I hard agree with what Gimli is saying atm
In contrast I think his worldview has a lot of depth to it and he believes what he's saying
It’s super easy to just attack me for “shallow reads” when I’m focused on my objective of eliminating who I think is a wolf and I’m am showing disinterest in even humoring Aureal/Klick as a suspect.
You might see my posts this phase and see I’m humoring the idea that you could be a wolf when talking to Ari but I think it’s just much much more likely Gimli decided to bus Andante and try to cash out on cred with how they did so.
I see Gimli trying to argue for my being a wolf but I feel like they’re arguments on me don’t come from a place of wanting to be right but rather just trying to use whatever ammo they can find on me.
I don’t wanna scream about Gimli being a wolf anymore.
I don’t wanna defend myself from Gimli’s shitpushes.
Both of these just translate into more screaming and yelling and just doesn’t sound productive.
I’m only doing it because I have to and I feel like it’s important to stay focused.
In post 1076, Alisae wrote:
I see Gimli trying to argue for my being a wolf but I feel like they’re arguments on me don’t come from a place of wanting to be right but rather just trying to use whatever ammo they can find on me.
Like with this they mentioned “what about Aureal”
They haven’t posted anything about Aureal. When they asked me to post something about Aureal I posted and they didn’t engage with it.
In post 1034, Alisae wrote:
Can u make posts about Aureal then and not about me?
like in response to this they “no u’d” me
In post 1035, Gimli wrote:
can u make posts about aureal then and not about me?
In post 1036, Gimli wrote:
like you're so sure it's me, so you must be strong townreading aureal. why? is it anywhere in this thread?
And then when I posted something they didn’t engage. If anything, by shallow they must be referring to my read on you and my Aureal read. Feels gross and easy to just attack.
I can’t sleep
The thought of how the fuck Gimli expects me to throw Andante hardball questions when she’s providing literally nothing to work with is just so ???? I can’t help but see it as just unreasonable
In post 972, Alisae wrote:
Mafia is a team game.
It doesn't just go 1 way. I don't just help you when it's convenient for you. That's a selfish way of playing and if you're going to pretend it's a team game when only you will only do what you think is right and only care to put your own reads before others, then like idunno.
Like ya you're a mason you're afraid you'll die tonight you wanna take your time that's fine, just don't promise to care about what I want when you care about what you want and you only see yourself as your only ally. I'm your teammate. One preferably uses their teammates to cover for their weaknesses. If you're confused, talk to me. If you need my help, ask me. If you don't know where to go, lean on me.
Mafia is a team game and knowing how to use your teammates strengths to cover for your weaknesses is an important aspect of the game.
I'm literally aristeia's team mate that you're shutting down. I helped kill scum on d1. you only got there when andante started flailing horrendously ITG. you spent the entire d1 enabling andante.
I wanna know what you think happens f3 after I flip. you're making sure you lose, alisae, do you understand that?
In post 1012, Gimli wrote:
I played with klick as a wolf team mate and I don't think klick is going to do with andante what klick did to andante as a scum partner. I'm hardclearing klick because of it. just check klick's ISO, they absolutely murdered andante, ari. it's not something you really do quite often to a partner early d1 of a 9er. klick caught andante in a trap play and exposed her as probable scum. that's how I got to strong SR andante when I was catching up with the game. while it's possible klick did that as a wolf, I think the only viable options as solves are alisae, me and aureal. if it's klick, I'm fine losing and we're going to lose.
I want to believe Klick is townie too which is why I think it's just you >_<
'want to believe' lol. aureal is also playing, btw, you don't even know what makes sense as a POE cause you're fake solving cause you're scum
There's an awful lot of aggressive appeal to emotion from Gimli here and I don't really dig it.
"Yeah after a point it felt like Aureal was the only one talking sense despite being a goose so I just followed."
-furtiveglance
In post 1041, Alisae wrote:
I think the best way to describe Aureal’s play is it feels agendaless?
