NY 114: Mafia vs. Werewolves (Game Over)

[Midnight's Sorrow]

Yes. But in this talk of masons and monks...why was only Seraphim out of the question of not being a werewolf?

[Leafsnail]

Yes. But in this talk of masons and monks...why was only Seraphim out of the question of not being a werewolf?

...?

[SerialClergyman]

Interesting finds, both nhammen and Parama. Now that I re-read foilist's posts, he does seem to be rolefishing quite a bit: previously, I took this for him just trying to make sense of the game. I still don't get the feeling that he's scum, but I'm not too sure just yet.

Vezo really is contributing far less to the game than he could be, hinting at the role without any clarification only helps scum, as far as I can see.

The speed with which Chronopie jumped on the nhammen wagon does surprise me -- he seems to be hoping to put the focus away from him and thus be forgotten. This doesn't look like very pro-town play to me. I also have to agree that his attempts at rolefishing would cause more harm if they were successful (I see LMP's role and knowledge to currently be of more importance than vezo's).

FOS: Chronopie

Unvote; Vote: nhammen

Not only do you never mention anything about whether the nhammen wagon is

good

, you actually

compliment and agree with him

in the bolded.
Not a particularly intuitive way to put yourself ninth on the wagon... Especially since if you didn't know your vote was horrible, you didn't do it on purpose like someone fishing for reactions/pressure would... which means that you intended to lynch nhammen with this post as reasoning.

Unvote: nhammen

Vote: Sevis

(L-12)

I'm fine with assuming nhammen-Town for the time being.

What?

I don't understand how you could do this reversal when you know there are two mafia groups.

And I don't understand how that makes you fine assuming nhammen town.

This whole post is pretty bizarre.

[Midnight's Sorrow]

@Leaf: I just found it odd that when it was a question of which one of them could be the wolf among the sheep as it were, that it was only veso and dan that were the prime candidates.

Thats all that meant.

[Vi]

Interesting finds, both nhammen and Parama. Now that I re-read foilist's posts, he does seem to be rolefishing quite a bit: previously, I took this for him just trying to make sense of the game. I still don't get the feeling that he's scum, but I'm not too sure just yet.

Vezo really is contributing far less to the game than he could be, hinting at the role without any clarification only helps scum, as far as I can see.

The speed with which Chronopie jumped on the nhammen wagon does surprise me -- he seems to be hoping to put the focus away from him and thus be forgotten. This doesn't look like very pro-town play to me. I also have to agree that his attempts at rolefishing would cause more harm if they were successful (I see LMP's role and knowledge to currently be of more importance than vezo's).

FOS: Chronopie

Unvote; Vote: nhammen

Not only do you never mention anything about whether the nhammen wagon is

good

, you actually

compliment and agree with him

in the bolded.
Not a particularly intuitive way to put yourself ninth on the wagon... Especially since if you didn't know your vote was horrible, you didn't do it on purpose like someone fishing for reactions/pressure would... which means that you intended to lynch nhammen with this post as reasoning.

Unvote: nhammen

Vote: Sevis

(L-12)

I'm fine with assuming nhammen-Town for the time being.

What?

I don't understand how you could do this reversal when you know there are two mafia groups.

And I don't understand how that makes you fine assuming nhammen town.

This whole post is pretty bizarre.

Bizarre posts are the only kind I make.~

I don't understand your first objection, so I'll move on to the second one.
Post 458 read like a frustrated Townie. The confusion, the disarray, the willingness to cuss out Parama. His doublepost adding pman to the group of lurkers suggests that he was actually trying to reread the game (although he hasn't come back yet after seven hours so etc.). Yes, I like falling for AtE.

[Super Smash Bros. Fan]

You might want to look at this article.
The second section under "Mafia Masons", which makes this a possibility, although unlikely.

[SerialClergyman]

Ah - I thought that your reversal was based on Servis' scummy entering onto the wagon. I was pointing out that the other scum group would have every reason to lynch him without caring so much about the reasons, and just because someone scummy jumped on his wagon, that doesn't make him town because he's quite possibly the OTHER scumgroup to Servis.

