[setup] Commandless Chain of Command

[Datisi]

the dream of fixing chain of command is not dead. and since i see the micro queue is kind of empty at the moment...

commandless chain of command

7 x

townies

2 x

mafia

first, the moderator flips a coin to see whether there will be 2 or 3 town power roles in the setup.

if there are 2 town power roles in the game:
- 2 random power roles are chosen from the list and given to town.
- the mafia is factionally informed of 1 random power role that is not in the game.

if there are 3 town power roles in the game:
- 3 random power roles are chosen from the list and given to town.
- the mafia is factionally informed of 1 random power role that is not in the game.
- the mafia is given a 1-shot factional roleblock. like the factional nightkill, it has to be assigned to one of the mafia members, and it is visible to trackers/watchers.

the mafia is able to multitask. both mafia members always flip as mafia goons.

the list of possible roles in the game is:

• babysitter
  
• doctor
  
• tracker
  
• lazy jailkeeper
  
• lazy roleblocker
  
• 1-shot friendly neighbour
  
• 1-shot neapolitan
  
• 1-shot loyal vigilante
  
• 1-shot watcher

if nobody yells at me and tells me that this is a horrible idea and that i should delete my mafiascum account and never come to this website again, i am probably queueing this sometime soon-ish. a sanity check would be appreciated, though.

[Datisi]

1-shot gunsmith feels like a way too polarized role wrt usefulness for town and scum. slapping an ascetic onto it fixes it a little bit i think?

[Datisi]

"why don't i try to balance and de-swing one of the most unbalanced and swingy micro setups," said datisi

adding lazy to jailkeeper and roleblocker, putting a 1-shot loyal vig in the game, and also babysitter? lmao

[Datisi]

yeah, probably. i would like another gunsmith-positive role, though. is 1-shot neap instead of the vengeful too strong for town?

[Datisi]

loyal vengeful, sure

but rolecop is muh gunsmith false positive >_>

[Datisi]

i will remove it if isis thinks it should be removed because isis is smarter at mafia than i am

[Datisi]

hmm, maybe

is 1-shot neap too strong for town, though? the vanilla cop seems decently like a downgrade from the rolecop, which i'm pretty eh on

[Datisi]

i thought of detective, but it feels like a second tracker, except one that can almost get only guilties. also i don't want a lot of roles that go too high up in power once one scum is dead, i'm still pretending like i know things about balance and swing

[Datisi]

i bullied isis on discord and she told me that 1-shot neap is prob fine so we're yeeting that in

[Datisi]

is the game that unbalanced with the possibility of scum getting a power role?

i was thinking about making a rule where the pr assignment is rerolled if both scum land a pr, since that sounds pretty brutal for town, but then i decided against it as it would then conftown the other two prs if the scum one were to flip. but if the game is that scumsided, maybe that would bring it into the right direction?

[Datisi]

hm, i see. what do you mean by make the information factional? inform scum what pr(s) were they "supposed" to rand, or?

loyal can be removed from the vengeful, but i want *something* to make it a bit less powerful, at least something that makes it unable to act in lylo. and 1-shot vig still sounds pretty powerful, so maybe keep the loyal on that one?

[Datisi]

alright, that sounds decent. inform scum of what roles were they supposed to roll, disable vengeful in lylo. and also in mylo?

i guess this slightly buffs the gunsmith for town (since no more mafia doctor false negatives), but also nerfs it since scum has theoretically more room to safely fakeclaim gunsmith positive roles.

maybe i should remove the ascetic from the gunsmith, then?

[Datisi]

aight. thanks, s_s!

[Datisi]

ok, i finally updated the op. scum don't actually get to use those roles, no.

[Datisi]

i mean, if i had wanted a non-mech game, i would've ran nightless vanilla

does the mech break all reads and turn the game into townofsalem-esque clusterfuck? if not, i thiiink it's fine

[Datisi]

that's not a bad idea. the first thing that comes to mind is...

if town gets all 3 power roles, scum gets a factional 1-shot strongman or 1-shot ninja - they choose which one they'd want to use and when, and both scum still flip as a goon (to make sure that the game doesn't become way too broken by conftowning all 3 power roles).

if scum gets 1 or 2 power roles, they don't receive them, and instead get a factional informed that tells them which roles were they supposed to get.

[Datisi]

oh wait, considering scum *always* flips goon regardless of what they rolled, i can make it so that the power role distribution is rerolled if it happens that scum has 2/3 power roles. so that it's guaranteed town will have either 2 or 3 of them.

