Oldy Mafia (Game Over, who won?)

[Patrick]

Votecount

Yosarian2 (6) -- Shanba, Ythill, Glork, CrashTextDummie, chamber, Cogito Ergo Sum
inHimshallibe (2) -- ChannelDelibird, Lord Gurgi
ChannelDelibird (2) -- Ether, DrippingGoofball
Shanba (1) -- HackerHuck
Lord Gurgi (1) -- inHimshallibe
Ythill (1) -- Porochaz
MrBuddyLee (1) -- Yosarian2

Not voting: MrBuddyLee
15 alive, 8 to lynch

[Ythill]

Glad to see Yos @ L-1. The wagon contains some scummy and borderline voters, but I'm not going to let that bother me because this game full of pros is likely to be bus-happy.

Do we have a hammer waiting? If so, I'll add my voice to those calling for a claim.

I'm probably one of the few people that could pull a gambit like that off, because everyone knows I love a good gambit, and the real vig would know that, too.

Which is precisely why you'd be bold enough to try it as scum. And it also explains the lack of CC if you're not the vig. Not trying to run you up here, just pointing out that lack of CC in this scenario says zilch about your alignment. I'll believe you for now, but I'm watching you.

[Porochaz]

And why arent we lynching ythill?

[Ythill]

He's town, obv.

[Yosarian2]

Do we have a hammer waiting? If so, I'll add my voice to those calling for a claim.

A: I'm not currently at lynch -1

B: If I was, I still wouldn't claim.

C: Stop tunneling on me for no damned reason and read the game, and help me lynch the real scum.

I don't know why in a game full of people who are this experienced everyone is playing worse then in most newbie games I've been in, or why the hell I'm about to be lynched for no reason, but there's no way in hell I'm claiming.

Of course, out of the 7 people who were voting for me when I was at lynch -1, 3 are obvscum (MBL, Chamber, and Shanba), so I guess it's not a surprise that it doesn't make any sense. Still, the people voting for me who I otherwise thought were town are frustrating.

[MrBuddyLee]

Porochaz, what do you think of inHim, Shanba and Yos?

[Yosarian2]

A

@Yos:

The wagons you were avoiding were all of them, until I pointed out that you were doing that. [/b]

I voted chamber, moved to the ecto wagon when I finally felt I had no choice, and then joined the mert wagon when it looked like the only hope for a lynch on day 1 that was at least semi-reasonable. I don't know when you "pointed out I was avoiding wagons", and I don't really care; it certanly didn't affect any of those decisions.

And WTF is up with your reads? It's like you live in opposite land.

Ythill, I have a question for you. Have you ever played with MBL when he was scum?

I have. He's damned dangerous scum, because he's a very skilled player who always looks vaguely pro-town, so you have to carefully go back and look at his play and what he's doing instead of just trying to read his posts and seeing if he feels helpful, because he always feels vaguely pro-town and helpful, even when he's scum who's not doing a damned thing to help the town. In this game, if you actually look at him and analyze what he's done, it becomes clear that he really hasn't done any solid, concrete actions that have a pro-town effect all game. This is very unlikely to be coincidence.

[chamber]

He's refusing to claim, lets finish him off.

[Ythill]

FTR, that's Yos' way of claiming VT.

Ythill, I have a question for you. Have you ever played with MBL when he was scum?

I don't believe I've ever played with MBL before. If what you say is true, then time and cardflips will be his doom. For now, I'm sticking by my town read.

[Yosarian2]

Let me summarize, briefly, how utterly idiotic this wagon on me is.

-Glork is voting me because he thinks he found a link between me, shanba, and inhim, despite the fact that looking for links like that before you know who the scum are is an incredibly foolish thing to do, and despite the fact that his theory dosn't make any damn sense anyway. He also seems to dislike my MBL vote, even though Glork was leading the MBL wagon yesterday.

-CTD is voting me because he thinks I'm scum with CDB, just because I didn't lurker hunt him. He claims this is inconsistant with my other play, which dosn't make sense because I haven't lurker hunted anyone this game. Again, this is just a horriblebad reason to vote someone. And now, he dosn't even seem to think CDB is scum anymore, but still suspect me, for no good reason.

-Ythill is voting for me because of a series of fairly improbably motives he's given to actions of mine, even though he can't critize any of the actions he's attacking.

-Chamber is voting for me because he's scum. He spent all day talking about how he suspected me for various bad reasons, in order to actaully commit himself to a vote until it looked like I was likely to get lynched, and when he did, it was with what looked like fake reluctance to vote me.

-Shanba supposedly started suspecting me during the ecto wagon yesterady, for a series of reasons that looks pretty scummy, even though shanba apparently agreed with my inital attack on ecto (and, in fact, accused me of "echoing him"). Despite not bothering to really defend Ecto at any point, or attack anyone else on the wagon; Shanba looks like scum who already knew Ecto was town, and was hoping to use that to go after me. Since then, he's pretty much just kept calling me scum without giving any real reasons for it.

