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[BlackStar]

I don't know what world you're living in BlackStar. Roden definitely lost his cool and made it personal after I voted for him. Saying I'm not capable of voting scum is a ridiculous take considering I've voted for two of his scumreads this game

Idk what to tell you. If he's town then he can't handle his emotions and maybe this game isn't healthy for him. If he's scum then he's pulling out all the strings to try to reverse the wagon (OMGUS, AtE, self voting)

He definitely could’ve handled it better

[Black]

I would be ok with a BlackStar vote but I would much rather fade Roden

is that your brain talking or your annoyance at them?

Not to put too fine a point on it but WHY do you want roden limmed?

I think he's probably scum. I've talked about why if you just read my iso

[Thestatusquo]

Give me post numbers because i mostly remember a lot of things I see as nai.

[BlackStar]

I've caught up. I think there's scum in the quiet contingent.

I don't really like how smiley and blackstar are like positioning themselves as voices of reason without really needing to take much risk and are letting the louder members of the town eat each other. I don't know if everyone yelling is town but I think the majority of them are.

Also I've done the exact thing roden is doing with the self vote lim my target tomorrow as both town and scum so I'm treating it as completely NAI.

I don’t think anyone has ever acused me of being the voice of reason lol. I’m barely ever sure about anything and terrible at explaining my thought process

[Enchant]

I am not lurking i am saving MANA FOR FUTURE

[Thestatusquo]

I mean, but thats what I don't like about your ISO blackstar. You seem to be unwilling to push the game forward in any direction. It reminds of how scum look when they're worried that if they push the wrong person that they'll end up getting counterpushed or they can't think of anything to push so they fall back into the much safer pattern of pointing out slight flaws in things other people think rather than trying to advance their own thoughts.

[Thestatusquo]

Like I guess I don't see any reason Roden can't be scum so I'm not like hard opposed or anything but a lot of the reason he's being pushed seems to be he got mad and said some mean stuff and then AtE self voted and that does not a scum case make imo.

[BlackStar]

I mean, but thats what I don't like about your ISO blackstar. You seem to be unwilling to push the game forward in any direction. It reminds of how scum look when they're worried that if they push the wrong person that they'll end up getting counterpushed or they can't think of anything to push so they fall back into the much safer pattern of pointing out slight flaws in things other people think rather than trying to advance their own thoughts.

I just second guess every thought about people that I have and don’t feel like sharing thoughts that I’ll probably back out on a page later. When I post, it’s because I feel somewhat strongly that it’s something important to mention

[OutWorldER]

It's not a flawed premise because Roden has zero reason to come into the day with 948 unless he's trying to pull some "I told you so" kind of nonsense. All of the first three posts I quoted in that wall are trying to knock Black down for pushing a mislim. The implication here is obvious.

But Black took the conversation in a completely different direction and started talking about all the other people she’s voted for and making the claim that Roden must be informed that they were all town. Roden asked her who she was voting for right now (him) and then Naerys jumped in and made a snarky post along the lines of “hello? Are you even paying attention to the game?”. She seemed to completely miss the point he was making and that just served to make him more frustrated. I’d get angry too after that.

Okay, but Roden's last few posts in that argument do not, at all, follow with this narrative you're putting out. Look at 973, 974, 975. Roden is outright calling Black scum here, a progression that does not make any sense at all. You're trying to say that Roden's trying to vote off a person he thinks is town out of anger (if I'm understanding you're arguement correctly, and I may be stupid so it's possible I'm not), but that does not at all follow with those posts.

If he didn’t say that he defended Wartortle hard, it seems weird to me to say that he might have planned t do it in the future. He’s had all this time to say that and still hasn’t, so it seems like you’re pushing a hypothetical instead of basing your read on his actual actions.


I don’t know if he think Black is town or not. My point was that multiple people either unintentionally or intentionally seemed like o misunderstand what he was saying and it’s understandable that someone would be upset about that

"not basing a read on his actual actions" My guy, read the posts again. Even if you don't want to say that Roden is trying to ride the fact that he wasn't on Wartortle's wagon, you can at least agree with me that Roden's initial posts in that argument are based entirely around discrediting Black, right?

Your second point just has nothing to do at all with Roden's progression on Black. By the time Roden is voting Black we're pretty well past the "misunderstanding" points of the arguement.

[Black]

Actually, I think I just want to go OWER here

I was looking in my ISO for Roden stuff and I found 561 which reminded me of how confident I was in this read D1 before I got talked out of it

VOTE: OutworldER

[Black]

I think there's a real chance that Roden is the type of person that just can't handle being incorrectly pushed

[Black]

Roden is probably going to hate me moving foward and he might not even play the game anymore but I think there's a greater chance in OWER flipping scum here

[Black]

I mean, but thats what I don't like about your ISO blackstar. You seem to be unwilling to push the game forward in any direction. It reminds of how scum look when they're worried that if they push the wrong person that they'll end up getting counterpushed or they can't think of anything to push so they fall back into the much safer pattern of pointing out slight flaws in things other people think rather than trying to advance their own thoughts.

