Mini Normal 2283 - Game Over!

[Firebringer]

was it shea who pointed out that if BBT is scum Aisa is almost certainly a partner?
I feel that so strongly now even though i don't see BBT scum.

What is even going on. Her interactions with and talk of BBT is like dancing around.

[Firebringer]

btw if BBT flips scum Aisa's posts feel EXTREMELY bussy to me.

[Firebringer]

Idc if BBT is my top scumread, if he presents a good case as to why someone is town or scum and I agree with it I’ll sheep it

okay but no case has been presented yet and you immediately said you will sheep it with low certainty. if this is how you meant it, wouldnt you say "lets hear it then" instead of sheeping this.

Also i dont understand mindset of sheeping reads of your scumreads in general but thats a tangent and probably not very useful in this convo

[Firebringer]

Bella isn't as fence sitting as i originally thought reading that last post. I don't like how few reads she seems to have any committed to but i think thats a problem with a general lack of not being as engaged to read the thread and me seeing "the game is unreadable" and getting a little annoyed reading that.

Anyways would also support the HPE wagon right now.

[Thestatusquo]

I am worried that aisa is just like... Idk something making the posts seem worse than they are or something because i really have been pinged by almost everything they've done but it's like idk would scum really play in the way that Aisa is playing? I feel that way wrt hpe too. I don't think there's a lot of people who just post stuff this easily attacked as scum.

I'm kind of willing to wagon aisa and not willing to wagon hpe at all because with aisa there seems to be at least some idea of an agenda behind the posts but i don't really see that for hpe at all.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

VC 1.12

With 13 players, it takes 7 to make a decision. Day 1 ends in (expired on 2022-10-18 11:30:00).

VC

BlueBloodedToffee [4]:

HighPrincessErinys [711], Eiralox [713], Grib [717], Solway Firth [733]

Solway Firth [3]:

Frogsterking [595], Thestatusquo [726], Aisa [735]

Aisa [3]:

Firebringer [80], Enchant [721], Elements [746]

Elements [1]:

Not_Mafia [342]

Thestatusquo [1]:

BlueBloodedToffee [377]

HighPrincessErinys [1]:

Bellaphant [716]

Not voting [0]:

Flavor

Spoiler: Broad City

[Eiralox]

I want to put HPE in my towncore. I agreed with whoever said it was "blowing with the wind" and in some sense it still feels like an apt description in that often Erinys goes with a point someone else brought up first. However, even when all it is doing is arguably sheeping someone else's read it explains its thought process in a way that feels pretty reasonable. The explanations are really helpful and make it sound like its reads are real.

Beyond that, I feel a bit lost. There is a world in which the scumteam is something like Not_Mafia, Enchant, and Solway Firth, and if we are in that world I am still doing alright. If we are not in that world, however, then I am fast running out of people to scumread. Even Elements feels kinda like good vibes, although obviously my brain is telling me I'd be a fool to townlock her for, uh, being generally unable to explain her read on me.

I guess it could be some of BBT/Bella/Frog, and who knows what alignment Fire is, but ugh.

Maybe I'll just chill on the Frog wagon for a while. VOTE: Frogsterking

If anything I would say that’s scum indicative for HPE. You’re saying that HPE is repeating thoughts by others but framing them in a helpful way. I think that rather points to HPE being scum and uncomfortable with making its own points.

I don't get this tbh, even tho for me High Princess Erinys is pretty null, the overall vibe i've gotten from it is one of more independent-thought forming on current gamestate than 'scum indicative thought-repeating' you're alluding to here. Idk tbh i feel you're twisting what Asia is saying here a bit, ie. changing 'Erynis goes with points others raised' to 'Erynis is repeating other's thoughts but with a veil of ingratiation.'

