Neon Genesis Evangelion Mafia (Game Over)

[Nocmen]

Stevie ISO:

Bringing up cults is most definitely a scum tell, it is an attempt to derail the D1 discussion. And, even though it was "justified" as a mention of another game, that still was a (fairly successful) attempt to keep us talking about unimportant things. For that reason, I will

Vote: Amrun

. Also, pretty much all of Amrun's posts have been defending himself about this issue, besides one post where he calls the Kast wagon bad - again this is a large post count that really isn't contributing anything pro-town.

I'm not getting a really scummy read of Kast, but I don't think the wagon is completely unfounded, however I wouldn't like it to see it get out of hand.

What is a RNG? never heard that term before or maybe i am rusty.

FoS: GreyIce

for not answering legitimate questions. If you do not get on that it will turn into a vote. I have some questions for you myself:
Why did you choose to claim D1 being completely unprompted? Not that this is necessarily a scum tell I simply don't get your motivation.
Why did you claim your role power without claiming what character you were?


On a completely unrelated note, I will be going to the beach this thursday and friday so I will not post on either of those days.

Steve

Why do you vote for a cult mention, when a vote would be more likely to pressure Grey to answer the questions you so badly want a reply for?

Come on, wagon scum to lynch by page 4.

Do it. DO IT

Town gains nothing by rushing for a quick lynch. Also you really haven't offered any significant criticisms of Kast, besides your sarcastic responses and posting about how much you want him lynched.

More issues you have with Grey, yet you keep your vote on him.

Clarification on the point on Kast: I have no problem with the people wagonning him as I think he is mildly scummy - I am not however going to vote for him.

What do you think is scummy about Kast? This just seems like a way to build up on a potential sheeping vote.

unvote, vote: GreyIce

Multiple posts, still hasn't answered the many legitimate and direct questions. Instead he did a pointless fake sarcastic claim which serves no purpose. Answer the questions, defend yourself against the points against you. Ignoring them is a sure route to getting lynched. You are doing a good job of scumhunting, and made a good point about Pomegrant's fos and vote. However, ignoring everyone who is criticizing you is very scummy.

As for Amrun, what he did is a scumtell. I'm quite sick of this debate but I believe its a scum tell, and worth a vote at that stage of the game. Not everyone in this game agrees with this, and frankly its been debated to death so I'm going to try and move past it. His recent posts have been good.

Finally do you move your vote here. Keep in mind this is immediately after GhostWriter calls him out for a bad vote.

As for Amrun, what he did is a scumtell. I'm quite sick of this debate but I believe its a scum tell, and worth a vote at that stage of the game. Not everyone in this game agrees with this, and frankly its been debated to death so I'm going to try and move past it. His recent posts have been good.

Why is it a scumtell? Because of an offhand cult mention, that may or may not refer to a previous game? At the same time, you've switch to grey for his mention of masons, which is attributable to almost the same thing Amrun did?

Doesn't help that you vote right after you get criticized for it too.

No I voted GreyIce because yesterday I posted that if he did not answer my questions I would vote for him. He did not answer my questions. I am voting for him.

If you want to see why I think the cult mention is a scum tell, then read my posts. That cult post has derailed a lot of our day one discussion. Its a scumtell and I'm not the only one who thinks that. If you disagree with that it's fine but to attack me over that is ridiculous.

While this is the post from him I agree most with, Grey has a few questions to Stevie that were unanswered at this point.

Actually, VOTE: Stevie. I hate the way he came in to make another short, meaningless post, gets criticized by GW for not having reads, and then right away comes in with a post voting GI (as well as the rest of his previously mentioned scummy behavior, of course). Additionally, although I don't like GI's play right now or anything, I can say that I don't want to be on a wagon with Stevie.

I think you guys see me being scummy about a playstyle thing I do. When I write posts I like to keep different topics separate and try to post multiple posts in a flurry. After I finished reading the thread and before GW posted I had already planned to vote for GreyIce. When I posted that first one sentence post I immediately started typing my post voting for GreyIce, the fact that GW posted a criticism of my voting at the same time was purely coincidental. You will see plenty of times in this game (assuming you dont all lynch me :p) that i post two or more times in a row. And of course I had never planned on posting one sentence and then leaving.

Look at what happens when I try and cram multiple thoughts into one post: I frankly admit that the sentence I wrote about Kast sucks ass and isn't vaguely good town behavior. That is why I tried to clarify what I meant.

Steve

Flailing under wagon pressure. While I don't agree with Pom's that multiple short posts are scummy, this seems like a bit too much of a defense on yourself. Talking about posting style instead of actually defending yourself using game actions.

