Micro 1050 | Ace Attorney: The Trial of Lotta Hart | End

[koopashell]

It would be indeed good if you tell us the reason. I have to agree with the bulge here. On the other hand, bulge, what's your stance on the radical rat post?

i don't think it was all that scummy

Why was that not scummy, but my actions worth questioning?
Seems like you are treating me differently than RR here.

??

I'm essentially implying that if I was in a position, where the thread was closed, and I was to choose 2 players and they both had to be wolves, or else we lose, my top 2 candidates would be Radical Rat and yourself due to how you are giving Radical Rat a pass for something very clearly a fishing attempt, while showing overt criticism for me attempting to push the game forward, and painting my actions in a way that is worse.

Do you have any gut reads, if any, other than me as wolf?

[Kcdaspot]

I'm not able to really partake in this game right now.

Over at my mother's making chicken.

I will be back later but for right now I'm just going to enjoy this obscenely large painting that I have in my office.

fat

no u.

rereading.

[ShadowGirl]

I’ve played DD and SoJ basically in full (just need to finish the DLC case of SoJ)
Haven’t really played any others otherwise, I did play through like a third of AJ once

I think I'm on case three of Spirit of Justice, but I've completed all the other mainline games (minus AAI2 which technically doesn't have an official translation but does have a fan one).

I think I'm effectively an IC based on my claim even though, yee, mafia have fakeclaims.

I have a novice role that is pretty weak too so I assume this is role madness.

https://objection.lol/objection/3580148

VOTE: koopashell

This feels a bit like rolefishing to me which on page 1 I don't think we need to get into outing everyone yet, as later on we collectively can decide if that will be beneficial to town.

But conversely I don't super love koopashell's soft innocent child (sorry if that is me misreading the acronym, I haven't played in nearly a decade) claim as it can feel like trying to get a town pass (but we know that the mafia has safe fake claims so I don't know if anyone can be cleared due to character flavour).

[koopashell]

I’ve played DD and SoJ basically in full (just need to finish the DLC case of SoJ)
Haven’t really played any others otherwise, I did play through like a third of AJ once

I think I'm on case three of Spirit of Justice, but I've completed all the other mainline games (minus AAI2 which technically doesn't have an official translation but does have a fan one).

I think I'm effectively an IC based on my claim even though, yee, mafia have fakeclaims.

I have a novice role that is pretty weak too so I assume this is role madness.

https://objection.lol/objection/3580148

VOTE: koopashell

This feels a bit like rolefishing to me which on page 1 I don't think we need to get into outing everyone yet, as later on we collectively can decide if that will be beneficial to town.

But conversely I don't super love koopashell's soft innocent child (sorry if that is me misreading the acronym, I haven't played in nearly a decade) claim as it can feel like trying to get a town pass (but we know that the mafia has safe fake claims so I don't know if anyone can be cleared due to character flavour).

Reading into mechanical info this early is ill advised - I would ask kindly that if you are town to simply discard the claim and instead read into the reactions to it. My role is 100% self resolving, by either mafia killing me tonight because they understand what I'm softing, or by me living to night 2 and being able to use my self resolving ability.

[koopashell]

I never asked anyone or criticised anyone for not townreading me for the claim, so the theory that I am doing it simply for that is not exactly valid - I can back up my claim when is needed, I'm simply laying crumbs to ensure people know I am not talking out my ass.
From my experience with host provided fake claims - they usually are not actually good, so when we do get to a massclaim stage, I do feel we can sus out whoever is mafia via their claim because they will be ostentatiously be "too safe".

[koopashell]

My apologies if I'm posting too much for the thread, I am used to a much faster speed normally, and I am simply trying to maintain my presence. It does help if people are open with their thoughts right away wrt other players so it is easier to sort and not have to go back and forth to get those answers.

[Kcdaspot]

i'm stupid.

how is that rolefishing?

[koopashell]

It's subtle bait to make it seem like I have to claim or to reveal more info about my role. Also generally I feel that wolves will feel uncomfortable with things that help town and tend to immediately react negatively to them.

