Large Normal 244 | Quotes From my Linear Algebra Professor or Random City Skylines or Random Songs: Town Wins!
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mmm on reflection. as a language accessibility thing we should probably translate these messages.
mine was just
i won't write ever again-
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which team/s do you think dragon could potentially be part of?In post 7362, pisskop wrote:
Its certainly possible dragonslot is scum, but dragon has really stepped upIn post 7360, Naerys wrote:
fair enough but then scum would be in snivy/enchant/the worst or youIn post 7359, DragonEater70 wrote: so I'm willing to call pisskop town for now-
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i lied, i'm a cop, and i have a guilty on dragoneater70 but also know that he's d6 limproof so let's kill him tomorrow
Spoiler: dragon only, nobody else click this-
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Hmm. I think we should probably take our time and try to be as confident as we can today.-
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I literally have so many words that all I can say is "yeeeeah".-
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I'm trying to see you but you're mischaracterising the reason I scumread you here rather than trying to help us solve.In post 7387, shaddowez wrote: Related to the above post, I'm not surprised I'm getting wagoned. What is surprising is the people hopping on and just accepting the super weak cases that are being presented. For example, worst is using the fact that I have "weak reads". I play and solve my own way, and haven't provided many reads at all this game except for when I've voted people. To say I have weak reads would be fair if I had reads to base that off of, but I'm not sure how reads I haven't actually given can be weak.
Similarly, Naerys accused my vote on RN to be opportunistic. Most of the game he's been TR, and there were no votes on him at the time I voted. There's little to no chance of him actually getting limmed, so I'm not sure how it was opportunistic. She could have called it an OMGUS (it wasn't, I put reasons in my post where I voted him), but at least it would have been a sensical argument, whereas opportunistic isn't.
You don't need strong reads. I haven't had confident reads for most of this game! When I'm looking for town, I'm looking for idiosyncratic reads with a believable thought process behind them. I just haven't seen enough of that thought process from you. It's not that your reads lack confidence or strength, it's that they feel like they were plucked out of thin air and I haven't seen you evaluate them as much as I'd need to have you as confident town.-
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This is another good conversation point - what's changed for you over the last 3000ish posts? Unless you think me + snivy is the solve, where have your reads developed? Who's absolutely town from your perspective?In post 7388, shaddowez wrote:
Looking back at this, I don't think Snivy and worst are both scum anymore, but definitely think at least one (*cough*Snivy*cough*) is.In post 4347, shaddowez wrote: This is still a huge list, but my based on vote placements I'ma bet scum lies in here:
bob3141,davesaz, camelCasedSnivy,Save the Dragons,Cat Scratch Fever,Aisa,BBMolla, the worst-
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talk to me about this one?
In the context of this game I agree with Naerys (nobody is voting you without a pretty good case Dragon). Broadly though yeah, if I was risking a game on RN being elimable, I would be assuming I'd lose that gameIn post 7398, DragonEater70 wrote:
Uhhhhh whatIn post 7390, Naerys wrote: He is certainly much more easier target to go after than Dragon, for example.
Random Nurse BITES when you vote him
I normally just snarl angrily and hope enough people TR me to not get limmed.-
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To re-contextualise this maths, assuming 3:3:xIn post 7402, shaddowez wrote: I will say, if there's enough belief that I'm scum, it makes more sense to lim me today than tomorrow though:
If I'm scum: 6/1/1
Today:Mislim (not me), no x-kills: 3/1/1 .Tomorrow:Lim scum!me, 1 kill, 2/1 (Kingmaker)
Today:Lim scum!me, 1 kill, 4/1, get an extra day.
If I'm town: 6/1/1
Today:Mislim (not me), no x-kills: 3/1/1.Tomorrow:mislim town!me, 2 kills, scum win (unless they miraculously both x-kill).
Today:Mislim (town!me), no x-kills: 3/1/1.Tomorrow:Hope you get scum, or in the same boat as above.
