Open 820: The Siege of Aurelia — Game Over!

[Dunnstral]

i find the fact that unwnd took gate to be rather scummy honestly

I find unwnd scummy, yes.

Nope - I meant catboi

catboi didn't take gate

[PenguinPower]

So what do you think of unwnd?

No strong opinion.

[PenguinPower]

i find the fact that unwnd took gate to be rather scummy honestly

I find unwnd scummy, yes.

Nope - I meant catboi

catboi didn't take gate

Right…I meant I found catboi scummy, not unwnd. I confused their avatars.

[catboi]

So what do you think of unwnd?

No strong opinion.

Okay

[ssbm_Kyouko]

PP/S_S/Skitter at Wall leaves no good place for scum!catboi to be swapped. PP, Skitter, Implosion and I all SR him, so having 2 of each of us at the other 2 stations makes it dangerous to swap him. Makes it hard for scum!catboi to get get out of having to keep his hammer promise at Keep. If Catboi is town though I can see scum!Dunn and scum!unwnd which means to swap town!catboi out they have to leave scum!dunn in Keep.

In this case of town!Catboi I'm not really worried about implosion being scum as one of he or unwnd has to be swapped, and I think making scum make a swap that involves Gate is ideal.

[catboi]

Why would you expect any rational scum play to revolve around swapping me? It gets incredibly annoying having to fend off these hypotheticals that are supposed to inform your decision-making when they rest on these assumptions that make no sense. What does scum!cat gain from swapping to the gate or the wall? The fearmongering is nonsensical at this point.

[T3]

I feel like I need a chart with everyone's avatars and then a line of different colors to whoever scumreads the other person

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Why would you expect any rational scum play to revolve around swapping me? It gets incredibly annoying having to fend off these hypotheticals that are supposed to inform your decision-making when they rest on these assumptions that make no sense. What does scum!cat gain from swapping to the gate or the wall? The fearmongering is nonsensical at this point.

Scum!cat gets out of their obligation to be the hammer vote at Keep by swapping out of Keep, to the Gate or Wall. Literally the answer to your question is posted in the post you are referring to, so what is the point of asking me these questions? <-Not asking rhetorically.

Makes it hard for scum!catboi to get get out of having to keep his hammer promise at Keep.

[catboi]

Why would you expect any rational scum play to revolve around swapping me? It gets incredibly annoying having to fend off these hypotheticals that are supposed to inform your decision-making when they rest on these assumptions that make no sense. What does scum!cat gain from swapping to the gate or the wall? The fearmongering is nonsensical at this point.

Scum!cat gets out of their obligation to be the hammer vote at Keep by swapping out of Keep, to the Gate or Wall. Literally the answer to your question is posted in the post you are referring to, so what is the point of asking me these questions? <-Not asking rhetorically.

Makes it hard for scum!catboi to get get out of having to keep his hammer promise at Keep.

What good do you expect that to

do

for me, though? In such a scenario, I remain a scumread at a location where people can vote me directly, meanwhile my teammate gets stuck at the keep with stronger townreads where they are less likely to win. It feels like you're just narrative-building with absolutely no sense of how my actions are supposed to play toward the scum win condition at all.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Why would you expect any rational scum play to revolve around swapping me? It gets incredibly annoying having to fend off these hypotheticals that are supposed to inform your decision-making when they rest on these assumptions that make no sense. What does scum!cat gain from swapping to the gate or the wall? The fearmongering is nonsensical at this point.

Scum!cat gets out of their obligation to be the hammer vote at Keep by swapping out of Keep, to the Gate or Wall. Literally the answer to your question is posted in the post you are referring to, so what is the point of asking me these questions? <-Not asking rhetorically.

Makes it hard for scum!catboi to get get out of having to keep his hammer promise at Keep.