I just second guess every thought about people that I have

and don’t feel like sharing thoughts that I’ll probably back out on a page later. When I post, it’s because I feel somewhat strongly that it’s something important to mention

Man I feel this

[Thestatusquo]

I'm gunna VOTE: blackstar until I actually see some indication they're trying to find scum.

[Black]

I'm gunna VOTE: blackstar until I actually see some indication they're trying to find scum.

What are your thoughts on OWER

[Thestatusquo]

Looks a lot like the town ower I played with in 2170

[Black]

Looks a lot like the town ower I played with in 2170

Can you give me some specifics. I feel like this is the first time you've mentioned OWER all game. Did this read just form?

[Thestatusquo]

It might be, I just skimmed through his iso when you asked.

Uh, two thoughts :

1) I really didn’t know OWER was trying to ask Naerys specifically on why she changed her vote and such, which is why I shared my theory on that—wasn’t trying to speak for her .

I also see what you mean about the two-pronged theory not being super helpful—I think in trying to be accurate (and therefore covering all the possibilities I could see), I lost most of the decisiveness of just presenting the possibility I thought most applicable. I appreciate you pointing that fact out for me—I’ll have to try to be more narrow with my theories in the future so they can have more… oomph.

Okay, none of what you're saying here is dissuading my vote on you because you're still dancing around the problem. You presented two theories, one of which implies Naerys Town and the other implies Naerys Scum, and then left it there without saying which you even believe in. It would be different if you stated a concrete read or even a lean on Naerys beforehand but in the absence of that it just looks like you're setting yourself up to see which way the wind blows on Naerys and shading her at the same time. That's what's ringing my scum alarm bells.

I think there's a lot of solving thoughts in a lot of his posts. Like there's a bunch of observations like this which feel like they're going a step further beyond what scum would do to fake a read a lot of the time. I think the main difference between the two games is that he is more present there and less here, but the content when he's here feels very similar to me.

[Black]

I think there's a lot of solving thoughts in a lot of his posts. Like there's a bunch of observations like this which feel like they're going a step further beyond what scum would do to fake a read a lot of the time. I think the main difference between the two games is that he is more present there and less here, but the content when he's here feels very similar to me.

Kinda seems like the way I play scum tbh

Thanks for sharing your read

[Black]

That was something I noted in 561 too. I think OWER is just me as scum

[Black]

Annie, can I get you to switch over to the OWER wagon?

[AnimatedWiz]

I mean, but thats what I don't like about your ISO blackstar. You seem to be unwilling to push the game forward in any direction. It reminds of how scum look when they're worried that if they push the wrong person that they'll end up getting counterpushed or they can't think of anything to push so they fall back into the much safer pattern of pointing out slight flaws in things other people think rather than trying to advance their own thoughts.

Hm… I feel like BlackStar has been pushing

a lot

though—and often, he’s pushing back against people and their reads. He’s kind of in the trenches right now and consistently arguing with most of the rest of town, and I think that might be why it seems like he’s not progressing the game like some of the rest of us are.

After all, when the majority of the town is against you and your reads, I would imagine you have to choose between pushing your own stuff and countering theirs—doing both probably isn’t feasible for just one person with a life y’know?

[Thestatusquo]

I think there's a lot of solving thoughts in a lot of his posts. Like there's a bunch of observations like this which feel like they're going a step further beyond what scum would do to fake a read a lot of the time. I think the main difference between the two games is that he is more present there and less here, but the content when he's here feels very similar to me.

Kinda seems like the way I play scum tbh

Thanks for sharing your read

Isn't this just describing "emulating their town play"?

Like what differences would you expect to see from townOwer that you're not seeing?

[AnimatedWiz]

Annie, can I get you to switch over to the OWER wagon?

I’ve been considering the OWER wagon as a good second choice, but I’d rather hear Roden’s updated readlist before I decide to hop off my current wagon.

[Thestatusquo]

I mean, but thats what I don't like about your ISO blackstar. You seem to be unwilling to push the game forward in any direction. It reminds of how scum look when they're worried that if they push the wrong person that they'll end up getting counterpushed or they can't think of anything to push so they fall back into the much safer pattern of pointing out slight flaws in things other people think rather than trying to advance their own thoughts.

Hm… I feel like BlackStar has been pushing

a lot

though—and often, he’s pushing back against people and their reads. He’s kind of in the trenches right now and consistently arguing with most of the rest of town, and I think that might be why it seems like he’s not progressing the game like some of the rest of us are.

After all, when the majority of the town is against you and your reads, I would imagine you have to choose between pushing your own stuff and countering theirs—doing both probably isn’t feasible for just one person with a life y’know?

pushing back against people and their reads != pushing your own thoughts/trying to solve the game.

I feel like that was entirely my point.