[Datisi]

though, if a pr-claiming scum does flip, i guess the problem remains that the town is somewhat likely to realize scum fakeclaimed due to their informed modifier, therefore the other two prs are town...

[Datisi]

Maybe scum could be informed of a few unused roles if they don't get any PR's?

that's a possibility. i first thought of strongman/ninja since (other than the obvious benefits) that adds more ~ambiguity~ to the validity of power role claims, and also lets scum fakeclaim them more easily, but if that's too strong against 3 town prs...

if town has 3 power roles, scum being informed of 3 random power roles not in the game is also a possibility? i can't tell which one is supposed to be better right now, it's way too late (like i would usually know)

[Datisi]

the above post is a "someone tell me what to do, i am an idiot when it comes to balance"

[Datisi]

after more bullying taking place on discord, this time of s_s, the following changes take place:
- removing the gunsmith and vengeful
- adding a 1-shot friendly neighbour
- changing some aspects of setup generation, read op

[Datisi]

okay, so the first run is over: viewtopic.php?f=83&t=88294

i will definitely be removing the vig from the 9p version.

this is the rough draft from the mod pt for an eventual 13p version:

okay, in this post i will start drafting a 13p version of this game because why not

33/33/33 chance the game has 3/4/5 power roles

possible power roles would be
- babysitter
- doctor
- motion detector
- tracker
- voyeur
- 1-shot cop
- 1-shot friendly neighbour
- 1-shot watcher
- 2-shot alien
- lazy jailkeeper
- lazy roleblocker
- odd-night neapolitan
- universal backup

i wanna wait on seeing how a loyal vig works out this game to tell for sure if i wanna keep it in or not, but i'm kinda leaning on no? maybe potentially include a hider or a vengeful now that there's 13p but i'll wait until this game is over and the mechanically smart people can help me out here. also i have no idea what the gates on the watcher and alien should be but something something first draft etc

anyway, scum is always informed of 2 town power roles that are not in the game. they are also multitasking and can use as many of these as they want in the same night.

if there are 4 power roles in the game, i'd give them a factional 1-shot roleblock, 1-shot rolecop, 1-shot ascetic

if there are 5 power roles in the game, they get a factional 1-shot roleblock, 1-shot rolecop, 1-shot ascetic, 1-shot ninja, 1-shot strongman

i kiiiinda wanna give them a 1-shot rolecop if 3 town power roles to keep the "scum gets extra 2 powers for every extra town power role" symmetry

[Datisi]

yeah, i wasn't sure what gate to put there so

what are other cool scum powers i could put there?

[Datisi]

i bullied s_s some more yesterday and the following is what we came up with:

commandless chain of command with 13 players

10 x

townies

3 x

mafia

a 1d3 is rolled to see whether the setup will have 3, 4, or 5 town power roles.

if there are 3 town power roles in the game:

• 3 random town power roles are chosen from the list and given to town.
  
• the mafia is factionally informed of 2 random power roles that are not in the game.

if there are 4 town power roles in the game:

• 4 random town power roles are chosen from the list and given to town.
  
• the mafia is factionally informed of 2 random power roles that are not in the game.
  
• the mafia is given a 2-shot factional reporting roleblock.

if there are 5 town power roles in the game:

• 5 random town power roles are chosen from the list and given to town.
  
• the mafia is factionally informed of 2 random power roles that are not in the game.
  
• the mafia is given a factional reporting roleblock.

the mafia has daytalk and is able to multitask. all members of the mafia always flip as mafia goons.

factional reporting roleblock is a roleblock shot that also informs the mafia whether they have successfully blocked an action with it, and refunds the shot if they haven't. like the factional nightkill, it has to be assigned to a member of the mafia to be carried out, it is visible to trackers / watchers / motion detectors / voyeurs, and it can be blocked.

the list of possible town power roles in the game is:

• babysitter
  
• doctor
  
• motion detector
  
• tracker
  
• voyeur
  
• lazy jailkeeper
  
• odd-night neapolitan
  
• 1-shot cop
  
• 1-shot neighborizer
  
• 2-shot non-consecutive night watcher
  
• 2-shot alien
  
• universal backup

all town power roles are in their normal variant, and that is how they are categorized for the voyeur.

sample role pm's:

Spoiler:

vanilla townie

welcome,

playername

. you are a

vanilla townie

.

role abilities:

~ you have no special abilities.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

town babysitter

welcome,

playername

. you are a

town babysitter

.

role abilities:

~ each night, you may target a player. assuming no interference with your action, that player will be protected from one direct kill, but will die if you are killed.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

town doctor

welcome,

playername

. you are a

town doctor

.

