NY135: Sexy Sedilla Semi-Open - Town Wins

[Oversoul]

/confirm

Sorry for the late reply, guys.

[Oversoul]

Vote Idher

[Oversoul]

You're an acquired taste Ythan. I mean, you still

skim the border of the socially acceptable

frequently, but meeting you IRL helps with the appreciation of playing with you.

Lmao. This is going to be a fun game.

[Oversoul]

:C Don't make fun.

[Oversoul]

w00t! I started that Idher wagon.

Must get rid of all the hydras.

[Oversoul]

Ythan, you're wrong.

Moving on.

[Oversoul]

Hiraki I see as slightly scummy just for his general attitude towards the game . I have Hikari and Spyrex as possible scum buddies because of their relative lack of communication yet continual support from Spyrex. Also, Hikari seems to be pretty much following along what other people say. He unvoted me after Ythan proposed a plausible statement of "implausible" as well as changed his mind when Idher said he believed Swag. He seems to act too flippy floppy and I would not mind a lynch on either him or Spyrex.

Ythan... I don't even know how to read. I am completely stumped. He seems mainly interested in arguing rather than the reason for arguing. I'll put him as town, but his dumb mason test makes it sound really scummy. Why would another town want masons to softclaim?

Parablocks I have as a town. 126 indicates that he cares about not being mislynched. At the early in the game, I don't think a scum would really care that someone started to /lean/ towards them. He shrugged when the pressure was put onto him and didn't really give adequate reasons for voting me other than saying my actions were unnecessary.

Sorry this took so long write up. I'm new at this and I hadn't really been paying attention to the thread.

[Oversoul]

Fourteen pages? Fuck you guys.

It isn't that important. Mostly just Ethosand Ythan duking it out.

[Oversoul]

You should probably re-evaluate that KoC townread.

-Amrun

You should probably come up with some kind of reasoning behind this.
Being in a hydra doesn't mean you get to throw shit around without explaining yourself.

Ya, Idher. Most of your posts aren't really contributing to anything, especially your random vote on Quilford which I assume is from Ethos's list.

The only reason I can come up with for your lack of substance is that you have a QT with someone else (other than your hydra partner).

394 sounds a bit...


slippery.

Why? Unless you think Para and Ethos are scum buddies, which would be risky for Ethos/Para to make a post like considering considering how much pressure *both* of them have received.

I still can't believe how many problems came as a result of one of my posts.

[Oversoul]

Oversoul, those in glass houses throw the most stones. (Hint: give actual content before criticizing others' style of play.)

You thnk I don't realize this? I am trying to contribute something, but I am still *very* bad at this game. I am clearly in the company of people who have played this game and know all the in's 'n' out's as well as the nuances of this particular setup. I know it seems hypocritical, especially for someone in my position, to ask people to post more, but I don't do it out of malice. I am sorry if the tone of my post came out as harsh. I didn't mean it to be that way.

Oversoul #268 is [goodposting], I wonder whose alt you are...

Why don't you believe that I am an actual noob?

Unvote Since Para is getting a replacement, we feel like replacement deserves a chance.

Chair, if you thought Para's slot was scum based on his play, why would you unvote? For the sanctity of the replacement? That doesn't sound like very townie behavior. I may be a noob, but I am pretty sure the objective of this game is to defeat all of the Mafia. Why give them a chance to cover their bases and readjust, unless you, like Ethos, feel that Para's /replace is out of frustration.

Both of which deserve a call out - but, not from a scum trying to blend. And, and when everyone went "Ohh no these pages are just Ethos and Ythan duking it out" he went "no, no its not." because it isn't. This is paying attention and pretty solid town.

Umm what? When other town players are calling out the Hydras and the V/LA absence, wouldn't that be an action a scum would want to do? Or are you saying because he didn't parrot what other people said and instead went his own way, he was not acting scummy? And the duking out part was just me.

