Newbie 1080 -- Game over

[[Moonstruck]]

Also, how do you know that it's a newbie scum? martini is the prime suspect right now, and he's an SE.

This was really just me assuming it was a newbie scum, like Moon said, without thinking about the suspects.

According to that logic, Hiraki has to be scum because Martini would have killed Hiraki during the night if he's scum. I personally don't think Martini is scum, as his interaction with Jack doesn't seem entirely scummy to me.

Note to self: Never give scum something they can use to defend themselves.
For the record, I didn't say that was exactly the case, I said that could be a possibility. Now that you're using my own words as your defense I get the feeling that you couldn't think up a defense on your own.

I'm also curious as to why Shift changed his vote after a post form Martini that really seems to have no content in it...

He already answered that with:

because Martini is making decent posts. Brundi is getting worse and worse with each post.

Meaning Martini's posts are getting better and yours are getting worse. Shift changed his vote based on comparison.

Vote:Brundibar

[Does Bo Know]

If I was scum, why would I lynch the one person who could help me? Jack was defending me almost more than anyone, and me putting myself as the lone scum would have been a ridiculously bad idea, especially when I could have easily waited for somebody else to hammer.

This doesn't mean anything. Big WIFOM. I was accused of lynching my own scum partner because it was "sudden" and I wanted him to "shut up," even though I was never scum in the first place. Lynching someone without your own reasoning that

happens

to be scum doesn't put you in the clear, Brundi. Fact.

Even if the Cop didn't die last night, Hiraki shouldn't have crossed anyone's mind as a cop because of his actions D1. He totally defended you D1

after

accusing you of being scum. This means he would've never gotten the chance to investigate, whether it be the night before D1 or in the middle of D1, silly.

I'm also curious as to why Shift changed his vote after a post form Martini that really seems to have no content in it...

You still have to make those statements that sound like a mind should be changed but it wouldn't be directly your fault. Moonstruck restated why Shift changed the vote, and that would've been my first argument, but the fact you think that Martini's posts don't have content and you

still

aren't voting for this "suspicion" leads me to believe that you aren't really looking for anything scummy in Martini/Shift; you're just throwing trash around that another person hopes to find as treasure.

I'm sure on this vote now.

[Does Bo Know]

EBWOP:

If brundi's next post isn't any good, I'll put him at L-1. I specifically want to know who his top suspect is and why, as well as explain the hammer.

Too bad he never answered your question on who was the scummiest to him. See, it's sad that Brundi can't read something 2 posts above him and answer its questions accordingly.

So, Brundi, I'll ask along with Plague, who is your top suspect?

Sorry I didn't include that in the last post. I just found it after my previous post.

[theplague42]

I still really don't understand Hiraki's constant defense of me though.

It would perhaps make a bit more sense if there was a chance he was cop

, but since that's not possible it doesn't make much sense to me, and I don't think it's making either of us look good.

I'm assuming you mean that he was a cop and had investigated you. This doesn't make any sense. He defended you D1,

before

he would have been able to make an investigation. Doesn't make much sense, does it?

Moonstruck stole my vote

Hiraki, has your view of brundi changed in light of these last few posts? Or is martini still your top suspect?

Unvote

if I haven't already. I'm also expressing intent to hammer eventually.

[theplague42]

EBWOP: Just saw that DBK already answered the first part. I missed it cause he hadn't quoted the actual statement by brundi.

[Does Bo Know]

EBWOP: Just saw that DBK already answered the first part. I missed it cause he hadn't quoted the actual statement by brundi.

Sorry. I don't like to quote many things at once to make a post essentially long. Plus, linking posts takes time, and I didn't have time.

Though, Plague brings up a good point, except I also want to know why Hiraki thought Martini was scum in the first place, despite Jack's serious vote on Martini. Actually, no. I just read a few of Hiraki's recent posts, and I think it was because of a frame by killing Quil? Could someone elaborate on what he's talking about before I ask for other reasons he believes Martini is scum?

