaiming to avoid getting proposed are unfounded.

This is not in fact obvious as there was no incentive for you to do it in the first place. Who would you be trying to fool here, because scum know whether they gave you a suit or not. you're literally only lying to town there

These two posts overall read as very defensive (given the vote which happens again later) which does feel like caught scum more than dumb!town

-Hop

Scum I expect would slip up (or react differently) *because* they know I'm lying. It may not be a sure shot strat but it at least could have given us something to work with.

Why would scum!me (in an actress/actress scenario) fake a seamstress suit and ask for a massclaim for the purpose of avoiding a bride shot knowing that the existence of only 1 oracle would point to my suit being a lie?

And if I know for a fact that there IS another oracle who fakeclaimed vt (in an actress/seamstress scenario where the actress is given a disguise), what incentive would I have to retract my claim at all?

[Pink Panthers]

NM was almost guaranteed to be town. We essentially have confirmation of whether scum got voted out since 1st scum lethal = they get to kill one of us (probably the bride).

-Hop

[Pink Panthers]

Spoiler:

I don't think the Gamma hydra would make this slip
ActionDan seems to have noticed the same stuff i did here so is less likely scum since scum doing this strat then getting the other to point it out for towncred is super -ev

taking them out of the subsequent pool leaves (NM/VFP/Arc)

-Hop

VOTE: Panthers

It's quite strange that you conveniently leave out possible situations that involve town!me to push your confscum!rock narrative.

Assume the team is {actress, seamstress} for instance. Why don't you think a mystic could lie about their role to essentially become an activated innocent child or something of that sort? Dan seemed to have suggested the idea in his posts, but you just straight up discard it??

Even if it's just {actress, actress}, why would lying about having a seamstress suit necessarily point to me being scum?
It isn't harmful to town in any way and can help increase the likelihood of scum slipping up the way I see it (which I think is the case here).

Your case doesn't look like something that comes out of a townie mindset, since I'd expect town!you to actually analyze how sensible a lie would be from either alignment before jumping to such an extreme conclusion.

You lied in a massclaim and i still see no reason why you did. Outside of possibly 'not getting checked by bride' which you say below wasn't your main goal, i fail to see the motivation.

Scum!you here would have made a mistake and town!you would have done it genuinely and presumably with a good reason which i haven't seen
how would you expect scum to slip up as a result of it given they would know you didn't have a suit
the harmful element comes if you are scum as you can be doing it to attempt to avoid being checked or if you're town from this scenario where you're doing things scum have an incentive to do which makes you look very much like scum
i ignored situations where town lied as town should not have lied. it's very strange that you find this unreasonable, even though you disagree with the conclusion

The bride proposes marriage!

I did not expect this to happen this soon.
I obviously would have revealed that I didn't in fact have any suit after everyone claimed.

ERgo arguments that I was just fakeclaiming to avoid getting proposed are unfounded.

This is not in fact obvious as there was no incentive for you to do it in the first place. Who would you be trying to fool here, because scum know whether they gave you a suit or not. you're literally only lying to town there

These two posts overall read as very defensive (given the vote which happens again later) which does feel like caught scum more than dumb!town

-Hop

Scum I expect would slip up (or react differently) *because* they know I'm lying. It may not be a sure shot strat but it at least could have given us something to work with.

Why would scum!me (in an actress/actress scenario) fake a seamstress suit and ask for a massclaim for the purpose of avoiding a bride shot knowing that the existence of only 1 oracle would point to my suit being a lie?

And if I know for a fact that there IS another oracle who fakeclaimed vt (in an actress/seamstress scenario where the actress is given a disguise), what incentive would I have to retract my claim at all?

@VFP - what changed for you to go from NM town > voting NM there? There was no setup related reasons for him to be lying. Any of (town NM+town Arc, town NM+scum Arc, scum NM+town Arc, scum NM + scum Arc) are all possible.

Because Arc lying there and pushing NM outs them as scum if NM is telling the truth.
Makes no sense as scum, therefore NM was lying.

It's plausible NM is still scum right?

