Daniel Anix Presents: The 20th Anniversary of UPick Game

[WePick]

VOTE: AniX

found confirmed scum

-u can't cee me i'm a mirage

[WePick]

Checking in.

-WePick

[WePick]

yup, there's definitely a scum in here, but we've got him distracted with doggie treats so don't worry

-mirage

[WePick]

VOTE: halfasleep
PUNISH THE DESERTER!

-StraightFlush

[WePick]

VOTE: WePick

kill the abominations

VOTE: dannflor

dann ur not an abomination

[WePick]

yay 21/22 hydra members are town

- mirage

[WePick]

i actually feel kinda sorry for the scumteam if they didn't think to ask for a sample town pm, i bet they weren't given one in their pt either

-mirage

[WePick]

Checking in.

-WePick

[WePick]

i townread WePick

Probably townreading the wrong head

[WePick]

r we actually doing reads this game cuz I thought this was a meme game

I read you as Jester

~firebringer

[WePick]

Hi Firebringer, are you guys Town?

~Spiffy

i don't remember. Our role is so complicated. I assume so

~firebringer

[WePick]

All rules apply except when specifically identified to you.

Rules don't apply to me!!!!

[WePick]

I am definitely town this game.

~firebringer

[WePick]

r we actually doing reads this game cuz I thought this was a meme game

Are you scared we'll catch you if we actually do reads?

~Spiffy

I'm a cult leader you can't catch me, I will catch YOU

I hard CC

Hi Firebringer, are you guys Town?

~Spiffy

i don't remember. Our role is so complicated. I assume so

~firebringer

It is quite simple actually, all 11 of us are different alignments

-Drew

[WePick]

like what would you think about a

blue stop sign

?

-

[WePick]

Checking in.

-WePick

[WePick]

Checking in.

-WePick

Checking out.

[WePick]

First!

We’re a death miller.
This means when we die it says we flip scum, but we’re not

-Bell

So… if you were to replace out would it mechanically destroy the game?

[WePick]

Also, completely serious, it is a scumclaim to neighborize anyone but us.

[WePick]

Also, completely serious, it is a scumclaim to neighborize anyone but us.

Bannable offense I would even add

-Drew

[WePick]

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~bia

[WePick]

i actually feel kinda sorry for the scumteam if they didn't think to ask for a sample town pm, i bet they weren't given one in their pt either

-mirage

this post is why i town read wepick

what's town about it? it's not so obvious to me

Probably makes you town as well

-Drew

[WePick]

Checking in.

-WePick

Thanks to an unfortunate series of misunderstandings featuring the dog Laika, a goat, Dr. Drew 72 cents, a robotic hamster replacement named Sergei, and the municipality of Bangor, I find myself contractually obliged to let you all know that I am here.

-Jingle

[WePick]

id rather eliminate the cabal because then i can say i killed 11 people in one day.

~firebringer

[WePick]

i also think a 11v11 hydra fight would be hilarious

`firebringer

[WePick]

id rather eliminate the cabal because then i can say i killed 11 people in one day.

~firebringer

You'd eliminate BorkJerfkin? What is

wrong

with you.

in a millisecond

[WePick]

It should

[WePick]

a town hydra with 11 heads has 11x the capability of catching scum though.
and 11x the capability of being misread.

ITs so much potential

~Change (firebringer)

[WePick]

@anix why the hell can i not view this subforum logged out. That is very annoying for if i want to lurk.

~firebringer

[WePick]

i do not believe more heads are better than one in mafia

Thats what a one head

would say.

~change

firebringer

[WePick]

im going to make meta arguments on why my other heads are scummy

~firebringer

[WePick]

im going to make meta arguments on why my other heads are scummy

~firebringer

You still aren't over me aren't you?

-Drew

[WePick]

i prefer a hydra elimination actually because 11 players in one slot means there's no meaningfully reading that slot. for me at least. it's a skill issue.

We need to bow out before melo/elo if the game doesn't end first. But, we'd like to catch some scum first.

for boring reasons, who said this?

The alchemist.