In a worst case scenario, If I'm town, a mislim on me tomorrow instead of today loses the game. If I'm scum, you get at least one more day but it's a better chance if you lim me today. Either way, if you're determined that I'malim, make it today so that we still have a chance.
d6 - 1:1:6 misyeet anyone
n6 - 1:1:5 scum shoot for town
d7 - 1:1:3 elo
---
d6 - 1:1:6 we hit scum
n6 - 1:6
d7 - 1:5
d8 - 1:4
n8 - 1:3
d9 - 1:2 elo
so no, like, if you are town this defeatist argument isn't really feasible. we are heavily incentivised to hit scum now.-
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Dragon has like some tiny redscum equity, and zero bluescum equity. Naerys has neither. Agreed basicallyIn post 7412, pisskop wrote: I really dont want to imagine a world where naery is scum here.
I think Id believe dragon is scum before naery
Neither of them are scum. Probably. Just putting it out there-
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From an outside pov I see why Dragon voted you there. He asked for your read on him. You are the only dissenting voice if you scumread him, which is highly important. You gave a vague non-response, which looked like cognitive dissonance --In post 7433, Enchant wrote: You make no sense.
1) You aren't convinced Dragon is town (this is a big deal bc everyone else is convinced)
2) You aren't bothered to go into your read (you don't see it as a big deal)
I don't know if this is exactly how Dragon reasoned it, but from my pov I was confused about the idea that you could have both of those thoughts at the same time-
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i keep falling back into this.In post 6334, Naerys wrote: Btw in the high unlikelyhood that pisskop is scum we are lost already. I am so deep in pocket there
like, every time i meaningfully dig into pisskop i'm just convinced he's town. i don't think he's aligned with flipped blue scum and i'm not really feeling him for redscum either.-
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oops - I missed a night phase there.In post 7441, Enchant wrote:
I saw this and could't resist to point that you are wrong.In post 7437, the worst wrote: d6 - 1:1:6 we hit scum
n6 - 1:6
d7 - 1:5
d8 - 1:4
n8 - 1:3
d9 - 1:2 elo
We elim scum D6:
d6 6vs1vs1
n6 6vs1
d7 5vs1 (Mislim chance wasted)
n7 4vs1
d8 3vs1
Forced skip forcing mafia to kill someone, to shred poe. It's not town aimed kill.
n8 3vs1
d9 2vs1. (Mislim chance wasted)
n9 1vs1. Lose.
2 Mislim chances.
If we elim town and mafia shot other maf:
d6 6vs1vs1 (Mislim chance wasted)
n6 5vs1vs1
d7 4vs1 (Mislim chance wasted)
n7 3vs1
d8 2vs1 (Mislim chance wasted)
3 mislims chances.
Now if we elim town but mafia shot townies:
d6 6vs1vs1 (Mislim chance wasted)
n6: 5vs1vs1
d7 3vs1vs1 (Mislim chance wasted)
n7 2vs1vs1
Still two chances, one of which wasted today. Outcome depends on kills but it's probably still lose.
Eliming me is fine, we lose nothing and gain much, just don't PRETEND you have case on me like i am survivalisting or other trash you probably taked from random mafia wiki.
I know i will be mislimmed sooner or later, if so i want to pick when. So be so kindly, if you don't vote me today, you won't bother me with "Enchant is mufia" bullshit later on because only answer you receive is "you lost your chance".
Also wtf where my jester wincon.
we do still win an extra day if we hit today-
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i get why, of all counterwagons, it's snivy, but i don't get why that's happening
@modpisskop is in the votes twice, Dragon is missing-
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though i guess i did bully enchant into voting.-
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got this urge to rewatch labyrinth now-
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*puts on voice* pisskop hates the door scene-
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we should organise a labyrinth movie night post-game-
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@shaddowez this isn't the best quote for it, but I don't think Naerys is aligned with Dave. Her read on dave across her iso just felt earnest to me - like she was sceptical of him, but gave him chances, but also didn't let him off when he underdelivered.In post 6423, Naerys wrote: But i am not going down without a fight so i am going to leave this here:
Snivy + dave
Enchant+ TL or gob idk i need to look at this
it doesn't feel like bussing to me, but it also doesn't feel like Naerys is scumreading Dave while also knowing that she is scum with Dave.
it's hard to explain succinctly (I'm on a break at work), but her associatives with Dave don't feel like they're coming from a scumbuddy to me. Did you have any thoughts on this?
i think my townread on nurse is a bit ethereal but if there's anything in particular that makes you suss him for red i'd love to hear more about that too-
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what nooo
pan's labyrinth is pretty good. it's not a fav, i wouldn't organise an impromptu post-game movie night for it. but it's good.-
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Remind me to ask for your favourite films after the game.In post 7478, DragonEater70 wrote: Sorry but
Horror/drama is not a good combination of genres. And even less so when combined with fantasy and Spanish Civil War.
