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[Kerset]

The case is vote in 1219

[Titus]

Yeah, Kyouko is scum.

Join me on DotW. Kyouko doesn't seem interested there. If it flips red, bigger case there.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Another thing I find scummy with DGB is the timeline here.

MB's paranoia about the gambit makes me believe that he's the towniest of the 2, ftr.

DGB gets scumpoints for attempting to pigeonhole Math into an anti-town fakeclaim.

The only paranoia I considered is MB thinking I made the suggestion to test him. If he refused I should consider him townie. That wasn't my plan, though. My plan was about drawing NKs, but I purposely didn't explain it to MB in case he's scum.

First, there is the claim that the only thing it felt paranoia about was thinking MB might think it was testing him. I don't think I ever worry about this as town because either Math will think that or he won't if he's town, and if he's scum it doesnt matter. I have confidence enough in my townplay to do whatever I want and get away with it though, so if Math didnt believe me right away, I would still expect eventually that he would realize I am town, and would try to make the play anways. Maybe this line of reasoning does not apply to DGB though, as it is prone to getting eliminated regardless of alignment in my experience.

Not sure what Math gets out of this play as scum though. DGB, How did the topic of fakeclaiming come to be in the hood? Did Math crumb of his own volition before talking to you about what to claim? Did you bring it up because of something Math said or did either in game or in hood?

Nero House DGB town I think is where I'm at as of catch-up completion

I still like Math for town more than DGB.

I think the context of what went on in the hood as this situation unfolded is.going to be key.

DGB, if it's not too much trouble, posting what happened between the 2 threads leading up to this in chronological order would help.

These last 2 posts are just for context of what I was asking of DGB, and its response follows.

One of the first things that were posted in the neighbor PT was MB explaining how he was going to crumb.

To which I answered, why crumb at all, we're not masons. And curiously MB said that if I'm town,

it's like we're masons

. It took me aback, because no, FMPOV we're totally not masons, not even close.

Then MB was concerned about, er, what's that role that checks if you have a PT? He worried that such a role would get a false positive if we were investigated.

Then a real lot of the thread was MB working me to scum read Nero, starting with Nero highlighting MB's "PR crumb" in the thread. I'm not very good at reading Nero, so I said I wasn't going to do this on Day 1. MB's crumb wasn't exactly subtle for the type of player that looks for crumbs (unlike me, i never see crumbs). It felt like an opportunistic trap a little bit, Nero had fallen into and MB was going for the kill.

At that point I was noticing MB premature-claiming in the thread and that's when I proposed a gambit, since it seemed like the whole neighbor bit was already blowing up in my face through no fault of mine.

In other word I think MB is scum.

This is the post that reminded me of my post in 233 where I outed my.whole reasoning for going along with the neighbor claim. Maybe I'll grab that post later for comparison.

Vote Count 1.03

Nero Cain (4)

- MathBlade, DrippingGoofball, House, Gamma Emerald

DrippingGoofball (2)

- Cat Scratch Fever, Nero Cain

ssbm_Kyouko (1)

- Almost50

Cat Scatch Fever (1)

- Titus

Titus (1)

- Dragon of the West

Kerset (1)

- ssbm_Kyouko

Not voting (3)

: Wake88, Kerset, Andresvmb

Deadline

: (expired on 2021-09-23 17:06:41)

Kinda feeling like there's scum on Nero wag.

House's talk about Nero pushing for a hood lim because Nero is informed of T/T, if anything, could be seen as House's own TMI spewing into the thread in order to frame up Nero on any hood lims or NKs.
If there is scum in the hood, my bet is on Math as DGB's play wrt the gambit aligns with its town meta, and I feel like it's possible that Math manipulated DGB into claiming

something

.
I'm not sure if I buy the outrage about outing Math's crumb, though Math didn't fake outrage in our last game together where he

was

scum, so possibly the hood is just t/t. From DGB's description it doesn't sound too much like it was manipulated into claiming, but DGB, if you felt at all like a horse being led to water, let me know. In truth that is what I was looking for, and what I expected to hear, but it seems like this may not be the case, in which case I don't have a case on Math at this time.
Gamma I got a bad feeling about early on and wasn't impressed by that last vote. I think the wagon has been on Nero long enough that if Gamma is scum, now is a good time to get on if Math, DGB, and House are all town. It doesn't look like a bus if Nero flips red, and there's little risk of the wagon dissipating, which means Gamma won't have to move his vote anywhere new anytime soon.

I feel like House or Gamma are the best bets actually, but House being scum is kinda contingent on t/t hood and aside from possible TMI he's seemed town.

How would I be manipulating DGB into claiming something?