[theplague42]

Though, Plague brings up a good point, except I also want to know why Hiraki thought Martini was scum in the first place, despite Jack's serious vote on Martini. Actually, no. I just read a few of Hiraki's recent posts, and I think it was because of a frame by killing Quil? Could someone elaborate on what he's talking about before I ask for other reasons he believes Martini is scum?

Let's just ask Hiraki directly to clarify.

[martini]

If I was scum, why would I lynch the one person who could help me? Jack was defending me almost more than anyone, and me putting myself as the lone scum would have been a ridiculously bad idea, especially when I could have easily waited for somebody else to hammer.

This doesn't make any sense, jack was already at l-1, waiting for someone else to hammer would also have put you as the lone scum.

Most other comments I have have been mentioned already.

@DBK,theplague
Reading hiraki's iso it seems like the suspected frame clears brundi's name. (his earlier post talked about something suspicious about brundi, which he then thought is a frame)
Hmm, it seems the last thing quilford talked about was his suspicions about brundibar. maybe hiraki thought brundibar nked quilford to stop him from outing those suspicions? but then thought it maybe was a frame. hiraki?

[theplague42]

The whole problem is that it's a bucket of WIFOM. That's usually the reason someone is picked for an NK along with killing PRs and scumhunters. Often both.

[Shift]

-waits for Brundi to flip scum-

[Nobody Special]

Votecount 2.05

L-1 brundibar - 3 - Does Bo Know, Shift, [Moonstruck]
martini - 1 - Hiraki

Not Voting: brundibar, martini, theplague42

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.

Deadline: April 17.

V/LA: ...

[theplague42]

-waits for Brundi to flip scum-

Ummm nobody's hammered yet and there's still 15 days until deadline.......

[Shift]

-waits for Brundi to flip scum-

Ummm nobody's hammered yet and there's still 15 days until deadline.......

-waits for Brundi to flip scum-

[theplague42]

Lol you may be waiting awhile.

[theplague42]

Bump.

[[Moonstruck]]

-waits for Brundi to flip scum-

Ummm nobody's hammered yet and there's still 15 days until deadline.......

I've got an idea! If plague hammers then we can get this over with. I'm not as convinced as Shift that it's Brundi, but I'm convinced that it's either Brundi or Martini. And if we lynch Brundi now we will either win on day two or lynch Martini and win on day three. It's a win win situation

[Does Bo Know]

-waits for Brundi to flip scum-

Ummm nobody's hammered yet and there's still 15 days until deadline.......

I've got an idea! If plague hammers then we can get this over with. I'm not as convinced as Shift that it's Brundi, but I'm convinced that it's either Brundi or Martini. And if we lynch Brundi now we will either win on day two or lynch Martini and win on day three. It's a win win situation

I've got a better idea. Let's wait for Hiraki to respond to questions before doing anything else.

[Hiraki]

Sorry about that. Something don gone wrong.

I feel bad as an IC for being inactive, but there was nothing I could do. I'll catch up with this now.

[martini]

I've got an idea! If plague hammers then we can get this over with. I'm not as convinced as Shift that it's Brundi, but I'm convinced that it's either Brundi or Martini. And if we lynch Brundi now we will either win on day two or lynch Martini and win on day three. It's a win win situation

We shouldn't lynch brundi this quick, especially with this kind of relevant discussion still going on, as we keep getting more and more information. You seem to want to quicklynch brundi and then chainlynch me, which would be cool if it turns out brundi is scum, or even if I was scum, but maybe we both aren't scum, then what? Then it would be best for day three to have as much information as possible. To me, it seems the only people who would want to lynch quickly and therefore get less information would be the scum.
This is the reason why I dislike this post (and the whole quicklynching/chainlynching idea)

and cheers for hiraki coming back to the game

[[Moonstruck]]

@Martini, the chainlynch idea has been out there for a while now, all that we've been doing is figuring out whether it's you or Brundi first. And I wasn't really going for a quick lynch with no evidence, I was going against sitting around doing absolutely nothing, when Plague has made it clear he was going to vote Brundi, but is waiting for more explanations from Hiraki.