Spoiler:

You had kind words for me before the union buster mafia

Your death shall be swift and painless

-Drew

[WePick]

OFFICIAL CABAL VS WEPICK RULES

Each side will pick ELEVEN DIFFERENT GAMES[i.e. Chess, Rock Paper Scissors, Trivial Pursuit, Pagetop Stealing Contest etc] to compete in and submit them as SOON AS POSSIBLE. If you do not submit any games I will simply not put any of your choices into the pool.

Pooky as a COMPLETELY unbiased ARBITER OF THE GAMES will randomly select games you submitted to play. if you do not submit any games, Pooky will select whatever the hell he wants.

Each time your hydra loses a game, a player in the totally meme mafia game will vote for your hydra. If any hydra receives six votes they will suffer a most tragic defeat whereas the other Hydra will be crowned HERO OF THE ELEVENTH HOUR and AUTOMATICALLY ADVANCE TO FINAL ELO.

./in for chess

~firebringer

[WePick]

i'm jealous that your hydra was able to actually communicate

- mirage

[WePick]

Y'know what a Miller who is also a Death Miller but totally isn't scum trust me guys sounds like to me?

Scum.

VOTE: The Cabal

Also the excuse of bork having a red name doesn't hold water here because bork abandoned the hydra before the game even filled.

- Rat

[WePick]

OFFICIAL CABAL VS WEPICK RULES

Each side will pick ELEVEN DIFFERENT GAMES[i.e. Chess, Rock Paper Scissors, Trivial Pursuit, Pagetop Stealing Contest etc] to compete in and submit them as SOON AS POSSIBLE. If you do not submit any games I will simply not put any of your choices into the pool.

Pooky as a COMPLETELY unbiased ARBITER OF THE GAMES will randomly select games you submitted to play. if you do not submit any games, Pooky will select whatever the hell he wants.

Each time your hydra loses a game, a player in the totally meme mafia game will vote for your hydra. If any hydra receives six votes they will suffer a most tragic defeat whereas the other Hydra will be crowned HERO OF THE ELEVENTH HOUR and AUTOMATICALLY ADVANCE TO FINAL ELO.

I'll toss in Puyo Puyo.

-Rat

[WePick]

btw, you're seriously claiming death miller? that's not a meme claim?

claims are irrelevant in a fight to the death

I'm not interested in your reindeer games.

Are you interested in my reindeer games?

-Jingle

[WePick]

i prefer a hydra elimination actually because 11 players in one slot means there's no meaningfully reading that slot. for me at least. it's a skill issue.

We need to bow out before melo/elo if the game doesn't end first. But, we'd like to catch some scum first.

i don't consent to this :v

Y'know what a Miller who is also a Death Miller but totally isn't scum trust me guys sounds like to me?

Scum.

VOTE: The Cabal

Also the excuse of bork having a red name doesn't hold water here because bork abandoned the hydra before the game even filled.

- Rat

im kinda surprised that this is an even remotely popular take. guess i shouldnt be. i wouldn't have agreed to claim death miller as scum and immediately make the game all about us, i actually wanted to play.

DID you agree to the claim?

-Rat

[WePick]

They did not. They’ve barely posted in the discord.
But I don’t really think they would’ve said no to what is commonly thought to be the objectively correct play.
-Bell

My point is that the argument "I wouldn't have agreed to this as scum" doesn't make sense if he didn't actually agree to it beforehand.

To further elucidate my thinking, the idea is that while this is one of the vanishingly few games I would believe a Death Miller to even be possible, I do not find it plausible. I also don't think it's a surprise to anyone that most players are going to predisposed to voting out one of us, simply due to our hydric nature. So, if you're scum, and you're expecting a high chance of dying anyway, and it's a wacky bastard U-Pick... Death Miller's not a bad claim. Prevents us from drawing real conclusions from your flip, which deters people from seeking it, and permanently hinders analysis of it if it does happen.

You are right though that claiming immediately is correct play if you aren't lying. But I just can't bring myself to believe a Death Miller exists at this point.

- Rat

[WePick]

Statistically, Mafia players are usually Town.

- Rat

[WePick]

Statistically, Mafia players are usually Town.

- Rat

You appear to be under the misconception that an idiot made the statistic and didn’t control for that.

It's not a comment on whether the Miller statistic is valid, it's a comment about how assuming a Miller claim is true because of those statistics is foolish, just as it would be to assume that a player is Town, because statistically they usually will be.

I'll believe your claim when THIS game gives me a reason to believe it, and not a moment sooner.