@GhostWriter I didn't like his response, here it was:

Also, how many games have you played before Stevie? Legit question, because I'm curious as to you knowing what you do to people who are tracked or watched targeting a night kill. Watched really makes it a 'throw in the towel' on me trying to just play super town and get night killed fast as I can be town enough not to get copped/tracked but I can't dodge a watcher.

Firstly, the entire post is trying to answer a question with a question. That is scummy behavior, I'm not going to answer the question for you.

Secondly, he again ignores my second question asking why he didn't reveal his flavor name. This is a legitimate question, and if more people jump on the wagon then we should force him to reveal this - that's really up to you guys though. This is also scummy - even if he doesn't want to reveal his flavor name (there are valid reasons for feeling this way, i just wanted to hear what he had to say) there is no reason he should be ducking the question.

I also think that if this wagon for GreyIce grows we should eventually demand to hear this flavor name.

.

Lastly, the noob comments are cracking me up. It's not my fault all my games on this website were lost in the abyss that is the internet - and considering I was playing mafia on the internet for year or so before I even came to this website I have plenty of experience. I also was a regular on ScumChat back in the good old days.
Steve

What makes no sense is that how much you post against Grey, you are doing the same actions he are, and could easily be voted for the same things alone. And going back to your post before this, you're now derailing discussion with your history on this site - I find this as much less relevant than the cult activity you went after Amrun for. I don't understand you pushing so hard for a flavor name.

Unvote, Vote: Stevie

[ace5993]

I agree with this, and the quote you reply to. Kast has handled the pressure very well so far with the votes. Then again, 4-5 votes isn't much in a large game. I am slightly curious as to how that changes if he gets a larger wagon on him.

Definitely starting to be more curious about Stevie. Not for the disagreement with the Kast wagon, but for hte vote on Amrun, as well as pressuring things that really don't need to be pressured right now.

This is wishy-washy nothingness. Curious is a scummy word. Also agreeing with both me AND drew is scummy. Drew is essentially saying we should wagon the scummiest to find reactions, I'm saying we should make the wagon that will prove most beneficial to town via reactions so we can more accurately figure out the scummiest. You can't really agree with both, even though it may appear like you can on the surface.

Nocmen's case on Stevie

And then you switch your vote. Essentially meaning you didn't agree with me at all, and were just trying to make friends. Nice try.

^Very weak couple of posts.

[Nocmen]

I agree with this, and the quote you reply to. Kast has handled the pressure very well so far with the votes. Then again, 4-5 votes isn't much in a large game. I am slightly curious as to how that changes if he gets a larger wagon on him.

Definitely starting to be more curious about Stevie. Not for the disagreement with the Kast wagon, but for hte vote on Amrun, as well as pressuring things that really don't need to be pressured right now.

This is wishy-washy nothingness. Curious is a scummy word. Also agreeing with both me AND drew is scummy. Drew is essentially saying we should wagon the scummiest to find reactions, I'm saying we should make the wagon that will prove most beneficial to town via reactions so we can more accurately figure out the scummiest. You can't really agree with both, even though it may appear like you can on the surface.

Nocmen's case on Stevie

And then you switch your vote. Essentially meaning you didn't agree with me at all, and were just trying to make friends. Nice try.

^Very weak couple of posts.

Drew said we get information based on their response to wagons. I was saying that I was satisfied a bit with Kast's response, and that we need to change wagons based on reactions. What exactly were you referring to by useful wagons? Defense against the wagons, or wagons as in who votes and why?

I tried looking at Stevie to see the possibility of a wagon, but once I got to the third post the hypocracy and scumtells were screaming at me.

[Kdub]

Day 1 - Vote Count #7

Amrun (1)

- animorpherv1

Kawaii (0)

-

GreyICE (2)

- malthusis, StevieT92

Antifinity (0)

-

Candle Jack (1)

- Antifinity

C-Worl (0)

-

kanyeknowsbest (0)

-

Nocmen (2)

- Amrun, LobsterCatapult

Surye (0)

-

Celebloki (0)

-

malthusis (0)

-

Starbuck (0)

-

ace5993 (0)

-

drewoftherushes (0)

-

ZeL1nK (0)

-

StevieT92 (8)

- vollkan, GhostWriter, Pomegranate, GreyICE, ZeL1nK, drewoftherushes, Candle Jack, Nocmen

GhostWriter (0)

-

SpyreX (0)

-

Kast (2)

- ace5993, Surye

vollkan (0)

-

Pomegranate (0)

-

LobsterCatapult (0)

-

animorpherv1 (2)

- Starbuck, Celebloki

No Lynch (0)

-

Not Voting (5)

- Kawaii, C-Worl, kanyeknowsbest, SpyreX, Kast

23 votes available, 12 votes needed to lynch

Deadline is July 18, ~ 10 am PDT

C-Worl is being replaced.