But anyway, do you think I should just bet on voting shadow? I mean we clearly don't have investigative roles and I keep going back and forth on you and Enchant and there's no much evidence for either being a better lim (except Enchant literally claiming scum at EoD but that's apparently forgivable).
I'm stuck on Shaddow because he makes more sense than anyone else (by a decent margin) for blue scum and he might also be red scum. I think he's a very very strong lim to hit one or the other and if I'm somehow wrong and he flips town, I don't really know how to break through and I don't know how I'd solve him or solve with him in a more precarious gamestate.
Will this hit scum? I think so. Is it a good lim? Yes. Am I 100% confident? Heeecckkk no.
I'd still vote with your heart here tbh this gamestate is just chaotic enough that magic might happen. But if we run to deadline without anything changing I don't see myself changing my vote.-
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In post 7480, DragonEater70 wrote:
Btw this post makes me want to just trust fall into ducky's arms, but I can't let go of the suspicion that he's holding all sorts of sharp weapons and is just waiting to stab me.In post 7472, the worst wrote:
@shaddowez this isn't the best quote for it, but I don't think Naerys is aligned with Dave. Her read on dave across her iso just felt earnest to me - like she was sceptical of him, but gave him chances, but also didn't let him off when he underdelivered.In post 6423, Naerys wrote: But i am not going down without a fight so i am going to leave this here:
Snivy + dave
Enchant+ TL or gob idk i need to look at this
it doesn't feel like bussing to me, but it also doesn't feel like Naerys is scumreading Dave while also knowing that she is scum with Dave.
it's hard to explain succinctly (I'm on a break at work), but her associatives with Dave don't feel like they're coming from a scumbuddy to me. Did you have any thoughts on this?
i think my townread on nurse is a bit ethereal but if there's anything in particular that makes you suss him for red i'd love to hear more about that too
I'm going to take this as a compliment on all fronts. Luckily I very much doubt we'll need to worry about each others' prickly pockets here.-
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First instinct is we should just lim today. We can escape yeetlo if we hit scum, scum aren't guaranteed not to fumble the night kill, and if we only have one kill overnight we're in 1:1:3 yeetlo or 1:5 yeet-1.
Limming in a misdeed & lose situation is scary but it's not a guaranteed loss and all we'd be doing is losing someone obviously town and having to lim again tomorrow in like, actual yeetlo. Rather work with the group we've got alive right now.-
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Sure. I don't know what to do with it yet because you're keepin us waiting.In post 7612, Random Nurse wrote: Hey Worst did you realize there's new game info just released?-
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I was not here. I'll be in & out today, got family stuff on.-
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whichever of y'all tried to shoot me I s2g,-
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unless blue was 2 vanilla goons, it is confirmed that I was targeted last night-
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by one or two teams
my threat level is higher than I expected ig-
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I guess it's possible that both teams shot RN as well.
pedit: no dice sorry. I would suggest that if anyone else withheld during massclaim that they come forward - RN is the only person I think was gambiting.-
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I'm curious about who would find me threatening rn.-
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it's such a strange melancholic process having someone get a soft inno on you, start explaining why it's an inno, and then realising it literally only makes sense from your own perspective
what a fever dream-
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sigh. the best thing I can do to prove that I don't have a factional kill in this game is to point to my read on RN. it's pretty clear that he's been a pr and I've been covering for him since massclaim. problem is I don't really want to expand beyond this because I think fleshing it out is probably slightly negative utility.-
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I mean that's just the thing. There was no kill last night and I know I didn't take any night actions, I'm aware that my threat level increased a lot on d6, and I was jailkept on n6. so from my perspective it's very likely at least one team tried to shoot me last night.In post 7651, Random Nurse wrote:In post 7650, the worst wrote: it's such a strange melancholic process having someone get a soft inno on you, start explaining why it's an inno, and then realising it literally only makes sense from your own perspective
what a fever dream
A soft inno?
