Open 832: Nightless Exploder Pandemonium III - Game Over

[Not_Mafia]

VC 1.05

Pavowski (0)-

schadd_ (0)-

T3 (1)-

StrangeMatter

innocentvillager (0)-

charlemagne (0)-

cowsloveSushirolls (4)-

charlemagne, PookyTheMagicalBear, T3, Pavowski

PookyTheMagicalBear (0)-

Enchant (0)-

numberQ (2)-

innocentvillager, schadd_

StrangeMatter (1)-

cowsloveSushirolls

Almost50 (1)-

numberQ

Clemency (0)-

Not Voting (3)-

Enchant, Clemency, Almost50

With

12

alive, it takes

7

to instantly eliminate.

Deadline is in

(expired on 2021-10-30 21:00:00)

- Oct 30th 21:00 GMT

[Almost50]

VOTE: numberQ

[cowsloveSushirolls]

I agreed with a lot of stuff in 201 so that’s good I guess?

why aren't you unvoting numberq/putting in the work to find partners then?

[cowsloveSushirolls]

Going to put my 10 cents into this but I really don't think its a good idea to put people at L-1 (Isn't it called E-1 though?),

especially since pressure should never be based off only votes, rather if you have a question to ask, you should ask it.

does this mean that you aren't actually suspecting T3 right now? who are your current suspects?

[cowsloveSushirolls]

why aren't you unvoting numberq/

putting in the work to find partners then?

okay i'm giving you an out here because this phase is unique in that mafia surrender if you find and lim just one but i don't see why numberq nets the highest chance of being mafia here

[innocentvillager]

I mean I see where your enchant partner thing is coming from it’s just that one post which I feel is kinda weak but I see it ig

like I can definitely see numberQ partnered with non enchant, one vote is hardly a flashwagon

[innocentvillager]

I don’t feel that I have anyone better to vote aorn

[innocentvillager]

idk this slot just feels a little uninspiring ya kno

[innocentvillager]

I would vote pavowski too

[innocentvillager]

I would vote pavowski too

[numberQ]

Some weird parts that stuck out to me in cow's 201:

no flashwagons please

I’m finally town lol

What's wrong with flash wagons? I like them.

likes flashwagons, doesn't participate in one right in front of him. feelsbad (and as silly as it is for me to suggest this, gives points to enchant/numberq?)

There was no flash wagon happening when I said that

like i think number's kinda scummy but the ball of wifom comes into play when you think about what the average scum pt here would have
like i'd imagine it would dive into mechanics/the scum gameplan right away since the game's supposed to be fast paced

number's oblivious to both of these which if he's mafia i'd imagine would only make sense if neither of his partners bothered to talk about it or he's wifoming it up with whatever scumteam
and i think the former's more likely than the latter because it's super ballsy to fake townslip (for lack of a better phrase) twice and not do anything when nobody bites

What do you mean that I'm oblivious to the mechanics/scum gameplan? The former, okay sure, I asked about strategies and had forgotten about the insta-lose thing. But at best that's null imo, scum could easily fake lack of knowledge, and even more easily probe for town strats. As for the latter, how would you know whether or not I'm oblivious to the scum gameplan? Not sure what was meant by that statement.

so the questions if you want to tinfoil are

- who are we looking for?
- are those people that fall under the above scummy?
i'll find that out tomorrow i guess

I want to answer this but I also want time to think it through, I'll put a pin in it until later.

so yeah, i actually don't have any suspects LOL
but i did think that while making this post that i'm cutting clemency and strangematter too much slack so i think that i start there

Felt like you were building a case on me there, is the "townslipping would be too ballsy" logic really strong enough to start probing elsewhere?

---

I'm at work right now and haven't done much but skim after 201, will post more thoughts later tonight.

[StrangeMatter]

Going to put my 10 cents into this but I really don't think its a good idea to put people at L-1 (Isn't it called E-1 though?),

especially since pressure should never be based off only votes, rather if you have a question to ask, you should ask it.

does this mean that you aren't actually suspecting T3 right now? who are your current suspects?