- Rat

[WePick]

Statistically, Mafia players are usually Town.

- Rat

I'll go one further. If both hydrae are scum, this game does not contain an uninformed majority. Therefore, by virtue of the fact that AniX is running this as a mafia game, at least one of our hydrae has to be town.

[WePick]

The logistics:

Discord chat.
1. Hey guys we’re a death miller.
2. That’s hilarious.
3. We should obviously claim right away right?
Spiffeh, I, and Lukewarm think we should claim. Nobody objects.
4. We ask a bunch of questions to figure out what death miller means, some of which have already been asked of us again.
5. End.

-Bell
Pedit: yes, I do say so.

It is very important that specifically Luke answers this question:

Do you investigate as User or Admin prior to your death?

[WePick]

I’m just skeptical of someone trying to figure out how to interact with an 11 person hydra. It just reads like busy work to me.

We came up with some options while brainstorming the submission, actually. I think my favorite was that we each pick a member of your hydra to sign as and only respond to posts made by your hydra signed as the same person we were signing as. Such was met with responses of "You're dumb" and "Can I please have that dog treat?"

[WePick]

Luke's not around atm, I think. And I already answered that.

That's okay, I can wait.

In other news, I think HEM's reaction to the death miller claim is likely scum.

[WePick]

OFFICIAL CABAL VS WEPICK RULES

Each side will pick ELEVEN DIFFERENT GAMES[i.e. Chess, Rock Paper Scissors, Trivial Pursuit, Pagetop Stealing Contest etc] to compete in and submit them as SOON AS POSSIBLE. If you do not submit any games I will simply not put any of your choices into the pool.

Pooky as a COMPLETELY unbiased ARBITER OF THE GAMES will randomly select games you submitted to play. if you do not submit any games, Pooky will select whatever the hell he wants.

Each time your hydra loses a game, a player in the totally meme mafia game will vote for your hydra. If any hydra receives six votes they will suffer a most tragic defeat whereas the other Hydra will be crowned HERO OF THE ELEVENTH HOUR and AUTOMATICALLY ADVANCE TO FINAL ELO.

As a self proclaimed expert on bad game design, I'm going to submit the "Hammer Pooky" minigame for contention. The hydra who hammers pooky's wagon first wins that round.

[WePick]

I would like to once again stress that this is a wacky bastard upick and my threats of bringing an anix controlled slot into the game are not unfounded

I have no fear of AniX being able to catch us as scum, so am unconcerned. AniX is, as the kids say nowadays, a chumpburger.

[WePick]

so i'm struggling to see why we'd like to keep you alive when you could just literally be scum and we won't find out until the game ends. i feel like i'd rather flip you then get pleasantly surprised when the game ends after we flip 1 and a half scum. eliminating you will give us a sample red pm too and i think that's relevant because anix didn't give out anything in the first page. scum could have a crazy wild reveal on win con and having that day 1 will be enormous.

on one hand, i don't see scum going into the thread with a bunch of all-stars and then going too scummy to be scum. they're immediately going to be in the elim pool one way or the other. so I'm weighing it against the possibility that you're the 1/2 scum PR that activates some sort of ability for your team upon death.

An 11 headed hydra managing to agree on fakeclaiming death miller feels wildly unlikely to me

How likely do you think it is that scum have an abnormal wincon?

I would like to once again stress that this is a wacky bastard upick and my threats of bringing an anix controlled slot into the game are not unfounded

This isn't cogdis, but it does seem interesting to me to be primarily concerned with both of these aspects.

Like, thinking HEM being worried about altscum is interesting and ALSO being worried about people implicitly trusting your threat to drop an AniX flavored bomb on the setup feels like a weird take.

[WePick]

tea and cheese

I have a delightful jade oolong and a sandwich with colby jack. This leads me to the conclusion that Dannflor is town.

[WePick]

I mean I assumed that AniX's interference via your role would be constrained to a level that doesn't fundamentally break the game of Mafia in the way that a Death Miller does.

But yes, the potential for and presence of wacky roles is why I'm even seriously considering the possibility of the claim.

- Rat

[WePick]

I mean I assumed that AniX's interference via your role would be constrained to a level that doesn't fundamentally break the game of Mafia in the way that a Death Miller does.

