Micro 1075: The Coalition of Imaginary Creatures (Game over)

[lilith2013]

V OTECOUNT 1.008
E LIMINATION V OTES
P LAYER N AME	C URRENT V OTES
Keychain (2)	northsidegal, Not_Mafia
patchwork (0)	None
KawaiiKame (1)	Keychain
Not_Mafia (0)	None
northsidegal (0)	None
Eiralox (0)	None
Umlaut (0)	None
Dunnstral (0)	None
Bingle (0)	None
NOT VOTING: patchwork, KawaiiKame, Dunnstral, Bingle, Umlaut, Eiralox
C OALITION V OTES
P LAYER N AME	C URRENT C OALITION
Keychain (5)	Keychain, northsidegal, Eiralox, Not_Mafia, Umlaut
patchwork (4)	patchwork, northsidegal, Bingle, Eiralox
KawaiiKame (5)	Eiralox, Dunnstral, Keychain, northsidegal, Umlaut
Not_Mafia (5)	Not_Mafia, Keychain, patchwork, northsidegal, Eiralox
northsidegal (2)	northsidegal, Eiralox
Eiralox (4)	Eiralox, northsidegal, Umlaut, Not_Mafia
Umlaut (5)	Umlaut, northsidegal, Keychain, Eiralox, Bingle
Dunnstral (4)	Dunnstral, northsidegal, Umlaut, Eiralox
Bingle (4)	Bingle, Eiralox, northsidegal, Dunnstral
With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lock in a Coalition and 5 to eliminate. Deadline: (expired on 2023-04-06 14:49:20)
Notes: Imaginary creatures have completely fallen by the wayside

[Bingle]

Bingle - conftown from my POV
Eiralox - treating this as spewed town today. The particular frustration at N_M is a town one, I think. I doubt scum gets that upset over N_M being unreadable when N_M doesn't look unlimmable.
Not_Mafia - I'm not going to bother partner hunting N_M, I don't think that's a useful way to spend my time.

northsidegal
Dunnstral
Umlaut
patchwork
KawaiiKame
Keychain

That's 15 scumteams for me to examine. I can handle that.

I'd only gotten halfway through nsg, but the post I'd left on my desktop seems to have disappeared. I'm not sure how much of this I'll get to tonight, but I hope to at least get through the 5 nsg options since they should go fast.

NSDunn: Possible, but unlikely. NSG townreads dunn early and it slips when she herself becomes very locktown, so it's potentially a thing that she was aware that scum's optimal out here is one on one off. 155 is particularly interesting as a set up for a bus without teeth (we're absolutely limming off the coalition group if we get that far) and nsg seems to be paying a lot of attention to dunn in particular. I don't know if nsg sets up a bus, though. Seems dangerous for a player who is considered very strong town and thus should theoretically have a short shelf life. I'm also not sure this tracks with Dunn popping back in right when nsg starts the "No Dunns in Brooklyn" campaign.

nörth: Very Unlikely. 13 is a bit antipartnery. Umlaut's steady downward trajectory through her readlist without much explanation or interaction doesn't feel like bus energy. As an aside, I think umlaut is considerably better than I did before having reiso'd here. Interested to see if that trend continues when I ISO them and the other usual suspects.

northpatch: The psychic abilities back and forth reads weird here. The patchwork defense of nsg comes across awkward, being entirely aimed at delta and not at all at NSG. NSG not having a scumread here in 96 is also a little :eyebrows: If nsg scum this is the most viable partner so far.

Turtleside: I think the biggest interaction read here is 356. Dismissing nsg/key as TvT seems low effort, but I'm not sure how Kame treats scum partners. Kame seems very unworried for someone with literally no one townreading them and townreads on all but two players, which could mean a well positioned scumbuddy.

@Kame

: Do you have any completed scumgames I can look at? I assume no, but no harm in asking.

The Scary Team: I'm lowkey worried because the 1v1 here that people are dismissing as town is a great position for scum. Like, honestly, this team is possible, and also probably the worst possible case for town. I'm just gonna ignore it for now, though.

[Bingle]

nörth: Very Unlikely. 13 is a bit antipartnery. Umlaut's steady downward trajectory through her readlist without much explanation or interaction doesn't feel like bus energy. As an aside, I think umlaut is considerably better than I did before having reiso'd here. Interested to see if that trend continues when I ISO them and the other usual suspects.

Addendum, this also seems very antipartnery. Seems weird to sheep nsg's read blindly then actually admit that and recant if they're S/S.

