NY 120: Flash mafia 2. GAME OVER

[mikeburnfire]

Well, that's what your statement made it look like.

[Ojanen]

Oman: are you playing from a phone or from a computer?

[Ojanen]

the grievous state of the game is that a lot of people are saying they don't have a clear suspect and have trouble voting and a big percentage of the cases made (Esp, Rich, Luchris off the top off my head) have been, circularly, for not providing reasoning.
Elli isn't giving me enough to get a read.
but mbf. I have this picture of you as having the air of this stereotype of an old user with a bunch of social site cred who barely is playing the game and finds himself too cool to be affected by social pressure of the other players getting annoyed. There's a group of old site users with a decent reputation who flake all the time without notifying the mod while staying active on the site (Jdodge, CDB etc), a bit similar to that phenomenon (the aura is different to newer lurkers). I might be a bit rude here but you're not exactly even pretending ("somebody give me a case to justify my vote thx" "let's lynch him so at least I won't look like he's my scumbuddy" and the n instances of you being unable to check a couple of pages back by yourself).
What do you like about the Luchris case? Preferably a part that wouldn't be applicable to your play here.

[Oman]

Phone, on a week long course for work. Safe to say that I dont get why Oman-scum would say ut is town more than Oman-town. I get the basic theory, I get buddying, I get all that but not why its more likely from scum than town. Townies have opinions too.

MBF leads me down a rabbit hole, I have no idea where I read him. He's voted me (several times? Maybe twice) with so little for me to defend against, or even pretend to refute. OJ gives me a better vibe today than yesterday, for those who care.

And re: my timing. PM came at 0602 and I responded at 1804, however I read this as getting the PM at 0602pm and responding 0604pm, as I either wasn't on or didn't see the pm for 12hrs.

[Ojanen]

I don't care about the time stamp anymore; your reaction was clear on you thinking that you were telling the truth about it.
you were on the site in GD a couple of times after your prod; that+your response coming right after my badgering of you was why I assumed you were active lurking also there.
the week before the last. Wednesday-Sunday. You know, the deadline time area. Posting from phone or computer?

[Ythill]

@Mike:

Yeah, I see how you got to that conclusion but... no.

Safe to say that I dont get why Oman-scum would say ut is town more than Oman-town. I get the basic theory, I get buddying, I get all that but not why its more likely from scum than town.

Look at the other things I said, and that vollkan repeated. The ones you're ignoring.

We have just over six days until deadline and Oman's still not voting. I may have to petition the mod for daykilling powers. Obviously, I am willing to hammer him if we get one more vote and an unsatisfactory claim. Any takers? Any flakers?

[Oman]

I'm happy to vote.

vote; MBF

[Fishythefish]

Deadline access issues:
As ever, poor weekend access - I'll probably check in, but don't expect much on Friday or Saturday. Sunday ok, but no access on Monday. Should be able to do something on Tuesday. So yeah, I'm afraid it's going to be another deadline semi-lurk from me.

@Luchris: please expand on your thoughts about Oman.

If I had to choose between mbf and Oman, right now it would be Oman. Mostly a gut thing. Both have done very little, but from mbf I get more of a vibe of genuinely not caring about the game, whereas Oman seems more active-lurky. The connections with UT (positive or negative) aren't a major factor for me here - I think it's pretty easy to concoct explanations for any combination, but without flips I don't think there's really enough evidence to draw any reasonably firm conclusions.

[mikeburnfire]

Yes, I suppose "MBF doesn't care about this game" is an appropriate summary. I

want

to get into it, but whenever I start reading from the beginning my mind goes blank, like when you read two pages of a book, then realize that you didn't actually absorb anything.

As for the case on Luchris, nothing positive can be seen by me about him, but nothing really scummy either. Maybe I'm not looking hard enough, but there just doesn't seem to be enough evidence to compel me to go after him.