But yes, the potential for and presence of wacky roles is why I'm even seriously considering the possibility of the claim.

- Rat

Thing is, Rat, that Death Millers were actually pretty common comparatively speaking when AniX was a player.

[WePick]

AniX was a player in a game last year that had a death miller, even

it's totally believable

- mirage

[WePick]

This is a uPick

Your flavour impacts your role creation. Alignment is still random

I mean.... I've seen UPicks where Alignment is based on submission to a certain extent.

I'm pretty sure at least one RC UPick I reviewed he made roles and then balanced by changing alignments for example. It's something you need permission to do, but it is 100% a thing AniX could have chosen.



In this particular case? I actually believe the flavor is town indicative. AniX definitely seems like the kind to go "You submitted werewolf as your flavor? You get to be the town bloodhound." as a 'Fuck you for trying to out think the mod' kind of thing. It certainly fits with what I know of AniX's design philosophy.

[WePick]

quote this if you want to party

but when the party starts, keep in mind that alcohol brings the truth out and weed makes your more paranoid

Fun Fact: Our discord has a channel for discussing whiskey and also no one tell cee we have a discord, please.

[WePick]

definitely not public knowledge

i spent a long time staring at the locked thread wondering if this game was actually a thing that was going to happen, like we didn't even get told to pick anything even though it's a upick so maybe it really was all a joke

after a week or two i logged into the hydra account and saw that the info had been sent in pm and we'd sent a pick in already

communication is hard

-

[WePick]

It wasn't in the sign up post, but it WAS in the PM asking for picks.

While I guess it is TECHNICALLY possible different people got different things, the PM is worded generically and necessarily would have been sent before setup design had happened, so I don't think it's alignment-based.

I will say though that I wasn't aware of this during the actual picking process, because the PM only went to the hydra account and not the individual accounts, so I never thought to check until now. I imagine many of my fellows have a similar experience.

- Rat

[WePick]

VOTE: humaneatingmonkey

- Rat

[WePick]

Are you implying that ITF will be able to act from beyond the grave?

- Rat?

[WePick]

Well, I suppose we'll find out soon enough.

In the meantime, people should start sheeping me.

- Rat

[WePick]

For reasons that are beyond mortal comprehension. And are nonetheless true.

- Rat

[WePick]

I think the extent of what I'm allowed to say is that it isn't infallible, but I do personally have very high confidence.

I haven't heard from my fellow heads yet, but I suspect they will share in at least a measure of my confidence.

And I don't think I can safely elaborate further, so that's what you've got, sorry.

- Rat

[WePick]

@Skygazer, Dann, Pooky, HEM, WePick

Did anything come from drinking for any of you guys?

-Luke

Not as far as I can tell. Nothing in PMs at least. Though we didn't get a day start PM, so maaaayyyybe that? Seems like a weird useless effect, but it's the only abnormality I can see.

- Rat

[WePick]

Hypothetically, a Godfather-type role could cause that result.

But I think we can deal with that if limming HEM doesn't end the game.

- Rat

[WePick]

It's ALSO possible that if you're checking specifically for wincon and not for alignment name, that bypasses the Miller?

- Rat

[WePick]

Checking out.

-Jingle

[WePick]

Skygazer, are you aware of any limitations to your role? Number of participants perhaps?

- Rat

[WePick]

I would strongly recommend we all chill out for a second here. We already know it's possible for lims to go through early, and as far as I can tell zefiend's only crime is not being here quick enough yesterday, so maybe we should... stop and put more thought into things before throwing a bunch of votes down? We might be at secret E-1 right now.

- Rat

[WePick]

gosh this game is weird


-mirage

[WePick]

At least when I accidentally slip, it isn't posting my scum PT posts in GD.

Wait, we weren't supposed to submit the nightkill in GD? THAT'S WHY JJ ISN'T DEAD!

Also, rat is right, we should lime the shit out of HEM.

Today is probably a good day for massclaim. We will be not participating if massclaim happens, because I said so.

[WePick]

wait are you asking if jjh summoned a scum sock puppet AniX

-mirage

[WePick]

VOTE: jjh927

verifying real quick

I'll verify your corpse, bozo!

Vote halfasleep

Can you validate my parking?