Oh, please explain this in detail.
but like I was saying, I can't actually detail this in a way that make sense from anyone's perspective but my own.-
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as in, you kind of already need to know I'm town for it to prove I'm town. which is not remotely useful lol.-
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I'd rather not but if it's going to help you significantly ill do it :shrug:In post 7657, Random Nurse wrote:In post 7653, the worst wrote: sigh. the best thing I can do to prove that I don't have a factional kill in this game is to point to my read on RN. it's pretty clear that he's been a pr and I've been covering for him since massclaim. problem is I don't really want to expand beyond this because I think fleshing it out is probably slightly negative utility.
Uh, no.
I think you need to start explaining what you're saying in more detail, now.
Don't make me play my trump card early.-
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If RN is shot tonight and there's a second kill, then whoever he targeted is clearIn post 7660, pisskop wrote:
by all means, keep sussing me tonight.In post 7655, Random Nurse wrote:In post 7652, pisskop wrote: I for one feel blessed that rando thought highly enough of me to protect me
Oh I wasn't doing it to protect you.
You were suss then and still fairly suss now.
but Id prefer if you didnt tell us who youre targeting.
not gonna say any more. his call, its difficult.-
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it's kind of semantic.In post 7663, Random Nurse wrote:
Rephrase that. As is what you just said makes no sense.In post 7658, the worst wrote: as in, you kind of already need to know I'm town for it to prove I'm town. which is not remotely useful lol.
world 1: because I know I'm town, i know there's a high chance I was shot & saved last night.
world 2: y'all don't know my alignment, so there's a question mark over whether I was shot by both kills, we split the kill, or whether I tried to kill someone
it's very weird living in world 1, but being aware everyone else is living in world 2. that's all I'm saying.-
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I don't mean to be egotistical but I think I'm a pretty good night kill. I do think Naerys & Dragon are better kills but I would've shot me last night.-
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idk if pisskop is picking up what I'm putting down either. I don't feel like I'm communicating well today I'm hung over.-
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I'm going to ask everyone to trust me that I am not a good lim!!-
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this game had two flipped vigilantes and two scumteams. you run into potential for up to 4 town deaths per night, which is absolute madness.
this set-up includes two town roleblockers. that does slow the rate of deaths, potentially, but roleblockers can only generate a guilty result (successfully blocking a kill), never an innocent result. vigilantes in this set-up could receive a single result every even night, and for psyches role only ever a result on a complex role. this is a very low information set-up for town.
there is basically no way this game gets passed without another tpr, which is most likely a protective role, side chance of an investigative. keep in mind that protective roles are capable of generating soft innocent results.
I am scared of playing scum against RN. and I'm not scared of shit else.
fast forward to massclaim, and RN posts this.In post 7028, Random Nurse wrote: So assuming it's 3:3 then there should only be one of each left.
T3, if a faction is defeated would you tell us in-thread?
If there's any sort of investigative role is now the time to start sharing results?
We've only had those two Town Roleblockers, right?
-In post 7042, Random Nurse wrote: OK, people need to be honest and start actually claiming and sharing their results.
I don't believe there's no investigative PRs and only Town Roleblockers and Vigs.-
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- RN is focused on active roles, not passive roles, and in the process forgets to mention his BP in the list of town power. That is a slip.
- RN is fishing for investigative roles in a set-up which is very likely to have a protective role in it. (Ngl I assumed it'd be an odd night doctor or smth for the vig synergy).
- since this claim I have consistently put my read on RN as "he is town, i will not be voting him, he is town for meta and I will not be considering his associatives at this time". please contrast the way I have been reading RN with the way I have been reading everyone else.-
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there's a fairly high chance he'll just tunnel on me anyway but I'm optimistic that we can at least lim some scum before both of them just take him out tonight.
RN, I have redacted a part of what I've noticed about your claim which I would strongly strongly prefer not to elaborate on. Going to ask you to trust me here.-
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you are correct, and fmpov its pretty clear RN has been hiding a protective or investigative role for a minute.
another quote incoming in a sec.
In post 7283, the worst wrote:In post 7269, DragonEater70 wrote:
I think regardless of shadow's alignment, this list has all scum in the game.In post 7268, T3 wrote: shaddowez (4 [E-1]): Random Nurse, the worst, camelCasedSnivy, pisskop
Mmm like maybe. Probably? Maybe.In post 7271, DragonEater70 wrote: Actually this is silly to ask Naerys since I know she TR's me and herself, so I'm basically asking if she thinks Enchant is town.
Oh well, I'll ask someone else.