It’s demonstrated I have a PT with DGB.
The only thing claimed is neighbors.
I did that first and then DGB narrowed it down.
So what manipulation would there be?

I don’t know if you’re just paranoid because of our last game or scum but this doesn’t logically add up

With leading questions in the hood, like the leading questions scum!you asked me about town!titus in our last game. I was specifically curious if there was anything like that in the PT, but didnt want to lead DGB there myself in case it is scum, and I don't think from its explanation that it is very likely that you led it there.

But yes, I am paranoid about you having manipulated DGB inside the hood specifically because of our last game.

I felt I was being manipulated into scumrrading Nero a bit, but then Nero wasn't helping himself. His more recent rebuttals had the passion of town, though

I also tried not to lead DGB into saying anything that incriminated Math in my original questions, and it didn't. DGB mentioned it's original paranoia that Math might think he was being tested. When DGB explained the timeline in 289 there was no mention of a concern it was being manipulated into SRing Nero. But, after I revealed what I had been looking for in an answer from DGB (evidence that Math had manipulated it), lo and behold, DGB expresses that very information I

was

looking for. I feel like DGB is trying to manipulate me into scumreading Math with this.

That's the end of the content about DGB in this post.

thats kinda dumb. I'm not sure if town Math should be worried about an invest.

I grabbed this quote while rereading because i feel like it's worth commenting that I do think town!Math worries about getting investigated here, as by his accounts, he is a weaker town player. By crumbing, he reinforces himself against false positives later, because he is worried that without a crumb he wont be believed (because he thinks of himself as a weak town player).
I also think it makes sense as scum to prepare this crumb for the same reason - to reinforce against "false" positives that Match can claim are coming from the hood rather than a scum pt.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Okay so I just finished reading through everything...I'm coming to the conclusion that D1s really frustrate me. Quick reads:

A50 - null; not enough content to read. Anyone familiar with A50's town vs scum play? I only played one game with them where they were scum and just seemed disengaged most of the time, similar to here so far.
Andre - townlean; not much content but what was there, I liked for town. reminds me of 233
CSF - mostly null; tone has seemed fine

DGB - townlean; I'm a little confused about how the whole hood thing played out but the way DGB came clean about the 'gambit' and explained the hood interactions in detail struck me as town-ish. Although, I disagree that claimed masons get targeted by scum for NK. the games I've seen so far the claimed masons/neighbors/mason-lites just get kept alive as weak PRs that people get paranoid about

Gamma - null to townlean; this seems like inquisitive town!Gamma for the most part. Seems to be a little more in the driver's seat here from other games I've played with them, but idk if that's AI
House - not sure what to make of this slot. maybe scumlean? some posts seem like they're acting from an informed position or agenda-y, but other ones also strike me as engaged and hunting. not sure if that's just busy-work, though
Kerset - null, no content
MathBlade - scumlean; I think if one of DGB or MathBlade is scum, it's this slot. Paranoia about getting investigated, "botching" the crumb/claim and then using that to cast suspicion on DGB seemed off and kinda scummy. I think they backtracked their DGB read when they realized it might get them killed either before DGB or right after
Nero - honestly, Nero is a mystery to me. Every game he seems to have a tinfoil paranoia hat on that makes no sense to me and sounds like he's just slinging conspiracy theories around and I get paranoid he's scum and then he ends up being town and his theories end up being right. I don't think I'll be on board for a D1 Nero lim
Kyo - null to townlean; thought process and questions seem like town!Kyo
Titus - townlean; much more engaged and aggressive early compared to what I saw in 233 where they were scum. They said they play very different game to game so again not sure if AI but tone strikes me as town
Wake - null, no content

VOTE: MathBlade
Hopefully I'll have more time to be around for discussion tomorrow

How does DGB's claim about the hood compare to my claim of being in Anya's hood in 233 for you? Do you feel similarities at all?

While I dont agree with a few of these reads, they do all look real. At first when I read Titus's post on how this readslist was too much effort for no scumreads I thought "yeah, I kinda buy that" but didnt go back to read this right away, and didnt say anything because Titus is scummy and even if I agree with scum it doesnt make what they're saying any more accurate. Now I've gone back to read it though in my reread and I don't agree at all so I feel like this is yet another comment from.Titus that appears agreeable on the surface.level but crumbles under any scrutiny. Like the shading she does of me. So when Titus shifted from me.to DotW it really.was just another attempt to counterwagon Gamma...

Looking more and more likely to me that Ythan, Titus, DGB is the team. Maybe DGB is just in the wrong here and I'm confbiasing after seeing a similarity to my last scumgame, so I'm going back to Titus for now.