Sträl: Decently likely. 107 is a challenge that never gets answered or followed up on, which is odd. Both players went lurk shortly after, so it's not too hair raising, but I'd like to see where that reaction goes from there and they should probably get to that. I definitely raised Umlaut's hackles a bit with the chainsaw read, but umlaut seems uninterested in pursuing it when he realizes I mean it entirely as an anti associative tell. Weird situation where Umlaut gets offended when Key's read slips down for brief inactivity and then immediately mentions the read on Dunn slipping for inactivity of roughly the same duration.

Dunwork: Absolutely no interaction until very recently, where dunn asks patch to unpack a "don't Coalate" read on another player after patch comes out with a don't coalate dunn read. Nothing really precluding or making this more likely.


DunnKame: Unlikely. See chainsaw comment. Additionally the way Kame describes going about copying Dunn's strategy for coalitioning in 108 doesn't seem like scum copying a scumbuddy. Potentially scum copying a town player if I squint. This assumes you believe that the explanation of 108 means Kame thinks aggressive coalition building is a towny thing to do, but I don't see why they would enter the way they did if they don't.

Dunnchain: No really meaningful interactions. Could go either way with this crowd.

[Bingle]

That's it for tonight. Should be able to manage the rest tomorrow.

[Eiralox]

HURT: Umlaut

HURT: northsidegal

Want to have a bit more certainty in my coalitions.

[Bingle]

If that is in response to the above it’s worth pointing out that I’m not looking at whether the individuals are scummy but whether they can be paired. I would be shocked to find anyone in the pool that didn’t have any likely partners.

[Eiralox]

It's not.

[Bingle]

Fair nuff.

[Umlaut]

Honestly I'm realizing I have very little room for wiggle in my coalition right now. I could maybe sub in Dunnstral for someone else if that's what it takes to pass one but despite what I thought was a towny entrance they haven't really done enough for me to be confident in them. I really don't see a universe where N_M or Kame ends up in there.

I could maybe be talked into patch, but I actually feel really good about who's in there now so I'm not looking to be talked into anyone.

[Umlaut]

Like I know I should probably be doing something better than just sitting on my heals but I think NSG/Keychain/Eira are all obvtown and Bingle is, if not obvtown, the best candidate we have.

[Bingle]

Umlaut
patchwork
KawaiiKame
Keychain

And thus we struggle onwards in that most futile effort we call life.

Umpatch: 85 is a pretty weak read, but I feel like the thought is a genuine one. I don't agree that the waffling is really a progression, but I think calling it one means that the explanation a few posts later is a real reason. That points to S/T or T/T, because it's usually harder to get a genuine townread on your buddy. (Aside, definitely think patch never responding to this is interesting.) Um doubles down on a weak reason to read patch town in 181. Seems like an odd move to stick out your neck for a struggling buddy when you're not in a particularly strong position yourself. Patch never mentions Umlaut. Could be that Umlaut is just aware of the weirdness of never mentioning a scumbuddy, but I lean to not a team here.

Kawaï: Eminently possible. kawaii calls um town twice. The first is blank in a coalition vote, the second is "shifting reads with new information." As of the first townread that doesn't really describe Um's behavior. In fact, Um is basically doing the opposite (holding to the patch read despite Key arguing against it) which implies the read might be faked.

Chäin: Lotsa weird byplay here. Key calls out Umlaut for inactivity and backs down easily when Umlaut wasn't missing particularly long. There's also the disagreement over patch where they just kind of stop talking about patch. It's weird for scum to have sentiments about mindmelding with their buddy. gth this is not how an S/S interaction plays out here.

[Bingle]

Keychain

Unpack this for me?

[Bingle]

Patchwork/Kame: Patch being hyperaware of players not being around yet makes sense if they're waiting on a scumbuddy, but patch trying to bus kawaii for cred and 367 in general just really doesn't make sense for scum to post if they're both scum. Kame's list not containing patch in it is also really antipartnery, particularly given the poor position they'd both be in. Seems like a good way to lose. I doubt this is S/S.


Locksmith: 92 Seems like it could be partner/partner. First point of interaction between the two, and it's a request from Key to have Umlaut explain a townread on patch. This is a great way as scum to cement a townread on your buddy, which I know Keychain knows having used it to great effect in her literal first game. Particularly, the fact that she's content to just let it drop with an agree to disagree makes this noteworthy. (Yes, I'm aware of the fact that I literally just asked Umlaut to explain his townread on Keychain. That's different and the rules don't apply to me because I'm just awesome like that.)