Quilford:
This feels like a false dilemma. (For the newer players here, a "false dillema" is when a person says "either person A is scum, or person B is scum" when there's no reason for that assumption. It's a common scum tactic, since if scum like to keep two townies at each other's throats, and since if the town buys it, they first mislynch one and then when that guy flips town they to mislynch the other one the "one or the other has to be scum" theory.)

Or that maybe could be just his reads on them. I think you're reading into his post too much.

[Oversoul]

Yos:

IF that is the case, then what do you make of Ethos very clearly giving a pat on the back in a "you're not a VI" way?

Still not sure what you mean, Spyrex. What post of Ethos are you talking about?

The one after Para lost it and called everyone dense.

I'll try to find it for you...

Hey bud, Unvote first. Also don't leave the site you're a good player, probably right and town, which is why the bandwagon is on you.

#372

If you think about Ethos's actions as scummy McScummerson then you can "create" a plausible reason why he is defending Para. He "claims" to not want to end the day phase in 3 days because it won't actually be good for the town since it will end with a town lynch and he also tries to comfort his "scumbuddy" telling him to stay and play since he has hopefully ended the early lynch wagon with his earlier plea.

I can see the scumminess of his actions, but why would he support my position as town, going as far to get into a pissing contest? Because it is clearly obvious that I am town and anyone refuting that would look scummy? :\ I still find it hard to believe that Ethos is scum.

Spyrex says one or the other is scum (Ethos/Para), but Ythan claims that they are both scum and yet he doesn't specify which one would be a better candidate.

I also think that Ythan has more information than just reads...


Spryex, you honestly have me stumped, buddy. I am going to try and ISO your posts later. That is, if I learn how to ISO posts. Is there any specific forum function I should use to make my job easier?

[Oversoul]

I also think that Ythan has more information than just reads...

This is a weird thing to say considering we know all the roles that can appear in this game.

Ya, but we don't know who has what, Benedict.

[Oversoul]

I also think that Ythan has more information than just reads...

This is a weird thing to say considering we know all the roles that can appear in this game.

Ya, but we don't know who has what, Benedict.

Except none of the roles present in the game could inform my suspicion, genius.

You sure?

Not all roles need day/night actions to give information.

[Oversoul]

For give my density/noobishness/stupidity, but what is sheeping?

[Oversoul]

Ya... I just read a definition that said sheeping is voting for someone with minimal thought and/or effort. Why would he be worrying about sheeping? To avoid looking scummy? Why would that matter at this point when Ethos/Yos are more than likely going to be lynched (unfortunately )?

That just sounds a little fishy, Emp.

Pedit: Oh, Spyrex's definition makes more sense in this case.
Pedit2: @Ythan Sure. I don't care really.

[Oversoul]

You were trying to get at something but it comes off as you haven't read the roles.

Not necessarily.

Empking is Empkinging.

I don't know if this a veiled attempt at mocking me, but I am going to assume it isn't.

Ythan, I am getting at something and I have read the roles (although rather poorly as Reckoner can attest for ). I would rather not share until after the first night to see if any certain situations change.

[Oversoul]

Don't forget - it also had that morsel of "this is happening because you're right this game".

If you're looking at your slot as a VI (and like I said it would take stones to call yourself out as scum) and Ethos is treating it as anything but can't you see the disconnect.

I'm scum.

Is Ethos's defense of Yos/Para the only reason you think he is scum, Emp?

[Oversoul]

Sapo: What are your feelings toward Hikari?
Oversoul: Where did you get your sheeping definition?

Epicmafia or something like that lol.

[Oversoul]

Don't forget - it also had that morsel of "this is happening because you're right this game".

If you're looking at your slot as a VI (and like I said it would take stones to call yourself out as scum) and Ethos is treating it as anything but can't you see the disconnect.

I'm scum.

Is Ethos's defense of Yos/Para the only reason you think he is scum, Emp?

...

Um.