role abilities:

~ each night, you may target a player. assuming no interference with your action, that player will be protected from one kill that night.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

town motion detector

welcome,

playername

. you are a

town motion detector

.

role abilities:

~ each night, you may target a player. assuming no interference with your action, you will learn learn if any actions were performed by or on that player, but not what the actions were or who else they involved.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

town tracker

welcome,

playername

. you are a

town tracker

.

role abilities:

~ each night, you may target a player. assuming no interference with your action, you will learn who that player targeted that night. you will get "no result" if this action is blocked.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

town voyeur

welcome,

playername

. you are a

town voyeur

.

role abilities:

~ each night, you may target a player. assuming no interference with your action, you will learn learn what was done to them that night (protection, investigation, etc), but not who did it.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

town lazy jailkeeper

welcome,

playername

. you are a

town lazy jailkeeper

.

role abilities:

~ each night, if at least two anti-town players were alive at the start of the night, you may target a player. assuming no interference with your action, you will simultaneously roleblock that player, and protect that player from any number of nightkills.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

town odd-night neapolitan

welcome,

playername

. you are a

town odd-night neapolitan

.

role abilities:

~ each odd-numbered night, you may target a player. assuming no interference with your action, you will learn whether or not that player is a

vanilla townie

.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

town 1-shot cop

welcome,

playername

. you are a

town 1-shot cop

.

role abilities:

~ once during the game, at night, you may target a player. assuming no interference with your action, you will learn whether that player is aligned with the

town

or the

mafia

.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

town 1-shot neapolitan

welcome,

playername

. you are a

town 1-shot neighborizer

.

role abilities:

~ once during the game, at night, you may target a player. assuming no interference with your action, you will recruit them into a neighborhood with you.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

town 2-shot non-consecutive night watcher

welcome,

playername

. you are a

town 2-shot non-consecutive night watcher

.

role abilities:

~ twice during the game, but only on non-consecutive nights, you may target a player. assuming no interference with your action, you will learn which other players targeted that player that night.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

town 2-shot alien

welcome,

playername

. you are a

town 2-shot alien

.

role abilities:

~ twice during the game, at night, you may target a player. assuming no interference with your action, all actions used by that player that night, and all other actions targeted at that player that night, will be blocked.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

town universal backup

welcome,

playername

. you are a

town universal backup

.

role abilities:

~ You will inherit the role of town power roles who die, losing this ability in the process.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

mafia goon

welcome,

playername

. you are a

mafia goon

.

factional abilities:

~ you are a member of the mafia, along with

playername

and

playername

.
~ once every night, a living member of the mafia may submit a factional kill action.
~ you may talk with your living teammates in the mafia private topic, located here. you may talk there at any time as long as you are alive.
~ you are factionally informed that there are

three

town power roles in the game. additionally, you are aware that [town role] and [town role] are

not

in the game.

role abilities:

~ you have no special abilities.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to the mafia (or nothing can prevent this from occurring) and at least one mafia player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name or by posting in the mafia pt.

mafia goon

welcome,

playername

. you are a

mafia goon

.

factional abilities:

~ you are a member of the mafia, along with

playername

and

playername

.
~ once every night, a living member of the mafia may submit a factional kill action.
~ twice during the game, at night, a living member of the mafia may submit a factional reporting roleblock action. you will be informed whether you have successfully blocked an action with it. additionally, you will be refunded the shot if you have not blacked an action with it.
~ you may talk with your living teammates in the mafia private topic, located here. you may talk there at any time as long as you are alive.
~ you are factionally informed that there are

four

town power roles in the game. additionally, you are aware that [town role] and [town role] are

not

in the game.

role abilities:

~ you have no special abilities.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to the mafia (or nothing can prevent this from occurring) and at least one mafia player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name or by posting in the mafia pt.

mafia goon

welcome,

playername

. you are a

mafia goon

.

factional abilities:

~ you are a member of the mafia, along with

playername

and

playername

.
~ once every night, a living member of the mafia may submit a factional kill action.
~ once every night, a living member of the mafia may submit a factional reporting roleblock action. you will be informed whether you have successfully blocked an action with it.
~ you may talk with your living teammates in the mafia private topic, located here. you may talk there at any time as long as you are alive.
~ you are factionally informed that there are

five

town power roles in the game. additionally, you are aware that [town role] and [town role] are

not

in the game.

role abilities:

~ you have no special abilities.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to the mafia (or nothing can prevent this from occurring) and at least one mafia player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name or by posting in the mafia pt.