KawaiiKeychain: 99 feels a little on the nose.

These posts as a total contribution so far from someone who (from a skim through their completed games) often posts multiple times over the course of a few minutes and asks a lot of questions is the shadiest thing I've seen this game, and picking the most popular coalition (Dunn's one, which is the same as Umlaut's and mine plus Delta) without even putting themself in it makes me want to throw out my whole coalition for having Kawaii's scum buddy in it

This strikes me as potential cheeky scum calling out an awkward post by their buddy and how it links them together, and it feels like a "Surely I wouldn't point out exactly what my partner is doing there." kind of attempt. Well, I think you would, and also don't call me Shirley, imaginary brain Keychain. The fact that Key doubles down on it in 341 doesn't make it any better.

I'll do a conclusions post later.

[Bingle]

I know nsg is probably going to feel betrayed, but HEAL: umlaut

[Keychain]

Loving those pair names, except for the ones that are bad

Locksmith: 92 Seems like it could be partner/partner. First point of interaction between the two, and it's a request from Key to have Umlaut explain a townread on patch. This is a great way as scum to cement a townread on your buddy, which I know Keychain knows having used it to great effect in her literal first game.

While that's an excellent callback to that game proving your memory is better than mine, "what progression" was not asking him to explain the townread, I just didn't see any progression between the two posts so was asking about that.

And your imaginary Keychain is correct Shirley, if Kawaii were my partner struggling with one of their first scum games, I would probably not jump on them so hard from their very first post, read up on how they're acting different than previous games to push them before the people with direct experience with them can chip in, and keep them as my top scumread ever since their appearance unless they asked me to bus them because they were hating the game, that's technically possible. I feel I'd be much more likely to try to make it easier for them to post naturally - I might fail, but I'd give it a shot first.

I look forward to the conclusions!

or maybe im just shit at the game idfk

patch are you normally pretty confident as town or no?

[Keychain]

Like I know I should probably be doing something better than just sitting on my heals but I think NSG/Keychain/Eira are all obvtown and Bingle is, if not obvtown, the best candidate we have.

best buds 4 life unless you're scum in which case... pocketed 4 life. but also N_M over Bingle

[patchwork]

patch are you normally pretty confident as town or no?

i'm usually not very confident at all

[Eiralox]

Like I know I should probably be doing something better than just sitting on my heals but I think NSG/Keychain/Eira are all obvtown and Bingle is, if not obvtown, the best candidate we have.

best buds 4 life unless you're scum in which case... pocketed 4 life. but also N_M over Bingle

I need some guidance on northsidegal, I'm not sure whether to trust or not to trust.

I'll also like your opinion: if I'm considering to heal KawaiiKame and patchwork(I might be) do you suggest I stay away from them completely or can they actually be good picks?

[Umlaut]

Keychain

Unpack this for me?

I don't know how to argue it to anyone else because a lot of it is just the number of times I've been nodding along with what she says in this game thinking "Yes, that's right." If you haven't had the same experience with her then I don't know if I can get you to read her the same way. Examples:

VOTE: Delta
Not that we're eliminating yet, but this read on north seems to be based more on her being difficult to understand than anything else which feels like someone scraping for a reason. If it was just the vote that would be fine since votes are basically symbolic right now, but also pushing to remove her from coalitions makes it seem like it's more serious.

Also hi patch! I like your flag, though I haven't seen that specific one before and had to look it up.

This post came at exactly the point in the thread where I was thinking the same thing about Delta for pretty much exactly the same reasons.

I'm also a bit concerned that you don't like some of my posts! How are you reading KawaiiKame's posts differently? In looking through their completed games I didn't see any scum rolls, so their pop in behaviour seems pretty consistent with newscum "oh no I don't know how to pretend to be engaged". Unless I'm mistaken about their experience level, in which case someone feel free to correct me.

Same read on Kame for same reasons, at a point where this was not really a consensus read.

I think it's NAI, but dropping the 'Newbtown' as a qualified when discussing my play will only serve to delegitimise reads and arguments that I develop further down the line. I'd appreciate you recanting and reconsidering the wording.

big fan of this response feels like a very town thing to be concerned about, not sure scum would immediately identify that as an issue. plus generally agreeing with the Bingle analysis on Delta there HEAL: Deltabreedy

This is one of my own favorite tells and is responding to the same post that started making me reconsider Delta.