[ace5993]

Drew said we get information based on their response to wagons. I was saying that I was satisfied a bit with Kast's response, and that we need to change wagons based on reactions. What exactly were you referring to by useful wagons? Defense against the wagons, or wagons as in who votes and why?

Kast hasn't changed his playstyle at all, it's still anti-town as of his last post. I would hardly call not caving in to the pressure of 4-5 votes anything to make Kast look town. Useful wagons early in day 1 are wagons that maximize our chance of finding scum. Read the post that you agreed with carefully and see if it's really possible to agree with it and also favor Stevie over Kast at the present time. Stevie will become a greater priority than Kast when Kast starts playing in a way that is both harder for scum to fake, and more beneficial in helping to catch scum. Right now, as I've said before, he's sitting on his ass "VI-hunting" and posting small comments on people just to make it look like he's doing something.

I tried looking at Stevie to see the possibility of a wagon, but once I got to the third post the hypocracy and scumtells were screaming at me.

I agree with your case on Stevie, I was calling you out for buddying me/drew.

[Kast]

I'm pretty sure the vibes I'm getting are anti-town rather than scum.

This to a degree. I don't want to give GI an Anti-Town-VI get-out-of-jail-free pass, but I'm sure we'll find a good lynch candidate today (to be clear, this isn't ruling out GI if he posts something damning in future).

@Amrun-

Spoiler: Prior to post #139

Obviously because I'm incompetent scum making elementary slips to prevent easy mislynch wagons :p

You're misreading what I posted. Stevie's playstyle and the fact he is a n00b to mafia (and certainly to MS) make a town-Stevie an inherent mislynch magnet. The possibility of scum-Stevie exists (either as a genuine n00b or just playing that card), but I think his behavior so far hasn't been very helpful in discerning between the two.

Given Stevie's veteran claim, I'm slightly surprised he continues playing as he does. It does reduce the likelihood of scum-Stevie as a genuine n00b, but overall does not change my read on him.

@Ace-

firstly you asked if he was joking,

which is not contrasting anything,

just asking a question.

Italics indicate where you get lost. I'm slightly relieved that you took the "I'm oblivious" tack rather than pretending that my question does not EXPLICITLY ask a clarification between (ie. CONTRAST between) SERIOUS and NOT-SERIOUS (ie. JOKING).

You don't even appear to consider grey scummy, so why are you wasting your time with this crap about him in the first place?

Spoiler: Given that EVERY SINGLE POST I addressed to GreyIce reiterated my reasons for pursuing, I must conclude you are not paying attention or not trying very hard

@Greyice-
How about you

cut the crap and play the game?

Otherwise,

answer the questions and get back to playing the game

.

But

please answer the questions already.

@GreyIce-

Answer:

-[D]oes your power ALSO prevent a watcher from seeing the ACTUAL culprit? (This should be a no-brainer to share if you're seriously claiming)
-Would your ability false track to protected and/or kill immune targets (ie. failed kill attempts)?

If you think answering hurts town, explain.

Once he answered the questions, I EXPLICITLY NOTED that further pursuit was a waste of time, though I still hope he'll shape up and join us in finding scum (or pretending to if he is scum).

@drew-
-GI is also potentially a mislynch magnet. I said as much in my second post of the game.
-I mourn more for the death of a friendly-innocent than an intentional-jerk/ass-innocent. Games are just more fun with the former than the latter.
-I'll place a vote when I'm ready. Don't worry

@GreyIce-
-Noc immediately voting for a claimed mason was stupid.

Spoiler: Grey's explanation for how it is a scum claim is equally stupid.

The "flying autopilot" with "no town thought processes" statement isn't relevant to the explanation and is fluff.

Since others jumped aboard the

contradiction

angle, that bears more attention:
Post 100 expresses implicit doubt that a player would be both mason AND miller, then follows with an ambiguous question expressing either shock/incredulity OR disbelief. In context, it would seem to be disbelief. Taken together with post 103, in which he explicitly lists dual motives for both a mason and a non-mason GI, it should be clear post 100 wasn't expressing belief that GI was actually a mason miller. This is a misrepresentation of Noc.

-Prematurely demanding a claim != rolefishing. Agreed that Stevie shouldn't be pressing for a role name, but why misapply terms when you can simply state what actually happened? You could also make things much clearer and save everyone a lot of time by answering direct questions directly.

force him out of his comfort zone as scum.