- A Friend

[WePick]

it's okay, i gave the car to the valet

i'm sure the guy sitting outside with the hand-drawn sign was the valet right

-mirage

[WePick]

Checking up -Jingle

[WePick]

At least when I accidentally slip, it isn't posting my scum PT posts in GD.

Today is probably a good day for massclaim. We will be not participating if massclaim happens, because I said so.

This is not a joke, btw. I genuinely believe we’re at a point where massclaim will put us in or at autowin, I’m about 70% sure HEM is scum pending claims, and we 100% will not be claiming our role.

[WePick]

quote this if you want to party

but when the party starts, keep in mind that alcohol brings the truth out and weed makes your more paranoid

Fun Fact: Our discord has a channel for discussing whiskey and also no one tell cee we have a discord, please.

@skyg, any idea why this didn’t trigger your role? We got a choice yesterday, but as I understand the claim it should have already resolved before that.

[WePick]

quote this if you want to party

but when the party starts, keep in mind that alcohol brings the truth out and weed makes your more paranoid

Fun Fact: Our discord has a channel for discussing whiskey and also no one tell cee we have a discord, please.

@skyg, any idea why this didn’t trigger your role? We got a choice yesterday, but as I understand the claim it should have already resolved before that.

It did trigger, there was just a small delay in processing, we should get the result soon.

- Rat

[WePick]

quote this if you want to party

but when the party starts, keep in mind that alcohol brings the truth out and weed makes your more paranoid

Fun Fact: Our discord has a channel for discussing whiskey and also no one tell cee we have a discord, please.

@skyg, any idea why this didn’t trigger your role? We got a choice yesterday, but as I understand the claim it should have already resolved before that.

It did trigger, there was just a small delay in processing, we should get the result soon.

- Rat

No, I get that it triggered eventually. I’m just curious as to why it didn’t trigger before the night phase and if there was a mechanical failure or a user error.

[WePick]

At least when I accidentally slip, it isn't posting my scum PT posts in GD.

Today is probably a good day for massclaim. We will be not participating if massclaim happens, because I said so.

This is not a joke, btw. I genuinely believe we’re at a point where massclaim will put us in or at autowin, I’m about 70% sure HEM is scum pending claims, and we 100% will not be claiming our role.

At this time I think we still have some room not to mass claim.

Can we just have human eating monkey full claim instead?

-Bell

I mean kinda?

The reason I think massclaim is good here is because I think it’s likely we have confirmable night actions and the scum kill works the way itf’s special ban action works. Which necessarily means if we can force confirmable night actions to act, scum can’t use the day kill without making multiple conftown

[WePick]

i'm confused, Sky has a role that triggers when someone quotes her? and one of us quoted her last Friday but it didn't trigger a pm to us until yesterday?

-mirage

[WePick]

clearly the delinquent stole it

- Mirage

[WePick]

got back my result about skygazer after choosing to drink. it says: "After their ability is activated by every player, it gives 0 more results."

which possibly implies the same player can trigger it multiple times, as long as there's at least one player who hasn't done so at all.

Could also mean that there is a set number of results and that set number of results is <= playerlist size, which solves a design issue with the role.

Regardless I think we should only part by consensus for the rest of the game.

-Jingle

[WePick]

1. Asides.

A. How are wepick communicating? Are you guys using an app like discord or are you talking in a thread on this site? I’d like multiple of you to answer this question.

B. Assuming Pooky’s ability works, it could arguably outright clear them. As it seems unlikely they wouldn’t have made any posts in the scum Pt.

I get the feeling based on stargazer’s info that the mod likes to use loop holes or rules lawyer. So it’s possible Pooky’s abilities are useless, but it’s something to weigh.

-Bell

We're communicating almost exclusively through Discord. Not everyone is really active, but our Hydra PT hasn't been used since pregame.

- Rat

[WePick]

The problem in dealing with HEM, is that we're limited in what we can say, in ways that aren't entirely clear, and can't be properly communicated. If we're lucky, Skygazer might be able to say something helpful about us, since drinking has resolved now.

I can say that I personally find the 70% number to be a lowball estimate. I can also say that I do have an answer to HEM's question about whether we know his role name, but I haven't decided if I want to answer that before he claims.

- Rat

[WePick]

sometimes we communicate in this thread

if this can be called communication

-mirage

[WePick]

Almost exclusively?