I couldn't disagree more about the AtE though. I think he's caught scum, pure and simple.

[Vi]

Edit to previous post - Too much time spent in front of a bright screen means I lose my ability to think coherently.

I didn't assume nhammen-Town based on Sevis-scum, if that's what you were trying to say. The Sevis vote was me moving on from someone I finally got a Town read on.

[Parama]

Goddammit SSBF please read. The masons in this game are NOT mafia. It's part of the point of having 2 different masonesque groups.

[SerialClergyman]

Yep - confusion sorted.

Now we just need to unconfuse your emotional attachment to the monkey

[Midnight's Sorrow]

I couldn't disagree more about the AtE though. I think he's caught scum, pure and simple.

Then why don't you do us a favor, and unvote him, and wait to see if he can be hammered That way, if he does flip scum(Like your SO sure he will ) then your in the clear baby.~ If he doesn't flip scum, and you survive, then your prime lynch material for tomorrow. /jk

Seriously. WHY do you think he is scummy? Your reasons don't make sense to me ...at ALL. >.>

[Vi]

Yep - confusion sorted.

Now we just need to unconfuse your emotional attachment to the monkey

*link to Bad Romance goes here*

Well, I wouldn't have gotten the Town read for no reason.

(Very little or superficial reason is still in the question though.)

I know it's an unusual question, but could you explain the scum thought process behind the post I mentioned? (nhammen #18, aka 458)

[Parama]

unvote, vote: nhammen

I think we're forgetting why we're here, guys.
Less pointless talk, more lynching of obvious scum please.

[LimMePls]

You might want to look at this article.
The second section under "Mafia Masons", which makes this a possibility, although unlikely.

And I thought my claim would solve the confusion.

*SIGH*

Apparently Vezo isn't the only one who has logic = suck.

Try to follow along SSBF, I'll explain this as slowly and fully as I can.

The mod told the monks that those in their monk groups are not werewolves. Vezo is in the monk group, therefore Vezo cannot be a werewolf.

The mod told the masons that those in their mason groups are not mafia. Vezo is in the mason group, therefore Vezo cannot be mafia.

This game has two scum groups, the werewolves and the mafia. Vezo cannot be a mafia. Vezo cannot be a werewolf. Therefore Vezo CANNOT BE SCUM.

If you're still confused I can't help you. I only pray to god you're still in school. And you need to go to your teachers, smack them upside the head, and demand that they actually do their job.

[SerialClergyman]

I would hammer him.

I've detailed why I think he's scum and I haven't seen him defend that accusation at all. I don't get why you think the person who places the hammer is auto-dead the next day, Midnight. a) You're too concerned over what happens to you personally when we should be trying to take out the scum and b) that's just not true, nobody looks at a 13 person wagon and goes hey, that last guy to get on, it's your fault.

Vi - nhammen is a good player doing his best not to get lynched. He got caught out trying to play below the radar and making safe attacks. Now he's getting wagoned, so he's doing what he can to appear protown. It's not like typing that up would have taken a giant effort. There's no outrage, save that he thinks the wagon HAS to be scum driven. He also modestlyy suggests that 3 scum members from each team are on his lynch, which is almost certainly rubbish.

I'm getting scum-WIFOM and scum-asssaving way more than I'm getting picked on townie who's desperately fighting to the last to help his team.

[LimMePls]

I thought Chronopie was scum before the nhammen wagon. I support that wagon. I'll move if I'm convinced its the superior wagon, but nhammen has yet to convince me he isn't deserving of a lynch.

@Vi You left the nhammen wagon because of AtE plus his pointing out lurkers? Isn't attacking lurkers like scum 101? They make easy targets because people disapprove of lurkers by policy (LynchAllLurkers) and they don't defend themselves.

[Super Smash Bros. Fan]

@LynchMePls: Okay, I think I see your point now.