Lulz. Cute

@Noc-
You just follow the prevailing wind at all turns...
I'm slightly dubious that my post 128 could have genuinely done anything significant in helping you reach your conclusion in 173. It certainly wasn't much different from before you placed your vote.

@Stevie Wagon-
This is interesting; wagon analysis of this should be fruitful if it goes all the way (regardless of flip).

@Ace-

Kast hasn't changed his playstyle at all...I would hardly call not caving in to the pressure of 4-5 votes anything to make Kast look town.

Strongly agree with this. Noc running away to a "safe" lynch doesn't reflect well on him.

At the same time, Ace looks like he's happy to park his vote where a lynch is unlikely and he can continue the day tunneled and avoiding participation in anything else. If Stevie is town, I'm sure Ace is looking forward to boasting that he wasn't on the Stevie wagon. The Ace/Noc interaction reads as potential distancing/chiding.

Hmm, tomorrow I'll prolly iso-re-read everyone and summarize my thoughts thus far.

[SpyreX]

I'm preemptively claiming this hammer. Know it will be struck with extreme prejudice.

When you vote you have to think about what purpose the wagon will serve. Will a wagon on Kast, or a wagon on Stevie serve more purpose? In this case, a wagon on Stevie will accomplish very little; he's not going to significantly change his posting style because he's already trying to defend himself. A wagon on Kast will either force Kast to contribute to scumhunting as town or force him out of his comfort zone as scum.

That's exactly what we should be doing this early in the game, trying to find which wagon will be most useful. For me, if I find two people scummy, if one person is already defending themselves and trying to appear like they are scumhunting while the other is doing absolutely nothing, I'm going to suggest we wagon the one doing absolutely nothing. We can come back to Stevie later.

If stewie flips scum go ahead and put a bullet here tonight so tomorrow can be fun and not the power wagon its going to be otherwise.

[StevieT92]

I want to hear what GreyIce's flavor name because as a fan of the series I want to see if the flavor makes sense with the role he is claiming. Also, if he survives a couple days we can actually confirm him as town if a watcher comes forward with results. I want to get him started on that road to being confirmed I also want to put more pressure on him because he's acting suspiciously.

@Ghostwriter

Liike I said - he did not answer my question. He asked me a question back. As for the second point about someone else answering the question - i don't want his scum buddy or anyone else answering questions for him, I want to hear it from his lips, which he has still ignored. When hunting scum, the best kind of questions to ask are the ones you already know the answer to - of course I know why he wouldn't reveal his role name right off the bat. The fact that he STILL has dodged the question is what I find scummy.

I'm also not voting GreyIce really because of his claim - he would indeed have to be an incredibly ballsy scum to come out with that day one. I'm voting him because his behavior since that claim has been extremely suspect.

[LobsterCatapult]

Oh, "the fact" thing is weak, but I still find Nocmen scummy otherwise.

Lobstersheep is very bad - torn between the two.

uh huh.

you think that nocmen is scum for reacting so strongly against the mason claim, but you dont think its scummy for what he actually said when he reacted?

there are other reasons why i think nocmen is scummy, the post that GreyIce pointed out convinced me to move my vote. i had already stated suspicion on nocmen before this.

1) i also dont like how strongly he reacted, especially in contrast with how he had worded his previous posts
2) him hopping back onto the kast wagon seems scummy, his vote doesn't show much fervor in fact i dont entirely understand it. he is attacking kast for not giving good reads, but this early d1, we are still forming reads, and in fact nocmen himself has not given really any reads except on Grey, Kast and stevie respectively, which i find hypocritical since kast has basically the same amount of reads accomplished.
3) what greyice pointed out
newly:
4) i find his case on Stevie mostly what other people have stated, but he seems to misrep Stevie by faulting stevie for bringing up his history, when he was asked explicitly (from greyice?) what his history was. i feel like, again, this is another reason to get on a wagon and get heat off himself.

[LobsterCatapult]

I want to hear what GreyIce's flavor name because as a fan of the series I want to see if the flavor makes sense with the role he is claiming.

i believe this like i believe the moon is made out of cheese.

[ZeL1nK]

Masons now too? Why the hell would you out

that fact

for no good reason?

Unvote, Vote: GreyICE

So that implies that I know exactly if the claim was true or not. Please, if I was scum, how would I know about masons?

No, the issue has nothing to do with 'knowing' about masons, it's about your reaction to GI's mason 'claim'.

As 'anti-town' as it may have been, do you really think it was scummy? And why are you giving GI 'the benefit of the doubt' if you still think it is anti-town/scummy behaviour?

More specifically, what about GI's joke stood out to you and made you think, "he is scum, and this is a plan of his"?

