Open 143: Jungle Republic (Game Over!) before 787

[Mixologist]

Since when is -like- an absolute term?

Vote Count

Mixologist 3 - AA23, AshMC1984, hewitt
AceMarksman 3 - Mixologist, Percy, dejkha
AA23 1 - Empking

[Mixologist]

EBWOP: Hit submit not preview.

Since when is -like- an absolute term? You're trying to stretch what I said into something it doesn't mean. Also please respond to the rest of 440.

[hewitt]

@AA- The people you are accusing me of dirtly hoping behind, Ash and hewitt, are now shamelessly hoping on behind you.

I think the reasoning behind my vote is pretty damn good and vote-worthy.

@hewitt- You don't even mention Ace and the fact that he lied. Why did you vote zwet over Ace?

The lie was lost on me, I honestly don't even know what it was. zwets stuck out to me as setting up a scumplay that I didn't think was right. I was wrong, but he seemed scummy to me and I explained my reasoning for voting for zwets pretty clearly.

[AA23]

lol You're backtracking on your statement now?

So you're saying that you don't HAVE to be the one to start/finish a wagon, you can be on at any time?

Then WHY didn't you get on the Zwet wagon on Page 5 instead of go to Page 14 chasing an Ace lynch? lol

Please enlighten me.
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And 440 doesn't have questions toward me - - you're also attempting to have me turn on other people for reasons you say I should - - I'm voting the person I think is scummy, and will not give in to your attempts to distract.

I've asked you a serious question, Mix - one that determines you as scum or town - - why would you choose to beat around the bush with it and distract me with your rants in 440 instead of just answer?.....scummy....

Just let us know why you had nothing to do with the Zwet wagon/Investigation until you hammered him.

You said it was because you don't like wagons you don't start/early on - - and that was proven to be a

lie

so you split hairs on the wording and kindly ask if "like" is concrete. - - so now that you've diffused your lying attempt to save your self...

WHY then, did you not get on the wagon on pg5 where all your reasons existed? WHY did you not investigate him at the very least? WHY did you practically ignore Zwet until he was a vote away from death?

Well, Mix?

[AA23]

Above is to mix*

[dejkha]

Dej - I'm not saying Ace is innocent, but his flipping villain WILL be a card for Mix to play - - what makes this a bad thing is Mix being a villain himself

Lol ok. I never brought that up. Bit now that you mention it, Zwet's town flip was a card you played. You weren't on his wagon when he was lynched but you went after half the people that were.

In the post above your last from me to him - - you see no scum characteristics from him?

Not really. All I see is bickering.

Once again - I have no case on you, but your refusal to be open minded to things makes me uneasy - if I'm missing something, help me out, but this case is far from opinionated.

Actually, all cases are opinionated.

Mix has lied, been hypocritical, opportunistic, and is failing to justify his actions

What say you?

What say I? I say you've lied, been hypocritical and failed to back up your claims. So yeah, he appeared to make a vote that was opportunistic, but he explained and I still don't think anything of it.

He's failing to defend himself - I request you please read the case

I have read the case, I just don't think it's a very big one. You and Ace take priority over him. You seem to think I failed to defend myself, yet no else seems to think so, so maybe he's not failing that much either.

[AA23]

Your first statement - - I've made it clear that I protested against the reasoning of Zwet's wagon after Hewitt's vote on D1 - - please read.

I also stated that my drive is LEARNING from YOUR mistake - - Would you prefer I pretend a towny didn't die, and ignore the wagon? Is that the alternative, or will you just let it be?

------------
Alright - you want to ignore the Mix case - - there are a number of people who care

[AA23]

I don't want a man on my wagon who will admittedly lynch someone for no reason.

My case on Mix has plenty of those, and will get votes.

[Mixologist]

The fact that you are saying that I haven't answered your question means you failed to read 440. Let me show you.

Ace is scum so bad it hurts. He is blatantly ignoring this game. Why? There is -zero- pressure on him to contribute. As long as he isn't under any pressure to contribute, he will continue to actively lurk.

Look back at the end of D1. Ace, again, was under -zero- pressure as everyone was focusing in on zwet. Percy and I, again, were the only ones voting him.

Let me say again. There is -zero- pressure on Ace to post. That is why he isn't. I'm not going to let someone who I think is scum fly under the radar. That is why I pursued Ace.

Also 440 does have questions.

The people you are accusing me of dirtly hoping behind, Ash and hewitt, are now shamelessly hoping on behind you. What do you make of that? Also, re-reading you AA, it should said that speaking in absolutes like you are concerning me actually implicate you. Saying that someone is 100% scum when you are not an investigative role implies that you have knowledge that the rest of us don't. Saying that implies that you are scum. Are you scum?