-Bell

Some mod communication has been done through PM, and then there's like a page and a half of pregame posts in the hydra PT. Other than that, all Discord.

- Rat

[WePick]

sometimes we communicate in this thread

if this can be called communication

-mirage

That too.

- Rat

[WePick]

i think there's only a vanishingly small world where the last scum isn't within Klick, monkey, and untypablenamefiend

and it continues to get smaller

-mirage

[WePick]

im gonna be honest iwth you all.

i lost all attention to this game as soon as little anix showed up

can i get a reason to care again

~fire

[WePick]

VOTE: Klick

[WePick]

i am here to be carried

same friend. very same

also im a horrible hydra partner im not even reading my teams discord at all....

~firebringer

[WePick]

most hydra folks be like:



-mirage

[WePick]

VOTE: zefiend

100% confidence this time.

~Jingle

[WePick]

That is unusual

I am informed when I am targeted by something and can make it target anix instead, which is why I am alive and anix is not

The whole target switching business and messy implementation makes me think scum went back and forth on deciding to shoot me

I believe I can explain the 'mod error' in the post game. Suffice to say, if it's what I think it's not incredibly relevant to the game and we should probably just ignore it. It's a PM timing thing.

~Jingle

[WePick]

well this has certainly been one of the games of all time

good job team, we worked hard for it

-mirage

[WePick]

lol if youre town why would you use a random redirector action on a slot softing information, that's so antitown

when and why did you allegedly target us

-mirage

[WePick]

btw i'm gonna give everyone a reminder list of who's in this hydra just so you remember how awesome we are

Bingle
Thomith
KayJayQueue
Radical Rat
Firebringer
StraightFlush
biancospino
T-Bone
Gypyx
Doctor Drew
-Cee Mirage (that's me! )

[WePick]

Yes I am awesome


-Kay

[WePick]

see I told you Kay is in this hydra

-mirage

[WePick]

Hello, Wepick should full claim. As should HEM.

Halfasleep, stop that. Bad kitty.

Dan, *points and laughs*

-Bell.

Right well, the thing about that is that we can't. We haven't just been being vague about things for fun.

In any case, we did bad about discussing and performing an optimal action last night, but someone did put us on HEM again a few hours before deadline, so shout out to whoever did that.

My conclusion from the first time we did that is unchanged. It is regrettable that zefiend threw us off by being a passive redirector and then also lying about it (which I recognize the lying was required, but even so), but now there is nothing standing in the way of it just being HEM, unless someone else has targeting shenanigans to claim.

- Rat

[WePick]

VOTE: humaneatingmonkey

Not moving from here for the rest of the game without a VERY good reason. HEM's claim is not a very good reason.

- Rat

[WePick]

Wepick, what happened to your 100% guilty?

-Bell

The weird edge case happened. Consult zefiend's flip and behavior prior to it.

- Rat

[WePick]

It’s a problem that you said 100%
That’s not flavor knowledge or a player lying about their role claim. That’s supposed to be reserved for unambiguous guilties.

You need to figure out a way to explain why you were so certain about this.

-Bell

Explicitly bastard resolution. And literally zefiends ability explains everything if you’re paying attention.

-Bingle

[WePick]

You can’t claim because you’ve been banned from claiming by the mod?

Correct.

What can you say about your role?

I don't know the limits exactly. I've had to ask AniX frequently when it comes up.

Do you have night actions?

Can't say, sorry.

- Rat

[WePick]

Lying about their role is not a 100% guilty.

-Bell

You are absolutely correct.

~jingle

[WePick]

Also, are you not allowed to claim your Flavor name, what your abilities do, or both?

-Luke

We will not be claiming abilities.

Flavor may happen, pending confirmation from AniX.

[WePick]

We would not target either AniX or you.

I can seek permission to answer the most recent question if you need more.

[WePick]

WePick - We can change the role of any player we want to whatever role we want. This will not change the players alignment.

Role name, getting on plane jingle

[WePick]

What happened to not being able to claim directly? lol

that's the flavor name

nothing about anything that our role actually does there

-mirage

[WePick]

yup

wait until you see the rest of the role x.x

-mirage

[WePick]

Red always mafia

I will take you activating delinquent AniX again as a scumsiding 3p claim, btw. I think it’s a reasonable assumption that donning the red crown will make delinquent AniX scum.