Unvote

Will make another vote in my analysis. I will disregard Seraphim, Vezopiraka, daniel, and LynchMePls due to the confirmation that masons and monks are not scums.

[Midnight's Sorrow]

That's just it SC, I don't get your accusation at all. It makes no sense to me why that makes him scum.

and @ reasons a and b. That was a joke son. -getoverit~-

[LimMePls]

MS strikes me as scum. Just sayin'.

[Vi]

Vi - nhammen is a good player doing his best not to get lynched. He got caught out trying to play below the radar and making safe attacks. Now he's getting wagoned, so he's doing what he can to appear protown. It's not like typing that up would have taken a giant effort. There's no outrage, save that he thinks the wagon HAS to be scum driven. He also modestlyy suggests that 3 scum members from each team are on his lynch, which is almost certainly rubbish.

I'm getting scum-WIFOM and scum-asssaving way more than I'm getting picked on townie who's desperately fighting to the last to help his team.

Nya? I've only seen nhammen's name occasionally onsite, so if you're calling him a good player that puts a different spin on things. I expect the suggestion that he has picked out ALL of the scum from n00bs

and myself

, but not from someone experienced. Ditto the cry that his wagon is scum-pushed, although that's not me so much~

I can't say I agree with the lack of outrage, looking back over nhammen's ISO. Granted I've lost games because of this before (back when AtE was UncertainKitten's first and only line of defense as either alignment) but I can certainly see him as frustrated with the tsunami of votes.

Could you show me a game that's representative of nhammen's skill as you see it?

WIFOM and not desperately fighting for the team, in this game, well...

@Vi You left the nhammen wagon because of AtE plus his pointing out lurkers?

More the AtE. It works for VI-types.

[SerialClergyman]

Vi = VI?

Here's the game.

I also had a PM conversation about it with him afterwards and I feel he's a solid player, definitely not a VI.

[Dry-fit]

But there have been two separate instances where M-Sorrow has been called obvTown (by Lowell and SerialClergyman) and I agree with them. Why do you disagree with these reads?

The first instance I don't get at all. He claims to have no idea what the cases are about, and is honest about it. Why can't scum be confused by that, or be honest about that confusion? The second instance, well I just don't think it's so conclusive.

Midnight's posts have mostly been fluff, and I thought that comment about the one to hammer being lynched next was odd.

Also:

I'm not eager to set up one

This is a HUGE ping on my scumdar. This just seems strange coming from town.

I'm fine with my vote where it is for now.

[Dr. Robotnik]

Doc Robot is back, and completely missed the giant nhammen bandwagon. While I feel he certainly has been acting suspicious, the fact that the wagon formed so fast, with some just hopping on with no explanations is also worrysome.

[Super Smash Bros. Fan]

Doc Robot is back, and completely missed the giant nhammen bandwagon. While I feel he certainly has been acting suspicious, the fact that the wagon formed so fast, with some just hopping on with no explanations is also worrysome.

Did you just parrot me on the matter? You basically said what I said earlier in my latest decent-size post of today.

[Midnight's Sorrow]

From what I can gain, what started out as a vote because of lack of content(or whatever it was), turned into a nhammen's wagon skyrocketing because of a small simple mistake. It was jumped upon in the midst of all the Mason and Monk chaos. It was jumped on

hard

.

Soon after it, the reasons were expanded, and several people became assured that they caught scum.

This is B.S. You do not expand B.S. reasons for wagoning a person and expect them to turn into a gem. I don't care how many times you expand your reasons.

"

B.S only begets more B.S.

"

All you end up getting is a bigger pile of heaping B.S. then you started with.

It seems to me though, that people seemed to push his wagon

much

harder when he roleclaimed roleblocker. Why? Do you want to lynch him just to be assured that he is in fact what he said he was? By then it will be to late, and we will be down a Town PR, because you wanted to make sure he wasn't lying???<(this is the basic gist of what I am seeing)

Please

The nhammen wagon needs to unload, and unload quick,. It's not big enough for anyone but nhammen.