Omg so many pages since last night. Good trust is good. I'll read the last ten pages later but anything I should know so I can try some phone posting today?
i really don't understand why hem would say me+shiki in finals when he was so certain that me+enchant are scum partners
MY PRONOUNS ARE THEY/THEM
do not assume my posts follow coherency they do not imagine that every time i post i put half of my knowledge into a clone and then the clone murders me
I could see that interp, maybe. I don't have much xp with Andante. In the moment it felt a little like it could be scum coming back to a thread, seeing things shaping up some kind of way, and trying to shoot their shot
I'm biased against assuming somebody doesn't know what's going on in general though I've occasionally done it myself... In this very thread, even
Why the worst is an evil scummy evil scum scummy scum scum mafia duck
Spoiler:
In post 856, the worst wrote:i'd be fine with ench/hem. i think enchant is honestly too abstract to leave clear associatives, so that world probably defaults to us yelling at each other until the most charismatic players exit two by two.
In post 901, chavela wrote:and it’s not like enchant always plays that way - my experience of town!enchant was much more downhill then that, but idk if the difference can be explained by the setup, potentially can
probably partly. idk if it helps but i think enchant is kinda towny partly because they're playing so loose. it's pretty hard to tell what they're thinking but they're making like literally no strides to be any combination of trustworthy, earnest, charismatic, etc.
i don't really feel like enchant is the type of player to take a setup like this (one pocketed towny can be insta-win) and just nosedive into an anti-charisma playstyle?
In post 979, the worst wrote:soulread, i don't think they're playing a scumgame.
i'd also be really sad if they accepted regardless of their alignment so i have decided to not
...and this is where they go off the rails.
So this seems like a half serious/half joke idea, the worst just happened to think of trusting Kuriyama! Very normal stuff.
Thing is, I think these posts have 2 purposes:
1. Pocket Kuriyama (who I don't get the impression is scum) by making such a suggestion in the first place
2. just generally nudge us towards going for an option other than Enchant/HEM.
They're challenging the status quo.
Spoiler:
In post 985, the worst wrote:if we need to cut the hem/enchant convo in half i'll trust enchant. i just trust myself lategame more than i trust myself earlygame. but if i'm in a sticky slot then etc.
Oh and right after the idea of trusting Kuriyama, it's now the more serious suggestion of perhaps trusting Enchant to "cut the hem/enchant convo in half", which feels kinda odd since yknow, there's nothing stopping us from diverting from the convo? and it's unnecessarily risky? Why the need to say this?
Spoiler:
In post 982, the worst wrote:kuri/hem/chavela, would you consider this game significantly easier to solve with my flip or no? i don't really have a sense for it yet.
pedit: knew i could trust u kuri <3
Guys... I totally don't want to leave or to change the outcome of this day but, how would you feel about me leaving?
I think this post was made in bad faith. Also HEM's point about charm is significant when looking at this post.
In post 989, humaneatingmonkey wrote:hold on so why do that trust, the worst? what's the rush? don't you want me and enchant to finally leave the game?
i would do it because i do not think that enchant would accept it!
In post 994, the worst wrote:increases enchant's town equity a lot, which makes this convo more interesting
In post 1000, the worst wrote:if you don't think it's worth the risk: what are you doing to avoid an enchant flip?
? enchant flips at status quo? and i have said multiple times i might trust before i am going to be absent again if it seems correct to me
so you offering enchant just adds variables
yes it does. i feel like you're seeing a problem in this but i genuinely don't see what you're seeing. variables which conform with gamestate & reads are rad.
In post 1015, the worst wrote:it would mean i can disrupt a conversation which is getting stale. i'm actually pleased the convo changed from enchant's alignment because i don't think that convo is productive.
the worst is on board with the idea of changing the gamestate and risking changing the outcome of the day... to slightly spice up conversation in a game that's not really lacking talking points, with a day about to end and a generally short format. I think this is just the worst's attempt to nudge us away from the option we had chosen up to that point, by suggesting new trusts be made. All while not being too blatant.
if there are uncertainties about enchant's alignment, the answer is simple. someone who doesn't townread enchant needs to disrupt status quo because they think scum are about to flip.
pondering endlessly about enchant's alignment without doing anything to advance reads or check other players' alignments is a waste of posts. mafia games get too fluffed up with that kinda stuff. let's be productive.
In post 1017, chavela wrote:weigh in on conversations being had about other players alignments then? or start those conversations?
i think enchant is town and i think town are leading this game! i'm quite pleased with status quo. are you not?
Oh boy... if the worst really is scum as I suspect, this is hilarious projection
I think the bit in italics is the most damning. the worst apparently is fine with Enchant/HEM leaving, the
status quo
. However, they
REALLY
want to make sure that if
ANYONE
wants to challenge that status quo, that they do it. It comes off as reasonable and just wanting to make sure all perspectives get considered before EoD, but it's pushing others towards doing their dirty work for them. To dismantle the established town core and stop the trust likely to be happening.
they claim to be pleased with the status quo... while also being the person challenging it the most. Their actions just do not align with what they claim their intent to be.
Spoiler:
In post 1044, the worst wrote:my shoulder devil was like "heyyy duck what if we trusted kuriyama....." but then i decided not to. there's not much more to it than that sorry, just a whim.
Okay... so it was just a whim despite them taking the idea pretty seriously in 979
Spoiler:
In post 1049, the worst wrote:it's quite hard to guess. scum are comfortable with the status quo, or scum feel unable to influence the status quo, or bugspray is scum. fwiw i do think the current core is quite hard to interfere with.
Yeah I think the worst's perspective here is from scum, unsatisfied with a town core that doesn't serve his mafia team, but who feels powerless against it. This also makes sense considering I'm under the impression the worst's partner was not active near EoD, so those feelings would stick out
"who is the towniest out of the names you just said and why"
Bugspray probably! I haven't analyzed your content to the same extent I have with the other 3 I mentioned, so I'm not totally sure about you tbh.
I'd say from most towny to least towny between you 4 at the moment it'd be:
Bugspray (806, 814, 823)
Ydra
Pav (804, 826)
Greeting (683)
I'm probably gonna try to get a better read on you 4 ASAP to get a stronger general read on the game, although I should probably avoid just completely assuming the worst is mafia, cause then if they aren't my whole perception of the game is wrong
variables which conform with gamestate & reads are rad.