[koopashell]

At least, that's how I interpret it and how it makes me feel when I am asked that. It's early game and I was trying to push on something to move the game forward at the very least and had wolfpings from it.

[Gamma Emerald]

You’re the one who volunteered role info apropos of nothing
Thinking people wouldn’t be curious what you were playing at seems short-sighted
What I rlly don’t get is why the mention of scum fakeclaims?

[koopashell]

You’re the one who volunteered role info apropos of nothing
Thinking people wouldn’t be curious what you were playing at seems short-sighted
What I rlly don’t get is why the mention of scum fakeclaims?

I mentioned wolf fakeclaims because objectively, people should think that my flavor is one that scum should not be able to receive, and thus why my role is fully resolvable at night 2.
RR's reaction was less curious - more frustrated, however.

I'm really surprised that no one really understood the soft although I'm sure wolves did and kept it to themselves.

I volunteer role info because I am a player who believes in honesty and openness, and that sharing as much as possible is a key to solving the game. I hardly expect people to see my view right away - I am oftentimes 2 steps ahead of town due to my experience, but I do believe in villas to eventually be able to reach the same conclusions as myself, if they are correct, eventually through other means, as the Truth always prevails.

[ShadowGirl]

I'm going to copy and paste the text from the RR image so that we can all refer to it and not have to click the link a million times.

Radical Rat

What's the point of even saying something like this? You don't actually give the claim that allegedly ICs you, you acknowledge that Mafia have fakeclaims that could negate it, so why bring it up at all?

[ShadowGirl]

I think I'm effectively an IC based on my claim even though, yee, mafia have fakeclaims.

I have a novice role that is pretty weak too so

I assume this is role madness

.

This feels a bit like a subtle fish too looking for confirmation...?

As I said in my previous post, I feel like koopashell's initial post could have been trying to get a town pass by a soft IC, which is now furthered by essentially asking for a D1 and D2 pass due to supposed mechanics of their role(?) which I don't know how to feel about that.

From my experience with host provided fake claims - they usually are not actually good, so when we do get to a massclaim stage, I do feel we can sus out whoever is mafia via their claim

because they will be ostentatiously be "too safe"

.

I mentioned wolf fakeclaims because objectively, people should think that my flavor is one that scum should not be able to receive

, and thus why my role is fully resolvable at night 2.

So you have a flavour claim that is totally safe but mafia fake claims will be "too safe"? So basically no one should be entirely safe due to flavour claims?

[koopashell]

Are you scumreading me, or not, ShadowGirl?
Inherently saying my role resolves on Night 2 and that my flavor is extremely villa indicative is not asking those things, I am merely trueclaiming.

Have I acted in a way where I am simply sitting back and abusing that fact to do nothing? That is how it feels like you are framing it.

I'm asking you to evaluate me on things outside of that, which you are stubbornly not doing and is frustrating from my point of view.

I know you have not really read my posts because you wrote down RR's words and failed to notice that I posted a screenshot of the thing he linked, so are you evaluating me in good faith or not?

[koopashell]

If I am a wolf, I have effectively crippled my team and have put faith in my wolf partner to endgame by themselves as I would be automatically chopped on day 3 as soon as it is clear I am not self resolving - so you don't really need to worry about that. Mafia is a game that is about holistic solves, you don't need to make hard reads like that on me when we can just play regular mafia and not try to be heroes here. My concern is that there is too much focus on my claim and not enough focus on sorting *other slots* and that this is engulfing the game in an unhealthy way when I have asked several time to disregard my claim right now.

[Radical Rat]

I'm going to copy and paste the text from the RR image so that we can all refer to it and not have to click the link a million times.

Radical Rat

What's the point of even saying something like this? You don't actually give the claim that allegedly ICs you, you acknowledge that Mafia have fakeclaims that could negate it, so why bring it up at all?

Thank you for doing this. I'd intended to, but got busy. And now it's in my ISO, albeit out of order.

Anyway...

[Radical Rat]

I am in fact NOT rolefishing here. You (koopashell) proclaimed yourself an IC but gave no elaboration. And note that my question was not "What is your role then?" but rather "Why did you say this?"