-I don't know why CES is voting me at all

[Yosarian2]

He's refusing to claim, lets finish him off.

And, yup, chamber is still obvscum.

DGB: IF I GET LYNCHED TODAY, WHEN I FLIP TOWN, PROMISE ME THAT EITHER CHAMBER OR MBL DIES TONIGHT, NO MATTER WHAT.

[chamber]

I'm not voting you reluctantly. I unvoted CDB reluctantly.

[Yosarian2]

I'm not voting you reluctantly. I unvoted CDB reluctantly.

Yeah, yeah. You spent most of the day talking about how you suspected me whenever you could but not actually voting me, and then finally voted me only when it looked like you could get a mislynch on me without taking much responsibility for it yourself.

[chamber]

Why would the way I've played it decrease the responsibility I take for your lynch? I'm calling for your l-1 and hammer, I've suspected you since yesterday, Im voting you right now. I would rather we hang InHim or CDB right now, but compromise is needed and you are a compromise I'm more than happy to take my share of responsibility for.

[Yosarian2]

Why would the way I've played it decrease the responsibility I take for your lynch? I'm calling for your l-1 and hammer

You're doing it in such a way that you can pass it off as a lame policy vote for "not claiming" when the wagon goes bad, and you're trying to manipulate the obv-town DGB by doing it that way. Of course, refusing to claim is not anti-town, not in the slightest, but that doesn't matter to you, because you're scum.

[Ythill]

That's the stance any town should have...

EVERY TOWN PERSON SHOULD HAVE BEEN VOTING SOMEONE THERE...

That's the pro-town move to do in that situation, and I think fairly obviously so.

Heh.

[chamber]

Huh? I'm not calling you more scummy for refusing to claim, I now just know I wont be getting one that will change my mind.

[Yosarian2]

That's the stance any town should have...

EVERY TOWN PERSON SHOULD HAVE BEEN VOTING SOMEONE THERE...

That's the pro-town move to do in that situation, and I think fairly obviously so.

Heh.

...huh? You don't agree that it's really anti-town to not be voting for anyone with deadline coming up and a no-lynch possible? That seems like a horrible idea.

And as I mentioned before, that's part of the reason I suspect MBL; I can't imagine why he'd do that as town at the end of day 1, he's to high-caliber a player to do that as town.

[DrippingGoofball]

Yosarian is town.

[CrashTextDummie]

In light of new developments, I don't think a CDB lynch is paramount anymore.

unvote, vote: Yos

PS: I don't condone the vigging of Shanba under any circumstances.

And that's all you have to say?


What recent developments? What in your worldview has changed?

I had this to say. Also a bunch of stuff that immediately preceeded your expressed willingness to lynch Yos. You

are

reading along, right?

Crash. I know you were in both i10 and that /invitational. No chance you've got a meta on Huck?

I am notoriously bad at reading him and don't have a working meta.

-CTD is voting me because he thinks I'm scum with CDB, just because I didn't lurker hunt him. He claims this is inconsistant with my other play, which dosn't make sense because I haven't lurker hunted anyone this game. Again, this is just a horriblebad reason to vote someone. And now, he dosn't even seem to think CDB is scum anymore, but still suspect me, for no good reason.

This is a complete distortion of my case against you.

1. My case against you has nothing to do with a lack of lurker hunting. It has a lot to do with applying scum tells selectively (in this case: lack of scumhunting,

not

lurking) and an internally inconsistent reaction when questioned about it. UT/CDB has been one of the main focal points during various stages of the game, which magnifies your ignorance of him (and lends weight to Ythill's argument that you've been ignoring wagons).
2. My suspicion of you has never been dependent of CDB's alignement. It still isn't.

[DrippingGoofball]

Which is precisely why you'd be bold enough to try it as scum. And it also explains the lack of CC if you're not the vig.

No one counterclaims a vig, especially in this OLDY version. Real vig shoots fake vig.

How long do you think a gambit like this could last, after we lynched our doctor on Day 1, and the vig isn't expected to be protected anyhow, and without a single other outed PR?

Basically, the scum is killing me tonight, I can only hope to take a scum out with me.

I won't be there tomorrow.

Why on Earth are you worried about my alignment??? It'll be a done deal tomorrow.

Also, in case there is a quicklynch, CES is scum. Please remember that and kill him good and dead.

[DrippingGoofball]

Does anyone have any idea with Ythill might be fretting about my alignment when my obituary is ready for print?

[CrashTextDummie]

Picking up on something MBL brought up:

Glork, why weren't you active around deadline on D1, when you were evidently present?

[CrashTextDummie]

Also, in case there is a quicklynch, CES is scum. Please remember that and kill him good and dead.

Says the claimed vig.

[CrashTextDummie]

Yos, why is DGB obvtown?