VOTE: Titus

Strongly prefer Titus/Ythan toDay. Maybe DGB is the third but I could be reading into things

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Spoiler:

Okay so I just finished reading through everything...I'm coming to the conclusion that D1s really frustrate me. Quick reads:

A50 - null; not enough content to read. Anyone familiar with A50's town vs scum play? I only played one game with them where they were scum and just seemed disengaged most of the time, similar to here so far.
Andre - townlean; not much content but what was there, I liked for town. reminds me of 233
CSF - mostly null; tone has seemed fine
DGB - townlean; I'm a little confused about how the whole hood thing played out but the way DGB came clean about the 'gambit' and explained the hood interactions in detail struck me as town-ish. Although, I disagree that claimed masons get targeted by scum for NK. the games I've seen so far the claimed masons/neighbors/mason-lites just get kept alive as weak PRs that people get paranoid about
Gamma - null to townlean; this seems like inquisitive town!Gamma for the most part. Seems to be a little more in the driver's seat here from other games I've played with them, but idk if that's AI
House - not sure what to make of this slot. maybe scumlean? some posts seem like they're acting from an informed position or agenda-y, but other ones also strike me as engaged and hunting. not sure if that's just busy-work, though
Kerset - null, no content
MathBlade - scumlean; I think if one of DGB or MathBlade is scum, it's this slot. Paranoia about getting investigated, "botching" the crumb/claim and then using that to cast suspicion on DGB seemed off and kinda scummy. I think they backtracked their DGB read when they realized it might get them killed either before DGB or right after
Nero - honestly, Nero is a mystery to me. Every game he seems to have a tinfoil paranoia hat on that makes no sense to me and sounds like he's just slinging conspiracy theories around and I get paranoid he's scum and then he ends up being town and his theories end up being right. I don't think I'll be on board for a D1 Nero lim
Kyo - null to townlean; thought process and questions seem like town!Kyo
Titus - townlean; much more engaged and aggressive early compared to what I saw in 233 where they were scum. They said they play very different game to game so again not sure if AI but tone strikes me as town
Wake - null, no content

VOTE: MathBlade
Hopefully I'll have more time to be around for discussion tomorrow

So the only slot we're in any major disagreement on is MathBlade, but I'm scum?

Also, on this, when you read like 650 posts and are forming one-liner reads on every player in your first post based on impressions, I think it's easy to not recognize every stance a specific player has taken, and not bias yourself into TRing someone for having similar views. This doubt of yours aligns with the "mindmeld" reasoning you yourself provided for TRing Nero earlier though, so this weighs +town. I'd just like to point out the doubt is likely misplaced if you actually think about the context of Dragon's post

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Is Ythan a better wagon than Titus though? I feel like he's big dipped and is just turtling until the storm passes

[MathBlade]

I feel like shit and am going to take a nap.

There’s a fuck ton of walls and my eyes are glazing over.

Simple two second case why Titus Kyo?

[Ythan]

Is Ythan a better wagon than Titus though? I feel like he's big dipped and is just turtling until the storm passes

The fuck are you even talking about

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Is Ythan a better wagon than Titus though? I feel like he's big dipped and is just turtling until the storm passes

The fuck are you even talking about

your predecessor was scum and you haven't caught up yet as I recall - feels like you're dragging out catching up until your wagon disappears while your scumbuddy Titus pushes me and then DotW for a counterwagon.

[MathBlade]

What made you reread Titus’s posts Kyo?

Sick Math trying to read things so don’t ramble please.

I kinda think Titus is town unless it’s Titus + (redacted) but don’t wanna say who yet or why.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Hence it feels like you're "turtling", like hiding in a shell while things around you get wild. If you keep your head down long enough people may forget why they were voting Gamma in the first place

[Ythan]

Is Ythan a better wagon than Titus though? I feel like he's big dipped and is just turtling until the storm passes

The fuck are you even talking about

your predecessor was scum and you haven't caught up yet as I recall - feels like you're dragging out catching up until your wagon disappears while your scumbuddy Titus pushes me and then DotW for a counterwagon.

I joined this over forty page game yesterday while I was at work and worked on catching up after getting home until literally two am fuck off.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

What made you reread Titus’s posts Kyo?

Sick Math trying to read things so don’t ramble please.

I kinda think Titus is town unless it’s Titus + (redacted) but don’t wanna say who yet or why.

I'm rereading from the beginning right now. Maybe yesterday I reread Titus? I could check my ISO and I'd probably remember why if that was the case, but I'm forgetful and have already forgotten if I did.
Also I swear to christ you said the exact same thing about Titus in the last game she was town and you were scum >_>

[MathBlade]

What made you reread Titus’s posts Kyo?

Sick Math trying to read things so don’t ramble please.

I kinda think Titus is town unless it’s Titus + (redacted) but don’t wanna say who yet or why.

