Mini 1088: Cookie Thief Mafia (Game Over)

[RobCapone]

unvote, vote shotty

his claim is less believable than elleran and he was quick to not believe it, why are we giving him the benefit of doubt

[Llamarble]

First off, claiming an important PR immediately makes someone more likely scum as scum claim PRs at L-1
since claiming VT will just get them lynched and claiming a PR will at least cause chaos.

Checking Elleran ISO for actions which TownExtroardinaryElleran does not take.
FOUND SEVERAL EXAMPLES.

"I am for role outing. We have about 4 days before the deadline. We need to do something and come to a conclusion."

Why on earth would you say this if you are actually a powerful town role,
whose presence makes it even more unlikely that there is a doctor?
That statement makes no sense unless you are lying.

Why would a 1shot cop exist in a land with so many abilities modifying cop results (3 GCs and possibly Olivia)?
A regular cop makes more sense to me.
So from a setup perspective I don't believe the role you have claimed exists.

"
'And Hungry Herold... Perhaps it means he can one-shot vig by eating someone's cookie? He doesn't NEED to be a scum. He could be a Townie.'

I hid this message there in case I was NK'ed and I didn't have a chance to reveal my findings."

Why is "Townie" bolded in that quote??
"He" refers to Shotty, not Darox in that statement.
I suppose when you were going back looking for statements to call breadcrumbs you picked this one without realizing it doesn't actually breadcrumb a "Darox is town" result?
(it says you think Darox is less scummy than Shotty, but the bolded "townie" refers to Shotty.)
Calling that quote a breadcrumb of a town Darox looks like a scumslip to me.

The "I'll eat my computer" quote is more of a breadcrumb, but is also very recent.
Neither of your breadcrumbs are from D1.
The reason players breadcrumb is to show that their claim isn't something they came up with recently for convenience. But your breadcrumbs are recent enough to eliminate that defense.


Oh wow.
don_johnson wrote:
"one of these three is scum:
shotty
darox
andrew.
simple wagon analysis tells us that. what is "girl's club"?"
Elleran responds:
"What is your reason for each person?

I personally disagree with andrew for sure. Like I said, I believe his claim."

IF YOU JUST COPPED DAROX AND GOT AN INNOCENT THEN WHY IS ANDREW THE ONE WHO IS TOWN FOR SURE?
DIE SCUM.


Without the roleclaim, Elleran is incredibly scummy (see my case before).
With it several of his statements simply don't make sense if he's town.
Perhaps E is for Evil or Envious.

[Llamarble]

Also about Darox:
"However, I would like to say that I am indeed very dissatisfied about his recent actions. His fake-daykill has put me in a meh mood."
WHY WOULD YOU UNDERMINE YOUR DEFENSE OF HIM IF YOU WERE CERTAIN HE IS INNOCENT?

[Darox]

Oh Llamarble, you're so adorable with your mining gear. Pity your tunnel hit bedrock.

Read his post again, the point was the last word of each sentence spelt out "Darox is Townie"

[Llamarble]

Okay, I misunderstood his intended meaning in the particular example Darox just mentioned.
But that in NO WAY clears Elleran.
I found two statements that are CLEARLY at odds with a Daroxtown investigation result.
Elleran says "Andrew is town for sure,"
After being presented with the scumlist "Andrew, Darox, Shotty."
There is no reason for Ellerantown to express certainty of Andrewtown instead of Daroxtown.
He also says Darox's daykill fake put him into a "meh-mood"
There is no reason for Ellerantown to undermine his expressed certainty of Daroxtown. At all.

I hid this message there in case I was NK'ed and I didn't have a chance to reveal my findings.

And now that I understand what he meant here, this is RIDICULOUS.
Ellerantown would NOT expect us to clear Darox because of
last words of 3 sentences of a specific post after he died.
Especially not compared to a statement like "Andrew is town for sure."
So this is clearly false as well.

And the fact that Darox picked out one misinterpretation,
in the midst of a sea of conclusive evidence of Elleranscum,
makes me completely certain that he is an Elleranbuddy.

I think the third is Furcolow, but that's not as clear.