Going over Erynis' posts prior to what you're saying here I'm seeing what Asia is saying way more, Erynis does bring up others' points, but for the world of me i can't see how that is particularly scum-indicative? So idk it feels as if Asia has made quite a logical point here whereas your interpretation of it feels... less so. I'm not sure about Erynis atm, honestly it has a weird tone but thus far nothing has straight out screamed scum to me. So meh i'm struggling a bit to see what you're getting at in above post in regards to its behavior.

[Eiralox]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: HPE

Just skimming, but 517 is a take I agree with, which I touched lightly on in an earlier post.

I haven’t posted a list yet because I’d probably waffle too much. I’ll post one when I can sit down and take in the thread as a whole.

HPE should not be a townread for the reasons Aisa gave imo. Tacking your own thoughts onto someone else’s reasoning is the easiest way in the world to blend in and actively lurk. I want HPE to get its hands dirty in some meaningful way, anything that signals the slot is trying to solve and not just echo others’ thoughts with a few extra words tacked on like sprinkles on a cupcake.

ok i just expressed my dislike of 517 so i guess i'll handle this. It's clear i'm not on board with that post, and what you're saying here... pretty much the same issue as with Solway tbh. Like i get Asia wanting to add Erynis to their towncore on this isn't maybe a logical play, but surely there can be an element of gut attached to it? Not a sin on day one tbh. So for me the main problem is i don't really see how Erynis has attached its thoughts to others, as i said, seems more giving a take on what others are saying.... i don't really get the parroting vibe you and Solway aver to?

Anyway I guess you've unvoted since then so the point may be moot, but can you please tell me how you feel on Erinys now tho? Are their hands dirty enough? #711 comes of pretty towny to me tbh, sorta holding a broad view of the game and being invested enough to encourage greater engagement.

[Eiralox]

Why do you think Enchant is Town, Frogster?

I'm shamelessly and fearlessly abusing meta

yeah i want more than this tbh. same with the status quo going 'enchant tends to lurkscum', i'm not onboard with this. now i don't want to get into an argument tbh, i get folk meta adn that it works for them, but at this point enchant is so null to me that anyone putting them above or below the line is gonna catch my sightballs.

Right now tbh enchant's hyper focus on Asia might shift them slightly red for me, but that alone isn't near enough for me to casing on rn. So i'm on board with what Asia's asking here, and I get you've answered the question but personally i'd like to hear more on enchant town! than 'cos meta'.

[Eiralox]

Why do you think Enchant is Town, Frogster?

I'm shamelessly and fearlessly abusing meta

Fool

lol did my work for me ^.^

[Eiralox]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: HPE

Just skimming, but 517 is a take I agree with, which I touched lightly on in an earlier post.

I haven’t posted a list yet because I’d probably waffle too much. I’ll post one when I can sit down and take in the thread as a whole.

I could get behind this.

Ok why? I've already questioned sol's and grib's logic on 517, so idk why u think their reasons re: Erynis there are solid?

Reading through the BBT/Shea fight, BBT’s reaction to Shea seems very avoidant of the actual questions Shea’s asking him. I also like the way Shea presents the case, his tone gives off legitimate charisma and annoyance meanwhile BBT comes off as more forced.

BBT's answers to Shea are focused on what was a very poor initial reason for pushing me. As soon as I read that, I didn't bother reading anything else in the post because the first part was so bad.

Why would I bother to engage further when the premise of the post is so far off-base?

From the start this has been about my response, and your reaction to it. I admitted that yeah i cAMe off as bit defensive there, so your initial sorta sarcastic reply i can chalk up to a knee-jerk to my... cockiness, acerbism, i guess? So one of the few places i've felt in line with bella, excepting their defense of Asia, is when they said you and the status quo sorta feel like siblings fighting, but i'm not even gonna consider classing such thread clutter as TvT tho. Where i've tried to follow the tsq/toffee chaos my brain started feeling gooey, so meh. I think the one thing that stands out to me is you calling Eira/Quo, cos i never got the feel that they defended me and i don't think you adressed this when i asked you about it.