[WePick]

-jingle. Also worth noting that there are subjective aspects of setup design and we explicitly don’t know what breaking the rules does

[WePick]

Out of curiosity, cabal, did AniX specifically ask y’all to sign accurately and not impersonate each other?

Jingle

[WePick]

Out of curiosity, cabal, did AniX specifically ask y’all to sign accurately and not impersonate each other?

Jingle

No. To my knowledge. I just sign because it’s less confusing.

-Bell

Good to know.

-Kay

[WePick]

I'm the Red Crown, if Anix finds me they get a night kill. I'm not informed if they find me in the day or the night, just that they find me. So I know there's a role named Anix, I was just not sure if it's a third party or admin-aligned. If mafia team are arsonists then game would have been over by now. I also don't want to reveal myself because a name like "red crown" isn't really a good look, but there's negative incentive to claiming early.

Basically, the main impacts of AniX being in the thread are:
-If you vote me or generally suggest that I should be voted, then AniX will vote you.
-If you vote me out, AniX will be voted out instead
-I can permanently send anix away, and would do so if I was going to be voted out because while eliminating me is bad, spending 2 phases eliminating me is worse
-Things that target me will be kinda fucky in a way I don't want to explain

Disclaimer: Since AniX has been shown to have voted outside of the parameters given, it is not inconceivable to me that AniX might take the opportunity to lolhammer

-jingle

[WePick]

A mod-controlled slot getting a nightkill would be pretty dumb

About as dumb as a redirect that acts in the middle of the night or sending results mid nightphase or a mod controlled slot in the game at all, yeah.

[WePick]

How does a role hide from a game moderator controlled slot

I don’t think the caught scum is trueclaiming what happens, only that there is an interaction with dAniX. The most likely would be a recruitment fmpov, which means I didn’t want to let dAniX interact with the red crown.

[WePick]

WePick - We can change the role of any player we want to whatever role we want. This will not change the players alignment.

Role name, getting on plane jingle

Are you able to claim who you targeted?

We cannot.

We were 70% sure of HEM scum D2, at which point we were ignored.

We were 100% sure of z scum yesterday, but z’s role was a blindside.

We are 100% sure of HEM scum today.

[WePick]

Why can’t HEM be another blind side?

-Bell.

I dunno. Let's ask.

HEM, are you a reflexive randomized redirector who also doesn't update the target name in a results PM and has to lie about your role?

~Jingle

[WePick]

We are 100% sure of HEM scum today.

who is we in this statement

which players in your hydra endorse this statement

I do. Jingle does. Mirage does. Everyone else SHOULD if they're paying attention.

- Rat

[WePick]

The funny thing is, we don't even need our own reasons for it to be apparent that HEM is scum. Even just his posting here is enough.

D1, basically everyone thought he was sketchy because of interactions Re:Cabal
D2, there's no kill and he immediately starts spinning up bullshit about ITF's personal ability being the factional kill. Regardless of why there wasn't a kill N1, that's a bit of an odd conclusion to jump to, is it not? He also expresses concern about his flavor being known, while we have confirmation from AniX that flavor influences alignment.
D3, he gets a free pass because a negative utility red herring role does its job and the day ends basically immediately.
D4, he finally claims, as The Red Crown. AniX tells us like picks are likely to be aligned. ITF's role was The Color Red. Notice any glaring similarities here?

And also... who else even COULD be scum here? The Cabal is cleared by Skygazer, who flipped blue. Dannflor's alignment technically isn't confirmed, but the ability is heavily implied to be from Skygazer's information lining up, and it feels like a very Town role. jjh got targeted by a kill. So that leaves Pooky, us, and HEM. We can afford to just go down the list at this point.

6:1 mislim HEM > 4:1 mislim us > 2:1 > Whoever's left, eliminate Pooky.

But actually it's even safer than that! As long as no one votes for Dannflor, no night actions happen, meaning no kills, meaning two extra days. HEM is claiming the ability to make himself unblockable, so he should get top priority here to prevent him bypassing Dannflor's prohibition.

Any questions that aren't baiting us to break restriction?

- Rat

[WePick]

Somehow I missed that clarification.