[Darox]

And the fact that Darox picked out one misinterpretation,
in the midst of a sea of conclusive evidence of Elleranscum,
makes me completely certain that he is an Elleranbuddy.

You are so cute Llamarble.

Where do you even get good quality pickaxes like that anymore.

[Llamarble]

Darox, do you believe Elleran or not and why?
Did you (or anybody else) expect Elleranscum to say something significantly different from what he said?
If not, then why jump off the wagon (addressed to Rob and Shotty and DJ)?

[andrew94]

what other joat abilities?

at airport (free internet) (only things thats free) (hope my luggage doesnt get stolen)

more when my plane actually arrives and lands (stupid delay)

[RobCapone]

Darox, do you believe Elleran or not and why?
Did you (or anybody else) expect Elleranscum to say something significantly different from what he said?
If not, then why jump off the wagon (addressed to Rob and Shotty and DJ)?

I am not going to lie, no I didn't expect elleran to claim JOAT, if it was a fake claim I was expecting cop or doctor, JOAT seems such an odd role that is hardly used in my limited games. Also the breadcrumbs he left were convincing for me.

I unvoted because I am not likely to vote a claimed power role when we have others like shotty - suicidal townie, andrew - multi live girl scount, and furclow - potential voteless townie

none of these make any damn sense and I never heard of 2 of them ever being used. Yes furc will argue that I am coming after the VIs, but their claims are horrendus and they aren't helping the town because they are not scum hunting.

I have been told many times, scum can't scum hunt and these 3 aren't scum hunting. Furc is atleast attempting but he is accusing everyone, so it devalues his efforts.

[FakeGod]

Vote Count 2.14

"New Year very very soon." -mod

drmyshottyizsik (3): Darox, don_johnson, RobCapone
Darox (1): andrew94,
Elleran (2): lewarcher82, Llamarble
RobCapone (2): Elleran, Furcolow
Furcolow (1): drmyshottyizsik

Not Voting: Zed,

With 10 players, it takes 6 votes to lynch someone.

The new deadline is Jan. 7th, 2011!

[lewarcher82]

Back from V/LA.

Happy Birthday Darox.

A lot of shit has happened; I skimmed through the thread and I will now read with more attention, but in order to better understand the events, I need to ask one question to Elleran.
@Elleran: I assume that you, like the majority of JOATs, have 1 shot at several different powers. Since you joined the wagon on Ivy, one would assume you would realise that using your investigative power on either Rob or Furco would have been EXTREMELY productive for town. If we knew that either Rob or furc are town, we could use a ML on the other one, and - if protecting is one of your skills - you could protect the GC still alive in order to guarantee us one or two CONFIRMED name-investigations. Why did you pick Darox instead?

for now, even if DJ is right that the claim of Elleran must be discussed in detail before we call it genuine, I prefere to

Unvote

.

[Elleran]

Happy Birthday, Darox!

How are lewarcher, Andrew, and zed clear?

Most of my list has mixed reasons, including what I think of their style, attitude, and evidence.

I believe Lewarcher to be town. One of the reason is that he admitted that he took the lead in mislynching Poison. Although this could have been a scum covering his tracks with bold statements, I believe his to be genuine. Also, during the times he makes cases, he uses evidences, asks questions to clarify the evidences, then knows when to leave the case when the clarified evidences point otherwise. He also likes to go for who he believes to be scum rather than going for 'quick lynches'.

I believe Andrew to be town. Like Llamarble has pointed out, I believe his claim. Although I agree that it is an imbalanced role in this setup, the situation in which he claimed makes the claim to be more credible. I believe Shotty's claim more than Andrew's though because of balance issues and Shotty's consistency.

I believe Zed to be town (believe it or not). I find his lack of postings unsatisfactory. His "I'll post later" have not always been followed up with breathtaking analysis. However, in his posts that he makes, he does make a statement and takes a stance. Although my belief in his towniness is just as strong as the number of posts he makes, I am leaning town for his alignment.