--

When you vote you have to think about what purpose the wagon will serve. Will a wagon on Kast, or a wagon on Stevie serve more purpose? In this case, a wagon on Stevie will accomplish very little; he's not going to significantly change his posting style because he's already trying to defend himself. A wagon on Kast will either force Kast to contribute to scumhunting as town or force him out of his comfort zone as scum.

I vote for someone if I think he's scum. Any wagon I join is for the purpose of lynching scum.

Kast seems to be scum hunting, regardless of the wagon on him. Amazing, isn't it? Your vote doesn't even need to be on him for him to do this.

[StevieT92]

@ Nocmen - responses to your questions

"Why do you vote for a cult mention, when a vote would be more likely to pressure Grey to answer the questions you so badly want a reply for"

I voted for a cult mention because a cult mention is worth voting for. When I asked those questions I was anticipating that he would take me seriously and answer them. Instead he did not.

"More issues you have with Grey, yet you keep your vote on him."

Wasn't really an issue - more of a playstyle discussion.

"What do you think is scummy about Kast? This just seems like a way to build up on a potential sheeping vote."

I thought he was going after players rather aggressively in the early stages of the game. At the point I made that post there were two camps - those attacking people on the Kast wagon and those attacking Kast. I was attempting to say that while I did not find anything worth voting for, there was no reason to attack those who were attacking Kast. Like I said before, it was a shitty sentence that did not convey my meaning in the least. I acknowledge this.

"Finally do you move your vote here. Keep in mind this is immediately after GhostWriter calls him out for a bad vote."

Like I said before, my post was NOT in response to ghostwriter in the least. usually when i respond to people I address them. It's a playstyle thing where I was planning on posting twice in a row.

"While this is the post from him I agree most with, Grey has a few questions to Stevie that were unanswered at this point. " I will respond to him in a seperate post.

"Flailing under wagon pressure. While I don't agree with Pom's that multiple short posts are scummy, this seems like a bit too much of a defense on yourself. Talking about posting style instead of actually defending yourself using game actions."

That is my posting style. I just felt that I should explain it.

"What makes no sense is that how much you post against Grey, you are doing the same actions he are, and could easily be voted for the same things alone. And going back to your post before this, you're now derailing discussion with your history on this site - I find this as much less relevant than the cult activity you went after Amrun for. I don't understand you pushing so hard for a flavor name.

Unvote, Vote: Stevie

When someone goes, stevie answer my questions or i will vote you, i will answer their questions. As for the experience question, someone asked me how experienced i was, so i answered them.

Quote tags fixed

[StevieT92]

FoS: Candlejack

for jumping onto LobsterCatapult and then jumping onto me. Not an OMGUS: i hadn't posted in between your voting, so if you had intended to vote me then why didn't you just do that?

[LobsterCatapult]

When you vote you have to think about what purpose the wagon will serve. Will a wagon on Kast, or a wagon on Stevie serve more purpose? In this case, a wagon on Stevie will accomplish very little; he's not going to significantly change his posting style because he's already trying to defend himself. A wagon on Kast will either force Kast to contribute to scumhunting as town or force him out of his comfort zone as scum.

Stevie's attitude towards the game could change a lot of he were put under more pressure, just like physics. the more pressure you apply to something, the hotter under the collar stevie will get, regardless if he is scum or town, however how he reacts to this, will help us figure out if he is scum, or town, and who on his wagon is scum or town. as a wagon builds, you dont just recieve information to whom the wagon is building upon, but also who joins the wagon, for what reason, and when. a wagon on stevie, if he flips scum or town, will help us figure out who his buddies were, or who was scum that misled town for the mislynch.

[StevieT92]

The post i promised responding to GI's questions isn't going to happen because he hasn't asked me any besides the experience question

[Pomegranate]

Busy day, but let me say that my post #41 was meant the way vollkan understood it.

[Starbuck]

Kast

@Greyice-
How about you cut the crap and play the game? Flailing around randomly D1 like an idiot is just going to waste time and peg you for a useless VI. If you're scum, then keep it up, but if you're town, you're just going to hurt your credibility when you try to play seriously later. In either case, you're just setting yourself up as lynch bait (either as a mislynch or a sacrificial bus) and that's clearly not playing to your win con.

This is a serious overreaction to something that was blatantly sarcastic, but I don't see why GreyICE reacted to Kast's questions as he did, which was a spark for the above.

Why not just answer Kast's original questions and be done with it? I kinda see Kast being used as a scapegoat for trying to understand things better.

Amrun

Amrun's Post 70 feels very odd to me. Then to beg people not to answer the question in Post 72 just reeks of backpedaling when she says "this could lead us somewhere I don't want to go."

