Micro 1068 | Normal Designer Mafia | Postgame
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Enchant Survivor
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Aureal she/herMafia Scumshe/her
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You didn't give any reasoning why you think sharing info will help town, you just gave your opinion. What scenarios do you envision possibly coming about because of shared info?In post 44, Enchant wrote:
Explain thisIn post 42, Aureal wrote: Do you really think I'm supposed to be no more suspicious of you and your suggestion without explanation than I was of Drew? Particularly given how its form shifted, and you're being inconsistent about what sort of picks you had?
You first suggested sharing"PR" picks, implying town roles. After other people started talking about sharing Mafia instead you seem to be taking what you can get there. And of course you went from not really having Mafia picks to having some that could be Mafia."Yeah after a point it felt like Aureal was the only one talking sense despite being a goose so I just followed."
-furtiveglance-
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bugspray They/ThemMafia ScumThey/Them
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susIn post 50, Enchant wrote:Yes, this is incredible dumb to be SvSMY PRONOUNS ARE THEY/THEM
do not assume my posts follow coherency they do not imagine that every time i post i put half of my knowledge into a clone and then the clone murders me-
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Enchant Survivor
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No, it's something you put in my mouth to make your mudthrowing better. When i said to share PR picks, i meant PR picks.In post 51, Aureal wrote:
You didn't give any reasoning why you think sharing info will help town, you just gave your opinion. What scenarios do you envision possibly coming about because of shared info?In post 44, Enchant wrote:
Explain thisIn post 42, Aureal wrote: Do you really think I'm supposed to be no more suspicious of you and your suggestion without explanation than I was of Drew? Particularly given how its form shifted, and you're being inconsistent about what sort of picks you had?
You first suggested sharing"PR" picks, implying town roles.
PR = Power Role
Mafia can have power roles.
So anyway, setup knowledge is universal. After people start dropping, they obviously can't share it, so why we don't now.Wizard-Mercenary
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Doctor Drew He/HimSurvivorHe/Him
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That is an incredibly week counter argument. I will go out on a limb and say that the picks people sent in for town were PR(maybe someone picked a vanilla town).In post 53, Enchant wrote:
No, it's something you put in my mouth to make your mudthrowing better. When i said to share PR picks, i meant PR picks.In post 51, Aureal wrote:
You didn't give any reasoning why you think sharing info will help town, you just gave your opinion. What scenarios do you envision possibly coming about because of shared info?In post 44, Enchant wrote:
Explain thisIn post 42, Aureal wrote: Do you really think I'm supposed to be no more suspicious of you and your suggestion without explanation than I was of Drew? Particularly given how its form shifted, and you're being inconsistent about what sort of picks you had?
You first suggested sharing"PR" picks, implying town roles.
PR = Power Role
Mafia can have power roles.
So anyway, setup knowledge is universal. After people start dropping, they obviously can't share it, so why we don't now.
And the backtracking on top of that.'dREW DID IT BETTER' - T-Bone
'doctor drew our hero' - Shiki
'I love playing with him, he's got an amazing presence to him that just feels like the game is lacking something when he's not there' - JacksonVirgo-
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Enchant Survivor
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Doctor Drew He/HimSurvivorHe/Him
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Did you read my post?In post 55, Enchant wrote:Vanilla Town is not PR.'dREW DID IT BETTER' - T-Bone
'doctor drew our hero' - Shiki
'I love playing with him, he's got an amazing presence to him that just feels like the game is lacking something when he's not there' - JacksonVirgo-
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Enchant Survivor
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Yes, like you did read mine.In post 56, Doctor Drew wrote:
Did you read my post?In post 55, Enchant wrote:Vanilla Town is not PR.Wizard-Mercenary
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Doctor Drew He/HimSurvivorHe/Him
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You want to share our PR picks, which would basically out all town PRs. I am genuinely confused but what you are saying, more likely than not no one chose VT.
So again, why is it a good idea to expose the town like this?'dREW DID IT BETTER' - T-Bone
'doctor drew our hero' - Shiki
'I love playing with him, he's got an amazing presence to him that just feels like the game is lacking something when he's not there' - JacksonVirgo-
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Doctor Drew He/HimSurvivorHe/Him
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I went and skimmed your ISO to make sure I didn't miss something.