How would pushing NM (if the claim was true) out Arc?
Obviously in the scum!arc world Arc does know at that point that NM was lying (or Enchant was, or another VT claim was, but NM lying is obviously most likely of the three for them there) so isn't going to be concerned NM targeted them

[Rockhopper]

I won’t really have time to post much but I can say I did approve massclaiming when asked
Also I kinda think ArcAngel is sus

~Gamma

Why? Because I caught with you a lie? Your discord story is one-sided. You seem to want to push it back because I may have already smelled you correctly.

VOTE: Gamma Faria

Lol! What lie btw??

~

Faria

Faria said that they want to discuss with Gamma first before confirming on the mass claim and after few posts they just claimed VT. When I asked about it. I became a suspect.

would you deny this?

For the last time and my time zone is UTC+6, so calculate yourself!

Spoiler: On Your Face!

Is this allowed?
Definitely town though.

[Enchant]

Targeted ActionDan.

NM is not mafia, because he didn't shot anyone. He is also not Oracle, because there should be reveal. Of course it's possible he is mafia/Oracle who decided to do nothing... Do you believe NM will not shoting when he can and not using ability when he can? Don't answer on this one, and assume him as VT.

[Pink Panthers]

Spoiler:

I don't think the Gamma hydra would make this slip
ActionDan seems to have noticed the same stuff i did here so is less likely scum since scum doing this strat then getting the other to point it out for towncred is super -ev

taking them out of the subsequent pool leaves (NM/VFP/Arc)

-Hop

VOTE: Panthers

It's quite strange that you conveniently leave out possible situations that involve town!me to push your confscum!rock narrative.

Assume the team is {actress, seamstress} for instance. Why don't you think a mystic could lie about their role to essentially become an activated innocent child or something of that sort? Dan seemed to have suggested the idea in his posts, but you just straight up discard it??

Even if it's just {actress, actress}, why would lying about having a seamstress suit necessarily point to me being scum?
It isn't harmful to town in any way and can help increase the likelihood of scum slipping up the way I see it (which I think is the case here).

Your case doesn't look like something that comes out of a townie mindset, since I'd expect town!you to actually analyze how sensible a lie would be from either alignment before jumping to such an extreme conclusion.

You lied in a massclaim and i still see no reason why you did. Outside of possibly 'not getting checked by bride' which you say below wasn't your main goal, i fail to see the motivation.

Scum!you here would have made a mistake and town!you would have done it genuinely and presumably with a good reason which i haven't seen
how would you expect scum to slip up as a result of it given they would know you didn't have a suit
the harmful element comes if you are scum as you can be doing it to attempt to avoid being checked or if you're town from this scenario where you're doing things scum have an incentive to do which makes you look very much like scum
i ignored situations where town lied as town should not have lied. it's very strange that you find this unreasonable, even though you disagree with the conclusion

The bride proposes marriage!

I did not expect this to happen this soon.
I obviously would have revealed that I didn't in fact have any suit after everyone claimed.

ERgo arguments that I was just fakeclaiming to avoid getting proposed are unfounded.

This is not in fact obvious as there was no incentive for you to do it in the first place. Who would you be trying to fool here, because scum know whether they gave you a suit or not. you're literally only lying to town there

These two posts overall read as very defensive (given the vote which happens again later) which does feel like caught scum more than dumb!town

-Hop

Scum I expect would slip up (or react differently) *because* they know I'm lying. It may not be a sure shot strat but it at least could have given us something to work with.

Why would scum!me (in an actress/actress scenario) fake a seamstress suit and ask for a massclaim for the purpose of avoiding a bride shot knowing that the existence of only 1 oracle would point to my suit being a lie?

And if I know for a fact that there IS another oracle who fakeclaimed vt (in an actress/seamstress scenario where the actress is given a disguise), what incentive would I have to retract my claim at all?

my model of scumyou involved you making a mistake that you didn't realize was a mistake
i'm factoring in your comments about not being sure about setup stuff earlier

i do agree that in the seamstess/actress/2 oracles world you are more likely town because it would be weird to retract that if you were expecting another town to come out as oracle and at that point it's easier to believe it coming from town thinking it was a good idea initially. i would take Arc flipping town as you being more likely town, and Arc flipping scum as you being more likely scum. do you think we're in the actress/seamstress world? what do you think happened to the 'missing' n0 action?