Stevie

I'm not getting a really scummy read of Kast, but I don't think the wagon is completely unfounded, however I wouldn't like it to see it get out of hand.

Fencesitting at it's finest. No reasons given as to why you find Kast town or why you don't think the wagon is completely unfounded.

Get off the fence, sir.

If you want to see why I think the cult mention is a scum tell, then read my posts. That cult post has derailed a lot of our day one discussion. Its a scumtell and I'm not the only one who thinks that. If you disagree with that it's fine but to attack me over that is ridiculous.

While I agree with the derailment of discussion statement and the fact that cult mentions (in any other case) are scummy, in this particular case (and as the person who all of this b.s. is about), you are seriously wrong in this matter.

GreyICE

Kast posts suck. This is a good reason to lynch.

You've done nothing but say things like this about Kast. How about a legitimate case rather than saying things like this?

Those questions are stupid. I specifically track/watch on night kills. If someone isn't KILLED at night, why would I watch/track to them?

As for roleblocking all watchers by inserting my name, NO. Why the FUCK wouldn't I mention that if I did THAT?!? I fucking just show up on the list of people. If it's me+1, then +1 is scum. If it's just me, lynch me and you'll have a confirmed Mafia Ninja and/or confirmed scum fakeclaiming.

I'm not really sure where all the negativity is coming from, but if you had just answered in the first place, then things wouldn't have gotten this far.

Drew those questions were still noise designed to look town, they were stupid as SIN.

How so? You could have easily given the above answer well before when you did it, rather than refuse, refuse, refuse.

Refusing to answer or giving people a hard time when they ask a question is quite anti-town to me. Why play to that?

Nocmen

Kast's posts seem pretty reasonable to me and I don't see what all the fuss is about.

Nice pun, though.

Why do you think his posts are townlike? He hasn't given much reads, aside from calling Grey a VI. Besides that, I find much of his posts hypocritical and overreacting about discussion on previous games and the claim.

She didn't say anything about his posts being townlike. Just that they are reasonable.

I'm a bit concerned about your assumptions here.

Masons now too? Why the hell would you out that fact for no good reason?

Seriously.

Pomegranate

GI's posts suck, considering he isn't answering valid questions, and he's criticizing Kast, who is making sense and stuff. GI continuously avoids/brushes off legitimate questions.

I definitely agree. The more I think about it, the more the footing of this Kast wagon is crumbling.

Celebloki

Starbuck seems to still be very sensitive over this and has done nothing but attack others for bringing it up with her posts. Again I don't find this town or scummy, just drama from previous games that doesn't need to be here.

Agreed, but I wasn't attacking anyone about it. My issue is that ever since that game, I cannot play a game where that specific instance is not brought up within a new game. I'm frankly tired of seeing it.

If it was a topic that needed to be brought up, then it should have been brought up in the sign up thread (rather than here) before the game started.

I think Amrun's claims of it being an RVS hello are crap, especially when she said that "I have no personal problem with Starbuck, but that warrants an RVS warning that such things will not be tolerated a second time." That statement alone proved to me that it wasn't just an "RVS hello" as she tried to make it out to be.

I understand the use of meta, but that one game, in no way, defines my meta as a whole.

[vollkan]

im not too familiar here with your point system, but are you saying that amrun is twisting Pom's interpretation of amrun's cult post, and her rvs fos into something scummy that isn't? because Pom never said what amrun did was scummy, she said it was wierd. to me there is a big difference. to me, at the end pom said that she was cautiously leaning town, also not indicative of me of a pure null tell.

I see that Pom's already said that she meant it how I interpreted it. In terms of Amrun, the problem is that he keeps accusing Pom of waffling, non-committal, etc. (actually, the attack has changed from being non-committal, to waffling, to having an actual read (ie. committing) and yet also RVing), when in fact her position was clear. Having a null read on something does not equate to being non-committal.

the interpretation of Pom's post here seems to be a bit off. to me, i dont see it as a roundabout way to get a null-tell, and i dont mind the rvs vote too much either. i see it as potentially scummy that she finds amrun's way of trying to describe the cult mention as not normal, i mean, what do you find not normal about the way amrun as defended herself? also, there was only 1 post amrun said that wasn't about the cult post, and all amrun did was ask questions to people (the one to ani was pretty bad), and say that she didnt see the case on kast, but didnt like his posts. i don't really like amruns post here, and i dont see why Pom does.

Pom's post gives me a vibe of fencesitting with a caution town label afterwards, it makes me wonder if perhaps there is some distancing going on here between amrun and Pom.