But let me ask you a question, do you believe there are VT in here, it is every time role a RP? In your opinion.'dREW DID IT BETTER' - T-Bone
'doctor drew our hero' - Shiki
'I love playing with him, he's got an amazing presence to him that just feels like the game is lacking something when he's not there' - JacksonVirgo-
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biancospino he/shecompulsive complex Inventorhe/she
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@Drew, the question is not for me, but this game is Normal. By Normal guidelines, there must exist at least one VT.
Now, about revealing picks, here's the thing, it's true that Mafia can have PRs, but crucially they know which PRs the Mafia has (and presumably Townies are unlikely to lie, so the Mafia would mostly get truthful information, and can just lie in response). So Mafia can get a much better use of the information. Most importantly, I'd rather the Mafia not know which investigatives we might have, lest they could play around the menace or in any case know what to expect.
What I do see as possibly having merit is revealing picks that aretrulyMafia only, i.e. Unstoppables / Traitors / Goons. After all, those we can be certain that are not Town, and if any of those picks is actually in the game Mafia already knows; and we could possibly benefit from knowing to expect a possible Ninja Mafioso or something.
Also, @Enchant, yes/no, do you believe it would benefit town if everyone outedalltheir PR picks?-
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Enchant Survivor
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While it gives idea what roles we could have, it gives it not only for mafia. Just in case, i liked idea with outing only scummy roles more.In post 58, Doctor Drew wrote:You want to share our PR picks, which would basically out all town PRs. I am genuinely confused but what you are saying, more likely than not no one chose VT.
So again, why is it a good idea to expose the town like this?
Eh. Majority are VTs, some like 1-3 are town PRs.Doctor Drew wrote:I went and skimmed your ISO to make sure I didn't miss something.
But let me ask you a question, do you believe there are VT in here, it is every time role a RP? In your opinion.Wizard-Mercenary
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Doctor Drew He/HimSurvivorHe/Him
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Ah thank you for that Bianco, didn't take into account that a normal game has to have a VT.
Also, I will say I chose a Traitor as one of my pics(selfishly because I was hoping to be the traitor lol)'dREW DID IT BETTER' - T-Bone
'doctor drew our hero' - Shiki
'I love playing with him, he's got an amazing presence to him that just feels like the game is lacking something when he's not there' - JacksonVirgo-
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Enchant Survivor
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Enchant Survivor
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I think yes. Atleast i don't see harm in it.In post 60, biancospino wrote:@Drew, the question is not for me, but this game is Normal. By Normal guidelines, there must exist at least one VT.
Now, about revealing picks, here's the thing, it's true that Mafia can have PRs, but crucially they know which PRs the Mafia has (and presumably Townies are unlikely to lie, so the Mafia would mostly get truthful information, and can just lie in response). So Mafia can get a much better use of the information. Most importantly, I'd rather the Mafia not know which investigatives we might have, lest they could play around the menace or in any case know what to expect.
What I do see as possibly having merit is revealing picks that aretrulyMafia only, i.e. Unstoppables / Traitors / Goons. After all, those we can be certain that are not Town, and if any of those picks is actually in the game Mafia already knows; and we could possibly benefit from knowing to expect a possible Ninja Mafioso or something.
Also, @Enchant, yes/no, do you believe it would benefit town if everyone outedalltheir PR picks?Wizard-Mercenary
You need replacement/players ASAP? PM me! I almost always accept.-
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biancospino he/shecompulsive complex Inventorhe/she
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Ok, but if that's the case, I don't get why then you specifically want to reveal PR picks as opposed to just every picks. Surely if we were to do this and someone e.g. revealed only two things, then the other one is either VT or Goon and I don't see why it would be in any way beneficial to not distinguish.