Either way, everything else I said holds true, just change who the confirmed slots are.

- Rat

[WePick]

VOTE: dannflor

Here's Dannflor getting voted D2

- Rat

[WePick]

Jjh got targeted by a kill?

-Bell

Apparently, it seems like we were the actual intended target, and that got redirected to jjh by zefiend, which then got redirected by jjh onto Delinquent AniX. I'd missed the bit where zefiend claimed to have deflected a kill off of us.

- Rat

[WePick]

Somehow I missed that clarification.

Either way, everything else I said holds true, just change who the confirmed slots are.

- Rat

- Rat

[WePick]

my role effect changes based on whether i get voted during a day phase, that is why I started D1 self voting, I didn't think to ask whether self voting counts

oh, that might mean it does work like any other vote then

I'll get back to you

skygazer you got correct info that self-voting is not beneficial in that self-voting basically deactivated my role for N1

- Rat

[WePick]

Oh.
Look just, I don’t wanna do the thing where we kill HEM and then if you’re wrong we have to kill you for playing below grade level standards.

Let people chat. Your guilty is noted and I promise this isn’t a power trip, I just don’t want to lose all control of this game and go automatically down the list. When the list is largely generated by one player.

-Bell

I'm alright with this. Don't mistake my certainty for impatience, I'm fine to take as long as it needs to. I apologize if I'm coming off as too forceful, I'm just trying to be as clear as I'm allowed to be and remove any lingering doubts people have. There need be no rush, so long as we are not led astray.

- Rat

[WePick]

Who targeted Dannflor?

- Rat

[WePick]

I need one post each from Firebringer, Gypyx, and Doctor Drew

Gypyx here, signing off on what radical rat said

[WePick]

I would have thought jjh's ability wouldn't have worked

admittedly Anix has been vague on what a role "returning a 0" really means

Who did you choose for the exception N1?

- Rat

[WePick]

Hey wepick, I know you can't go into any detail, but do you think it is plausible that everybody who used night actions targeted dannflor on n1

I actually don't think it's plausible on either night now that I'm re-examining things.

zefiend's role allowed them to deflect from someone else in addition to passively redirecting from themself. They claim to have targeted us with that, and deflected a kill as a result, and we know that kill wound up on Delinquent AniX, presumably as a result of you deflecting it.

To my eyes, that would mean, at minimum, one action targeting me and one action targeting Delinquent AniX. And if zefiend lied about that, and targeted either you or your child, then the kill would have been deflected to someone else, which means the only lie they could have told to make this work is if they targeted no one at all.

N1, Dannflor claimed to have given immunity to his effect to Pooky, so that should count as targeting someone else. Which means someone targeted Dannflor, and Dannflor also targeted someone else, ergo not the same target.

So the possibilities that I can see are:
1. The Cabal's Oracle is unreliable in some way (or has been misinterpreted)
2. There's some shenaniganery afoot with what counts as actions and targets
3. There have been severe game-compromising mod errors made

While all of this is very concerning, none of it actually changes my assessment of HEM, so I do think the best course of action is to just. Eliminate him anyway, and deal with whatever went wrong here if the game doesn't end?

- Rat

My bad, sorry
- Rat

[WePick]

If that doesn't count as an action, I think we can infer that zefiend's doesn't either. Which does at least partially resolve the issues here.

In this case there is exactly one possible world in which everyone targeted Dannflor N1, but it is a very unlikely world in my mind. I don't think I can say much more than that.

- Rat

[WePick]

If that doesn't count as an action, I think we can infer that zefiend's doesn't either. Which does at least partially resolve the issues here.

In this case there is exactly one possible world in which everyone targeted Dannflor N1, but it is a very unlikely world in my mind. I don't think I can say much more than that.

- Rat

Actually, upon re-reading zefiend's flip, this world doesn't exist. Based on the claims given so far, there should have been no one capable of targeting Dannflor.

If anyone has any information to dispute this, they should say so as soon as possible.

- Rat

[WePick]

This is my thoughts on the matter

Riveting stuff

-Kay

[WePick]

(I'm the chad and WePick is the soyjack)

Thank you for the clarification, I clearly needed it lol

-Kay

[WePick]

Shouldn't matter, but just in case.

- Rat

[WePick]

this game is silly

-Mirage