I don't think you can seriously deny that Amrun's actions were weird. In which case, I can't see why Pom is unreasonable in her view of it: namely, that it was weird but could be written off as a mistake.

I'm also not voting GreyIce really because of his claim - he would indeed have to be an incredibly ballsy scum to come out with that day one. I'm voting him because his behavior since that claim has been extremely suspect.

Yup. GI is scum because he has done the right thing in claiming and is also refusing to give away any more information than he needs to.

[LobsterCatapult]

im not too familiar here with your point system, but are you saying that amrun is twisting Pom's interpretation of amrun's cult post, and her rvs fos into something scummy that isn't? because Pom never said what amrun did was scummy, she said it was wierd. to me there is a big difference. to me, at the end pom said that she was cautiously leaning town, also not indicative of me of a pure null tell.

I see that Pom's already said that she meant it how I interpreted it. In terms of Amrun, the problem is that he keeps accusing Pom of waffling, non-committal, etc. (actually, the attack has changed from being non-committal, to waffling, to having an actual read (ie. committing) and yet also RVing), when in fact her position was clear. Having a null read on something does not equate to being non-committal.

the interpretation of Pom's post here seems to be a bit off. to me, i dont see it as a roundabout way to get a null-tell, and i dont mind the rvs vote too much either. i see it as potentially scummy that she finds amrun's way of trying to describe the cult mention as not normal, i mean, what do you find not normal about the way amrun as defended herself? also, there was only 1 post amrun said that wasn't about the cult post, and all amrun did was ask questions to people (the one to ani was pretty bad), and say that she didnt see the case on kast, but didnt like his posts. i don't really like amruns post here, and i dont see why Pom does.

Pom's post gives me a vibe of fencesitting with a caution town label afterwards, it makes me wonder if perhaps there is some distancing going on here between amrun and Pom.

I don't think you can seriously deny that Amrun's actions were weird. In which case, I can't see why Pom is unreasonable in her view of it: namely, that it was weird but could be written off as a mistake.

I'm also not voting GreyIce really because of his claim - he would indeed have to be an incredibly ballsy scum to come out with that day one. I'm voting him because his behavior since that claim has been extremely suspect.

Yup. GI is scum because he has done the right thing in claiming and is also refusing to give away any more information than he needs to.

amrun was acting wierdly, i never denied that, what i said was that wierd=/=scummy in terms of wording. if i said amrun was acting wierd, id consider that to have a different meaning than amrun was acting scummy.

by no means, right now, do i see amrun as acting very townie.

[vollkan]

im not too familiar here with your point system, but are you saying that amrun is twisting Pom's interpretation of amrun's cult post, and her rvs fos into something scummy that isn't? because Pom never said what amrun did was scummy, she said it was wierd. to me there is a big difference. to me, at the end pom said that she was cautiously leaning town, also not indicative of me of a pure null tell.

I see that Pom's already said that she meant it how I interpreted it. In terms of Amrun, the problem is that he keeps accusing Pom of waffling, non-committal, etc. (actually, the attack has changed from being non-committal, to waffling, to having an actual read (ie. committing) and yet also RVing), when in fact her position was clear. Having a null read on something does not equate to being non-committal.

the interpretation of Pom's post here seems to be a bit off. to me, i dont see it as a roundabout way to get a null-tell, and i dont mind the rvs vote too much either. i see it as potentially scummy that she finds amrun's way of trying to describe the cult mention as not normal, i mean, what do you find not normal about the way amrun as defended herself? also, there was only 1 post amrun said that wasn't about the cult post, and all amrun did was ask questions to people (the one to ani was pretty bad), and say that she didnt see the case on kast, but didnt like his posts. i don't really like amruns post here, and i dont see why Pom does.

Pom's post gives me a vibe of fencesitting with a caution town label afterwards, it makes me wonder if perhaps there is some distancing going on here between amrun and Pom.

I don't think you can seriously deny that Amrun's actions were weird. In which case, I can't see why Pom is unreasonable in her view of it: namely, that it was weird but could be written off as a mistake.

I'm also not voting GreyIce really because of his claim - he would indeed have to be an incredibly ballsy scum to come out with that day one. I'm voting him because his behavior since that claim has been extremely suspect.

Yup. GI is scum because he has done the right thing in claiming and is also refusing to give away any more information than he needs to.

amrun was acting wierdly, i never denied that, what i said was that wierd=/=scummy in terms of wording. if i said amrun was acting wierd, id consider that to have a different meaning than amrun was acting scummy.