Well first that was an RVS vote and I never actually went off it. Secondly, I don't feel like I have any good suspects. I'm at the point of this game where I have no clue what's serious or not, and whether I should or shouldn't be posting about something or making questions for it. Seriously, I thought the CLSR wagon was a little odd then I looked at the posts and asked myself, is this a joke? I think I'm going a little crazy asking myself this question too much.

However, I don't like the post that said its fine to put people at L-1/L-2, which to me seems a little scum motivated.

[StrangeMatter]

Alright let me catch up

well i can tell you i chose a person to vote based on their posting

There's one point of charlemagne's #100 I particularly agree with, that we shouldn't be afraid of L-2/1.

I want to see reactions from people under pressure, and if scum do bumrush a wagon like that near the end, that seems like some prime explode bait to me. I think if it really is just a meme wagon with no substance or scrutiny, sure, avoid that. But the memery has slowed down and there's a lot of actual scumhunting going on, so I'm all for the wagoning.

Can you explain why we shouldn't be afraid of L-2/L-1?

[Pavowski]

why not give him the benefit of the doubt and ask?

No benefit

Only doubt

[T3]

UNVOTE: cows

lots of fluff but i don't like this wagon anymre

[Pavowski]

Going to put my 10 cents into this but I really don't think its a good idea to put people at L-1 (Isn't it called E-1 though?), especially since pressure should never be based off only votes, rather if you have a question to ask, you should ask it. Although, I don't think I can elaborate any more than that without snapping a rule.

Getting a little meta here, but there is more than one kind of pressure. There's pressure from questions and pointing out inconsistencies, and then there's pressure from threat of elimination. They're not the same but they do both create, well, pressure.

(Yes, it's e-1.)

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

UNVOTE: cows

lots of fluff but i don't like this wagon anymre

so basically T3 finally read the part that says he loses if he busses on d1

[Pavowski]

Alright let me catch up

well i can tell you i chose a person to vote based on their posting

There's one point of charlemagne's #100 I particularly agree with, that we shouldn't be afraid of L-2/1.

I want to see reactions from people under pressure, and

if scum do bumrush a wagon like that near the end, that seems like some prime explode bait to me.

I think if it really is just a meme wagon with no substance or scrutiny, sure, avoid that. But the memery has slowed down and there's a lot of actual scumhunting going on, so I'm all for the wagoning.

Can you explain why we shouldn't be afraid of L-2/L-1?

Not to butt in on a conversation that doesn't involve me, but I think his post there kinda answers it.

Town can't lose in the first phase here, but scum can, and anybody jumping on an e-1 vote to hammer somebody -- especially at this point -- is gonna get some sideways glances in future rounds

[cowsloveSushirolls]

UNVOTE: cows

lots of fluff but i don't like this wagon anymre

so basically T3 finally read the part that says he loses if he busses on d1

real scum t3 would hardroll traitor novice exploder then fake a cop sided on me

[cowsloveSushirolls]

There was no flash wagon happening when I said that

wording error of mine, i mean that there was an opportunity to help create one and you just voted the person who wanted to

What do you mean that I'm oblivious to the mechanics/scum gameplan? The former, okay sure, I asked about strategies and had forgotten about the insta-lose thing. But at best that's null imo, scum could easily fake lack of knowledge, and even more easily probe for town strats. As for the latter, how would you know whether or not I'm oblivious to the scum gameplan? Not sure what was meant by that statement.

well, i might be projecting a bit when making these awesome logical leaps
as scum i never try to fake townslips because it always feels more fulfilling to get townread for other reasons
in fact i think it's kinda scummy
are you that kind of person, numberq?

i think the use of the word "oblivious" is also wrong, unaware seems better
because oblivious, to me, seems like it would imply that there's a world that you're with XXX scumteam who talked about mechanics and you didn't bother to absorb any of it
but i heavily doubt that one's the case. i may not have answered your question here so get back to me

Felt like you were building a case on me there, is the "townslipping would be too ballsy" logic really strong enough to start probing elsewhere?