PREVIEW EDIT: @Lewarcher: I had a one-shot investigation ability for alignment. I didn't want to use it on a GC because they said that if investigated, they would come up as 'Girls Club' alignment. I didn't want to risk wasting my one-shot ability, so I did not investigate any of the GC. I realize that if I HAD investigated and it DID work, then it would be very helpful for town right now.

I investigated Darox at the time because he was being so chaotic. Because of his wild playing style, I could not tell whether he was a town playing badly or a scum intentionally being crazy. Also at the time, there were lots of interaction taking place with Darox being involved. Players like you and Llamarble were more focused on other business, so I didn't feel the need to investigate one of you at the time. Right now, I would really like to know the alignment of you and Llamarble very much (if that means anything to you two).

[Elleran]

Elleran responds:
"What is your reason for each person?

I personally disagree with andrew for sure. Like I said, I believe his claim."

IF YOU JUST COPPED DAROX AND GOT AN INNOCENT THEN WHY IS ANDREW THE ONE WHO IS TOWN FOR SURE?
DIE SCUM.

@Llamarble: I intentionally said nothing about Darox. I responded to the point about Andrew because that was something I believed.

[drmyshottyizsik]

Here's the thing guys if we get to dead line and I'm L-1 I will suicide, and then the day will still be at dead line!

[RobCapone]

So you say

[drmyshottyizsik]

Yes, do you really want to run that risk? I suicide on dead line, and then you guys are SOL

[RobCapone]

if you suicide at deadline and we hit deadline without a lynch, than it is a NL so if you are telling the truth our lynch of you happens one way or another so yeah I am fine with it actually.

[RobCapone]

I think you knew you were SOL if your name came out and you made up the whole suicidal townie thing, mafia could be Hungry Harold, Starving Steven, Famished Fred

who knows until we lynch mafia, right now your name is damning

[drmyshottyizsik]

Mafia are not hungry, they are the ones getting all the cookies dumb ass.

[RobCapone]

and what are they doing with them? probably eating them

[drmyshottyizsik]

Exactly, if they are eating the cookies why would they be hungry, I have to eat my own cookie because the mafia are stealing the rest, anyway lynch furc

[lewarcher82]

PREVIEW EDIT: @Lewarcher: I had a one-shot investigation ability for alignment. I didn't want to use it on a GC because they said that if investigated, they would come up as 'Girls Club' alignment. I didn't want to risk wasting my one-shot ability, so I did not investigate any of the GC. I realize that if I HAD investigated and it DID work, then it would be very helpful for town right now.

Yes, convincing answer. I wanted to see if your answer made any sense, and it does. The GCs were not clear about their investigation-immunity, and it was natural for you to assume you would have wasted your shot. You would have probably gotten a "GC" report.

@DJ: why is a town JOAT hard to believe? Please, explain and be detailed. Also: Since Elleran already claimed town-pr, it would be interesting to find a way to confirm his claim. Can you think of any way we can do it? I ask you because you are particular fond of this kind of strategies, so you may come up with something.

@DJ(2): you say that andrew may be scum. Do you mean that you believe his claim and he is a multi-lives scum or do you think he simply lied about his role?

@Rob: something is starting to strike me funny, in your posts. You say that I was scummy. But you are in favour of a mass nameclaim? What makes me scummy then? You say that scum can't scumhunt. Am I not scumhunting. Once and forever: Do you or do you not believe that there is scum in the GC?

@shotty: I see no advantage in having you sui at deadline. It is exactly as though you were lynched.

@Llamarble: do you know elleran? You already played with him?

@Llamarble(2): you think Elleran is scum. Do you think Darox is scum as well? Is there a claim you believe?

@Llamarble(3): a JOAT claim can normally be verified (if he is a 1 shot vig, we can ask him to vig someone, and so on). Why wouldn't Elleran just fake-claim alignment-cop, instead? Why JOAT?

[drmyshottyizsik]

no lew it's not, because when I suicide day doesn't end

[lewarcher82]

It is if you do it at deadline. So what is the advantage?

And change avatar, please. A white "fuck off" on black background is not nice, not brilliant, not sarcastic. Nothing but stupid and rude.

[drmyshottyizsik]

I love this picture