Sure, the word "weird" in isolation doesn't mean "scummy". But Pom juxtaposed it being "weird" and her not "liking" it against her thinking it was potentially just a town mistake; which implies that weird was just being used instead of scummy. Now, that isn't technically a correct labelling, but it's hardly unusual for a person to use the word "weird" when they mean "scummy"

[Starbuck]

Kast

Kast, how do you know Stevie would be a mislynch? What makes you think he's town?

Was this ever answered? Or did I miss it during my catch up?

Stevie

Clarification on the point on Kast: I have no problem with the people wagonning him as I think he is mildly scummy - I am not however going to vote for him.

K, cool story bro. Why do you find him mildy scummy?

He's been asked to elaborate before and still hasn't (at this point that I'm reading). Kinda hypocritical with his vote on GreyICE for doing the same thing.

I voted for a cult mention because a cult mention is worth voting for.

But what of the explanation? You still think it's scummy after that?

When someone goes, stevie answer my questions or i will vote you, i will answer their questions.

Why does there have to be a threat of a vote in order for you to respond? That's pretty damn anti-town imho.

Unvote
Vote: Stevie

[LobsterCatapult]

im not too familiar here with your point system, but are you saying that amrun is twisting Pom's interpretation of amrun's cult post, and her rvs fos into something scummy that isn't? because Pom never said what amrun did was scummy, she said it was wierd. to me there is a big difference. to me, at the end pom said that she was cautiously leaning town, also not indicative of me of a pure null tell.

I see that Pom's already said that she meant it how I interpreted it. In terms of Amrun, the problem is that he keeps accusing Pom of waffling, non-committal, etc. (actually, the attack has changed from being non-committal, to waffling, to having an actual read (ie. committing) and yet also RVing), when in fact her position was clear. Having a null read on something does not equate to being non-committal.

the interpretation of Pom's post here seems to be a bit off. to me, i dont see it as a roundabout way to get a null-tell, and i dont mind the rvs vote too much either. i see it as potentially scummy that she finds amrun's way of trying to describe the cult mention as not normal, i mean, what do you find not normal about the way amrun as defended herself? also, there was only 1 post amrun said that wasn't about the cult post, and all amrun did was ask questions to people (the one to ani was pretty bad), and say that she didnt see the case on kast, but didnt like his posts. i don't really like amruns post here, and i dont see why Pom does.

Pom's post gives me a vibe of fencesitting with a caution town label afterwards, it makes me wonder if perhaps there is some distancing going on here between amrun and Pom.

I don't think you can seriously deny that Amrun's actions were weird. In which case, I can't see why Pom is unreasonable in her view of it: namely, that it was weird but could be written off as a mistake.

I'm also not voting GreyIce really because of his claim - he would indeed have to be an incredibly ballsy scum to come out with that day one. I'm voting him because his behavior since that claim has been extremely suspect.

Yup. GI is scum because he has done the right thing in claiming and is also refusing to give away any more information than he needs to.

amrun was acting wierdly, i never denied that, what i said was that wierd=/=scummy in terms of wording. if i said amrun was acting wierd, id consider that to have a different meaning than amrun was acting scummy.

Sure, the word "weird" in isolation doesn't mean "scummy". But Pom juxtaposed it being "weird" and her not "liking" it against her thinking it was potentially just a town mistake; which implies that weird was just being used instead of scummy. Now, that isn't technically a correct labelling, but it's hardly unusual for a person to use the word "weird" when they mean "scummy"

ill concede, its not unusual, i had a problem with you making that inference when that wasnt really waht she said, but since she has confirmed that is how she wanted it to be red, i dont see the point in arguing it further. i suppose my point that should still stand is even when i see something and say, thats odd/wierd, when i use it, i dont necessarily always mean scummy but this could be a minority opinion.

also, looking at starbucks post, i missed kast saying that stevie is a mislynch, i am curious as to why kast as such a town read on stevie.

[StevieT92]

Yup. GI is scum because he has done the right thing in claiming and is also refusing to give away any more information than he needs to.

You're reaching..have you read my posts at all?

[SpyreX]

I'm also not voting GreyIce really because of his claim - he would indeed have to be an incredibly ballsy scum to come out with that day one. I'm voting him because his behavior since that claim has been extremely suspect.

You just literally said you believe the claim and that scum wouldn't do it but then said you're voting him because hes scummy.

I think my face melted off

[vollkan]

Yup. GI is scum because he has done the right thing in claiming and is also refusing to give away any more information than he needs to.

You're reaching..have you read my posts at all?

Yup. And for all your carping about him not answering questions about his claim and his rolename, you're ignoring the fundamental point which is that he may well have good reasons for not providing said information. In short, he becomes scummy because he doesn't play along with a thinly-veiled fishing expedition.