[AA23]

Rolefishing for a counter-claim is about as good a D1 scumtell as we're going to get

. I intend to see Ace lynched tomorrow. He is scum.

He makes a statement that someone IS scum, yet gives an out of the blue vote to someone SUSPECTED of being scum (and not even by him for the last how many pages)

The above reaosning was on page 5 - - this is page 14
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Why didn't you go on the wagon sooner, Mix? Why would you say practically NOTHING to Zwet, not investigate him or anything, and hammer him for something you could have done earlier?

So here was my thought process on switching my vote.

zwet's playstyle is null. Let me say that up front. However, if you read him over, can't mention specifics as some of the games are currently ongoing, there is a very distinct difference between scumzwet and townzwet.

Actually after re-reading both zwet and Ace in isolation I'm more interested in Ace.......

zwet might not be the brightest crayon in the box, but I doubt he would purposefully link himself to his scum buddy. I'm liking Ace more as Mafia and zwet as Wolf at this point.

unvote

vote AceMarksman

FOS hewitt

Doesn't sound so "Null" anymore...pretty interesting how you like to flip flop

That was also after page 5 - when he could have voted Zwet, but prefers Ace

I don't like being on a wagon early, unless I am the one starting it.

That's a lie, you didn't start the Ace wagon and you were second on it - - two contradictions.

Since when is -like- an absolute term?

Wow, splitting hairs....

Then WHY? You're either lying, or you don't have an answer lol

if I am lynched today, will be my downfall.

Not the town's downfall? Yours? Are you seperate from us?

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To make it clear so you stop asking me - - - I am primarily interested in YOU. There are 4 other villains in this game, ANY scum can argue "wah wah, why are you after me and not THEM" - - dude, if you have a case on anyone, present it and lay it out - do what I'm doing.

WHY didn't you investigate Zwet? Why didn't you go on the wagon earlier? It's the million dollar question and you're dancing around it lol

[Mixologist]

So are you refusing to answer my question?

I've answered. Please read.

[AA23]

The people you are accusing me of dirtly hoping behind,

Ash and hewitt, are now shamelessly hoping on behind you. What do you make of that?

Anyone can vote for any reason - - If there's a case on them, go ahead and persue it - I'm voting you for my case, good sir.

Also, re-reading you AA, it should said that speaking in absolutes like you are concerning me actually implicate you.

Saying that someone is 100% scum when you are not an investigative role implies that you have knowledge that the rest of us don't. Saying that implies that you are scum. Are you scum?

Ace is scum so bad it hurts.

I intend to see Ace lynched tomorrow. He is scum.

lol.....OUCH.....
-----------------------------------------------------------------

Now please - Answer the question. Or are you indeed guilty and can't think of a new answer? DO let this answer be "absolute" will you, friend?

[Percy]

Urgh... RL is killing me, will post tomorrow

[ThAdmiral]

Thesp replaces Gorckat

(just to make it official!)

[Percy]

1. Ace is scum. His play is

completely

incompatible with a pro-town player. He must be lynched today.

2. AA23 is pushing the Mix case hard. Mix has answered his questions, and AA refuses to answer Mix's questions. I stand by my earlier statement - whilst the quickhammer may be opportunistic, I don't think it was necessarily anti-town play.

3. AA continues to appear more scummy than Mix to me, including his treatment of the (current) Ace wagon.

4. Whether you agree with Mix or AA, the case against Ace is far stronger.

Response to AA's questions:

1.I'd like the post numbers of your quotes where Mix apparently addresses the Zwet case beyond thos tidbits - -
2.I would like to read them in context
3.And I'd like to read what else was in the quotes.

Post numbers are 115, 222 (which is on page 9, by the way). The discussion wasn't great, I agree. However, it is not the scumtell you think it is. By blowing it out of

all

proportion with your irritatingly long posts, filled with nothing but repetition and the same, tired emotional appeals, you are destroying any case you are trying to build.

His response in 340 was completely acceptable to me. Read the posts yourself if you want them in context.

4.Also - your opinion on the hypocrisy of him not moving to the wagon earlier.

Meh. Zwet was going to get lynched, Mix just hammered.

I find it more disturbing that you didn't comment on the wagon at all when it was happening, and have done nothing but talked about how crap it was today. Your responses to this line of attack have been weak-to-absent.

[Empking]

Thesp: What are your feelings on Mix?

[AshMC1984]

there is Ash on the wagon who also has a tag that suggests policy lynching Zwet - - I'm not a fan of players who take pride in how quick they get players killed over how many scum they catch

Huh?

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I don't find Mix overly scummy.

Thesp: What are your feelings on Mix?