Did you just claim scum, Overlord?

First, it is Oversoul.

And no. It was a joke. See the post I quoted.

[Oversoul]

Dramonic, can you post, cause I see you lurking.

[Oversoul]

Ok. I just wanted to call you out incase you were trying to lurk and coast through out the game.

[Oversoul]

Ok. I just wanted to call you out incase you were trying to lurk and coast through out the game.

Erm... what?
Proper course of action: Call someone out for lurking -> they don't post anything of substance -> continue to call them out for coasting
Oversoul: Call someone out for lurking -> they don't post anything of substance ->

CARRY ON!

Yeah, no.

I'm new. This is literally the first game that I was able to play. Jesus for not knowing the proper procedure.

Besides, Dram said he was reading so I wanted to give him some time to collect his thoughts.

[Oversoul]

You were trying to get at something but it comes off as you haven't read the roles.

Not necessarily.

Empking is Empkinging.

I don't know if this a veiled attempt at mocking me, but I am going to assume it isn't.

Ythan, I am getting at something and I have read the roles (although rather poorly as Reckoner can attest for ). I would rather not share until after the first night to see if any certain situations change.

You know there was no n0 yes?

Yes...

Do you think I think you are a bookie?

[Oversoul]

Yes...

Do you think I think you are a bookie?

Heh. If you're saying what I think you're saying, the "Ythan is trying to force through one specific mislynch because he is a mafia bookie" theory you seem to be going for is cute, but it doesn't actually work, since according to the roles on page 1, mafia bookie doesn't get to make a bet until a night phase happens, and it hasn't yet, so that's not actually possible.

Resisting the attempt to pull out my hair.

No, I do not think that Ythan is a bookie. I realize that there is no Night 0 guys. I never said I think Ythan is bookie, I asked

Ythan

if

he

thinks that

I

think he is bookie.

I know I am failing at explaining things, but does that make it clearer? :\

And by the very nature of being a Mafia member you have more information than a townie. That is what I was getting at.

[Oversoul]

If bussing is what I am guessing, then yes, I do think you are bussing.

I think that the Para/Ethos voting block which is partly driven by the Mafia in the attempt to get a second nightkill, meaning yes, the Bookie is either apart of the wagon or at least orchestrated it in order to have an already established strong base for a mislynch the following day.


I originally thought Spyrex was the bookie, but after he used a few unfortunately coincidental words I tried to breadcrumb him, but I am assuming he didn't notice.

Predit: Ythan, I think you are a traitor, or the traitor depending on how many there are in the game. You would know who the Mafia are (for your strong scum reads so early in the game) and could easily create a situation that would fortify your basis as a town and no one would know since you would come up as innocent to the cop. The only possible situation is if the Mafia try to kill you resulting in a deathless night by either the 1 shot immunity of the traitor ability or the mafia choosing to not kill anyone.

[Oversoul]

Oh that was horrible grammar. For the voting block sentence, I meant to add "which is rather large is partly driven..."

[Oversoul]

I never liked how Ythan immediately latched on to the aspect that Ethos/Para was scum. Although he has convinced me I just found it really strange he could read both of them with such a large amount of ease.

Also, T Booker, you will find that I am incredibly inconsistent. In almost everything I do in real life I am inconsistent. I don't know what it is. I have these little epiphanies (or so I think ).

I DON'T THINK YTHAN IS BOOKIE!!!

[Oversoul]

Sorry, T Bone. I wasn't paying attention.

Untrod, you haven't been as vocal about the whole situation as Ythan.

And what looks better for a townie than a scum lynch?

And if you do decide to lynch me you are only giving the Mafia a by for that day.

[Oversoul]

He's saying I'm bussing them to gain town cred. Which means he believes they're scum. Which means he's not being honest.

I am being honest. I don't know what to think of Ethos and Para anymore. I used to think both of them were townie, but after what has happened I am not so sure.