Oman, UT, volkan, and ythill were a part of the RGH wagon yesterday, with ythill only jumping off because he knew that RGH was going to be the lynch even without his vote. I wouldn't mind voting UT or Oman based on how they joined the mislynch yesterday. I'd prefer UT since he voted after Oman, and because he admitted to not thinking RGH was scum when he placed his vote.

As it stands, I'm already voting UT, so I'll leave my vote there.

Oman: why are you voting me? Deadline vote again?

Ythill, are you voting me as "Even if he's not scum, he's a liability"?

[Ythill]

Oman, UT, volkan, and ythill were a part of the RGH wagon yesterday, with ythill only jumping off because he knew that RGH was going to be the lynch even without his vote.

Reality check: I never voted for Richard.

I'd prefer UT since he voted after Oman, and because he admitted to not thinking RGH was scum when he placed his vote.

What difference does the order make that close together? They both admitted midland reads on Rich, how is that scummier coming from UT? The way I see it, he has a better excuse since a town player under pressure

should

vote his own alternative at deadline.

Ythill, are you voting me as "Even if he's not scum, he's a liability"?

Definately not. I'm not much of a policy voter. Are you going to keep guessing?

[Ojanen]

As for the case on Luchris, nothing positive can be seen by me about him, but nothing really scummy either. Maybe I'm not looking hard enough, but there just doesn't seem to be enough evidence to compel me to go after him.

What did you mean by this

I like UT's case on Luchris.

and does it affect your read on UT somehow?

[Fishythefish]

Espeonage - you've done nothing today. Who's scum, and why? Why the recent lack of content?
Parama - I dislike the way you have virtually no stated opinion on anyone who looks in any danger of a lynch.

To anyone who is town: this game is not going well. We need more content from more people. Right now, the scum can happily hide among the lurkers and come in with deadline votes on any wagon without standing out in any way. Commit to opinions, with reasons - at least on the major suspects. If you don't have opinions, make them. If you don't, we will lose.

@mod

please replace Seol.

[Fishythefish]

EBWOP: I see myk is already replacing Seol. Hooray!

[Parama]

Okay, I am dumping all of my reads and starting over, because my reads this game suck and I'm pretty sure they suck. Let's see what conclusions I come to on a reread:

Blank Slate Reread!!! Not writing anything besides reads because if I do more than that I tend to wallpost and I am not in a wallposting mood right now.

And heck yeah replacements get placed separately from replacees. Because I might factor a read on a replacement into a read on a replacee. Somewhat.

Everyone gets to be in one of two categories here:

PLZ DIE

or

HAPPY PEOPLE

PLZ DIE

vollkan
Espe AND/OR Luchris

NOT BOTH

changed my mind
Budja
Seol

HAPPY PEOPLE

JDodge
Mike
Ojanen
Oman
Fishy
UT
Ythill

These are in no order besides the two groups. And wow looks like I ended up reading both replacements and replacees similarly.
I'll order them for convenience:

PLZ DIE

Espe AND/OR Luchris

NOT BOTH

changed my mind
Seol
vollkan

HAPPY PEOPLE

Fishy
Ythill
UT
Oman
Mike
Ojanen

Vollkan: I know what question you're going to ask; the answer is no.

unvote

I want Luchris and Espe's top scumpicks right now. RIGHT NOW.

[Oman]

no MBF, I'm not voting you for deadline, I'm voting you because you aren't giving me anything other than "unreadable" and that, if this makes sense, seems really anti-town. basically even Townies get me thinking they're scum every now and then, but you're striking me as so cautious and non-commital that I do not believe you are town.

[mikeburnfire]

Wow, that's a pretty shitty reason, Oman. You tempt me to move my vote.

What difference does the order make that close together?

Because the latter could be following the lead of his scummate. Alternatively, the latter could see townsfolk latching on and try to slip on as well.

Are you going to keep guessing?

I'm a busy man. Random.org?

What did you mean by this

I like UT's case on Luchris.

and does it affect your read on UT somehow?

I said it off-the-cuff. Upon closer inspection, it's not all that spectacular.