I'm rereading from the beginning right now. Maybe yesterday I reread Titus? I could check my ISO and I'd probably remember why if that was the case, but I'm forgetful and have already forgotten if I did.
Also I swear to christ you said the exact same thing about Titus in the last game she was town and you were scum >_>

That doesn’t answer the what/why you started a reread.

And possible. I keep town and scum meta similar as I hate town/scum tells and would rather be read by the quality of posts I provide not some syntactical crap.

[MathBlade]

I feel like you don’t have any strong reads.

I skimmed your wall and you said I am town math.
If you think I am town why the shade?

Can you just lay out your current reads or theories no long winded explanation?

[ssbm_Kyouko]

I feel like shit and am going to take a nap.

There’s a fuck ton of walls and my eyes are glazing over.

Simple two second case why Titus Kyo?

Didn't see this.

She shades/cases/pushes, whatever you want to call it, with posts that look believable on the surface, but when you really read into them even slightly it becomes apparent they're faulty. The shade also is conveniently directed in a way that appears to feed the agenda of "get a counterwagon to Gamma/Ythan off the ground to prevent that slot from getting eliminated."

[MathBlade]

I feel like shit and am going to take a nap.

There’s a fuck ton of walls and my eyes are glazing over.

Simple two second case why Titus Kyo?

Didn't see this.

She shades/cases/pushes, whatever you want to call it, with posts that look believable on the surface, but when you really read into them even slightly it becomes apparent they're faulty. The shade also is conveniently directed in a way that appears to feed the agenda of "get a counterwagon to Gamma/Ythan off the ground to prevent that slot from getting eliminated."

Then why push Titus who has no votes over Gamma/Ythan slot?

Gamma/Ythan slot is probably town here. I am not seeing anything blatantly scummy here.
I don’t get how you pivoted from DGB to Titus.

[MathBlade]

Yeah, Kyouko is scum.

Join me on DotW. Kyouko doesn't seem interested there. If it flips red, bigger case there.

Give me a minute. I think if Kyo is scum she’s doing something specific. But I am not sure if she is.

Minimum she still needs avatar jail. So many similar avatars.

[Ythan]

I would use a blue haired version if I wasn't bound by a sacred bet.

[DrippingGoofball]

UNVOTE: Too many nuances, and back-and-forth, in Kyouko's analyses to come from scum.

[Nero Cain]

I'd vastly prefer DGB/ythan/math over Titus. I mean maybe Titus is just scum that knows my reads are bad instead of being town that is talking out of her ass but she's sorta null town for me.

[DrippingGoofball]

maybe Titus is just scum that knows my reads are bad

She could even be town who knows your reads are bad!

[Nero Cain]

says the person thats voted nothing but town today.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

What made you reread Titus’s posts Kyo?

Sick Math trying to read things so don’t ramble please.

I kinda think Titus is town unless it’s Titus + (redacted) but don’t wanna say who yet or why.

I'm rereading from the beginning right now. Maybe yesterday I reread Titus? I could check my ISO and I'd probably remember why if that was the case, but I'm forgetful and have already forgotten if I did.
Also I swear to christ you said the exact same thing about Titus in the last game she was town and you were scum >_>

That doesn’t answer the what/why you started a reread.

And possible. I keep town and scum meta similar as I hate town/scum tells and would rather be read by the quality of posts I provide not some syntactical crap.

I mean, technically the

!

and

"teapot read"

were accurate last time. Not like I'm not going to read you over syntax because you prefer not to be read that way. That said, I don't think you would intentionally repeat things to me so soon after that game, so probably in this case this is just how you talk and it's NAI.

I feel like you don’t have any strong reads.

I skimmed your wall and you said I am town math.
If you think I am town why the shade?

Can you just lay out your current reads or theories no long winded explanation?

What shade?

Current reads

Town: Nero, Math, House
The Verge: Kerset, CSF, Wake
POE: Dragon, Andres,

(there's a 13th player I'm forgetting is in the game)

Almost50
The bad verge: DGB
Scum: Titus, Ythan

Gamestate theory: DGB has either been unfortunate to be on the wrong wagon at the wrong time more than once and the situation is being taken advantage of by Titus, or it is just scum with Titus. Titus is diverting attention from the Gamma/Ythan wagon because they are buddies and Titus is not above defending a buddy as scum. There may be scum taking advantage of Nero's aggressiveness towards Gamma pre-replace regardless of Gamma/Ythan's alignment.

[Ythan]

Hence it feels like you're "turtling", like hiding in a shell while things around you get wild. If you keep your head down long enough people may forget why they were voting Gamma in the first place

Also how is this an opinion you form while last I recall seeing I had two votes at most while Dragon is at last I checked -2.