And I do see the harm. Say someone picked e.g. a simple Follower and scum has a Goon, now scum know they shouldn't send the Goon to do the kill. Or maybe someone picked a disloyal FV and now Mafia knows to never declare fruit, just in case. I'm sure it's not hard to come out with countless examples. And in general I don't see why we should broadcast to the mafia what kind of roles may exist, I don't see the advantage for town and it removes the surprise effect of pretty much anything.-
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Enchant Survivor
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Erm.In post 65, biancospino wrote:Ok, but if that's the case, I don't get why then you specifically want to reveal PR picks as opposed to just every picks. Surely if we were to do this and someone e.g. revealed only two things, then the other one is either VT or Goon and I don't see why it would be in any way beneficial to not distinguish.
And I do see the harm. Say someone picked e.g. a simple Follower and scum has a Goon, now scum know they shouldn't send the Goon to do the kill. Or maybe someone picked a disloyal FV and now Mafia knows to never declare fruit, just in case. I'm sure it's not hard to come out with countless examples. And in general I don't see why we should broadcast to the mafia what kind of roles may exist, I don't see the advantage for town and it removes the surprise effect of pretty much anything.
We applied picks of PRs. Out of all these picks, RH made setup. This setup was REVIEWED for balance.
I see point in your words btw. As i said before, i liked idea of only revealing mafia picks first.Wizard-Mercenary
You need replacement/players ASAP? PM me! I almost always accept.-
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biancospino he/shecompulsive complex Inventorhe/she
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I mean, that's false, we applied forIn post 66, Enchant wrote:We applied picks of PRs. Out of all these picks, RH made setup. This setup was REVIEWED for balance.roles, not necessarily PRs. VT is a role.
Anyway, then why did you out your JOAT(Neighborizers) then? It's not a scummy role (though in fairness I don't think any harm was done with revealing that specific pick, but still)Description: Players pick either a maximum of three Normal roles or Normal roles with modifiers that they want in the setup but the prescence of such roles will not be guaranteed. Preferably, the picks are submitted during signups so the setup can be reviewed after it.-
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furtiveglance He/HimJack of All TradesHe/Him
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In post 33, bugspray wrote:The light-hearted defence here heavily contrasts the more apparently serious previous posts. 8 14 Are all serious responses to interactions which merit them. We do see a few more light hearted posts by furtive such as 12 and 10 but they are light hearted in response to light hearted things. The light hearted response to my serious accusation of caught scum is a notable change in emotional tempo.
Inconsistent tone thenIn post 34, bugspray wrote:The seriousness I mean in 8 is the matter of fact analysis of the lack of third parties and amount of scum in the setup which is something that should be obvious anyway. It makes for good busywork to appear you are helping town while providing nothing of substantial value.
Yeah I was mostly memeing but I wanted to inform people that there aren't 3p if they didn't know that-
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furtiveglance He/HimJack of All TradesHe/Him
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biancospino he/shecompulsive complex Inventorhe/she
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furtiveglance He/HimJack of All TradesHe/Him
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Enchant Survivor
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VT is a not Role, VT is "Vanilla Town Alignment". For example, Serial Killer and Mafia Goon are ALSO not Roles.In post 67, biancospino wrote:
I mean, that's false, we applied forIn post 66, Enchant wrote:We applied picks of PRs. Out of all these picks, RH made setup. This setup was REVIEWED for balance.roles, not necessarily PRs. VT is a role.
Anyway, then why did you out your JOAT(Neighborizers) then? It's not a scummy role (though in fairness I don't think any harm was done with revealing that specific pick, but still)Description: Players pick either a maximum of three Normal roles or Normal roles with modifiers that they want in the setup but the prescence of such roles will not be guaranteed. Preferably, the picks are submitted during signups so the setup can be reviewed after it.Wizard-Mercenary
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furtiveglance He/HimJack of All TradesHe/Him
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biancospino he/shecompulsive complex Inventorhe/she
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I'm pretty sure they are, though it can't hurt to get confirmation I suppose.In post 72, Enchant wrote:VT is a not Role, VT is "Vanilla Town Alignment". For example, Serial Killer and Mafia Goon are ALSO not Roles.
@mod, would "Vanilla Townie" or "Goon" have been valid picks during signup?
In any case, I also do believe that you don't believe they are, so you did satisfy the doubt I had.
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