What good do you expect that to

do

for me, though? In such a scenario, I remain a scumread at a location where people can vote me directly, meanwhile my teammate gets stuck at the keep with stronger townreads where they are less likely to win. It feels like you're just narrative-building with absolutely no sense of how my actions are supposed to play toward the scum win condition at all.

I dont expect it to do you any good, again, if you had paid attention to 504, you would have seen the whole idea of that post is to pitch a setup that is good for town if you are scum. So if you are scum, there is not a good swap for you in this scenario.

However, if we go with a different setup, I think there are ways for you to.escape to.wall and have a decent shot at winning for scum there. I want to push a situation where scum swaps someone in/out of Gate, so I dont like the idea of making it possible for my top scumreads to have the option switching a Keep and Wall player.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

So did you not understand from 504 that I already answered both of your questions in that post?

"What does scum!cat gain from swapping"
And
"What good do you expect that to do for me"

[catboi]

No, you literally have not established how I advance the scum win condition at all in your hypothetical. Your theory is that my sneaky, nefarious plan is to make a snap move to the keep that earns the ire of half the game, and get out of a promise by swapping myself out of the keep. You are painting a narrative that begins with the presumption I am scum, and so anything that happens with me must be for some nefarious purpose. The goal, for scum, is to win locations. How is the swap supposed to benefit that? Answer that rather than obfuscating and claiming you already answered.

[T3]

We'll see what happens with the swap.

[T3]

Because I think catboi's alignment really depends on that.

[Something_Smart]

The less we say about how we will interpret a particular swap, the better, methinks.

[skitter30]

Are we waiting on anything else?

[catboi]

Because I think catboi's alignment really depends on that.

I feel like things are being set up to attack me. I know for a fact the narrative against me cannot be wholly organic - by sheer virtue of numbers in this game, it cannot be. Someone had a misplaced suspicion of me, scum seized upon, now anything I do gets attacked. It's become apparent to me that I'm their mark and it's incredibly hard to fight off a coordinated push. Scum need their targets to win the game, if they can't get me the game becomes just a little bit harder for them. That was a big sense of why I chose the keep - that is the

one

place where I do not need to convince anyone I am town. It's the spot where the town and scum win conditions are most divergent. That this is not an explanation that seems to be understood by most people is also very annoying. I've been tunneled as town twice in newbie games, it is utterly exhausting to defend myself and I don't like having to do it. You were in one of those games! I would much rather

not

have to fight for my own survival with people who are conf-biasing all my words. I want to be able to think, analyze, and make decisions for myself, rather than wasting all my time arguing to convince someone.


The frustrating thing is my gut tells me that kyouko's arrogance and overconfidence is town-indicative, but the sheer lack of any logic whatsoever frustrates me to no end. I look at all this theorizing as to how I could be setting up for a ~sneaky swap~ and cannot help but think, is this all in service of having a narrative for eliminating me? That's what the paranoid part of my brain is whispering.

[T3]

The less we say about how we will interpret a particular swap, the better, methinks.

Agreed.
SS, do you want to hammer the gate?

[Something_Smart]

Not really? I think the last game showed that the gate is not my strong suit. Especially with the low amount of content I have right now.

[T3]

Not really? I think the last game showed that the gate is not my strong suit. Especially with the low amount of content I have right now.

True.

I have a bunch of theories based on whatever swap... I'll say once said swap happens.

[Something_Smart]

I kinda feel like having me at the gate is just all around bad, because I'll never be able to generate genuine content once I'm locked in a 1v1.

[catboi]

That was part of why we kept you there last time >_>

[Something_Smart]

Well I don't think it was really true last time. But since I was V/LA, it's a lot more true this time.

[catboi]

Figured it would be easier for me to argue over you than infinity. Regardless, I agree you going to the gate is probably not optimal here.

[unwnd]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the current makeup of the wagons should indicate that scum has already chosen a spot? See there's 4 left for the choosing and well, scum can lose if they're all forced into one. I don't know if this has happened though, because if I'm scum and I see only one spot is left? I take that last spot just so I don't lose.