I don’t understand BBT strong townread on Bella. Bella’s ISO is some posts complaining about the game state and a bit fairly good content. I don’t see anything that jumps out as a shining beacon of towniness, Bella’s tone seems neither towny nor scummy and her analysis isn’t very deep.

My town read on Bella comes from playing with Bella an awful lot. She was to the point with early reads and I think this is much more likely to come from town!Bella.

*sigh*

there are a whole lota meta reads this game, guess i'll have to get used to it.... hopefully things even out later once folk come to grip with each other but whatever, to each their own I guess. Basically you and bella have been townreading each other pretty strongly thus far, and i'm not sure how i feel about it. I'm pretty much on board with sol that bella's posts don't feel particularly towny or scummy to me, early on they felt sussy but they've made a few points that have some logic behind 'em so eh. I think in terms of engagement i'll definitely place them above N_M and Enchant, but town?

I get you've asked me to explain on Asia, i'm coming to that, but what i'm looking for here is some expansion on bella, not merely 'meta and early reads' but recent Bella as well

[Eiralox]

VOTE: BlueBloodedToffee

What changed?

Yeah I want to know why me and tsq are being paired if we haven't really talked that much, and when i can't see that they really dfended me? I asked this before and only the status responded. Right now my scumleans are you, BBt, and maybe maybe Bella... but nah, i think bella i'll place in my overlarge nullbin. but fuck me if i can read any of ya'll with clarity, so far the only read I feel solid on is Asia for town, with a strong town lean on fire too i'd say.

My issue with you is, like i mentioned earlier, i can't shake the feeling that you're hanging back, playing it as safe as possible so as not to appear scummy in any way possible... tho there have been a few places we're i've gone 'yeah this is a good question', so meh i'll be observing you i figure.

Bbt i've had a few moments we're i've felt they were being sincere under pressure, i struggled to follow what they're saying at times but I guess that goes for TSQ as well, but on general tsq carries on in a more methodical and town-seeming manner. I think the main thing on toffee is that strange tsq/eira pairing, and maybe strange vibes from asking me to talk about asia? which im coming to hopefully so meh. I earlier had a hunch on bbt/elements when they defended you(or i thought they did) so that's a pairing i won;t discount rn.

Anyway, why are you voting Asia for a third time?

[Eiralox]

Should be five votes for BBT.

UNVOTE:

VOTE: hpe

Everything it posts feels really disengenuous but also like it knows that.

Which posts specifically, and in what way?

why didn't u notice u were putting bbt at -1?

[Eiralox]

VOTE: Elements

VOTE: Aisa

Locked, never changing my vote

Ok, me and Erynis vote toffee, you immediately vote elements, after they note they're no longer the largest wagon. then grib puts bbt at -1, Asia unvotes, and you once more lock your vote on Asia.....

so why dud you vote elements, and why feel the need to swithc back to Asia so fast?

[Eiralox]

These votes are interesting.

yup lol

[Bellaphant]

@eir, come talk to me, not about me?


I think fire could be town and frog could be scum. I low key think aisa might be town but it's a meta read and not a good one. Grib can be town. In annoyed no one engaged me on hpe. I find the back and forth between grid/tsq/fire/frog/a little bbt soeta unreadable' because it looks like a pissing contest and I never get anything out of them.

So, there's some stuff to get your teeth into

P-edit enchant could well be scum. I don't want nm ans enchant to be scum but I've played with both of them recently and won in a scum team with nm, they could both be doing more

[Eiralox]

Yeah gonna be real here, the game's activity is largely dominated by like 3 or 4 people and the vote is scattered. Still personally feeling Frogster right now but like. BBT

is

up there too. In the interest of running things along, this one shall UNVOTE: FrogsterKing and VOTE: BlueBloodedToffee, and then probably get on Frog's case again unless he stops acting weird.

Shea and BBT's arguments are alot to unravel in terms of where logic begins and personality ends, but the core of the matter is that BBT is just, yeah kinda scummy. So here's to less flopping around like fish and more pushing votes and wagons.