Now you guys are making me doubt myself and my thoughts on Ythan.

[Oversoul]

Claiming mason without claiming buddies is...what is the word...

worthless, that's what it was!

I guess what I'm saying is that claiming 1/3 of a mason team doesn't sway me.

I think I can guess at least one other mason. (Hint: It isn't me)

[Oversoul]

And if you do decide to lynch me you are only giving the Mafia a by for that day.

AtE

He's saying I'm bussing them to gain town cred. Which means he believes they're scum. Which means he's not being honest.

I am being honest. I don't know what to think of Ethos and Para anymore. I used to think both of them were townie, but after what has happened I am not so sure.

Now you guys are making me doubt myself and my thoughts on Ythan.

This contradicts your accusation against me at the most basic level.

Also lol partial mason claim. Especially considering earlier.

Ok. What the hell is AtE? Too many acronyms to memorize.

Honestly guys, it isn't like Ethos threw a parabola at us. We can work with the information (or misinformation if you so choose to believe) he has given us. (well, that is my guess at least)

Ythan, this was my thought process. Ethos and Para are townie. You jumped in and said one of them had to definitely be scum for their actions. Making me change my mind and feel uncertain. Then you continued to pile drive the fact that they were the best wagon which made me uncertain about you. I felt that Para was more townie than Ethos based on your posts and the posts of a couple of others and that is when I got the idea that you were the traitor and knew that Ethos was scum and had decided to push him in order to solidify your base as a townie.

I am definitely feeling uncertain about my thoughts now, though.

[Oversoul]

Ok. What the hell is AtE? Too many acronyms to memorize.

Honestly guys, it isn't like Ethos threw a parabola at us. We can work with the information (or misinformation if you so choose to believe) he has given us. (well, that is my guess at least)

Ythan, this was my thought process. Ethos and Para are townie. You jumped in and said one of them had to definitely be scum for their actions. Making me change my mind and feel uncertain. Then you continued to pile drive the fact that they were the best wagon which made me uncertain about you. I felt that Para was more townie than Ethos based on your posts and the posts of a couple of others and that is when I got the idea that you were the traitor and knew that Ethos was scum and had decided to push him in order to solidify your base as a townie.

I am definitely feeling uncertain about my thoughts now, though.

AtE is appeal to emotion which is what you do when you're flailing.

What the fuck does a parabola have to do with this.

You say you can work with the information but you don't say anything concrete.

You're backpedaling from your stated reason for suspecting me. This is because you are lying.

HOLY FUCK.

Ok. I am done trying to breadcrumb since it is apparently beyond you.

I breadcrumbed you asking if you were Benedict. A reference to Benedict Arnold, an infamous traitor during the American Revolution.

If what Ethos is saying is true, then I am sorry. I think Parabollocks/Yosarian2 is another partner for the Masons group. Ethos's plea to Para to stay "you are right, scum are doing this to you" fits perfectly since he would know that Para is town because he is part of the mason group.

Parabola was an attempt to try and breadcrumb Parabollocks/Yosarian2 without directly saying it. Sorry guys if I am right.

And what exactly do you think I am lying about? I am a vanilla townie. I have no powers. I am not scum.

Are you saying I am backpedaling because I am now uncertain whether or not you are scum because my plan if what Ethos claimed is true CLEARLY does not account for your actions.

[Oversoul]

Okay, so I'm not a mason then. lololol

Where the fuck are you seeing these posts? I don't see this post or Ethos's parabola picture one either.

[Oversoul]

You are claiming that you breadcrumbed

asking me to out myself

as a scum role.

You basically did the same earlier in the thread indirectly asking Ethos if he was mason with me. I don't really see the difference other than it is *very* stupid for scum to out themselves.

And here let me look up and show you the not-mason claim. You assuming that buddying must confirm the mason claim is ridiculous.

I believe Ethos until I see otherwise.

And you're claiming that you couldn't be lying because you're a vt.