-Hop

[Pink Panthers]

T3/Enchant/Faria
Actiondan
VFP/Arc/Rock

you probably could have worked out my reads list

-Hop

[Rockhopper]

Targeted ActionDan.

NM is not mafia, because he didn't shot anyone. He is also not Oracle, because there should be reveal. Of course it's possible he is mafia/Oracle who decided to do nothing... Do you believe NM will not shoting when he can and not using ability when he can? Don't answer on this one, and assume him as VT.

The role pm states that scum on death

may

use their 1 shot vengeful ability, no?
{Arc, NM} is still possible because scum choosing seamstress just to confuse town with an extra oracle seems unlikely, with the potential briding element.
Does NM usually fakeclaim as town just for the lulz?

[Enchant]

Targeted ActionDan.

NM is not mafia, because he didn't shot anyone. He is also not Oracle, because there should be reveal. Of course it's possible he is mafia/Oracle who decided to do nothing... Do you believe NM will not shoting when he can and not using ability when he can? Don't answer on this one, and assume him as VT.

The role pm states that scum on death

may

use their 1 shot vengeful ability, no?
{Arc, NM} is still possible because scum choosing seamstress just to confuse town with an extra oracle seems unlikely, with the potential briding element.
Does NM usually fakeclaim as town just for the lulz?

Yes. I simple doesh't believe NM would ignore his chance to shot someone. If he IS mafia, then by not shoting he harmed mafia faction by not killing Bride and suggest for remaining mafia member to surrender.

This is first time he actually fakeclaim, i think.

[Rockhopper]

Spoiler:

I don't think the Gamma hydra would make this slip
ActionDan seems to have noticed the same stuff i did here so is less likely scum since scum doing this strat then getting the other to point it out for towncred is super -ev

taking them out of the subsequent pool leaves (NM/VFP/Arc)

-Hop

VOTE: Panthers

It's quite strange that you conveniently leave out possible situations that involve town!me to push your confscum!rock narrative.

Assume the team is {actress, seamstress} for instance. Why don't you think a mystic could lie about their role to essentially become an activated innocent child or something of that sort? Dan seemed to have suggested the idea in his posts, but you just straight up discard it??

Even if it's just {actress, actress}, why would lying about having a seamstress suit necessarily point to me being scum?
It isn't harmful to town in any way and can help increase the likelihood of scum slipping up the way I see it (which I think is the case here).

Your case doesn't look like something that comes out of a townie mindset, since I'd expect town!you to actually analyze how sensible a lie would be from either alignment before jumping to such an extreme conclusion.

You lied in a massclaim and i still see no reason why you did. Outside of possibly 'not getting checked by bride' which you say below wasn't your main goal, i fail to see the motivation.

Scum!you here would have made a mistake and town!you would have done it genuinely and presumably with a good reason which i haven't seen
how would you expect scum to slip up as a result of it given they would know you didn't have a suit
the harmful element comes if you are scum as you can be doing it to attempt to avoid being checked or if you're town from this scenario where you're doing things scum have an incentive to do which makes you look very much like scum
i ignored situations where town lied as town should not have lied. it's very strange that you find this unreasonable, even though you disagree with the conclusion

The bride proposes marriage!

I did not expect this to happen this soon.
I obviously would have revealed that I didn't in fact have any suit after everyone claimed.

ERgo arguments that I was just fakeclaiming to avoid getting proposed are unfounded.

This is not in fact obvious as there was no incentive for you to do it in the first place. Who would you be trying to fool here, because scum know whether they gave you a suit or not. you're literally only lying to town there

These two posts overall read as very defensive (given the vote which happens again later) which does feel like caught scum more than dumb!town

-Hop

Scum I expect would slip up (or react differently) *because* they know I'm lying. It may not be a sure shot strat but it at least could have given us something to work with.

Why would scum!me (in an actress/actress scenario) fake a seamstress suit and ask for a massclaim for the purpose of avoiding a bride shot knowing that the existence of only 1 oracle would point to my suit being a lie?