I don’t get the impression they’re informed and playing with a teammate.
I agree with this
I agree with this also.
I'm very helpful, I know.
In post 1087, Gimli wrote:
showing frustration with a player =/= appealing to emotion
being emotional =/= appealing to emotion
Mmm, maybe I'm not applying terms exactly how they should be, but I think there's an agenda behind the emotion. Like, what are you even trying to do here? You're getting mad at Alisae for... thinking you're scum? But you think she's scum, so you get mad at her and try to convince her that she's scum? This is not going to work. If you think that she could be town and is dooming town to losing to me, you'd be better off trying to make that case on me.
"Yeah after a point it felt like Aureal was the only one talking sense despite being a goose so I just followed."
-furtiveglance
I was annoyed at the way e was pushing me, and the worlds in which e is town are ones where we are doomed to lose because the way e is pushing me is par with an easy f3 loss. I think e is the mafia but I'm open to the idea of being you instead, it was simply impossible to try and work it out with alisae cause e is determined to keep er mindset at 100% solved, even though it was clear from my conversation with er that e does not hold a good grasp of this game and what makes either you or klick town.
@klick: can you go over aureal's ISO again and tell me how is she so clear in your mind? I don't think she did anything after the beginning of d1 with that push on myko, that's par with being such a strong townread now. 'agendaless' isn't necessarily a townie thing.
In post 1088, Gimli wrote:
is this all you got, aureal? been expecting you to town it up this gameday
I'm trying. It's a little hard to interact with this game when all of the activity happens when I'm sleeping. In addition to kind of being a fifth wheel who has relatively little experience and no meta with anyone but you (and it does feel like a lot of this game has been people interacting with others based on their meta, which just isn't very helpful to me ).
Aristeia has managed to make me a little less confident in Klick, from what I'm reading. This is not a forward direction that helps my confidence in doing things. I'm now remembering how I was trying to ask him about that 'trap' for Andante, and wishing I'd managed to get more clarity there. I didn't feel like it was as straightforward "Andante is scum for not reading stuff" as you thought. The impression I got was that Andante regularly plays that way, and I was hoping people with experience with that would give insight. But it didn't really go anywhere at the time, then the second wagon on her just materialized with no real discussion of that. So I'm thinking you came in and decided she was doomed after seeing that and thus had no problem going after her. It wasn't even apparent it was going to catch fire the way it did. I think it'd be a little more weird for Alisae to put Andante at a point where she makes a scummy claim so that Alisae can call out the claim for being scummy? Or maybe Andante is just that loose of a cannon that she's not playing according to any sort of plan? I still don't really know what to make of her play other than obviously it's quite erratic.
"Yeah after a point it felt like Aureal was the only one talking sense despite being a goose so I just followed."
-furtiveglance
I can't believe I re-read all that talk about massclaiming. And I still don't have any more idea what possible benefit town could get from it. Alisae, now can you explain what you expected to happen if people had claimed like you wanted? What kind of scenarios did you expect to see?
"Yeah after a point it felt like Aureal was the only one talking sense despite being a goose so I just followed."
-furtiveglance
In post 1094, Aureal wrote:
Alisae, now can you explain what you expected to happen if people had claimed like you wanted? What kind of scenarios did you expect to see?
I expected 1 wolf to claim it, 1 wolf not to claim it and I wanted to divvy up into groups like in this open setup https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?ti ... nd_Conquer I was kind of posting in a way that would suggest to wolves to play it like this.
The plan was to then use dayplay to sort the groups
I think if my prediction was correct it would have helped us find wolves cause we can compare claims to what had happened prior in the day phase
In post 345, Wavelength wrote:
Even if you assume that both scum have the role, there is just enough ambiguity, that the scum could do a 1 claim it and 1 doesn't claim, and the final numbers are still falling in your realm of "possible"
Wavelength picked up on what I was trying to do here ^^^^^
).