Ok. I agree that looks bad. I have to hope that you will trust me, or at least the others will. I am a vanilla townie. I know that it is the most obvious role that scum will fakeclaim, but you have to trust me. I am a vanilla townie.

And I'm saying you're backpedaling because the basis of your accusation was that I was bussing scum.

I am backpedaling. Ok. I realize that now. I am not backpedaling because I am afraid to blow my cover. I have no cover. I have no power to lose. I have no limited faction to let down (other than town, but I feel I have already done that).

Do you not know how to use a phpBB forum?

I seriously don't see those posts. Tell me their number so I can check.

Ethos, did you lie about your mason claim?

[Oversoul]

Okay, so I'm not a mason then. lololol

Wait. Was this when you asked him if he was Mason within the first day of this thread's creation?

[Oversoul]

I asked him to convey to me if he were a mason, ie if there were some valid reason for his buddying. Asking me to scumclaim is different and retarded. There is no intelligent reason that you would have done that sincerely.

If you did have some valid reason (?) to be backpedaling it might be a bit easier to take it in stride.

Iso the player in question and ctrl+f.

Ya. I didn't remember Ethos said that previously until you quoted it again. Sorry for the confusion.

I am done trying to explain myself tonight. I am obviously very bad at this game. I backpedaled on my thought that you were traitor because people genuinely believe that Yosarian and Ethos are scum. Since I am new to this game I thought it was just my newbiness that led me astray and I consider you a very strong player. By that time though, I had already made the Benedict comment as well as the "I think Ythan has more information than he is letting on" comment which made you inquisitive about my own comments. You were pressing for answers so I gave you my original "you are traitor bussing scum" idea.

[Oversoul]

I just want to clarify. The majority of my current suspicion of you is based on the fact that you accused me of bussing without expressing any suspicion of the scum I was attacking. If you thought I was a traitor bussing scum you must have thought they were scum. Which you do not seem to have thought.

Oh. My god, I misread that post of yours too. I was uncertain because people kept saying that it was either one or the other (meaning either Ethos was scum or Para was scum, but not both) and I had previously thought both of them were town. I couldn't make up my mind on which one was scum at the time because you were stressing me out prying me for answers to my cryptic comments. Also, I didn't think it mattered because people were piling onto their wagons and I thought they would both get lynched within 2 days. I was more preoccupied with you (who at the time I thought was traitor) running the show.

If it matters I think Ethos is the scummier of the two.

[Oversoul]

Overlord, why did you just claim VT? It's really anti-town to do that. What are you doing?

I know claiming VT is generally a bad thing, but I was flailing at the time. Ythan destroyed my opinion on the Ethos and Para slot wagons and then started to demand more from me. I felt if I gave him my role pm it would prove to him that I am town. I still don't think he believes me, though.

Just wondering, Yos, but why is claiming VT generally anti-town? I believe it to be anti-town because it is the most common role that scum fakeclaims. However, I am interested in your opinion.

[Oversoul]

The deadline is coming up in roughly five days and the last thing we need is a last ditch attempt to actually start gaining ground on a reasonable lynch. Everyone who hasn't voted Empking need to explain their reluctance in doing so in their next post. Furthermore it's highly evident that the day has revolved around too few players, noticably SpyreX, Ythan, Hiraki, Oversoul, Yosh and ourselves therefore we want everyone to tell us what their thoughts are of the quieter posters in their next post as well.

We can see the merits in revealing my mason partners especially considering the fact that scum are currently able to narrow them down to a select few possible partners to begin with:

Our mason partners are Dramonic and T-Bone

.

Regfan and Slaxx

Hmm. Dramonic comes as a surprise... T-Bone given his most recent posts isn't all that surprising.

Sorry, Yos, I hadn't thought about that possibility.

I really have no reluctance voting for Empking and once Idher started to single out Quilford and his behavior I started to feel that he was scummy, but I was more obsessed with Ythan being scum to really care.