Do you agree, Ducky?
I really don't vibe with the scum!RN theory and every time I think about not yeeting Enchant I flash forward to the dark timeline where Enchant is scum and we've just flushed the game down the toilet but like I just can't bring myself to put Enchant at the top of my poe either.
So more accurately I think shadd/css/pisskop is a pretty sound POE. I get why you're not clearing me. Enchant is my wildcard before RN is my wildcard.In post 7258, the worst wrote:
is this your town list... I'm so confounded am I not seeing something here?In post 7243, Enchant wrote:
Ok.In post 7241, pisskop wrote: Lets get a general poe list from everyone and we can take out the common denominator
Random Nurse.In post 7245, the worst wrote:
Why are you voting RNIn post 7140, pisskop wrote: VOTE: Random
Im kind of here too. I think the final 2 maf are in [shaddow, random, snivy]-
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this is not an earnest townread in a multiball game with multiple flipped scum to farm for associatives.In post 7160, the worst wrote:
if i'm alive in e-lo i will snap-hammer whoever is not RNIn post 7087, Enchant wrote: I don't care what he writes now, if we both alive at elo, i just 1vs1 him. I don't really care what anyone say now.
well ok. not literally. but like, rn is outside his scumrange and has been for a minute. i've recently won alongside town!rn & failed to manipulate town!rn. d1 & d2 of this game was rn's towngame to an absolute t, in a way that i don't think he finds easy to replicate. i get that there are small points for & against certain associatives, and i do think there's like enough that if scum had to try and misyeet RN they could probably put some kinda case together
it just wouldn't be that convincing. it's not just that RN doesn't have partners in this game, rn has played this game in a way that feels antithetical to what i've seen of his scumgame. i'm so sorry for bringing it up this late in the game but i'm still flashing back to psyche's "batman" call. like that is exactly the RN town thing. and this is it!
i'm willing to hear a case out but i'd need it to be a lot more convincing than anything i've seen here. naerys & dragons are clear to me based off associatives (like 99% blue, 80%+ red which is more than i'm giving most folks) so i'll concede they're harder townreads of mine right now. but rn is town because he is just not scum.-
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the worst Snuggly Duckling
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well it's quite a good read on day 2 or 3 or something but not when we're facing down endgame.-
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I don't think you're picking up what I'm putting down. I am townreading you because I have had a hard TPR read on you for quite a while.
Would have approached this game quite differently if I was scum.
I also know you enjoy the "gotcha" so I don't like....intend to try and talk you away from having an opinion, like you are allowed to vote me, but I am going to put my case down for others to not vote with you and to vote for scum instead.-
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In post 7645, pisskop wrote: i'm out right now, do you think you block that missing kill earlier?
@pisskop still wondering abt thisIn post 7647, the worst wrote: What missing kill earlier?-
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I do not remember that conversation and it seems unlikely tbh but it also doesn't interest me a lot. it'll be interesting to see post-game.-
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I think we need two conversations to be going at once here. Not only does it matter if RN is true claiming (I think he's shown that he's not going to back down from this claim, and honestly I think it's either true or only *very* slightly altered) - we also need to talk about how we all feel about the implications of that.-
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That is correct - if I were scum and did have a kill blocked, then the other team targeted me or targeted a bulletproof player. or someone holstered.In post 7703, pisskop wrote: For worst to be scum and eaten only 1 shot, it implies a crosskill, doesnt it?
That or they holstered.
fmpov both scum targeted some combination of myself & RN assuming he is full bulletproof.
my ego yearns for both scum to have targeted me but I need to dial it back ;(-
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I am like, probably a better lim than RN but am not a better lim than anybody else. If I lose the game on a tpr read I'm sorry but I'm fairly confident there.
VOTE: Enchant I really hate that I kinda have to stake my life on this but there's just not a lot of people left and I do think scum's win condition atp is to try and remove RN and win together.
Pisskop is also raising my alarm bells a little this phase bc hedging around this dichotomy without presenting a super strong opinion is pretty important if you're trying to squeeze one more phase.
That's about all I've got. Still busy irl here. I can properly deep dive later but I do think my first preference is not being literally yeeted into 2:4 endgame risk like right now.-
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If I'm just totally upside down, I think I have the best lens to solve this game through. You are not correct on RN. What is happening here fypov?-
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