[Espeonage]

@ Parama: Oman, Fishy

@ Oja: I have nothing to say. I'm happy with my vote. I'm reading everything.

[vollkan]

unvote, vote: vollkan

Because?

It's intersting that, to me, MBF looks like a UT buddy in one scenario whereas Oman looks like scum using UT-town in another. Combining them would lead me to a MBF-Oman scumteam conclcuion with UT as the town pawn, if not for the vote-grouping caveat. Thoughts?

You're right about MBF. I just ISOd him and he goes from completely unsure and neutralish to OTT certain on RGHP. His subsequent explanation of it ("Well, there was a lot of reason for me to go after Richard. I had a case and everything") doesn't do much either, since it doesn't explain the sudden spike in passion.

MBF+4

(not changing vote yet since not sure of the VC)

As for Oman, as somebody who also had problems with the UT wagon, I don't see the way he rejected the UT wagon as scummy

Hey, at least I tried. If RGH was scum, I'd be super-confirmed now.

The fact you "tried" is kind of the problem; it was inconsistent.

If UT and I were scum, then my sudden, uncharacteristically loud jump from UT to RGH would have been a dumb move to make, since it is abnormal behavior for me (so far this game), and nobody else really showed an interest in lynching RGH. Essentially, I would have chosen an uphill fight that, if I lost, would have heavily implicated me.

You're only looking at one side of the issue. RGHP's wagon was small, but I know by that stage both Oman and I had both expressed scepticism about the UT wagon.

[Parama]

@vollkan: I didn't like the vote or the timing.
@Espe: Elaborate?

[Espeonage]

Already done to an extent and no.

[Ojanen]

I'm so sick of towns only being able to find mafiosos who are gambitting through intentionally acting dumb or useless, or actually are dumb/useless regardless of alignment. But it's bound to happen that way in a low-content game.
Argh. I'll be back with something more productive tonight.

[mykonian]

with Seol proving to be not as great as we happened, we needed someone really awesome as a replacement.

And guess who offered? Please welcome Internet Stranger!

[mykonian]

votecount

Oman (4): Espeonage, Ojanen, Luchris, Vollkan
Untrod Tripod (2): Fishythefish, mikeburnfire
mikeburnfire (2): Ythill, Oman
Luchris (1): Untrod Tripod

not voting (2): Internet Stranger, Parama

With 11 players it is 6 to lynch.

[Internet Stranger]

It looks like this game is going slow and in desperate need of help. Thats usually a sign of cowardice.

But, nothing to worry about anymore. Now that im here, it should be ridiculously easy to ferret out the scum.
Look at me like the corporate hatchetman coming in to get rid of slackers and useless deadweight stopping us from our goal of destroying the scum threat. If youre not helping me catch scum, you might as well be one too.

Yes, there will probably be some casualties along the way. Its an unfortunate fact of mafia. Innocents must bleed along with us heroes for the scum to be eradicated. Sacrifices must be made, pain must be endured. But in the end, this town will emerge victorious. Lets make history here, people. Let us prove to them other towns that we stand in the face of fear and catch the scum better than any of them.

I do still have some reading to do, but considering the state this town finds itself in, its probably an useless exercise. Spirits need to be lifted. Souls must be nourished. People need to be shaken awake!

Vote: Oman

If four people are voting for Oman already, there must be a reason. So lets do it. Lets just lynch this one guy here and lets see what happens. If you all need to sack up, if you all need to find your inner fire, then lets vote for this Oman character and start anew in a new day. Its for our future, its time to fulfill our mafia hunting destiny.

Time to die Oman. Your efforts will forever be immortalized. Its for the good of the group. The future hinges on us. Dont let us down.

[Untrod Tripod]

Good to see you again, IS.

Apparently, IS will be played by this guy

for the duration of the game.

And I for one couldn't be more aroused. Turgid member notwithstanding, I am not moved to the point that I want to lynch someone I have a town read on. Your words will not sway me, Mel Gibson.