If you're Town, this is bad because you're just painting a target on your back for nightkills without actually getting the benefit of being, y'know. An IC.

If you're scum, then you don't have to worry about the nightkill, and maybe you get some free townreads for pretending to say something meaningful.

So yeah, I know which way I lean here, and your OMGUS really isn't helping change my mind.

[koopashell]

"It is anti-town ergo wolfy"
Heard this one a million times, imagine my shock when it is actually a terrible way to sort someone.

Your statement about scum not worrying about the nightkill is extremely nonsensical. I can fullclaim at any time and bury you if you want to continue spewing nonsense, RR, would you like that?

[koopashell]

There is actually a benefit to not actually being clear, because it's easier to read the game.

Can you tell me what your reads *outside* of my slot are?

I am tired of asking this question because it seems I am getting all of the focus and it is quite annoying when I feel I should be fairly obviously a villa if one just discards the daystart claim as reasoning because, well, it isn't real reasoning and is a noob trap.

[koopashell]

As for the difference between "what is your flavor then?" and "why did you say this" there is no effective difference, so please spare me the overexplainations of how it is "technically" not the same thing. You wanted me to claim my flavor and I am refusing to.

I guess it is not just other sites that people are completely terrible with reading into mechplay and assume the worst possible theories because they all want to be heroes, except they are too busy trying to take shitty shortcuts instead of playing mafia

[Radical Rat]

Can you tell me what your reads *outside* of my slot are?

I mean, it's page 3, and you're by far the most interesting poster.

However, I do have a scumlean on NK15, and a Town lean on Gamma and ShadowGirl

[Radical Rat]

As for the difference between "what is your flavor then?" and "why did you say this" there is no effective difference, so please spare me the overexplainations of how it is "technically" not the same thing. You wanted me to claim my flavor and I am refusing to.

I really didn't. I wanted to know why you felt like saying things you had no intention of doing anything with. You either had a reason or you didn't, and right now it sure seems like the answer is that you didn't.

[koopashell]

VOTE: The Bulge

Something in your last post felt villagery, however, even though it is so convoluted and wrong. Feels more you think you got a case of the "I want to be wright", but really you are just, as I mentioned in my last post, taking a shortcut that does not ever work consistently.


You have never played with me - you should perhaps assume good faith that the action I am doing, if it can be determined as NAI, is indeed, NAI. In fact, I think many would actually improve their townplay if they didn't attack a claim just for the sake of attacking someone claiming such as in the manner I did Just a thought.

For all you know, I am a vanilla role trying to gambit my way into drawing the night 1 kill. But I digress. I am getting a bit frustrated with how I am being treated by several people and feel this discussion is easily making it possible for wolves to blend in at this point and hyperfocus my slot.

Reread it, something feels off with ShadowGirl in her latest post - @ShadowGirl, would you mind posting a reads list so far for us? Just a ranked list, doesn't need to be fancy. I would like to prod into your thought processes. It is not because of the fact I am the one being attacked - before you try to accuse me of that. I have my own reasons and they revolve over how you fit this bill I feel for a wolf who is attempting to blend into this nonsense mech discussion. There's a lot of "uncertainty" that comes off as disingenuous

to me

, such as the first sentence trailing off as a question, as if seeking validation for the point. Reminding me however how much I hate the early game because of all the stretches one has to make to progress the gamestate especially when not everyone has been particularly active.

[koopashell]

Can you tell me what your reads *outside* of my slot are?

I mean, it's page 3, and you're by far the most interesting poster.

However, I do have a scumlean on NK15, and a Town lean on Gamma and ShadowGirl

Interesting, because I find NK15 to just be VI material rather than a wolf, while ShadowGirl, as I explained in my last post, has pinged me in a wolfy way.

Gamma I will agree on that they have been fairly villagery so far. I feel that is a player that will show their alignment over time through stamina and energy, so I am not particularly worried about them.

[koopashell]

Not Known 15
Gamma Emerald
Save the Dragons
Radical Rat
Not_Mafia
Kcdaspot
ShadowGirl
The Bulge

A ranking I made according to gut feeling within 10 seconds.