And if I know for a fact that there IS another oracle who fakeclaimed vt (in an actress/seamstress scenario where the actress is given a disguise), what incentive would I have to retract my claim at all?

my model of scumyou involved you making a mistake that you didn't realize was a mistake
i'm factoring in your comments about not being sure about setup stuff earlier

i do agree that in the seamstess/actress/2 oracles world you are more likely town because it would be weird to retract that if you were expecting another town to come out as oracle and at that point it's easier to believe it coming from town thinking it was a good idea initially. i would take Arc flipping town as you being more likely town, and Arc flipping scum as you being more likely scum. do you think we're in the actress/seamstress world? what do you think happened to the 'missing' n0 action?

-Hop

I didn't consider the idling case.
But noting the timing of everyone's first post I'd say it's unlikely. NM is the only player who arrived a bit late, but his partner could have decided the roles if he was scum.

[Pink Panthers]

Not_mafia is notable notorious, but i don't seem scum!NM making an intentionally suboptimal action choice here with no clear upside

The bride is confirmed town. If it's 1 scum remaining then bride is in lylo and scum's win involves lethaling 6 town from here (everyone except themselves would need to be voted out for them to win if scum!NM chose not to kill). i don't see any upside, let alone one that compares to the impact of that

NM was town, VT specifically. (although i didn't realize that deathflips involved suits so that's a useful knowledge update)

-Hop

[Rockhopper]

Targeted ActionDan.

NM is not mafia, because he didn't shot anyone. He is also not Oracle, because there should be reveal. Of course it's possible he is mafia/Oracle who decided to do nothing... Do you believe NM will not shoting when he can and not using ability when he can? Don't answer on this one, and assume him as VT.

The role pm states that scum on death

may

use their 1 shot vengeful ability, no?
{Arc, NM} is still possible because scum choosing seamstress just to confuse town with an extra oracle seems unlikely, with the potential briding element.
Does NM usually fakeclaim as town just for the lulz?

Yes. I simple doesh't believe NM would ignore his chance to shot someone. If he IS mafia, then by not shoting he harmed mafia faction by not killing Bride and suggest for remaining mafia member to surrender.

This is first time he actually fakeclaim, i think.

That's true, but it's possible if he thought confirmed scum!NM would point to scum!Arc.
I should give it more thought tho.

[Pink Panthers]

in the scenario of Arc!scum who would you read as more likely town/scum?

-Hop

[Rockhopper]

in the scenario of Arc!scum who would you read as more likely town/scum?

-Hop

Town- Gamma Faria, VFP based on interactions
Scum- NM based on mechanics

[Rockhopper]

Why would anyone push at the first post? I don't understand your response.

I'm just joking. The post is irrelevant.

This feels too awkward to be scum theatre.

[Enchant]

in the scenario of Arc!scum who would you read as more likely town/scum?

-Hop

Town- Gamma Faria, VFP based on interactions
Scum- NM based on mechanics

Why i am not Town in this situation?
Why NM mafia based on mechanics?

[VFP]

How would pushing NM (if the claim was true) out Arc?
Obviously in the scum!arc world Arc does know at that point that NM was lying (or Enchant was, or another VT claim was, but NM lying is obviously most likely of the three for them there) so isn't going to be concerned NM targeted them

I see it as a CC.
I actually have no idea what's happening.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Hi, don’t prod us again. Sorry I’m overgamed af.

I haven’t been reading the game. Why did we elim NM?

[Pink Panthers]

Hi, don’t prod us again. Sorry I’m overgamed af.

I haven’t been reading the game. Why did we elim NM?

[Pink Panthers]

in the scenario of Arc!scum who would you read as more likely town/scum?

-Hop

Town- Gamma Faria, VFP based on interactions
Scum- NM based on mechanics

Us and T3 are confitown or aren’t you reading?

[Pink Panthers]

How would pushing NM (if the claim was true) out Arc?
Obviously in the scum!arc world Arc does know at that point that NM was lying (or Enchant was, or another VT claim was, but NM lying is obviously most likely of the three for them there) so isn't going to be concerned NM targeted them

I see it as a CC.
I actually have no idea what's happening.

how was it a CC? what do you mean

in the scenario of Arc!scum who would you read as more likely town/scum?

-Hop

Town- Gamma Faria, VFP based on interactions
Scum- NM based on mechanics

Us and T3 are confitown or aren’t you reading?

you mean conftown by play right? obviously we had that talk on Sunday about Rock

-Hop

[VFP]

how was it a CC? what do you mean

Arc CC NM.
And Arc was right.