[martini]

@moonstruck
the way I read plague's posts was is that he is willing to hammer eventually, but not yet (seeing as there is still quite some discussion, and we are not ''sitting around doing absolutely nothing'' at all)

about the chainlynch idea, I think you're making it sound more established than it actually is, as I think:
-shift is pro-chainlynching (came with the idea)
-you seem to be pro-chainlynching
-hiraki didn't want to lynch brundi and wanted to lynch me instead (reasoning still being discussed)
-DBK hasn't said anything about chainlynching
-theplague was "pulling off of the chainlynch idea"
-not sure about brundibar

you make it sound like it's already established that brundibar and me are getting chainlynched today and tomorrow, and we're just figuring out who is to go first. This doesn't seem to be the case.

[Does Bo Know]

^^^^I like this post. I don't see it as an excuse not to be chainlynched tomorrow or anything, but as a valid argument toward Moonstruck's "hurrying attitude." I have more confidence that Martini is town due to Martini's D2 play and the fact Jack seriously voted Martini and it was the only vote against Martini D1.

@Moonstruck:

And I wasn't really going for a quick lynch with no evidence, I was going against sitting around doing absolutely nothing, when Plague has made it clear he was going to vote Brundi, but is waiting for more explanations from Hiraki.

This implies that you don't want Hiraki's explanations, because you discussed hammering, yet you already say that Plague was going to hammer

anyway.

The difference in hammers is that yours is to get the game moving, while Plague's possible hammer (I don't think he confirmed it yet) is actually based on the content of the game. This makes me crave Hiraki's next post even more, since it's at request and you'd rather get the game moving.

To respond to my silence on chianlynching, I'm against it primarily because I don't see Martini as the second possible scum, or even scummy, for that matter. However, if we had as much or almost as much valid evidence against Martini (or any other player for that matter) as we do Brundi, then I wouldn't object to chainlynching. Just don't see a clear second candidate right now.

[theplague42]

Ok posting this on mobile, more later this week.

Moonstruck's last few posts are a little too eager for me. martini made a good argument above, and I think he's down to #3 suspect for me. Moon is now #2. I'm not sure if scum would dare to be so eager for a lynch, but I still dont like it. I'll try to do brundi, Moon, and martini ISOs this week if I remember. I've either been forgetting or busy this week.

[Hiraki]

I actually hate the Moonstruck post. Again, I don't care which dies, I'm convinced that it's Moonstruck/Martini at this point. Brundi is newbie town. If he flips scum, I will cry myself to sleep some day.

Hmm, it seems the last thing quilford talked about was his suspicions about brundibar. maybe hiraki thought brundibar nked quilford to stop him from outing those suspicions? but then thought it maybe was a frame. hiraki?

Exactly. This looks perfect for scum. I like Moonstruck-scum more than Martini-scum for right now.

Unvote, Vote: Moonstruck

Hiraki, has your view of brundi changed in light of these last few posts? Or is martini still your top suspect?

I'm waiting for the scum to BW me, which is impossible, so that I can prove Moonstruck/Martini scum. Brundi is not scum.

[theplague42]

BW?

Time for a little thinking ahead. So if we're at 6:1, then it goes 4:1 and 2:1 not counting a doc save. So we get three shots at lynching the final scum. I'm not going back to chainlynch idea, but it seems like we do have a bit of leeway. We should sit back and analyze Jack's posts on other players to death, as that seems like the best way to make progress. I'm taking a leaf from Quil's book and asking for top three suspects from everyone. A bit of switching lately, and I'd like to know where everyone stands.

1. brundibar (despite Hiraki's insistence otherwise)
2. Moonstruck (very close to #1)
3. martini (mainly for lack of a better candidate)

@Hiraki
Can I steal the crying quote for my sig once the game is over?