(I get it but it's annoying to take one night off Mafia and see people react this way)

Yeah that's fair, I didn't really take the time to check how long it had been and think about timezones etc before making that comment so it was definitely based entirely on my feeling.

Maybe self-centered of me but I think this immediate backing down reflects Keychain really thinking about my slot instead of looking for a reason to push me. I think my response was something that could just as easily be framed either way and I don't think Keychain had any real scum motive to back down like that.

[Umlaut]

Like I know I should probably be doing something better than just sitting on my heals but I think NSG/Keychain/Eira are all obvtown and Bingle is, if not obvtown, the best candidate we have.

best buds 4 life unless you're scum in which case... pocketed 4 life. but also N_M over Bingle

Can you respond to my 354 re. Bingle?

[Keychain]

Yeah but give me a second, I was writing this post

I need some guidance on northsidegal, I'm not sure whether to trust or not to trust.

I'll also like your opinion: if I'm considering to heal KawaiiKame and patchwork(I might be) do you suggest I stay away from them completely or can they actually be good picks?

I feel like I've been pretty clear on my Kame thoughts! they seem like nervous scum to me and I'll feel awful if I'm wrong and I tunnelled them like this but oh well ignorance is bliss

On patchwork I'm leaning town now, partly because their blatant struggle to have any strong opinions feels like paranoid town, but I do want to look through some of their completed games before I commit any harder.

I'm trusting north as town at this point. I don't remember what made me think that originally but now I don't really think she deliberately picks this fight with me as scum though maybe that's giving her scumgame too little credit.

patch are you normally pretty confident as town or no?

i'm usually not very confident at all

understandable, but can you give like a rough list of the players from most wanted in the coalition to least? I'd like to get more opinions from you

[patchwork]

understandable, but can you give like a rough list of the players from most wanted in the coalition to least? I'd like to get more opinions from you

me
delta/eira
nsg
keychain
bingle
kawaii
umlaut
dunnstral
n_m

note that this is a very rough approximation. some players havent' caught my attention so they just naturally have to be nearer the bottom, bingle i used to tr on vibes but now i'm a little more skeptical of, umlaut i literally do not remember being here at all and i know they've been posting it's just like they haven't been really there
same for kawaii they're just not doing anything
n_m's at the bottom because cringe, but their play feels more towny than not

[Eiralox]

HEAL: KeyChain

HEAL: KawaiiKame

HEAL: patchwork

[Keychain]

Where are you on Bingle right now?

Leaning scum - I feel like he has good posts but what feels like most of them are generic helpfulness/coaching and setup discussion, I associate too much of that with scum

A lot of them are that, but Bingle is also the top poster in the game. If you take away the kind of content you're talking about, what's left is still pretty good I think. I found 57, 124, 139 for example to be good while also being about forming reads and advancing the game. I also think the read on Kame in 154, while I disagree with it, is not the sort of thing scum makes up (unless the team is exactly Bingle/KK maybe, but on balance still towny), and the questioning me for clarification in 226 just felt... like a real question, which I suppose it could be but I feel like scum wouldn't care so much to ask as long as I'm townreading them on net.

I agree he has good posts though I'm not sure they outweigh the fluff that feels more empty to me - people naturally have different posting rates, it's more of a percentage thing, and by percentage I mean how much I feel like it's one or the other because I haven't counted. 226 is certainly one of those good posts. 57 is one of the posts I was thinking of more as generic helpfulness with not much personal opinion though.

Overall I don't think he's sure scum but I also feel like N_M's contributions have been pretty insightful so I like him more for the coalition - also 232 after trolling delta who was clearly getting pretty pissed seemed like a pretty town about-turn

[Keychain]

understandable, but can you give like a rough list of the players from most wanted in the coalition to least? I'd like to get more opinions from you

me
delta/eira
nsg
keychain
bingle
kawaii
umlaut
dunnstral
n_m

note that this is a very rough approximation. some players havent' caught my attention so they just naturally have to be nearer the bottom, bingle i used to tr on vibes but now i'm a little more skeptical of, umlaut i literally do not remember being here at all and i know they've been posting it's just like they haven't been really there
same for kawaii they're just not doing anything
n_m's at the bottom because cringe, but their play feels more towny than not

which reads are you most confident on? (even if that's still not very confident)
Also you mentioned not wanting dunn in the coalition before and have him low here again, any specific thoughts there?