yeah it was a case but voting you would mean that i'd have to ignore both slips you did, your earlier logs and assume that the rest of the scumteam is the people that haven't talked about mechanics here
i don't know you, but why wouldn't it be? i think mafia isn't above using really easy ways to get townread (would assume at least one mafia in the mechanics spammers for ex) but townslipping isn't really one i expect to be that reliable, and so i dont imagine scum doing it in the first place

[cowsloveSushirolls]

UNVOTE: cows

lots of fluff

but i don't like this wagon anymre

shunt up pee three

I mean I see where your enchant partner thing is coming from it’s just that one post which I feel is kinda weak but I see it ig

like I can definitely see numberQ partnered with non enchant, one vote is hardly a flashwagon

the chainsaw thing is definitely weak but i'm somewhat proud of everything else

--
i like strange's 236 but it's another one of those things that you gotta sleep on

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

the way you play this game is

if you throw someone into the river

and they drown

they're probly innocent

if they won't die

they're probably a witch

[charlemagne]

liking numberq, kind of been constant on cows (their posts have had me going back and forth a little bit), very uncomfortable with strangematter's posts in general because they seem "slippery" in a way that i think I'll be able to better elaborate when i'm less tired, but for now have a VOTE: strangematter

[numberQ]

Kind of doing this piecemeal, so there may be more I want to comment on between my last post and this one. Wanted to get this out though.

VOTE: cows

The vote on strange makes no sense, and somehow putting Clem and Strange on similar footing here also makes no sense

Gonna move my vote due to this post. A50 feels like a dead end anyway, didn't really get a reaction like I wanted other than what looks like OMGUS retaliation. Which, maybe a scumtell? But eh I don't think so. Plus, after some reflection I think it's just his posting style that I struggle to understand. Which is not necessarily scummy.

Pav on the other hand is pinging me hard with this one. Made me look through his iso, and every single post can come from a scum or null POV. Very little looks town-oriented imo.

ISO 0-3 are RVS or contentless, which is fine for early game.

ISO 4 is him giving me town points because I basically said "everyone's shitposting so what do?" Not sure I get why that's +town. I was not under too much scrutiny at the time aside from a single vote from A50, so this feels like scum!Pav pretending to analyze.

ISO 5 is unvoting Clem, I assume because RVS was over. Null.

ISO 6 is giving out a few vague yet fairly popular reads. Again, scum pretending to analyze without rocking the boat.

ISO 7 + 8 are null.

ISO 9 is the one I quoted at the top of the post, and it feels so weird. Why does the Strange vote make no sense? I mean, okay, I was kind of saying the same thing in my last post when I found it odd that cows was analyzing me so much then turned around to vote Strange. But Pav doesn't mention that at all, for some reason it's cows mentioning Clem that is suspicious? I don't buy it. This is scum!Pav finding a reason to jump on a wagon.

ISO 10 is null.

ISO 11 + 12 is IIOA. Scumtell only with other scummy context, which in this case, means it's a scumtell.

VOTE: Pavowski

Is anyone getting a different read from Pav's ISO?

[numberQ]

[snip]

I want to see reactions from people under pressure, and if scum do bumrush a wagon like that near the end, that seems like some prime explode bait to me. I think if it really is just a meme wagon with no substance or scrutiny, sure, avoid that. But the memery has slowed down and there's a lot of actual scumhunting going on, so I'm all for the wagoning.

Can you explain why we shouldn't be afraid of L-2/L-1?

I snipped out my post that you quoted but left the part where I explicitly explain why we shouldn't be afraid of L-2/L-1. Is my explanation unsatisfactory and/or do you disagree?

---

I like cow's 244, particularly the last part. Puts his 201 in a context I wasn't getting at the time.

---

2 votes on Strange. 1 from cow on the basis that cow thinks he's cutting Strange too much slack, but then as far as I can tell slack continues to be cut. And the 2nd from charlemagne because Strange is "slippery". I'm kind of null on Strange right now, would love to hear if there's anything concrete behind these votes. charlemagne already said he'll elaborate later - @cows, what's with the vote and subsequent ignoring of Strange?