Why ask specifically about a case that you've pretty much stated you don't feel worth persuing when there's other current topics? Active lurking?

FOS: Empking

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If Ace doesn't post soon he will incur my vote.

[Empking]

Asking important questions is not active lurking.

[Percy]

It is when you haven't established that the questions are important

to you

.

[AA23]

Percy - you deminish your statements about my case, when you end your post with "Meh, Zwet was going to be lynched - why not hammer" - -

It's that very ignorance that calls for repetition.
----------------------
Ace getting lynched before Mix gives him a card to play - - the iron will no longer be hot, and just because Ace is worth investigating, doesn't mean Mix is innoccent - - your argument suggests I should stop trying to lynch suspected scum (like Mix) because there are 4 other people worth lynching as WELL.
-----------------------
Please read.

I protested the reasons for the Zwet wagon after Hewitt voted.
-----------------------

[Empking]

It is when you haven't established that the questions are important

to you

.

A replacement's feelings on the biggest bandwagon are always important to me.

[dejkha]

your argument suggests I should stop trying to lynch suspected scum (like Mix) because there are 4 other people worth lynching as WELL.

I don't think that's it. I just think he's saying that

he's

not gonna stop trying to lynch who

he

suspects to be scum. That's the approach I think most of us are taking.

[AA23]

I'm not the only one voting Mix, Dej.

And what I'm saying is exactly that - - You two are pointing at the fact that there are 5 villains in total - - does that mean I should ignore the

1

I'm looking at now?

lol you guys are laughable - - "AA, don't go after Mix jsut because you think he's scum and he's poorly defending himself, go after some OTHER possible scum!"

------------------------------
And can you guys put up a quote where Mix answered why he hopped without warning or showing any care for the wagon? Because the only answer he gave turned out to be a lie, and post 461 doesn't make him look too hot....

He was online for 6 hours until almost midnight after post 461.....funny how he couldn't give an explanation - - Then again he could have been embarrassed (I would understand)

I definately built the case and wagon on this one, but I'm no leader of sorts - - I can firmly say my stance won't change - -

[Thesp]

Crud. I had some posting typed up at work, and never was able to transfer it home, while I've got the time here. Let's get somewhat re-started, anyway, as much of my original thinking was superceded.

I'm not fond of AA23, and sure wouldn't mind him lynched.

Unvote

Not willing to let scum hammer the Seer without a complete re-read to reaffirm or alleviate my suspicions.

Afraid of a hammer after two people ahead of this post unvoted?

I think this was prescient as well.

I think AA23 and dejhka both have substantial chances to be scum, which makes their back & forth interesting and awesome. I'd be happy seeing both strung up. I don't particularly care yet in which order.

By the way, curse you all for getting Dust killed. I enjoyed playing with him in the newbie game I ended with him not long ago, where I strongly disavowed the RVS stage and aggressively asked questions of people to gauge their alignment. He comes here and does that, and gets rounded up. Yikes.

I absolutely do not like Mixologist's quickhammer. I think it's far more likely to come from scum than town. (There was no deadline at the time that was pressing, correct? I do not recall seeing one.)

Percy, what do you think of hewitt?
hewitt, what do you think of AceMarksman?
AceMarksman, what do you think of Percy?

A vicious pun! This makes me take you less seriously. The more confident and self-assured you proport yourself, the less I believe you.

Crud, this doesn't bode well for you ever believing me.

In other news-Welcome, Thesp.

Thanks!

Thesp: What are your feelings on Mix?

I disagree with you on him - I think he needs to die. Along with AA23 and dejhka. I'm happy lynching any of them. I don't mind the pressure on AceMarksman. There are some others I won't lynch that I'm not going into at this moment.

I greatly appreciate the activity in this game, though I think it could do with less walls o' text.

Glad to be in the game! I'll post more when I have those few questions answered, or if anyone has particular questions for me.

[dejkha]

I think AA23 and dejhka both have substantial chances to be scum, which makes their back & forth interesting and awesome. I'd be happy seeing both strung up. I don't particularly care yet in which order.

Any reasons why? That's a pretty baseless statement that, if you don't elaborate on, would make me happy to see you "strung up".

I'm happy lynching any of them. I don't mind the pressure on AceMarksman.

You just "don't mind" it? So you want Me, AA and Mix lynched, but you're not sold on Ace? That's in need of serious explanation. How do all three of us take priority over someone that lied in an attempt to get an early lynch, lied even more to try and get out of the previous lie and then laid low ever since caught on both lies?

There are some others I won't lynch that I'm not going into at this moment.

Unless you do some serious explaining on the issues above, I'm gonna guess the people you're not going to lynch are your scumbuddies.

First real post in the game and you're already not making sense...