Like here: I agree with the first sentence, but there isn't really a depth of thought behind it: I'd be shocked if all if grib/fire/tsq/frog are town, the thread is nearly unreadable. The voting nice feels really self conscious and steps away from the reads in the same sentence, then commits, then goes back to ,'doing it fit the wagon/game'. It isn't the first post that's feltike this from the slot

hmmmm ok but Erynis never said the top posters are town tho? It only noted that 3 or 4 ppl are generally more active. So idk where u get them saying grib/fire/tsq/frog tow In fact they seem to sr'ing frogster. But i guess you got a point about all the clutter, i've felt it a bit at the start and i mean tsq/bbt is mostly a tsunami of interpersonal bullshit tbh. but i haven't really felt that fire has an agenda in this game? in the beginning yeah i get there was grib/fire frog/fire fluff but i've failed to detect any malicious intent from fire at least reading back, seems like early sorting to me.

So meh i don't think this thread is unreadable? I get ur exaggerating, and yeah u got a point about bbt/tsq in this i guess cos as is said earlier their back and forths gave me gooey brain a few times, but overall i don't see how this all ties in with what Erynis said. And I mean Erynis read more like uncertain but a proponent of change, saying who they feel are scummy and sorta why?

And the point about Shea and Bbt's interactions being a chaotic mishmash of logic and ego is sorta on point, at least i felt that way when i read it and still do.

So sorry if im confused here but exactly are you tryinh to say about Erynis?

[Eiralox]

I am in good mood, so i will answer on one question, before i go to sleep

when ur back can u tell me what u think bout Bellaphant?

[Eiralox]

...Why would you sheep BBT's read on Bella if they're your top scumread?
VOTE: Solway Firth

i missed solway doing this i'll check

[Eiralox]

Is Solway trolling? The posts on this page look awfully troll-y.

What I really want to know is why BBT’s read on Bella meta-based.

lol looks like we're asking the same shit. y u think Sol is trolling tho? didn;t get that feel

[Bellaphant]

You've both focused on the least important bit of that sentence, I don't know if i'm just ridiculously unclear.

I thought its initial take was really surface, that's why I mentioned the scum agenda of making the thread unreadable, that it didn't feel like it had engaged with. My main point was about it's further reads and vote: it felt like it was making two steps toward a read, then walking it back, etc. Do you not get really self conscious vibes from their posts? I can find more in its iso! They don't feel organic to me at all.

[Bellaphant]

Sol voted for bbt and in the same breath said they were ok with bbts read on me, which felt trolly.

[Bellaphant]

Also, the whole thread isn't unreadable now at all, but there are like two lots of at least three pages that turned my brain to jelly.

[Eiralox]

Enchant is another one that I don't really like being a day one wagon .he gets pushed as mis lim bait but also, the things I town read enchant for tend to come later, like mech stuff, but then I've played a lot with them in the open queue. This doesn't feel like town enchant or town nm, honestly.

uh... can you please expand? it's day 1, i cAn't form any other read on both than 'null' so i'm not sure how u can tbh, especially not N_M. enchant has posted more, not enough for me to get a feel on 'em at all tho. well, ur using meta so that's how i guess ; / . anyway i'm just not hot on anyone calling these slots either way this early, without at least some in0-game reasoning./

Eiralox could be scum. #hottake

let's heat it up: why?

[Eiralox]

You've both focused on the least important bit of that sentence, I don't know if i'm just ridiculously unclear.

I thought its initial take was really surface, that's why I mentioned the scum agenda of making the thread unreadable, that it didn't feel like it had engaged with. My main point was about it's further reads and vote: it felt like it was making two steps toward a read, then walking it back, etc. Do you not get really self conscious vibes from their posts? I can find more in its iso! They don't feel organic to me at all.

self-conscious, yes. sorta hesitant i guess, but my feel is that might just be their personality? like to you that might seems inorganic but honestly it might also be someone who's abit more reserved and honestly struggling to get a grip on thi9er reads?