[Oversoul]

Is there a chance that I could have been right...

[Oversoul]

Mastin. What's your opinion on T-Bone?

Actually, I want that to go out to everyone.

I personally don't like his last two posts, and can't remember much more about him.

So I'm very iffy on him.

What?

That is very suspicious, Hiraki. Could you please read the thread before asking

obvious

scummy questions?

[Oversoul]

Hiraki is always a good shot.
And I haven't even read the game too!
I'm going to ask Ethos to post his read list in the QT too, since now he, I and Bone are all giant NK targets. Just in case he turns up dead we'll have his opinions on whatever. Not that they'll be super special awesome, but you know, he still is town!

This post seems... unneeded.

I am okay with a Hiraki Venge Kill. However, what has priority? A night kill or a venge kill?

[Oversoul]

Frankly, I chose Kanye over you because Ethos felt Kanye was his top scum read. They thought you were town. I figured I'd include their reads too into my discussion.

Could you include their reads so everyone can see unless, of course, there are specifics that may aid the scum. I know Dramonic asked Ethos to post their reads predicting a mason kill, and from your post I am going to assume he followed through with the request, but please any information at this point is helpful.

Anyways....

This game just went to hell in handbasket...

Empking, if you are townie, and you legitimately forgot, which I doubt, you have probably secured a win for the scum. Howrever, I have this thought in the back of my mind that this is just one huge ass gambit.

If there is a bookie, this could be their attempt to gain the 2 nightkills. Empking "claiming" 1 vigkill can do two things. A) it outs the real vigilante, if there is one or B) sets up bookie fodder perfectly once the claim is proven fake.

For fear of the bookie and playing into the hands of the scum, I would hold off on killing Empking. We can save his lynch for later as well as give him time to "prove" his vig ability. It is highly unlikely that the Mafia would throw one of their power roles under the bus either, so it is safe to assume that Empking is either a (forgetful................. -.-) Vig 1-shot or a Mafia Goon.

I really don't have any reads from this game other than my failed Ythan read. However, I find it ironic how Hiraki has not posted back here again AND he was unphased when Empking stated he would shoot Hiraki...

I still don't see the scumminess of Kanye's actions. I guess I am a noob and don't realize some of the hidden nuances, but could someone point them out for me? :3

[Oversoul]

Its not a function of Empking or any gambit.

Its risk-reward on the scum side.

I fully, FULLY, expect that if there is a Bookie he's Bookied. Regardless, he's scum.

Are you advocating lynching Empking regardless of the 2 shot bonus that is likely placed on his head?

Or are you saying that since Empking is basically confirmed scum, the bookie is going to have Empking be booked the entire time, regardless of what day it will be? That was my initial fear, but that is remedied if we find the actual bookie.

Also, what would be the point in lynching Empking now? It would do absolutely nothing for town.

[Oversoul]

It would do absolutely nothing for town.

LARIATO

Unvote, Vote: Oversoul

Nice substance.

Here is what I think happened.

In the scum quick topic, they realized that Untrod and Empking were under pressure and likely to be lynched on Day 1. In order for town to miss the scum, they have Empking fakeclaim a vigilante ability, which in essence sets scum up to out the true Vigilante and using their nightkill on that person, or potentially setting up a bookie bonus kill the next night as well as killing a townie through the mislynch. From this I assume that Empking is a goon or other mafia role that is not vital. Hell, he might even be the bookie in which case we are fucked. The bookie would have placed the power on Empking preparing for the imminent, "why didn't you use your vig shot ... you're scum" which was going to happen once everyone realized there was only 1 kill last night securing an extra night kill and killing a confirmed scum. However, if the Mafia desperately needed the extra nightkill they would continuously put the power on Empking knowing that he would be lynched sooner or later.

If we search for the actual bookie, we can avoid the possibility of giving the Mafia a second nightkill. This plan is trumped only if the bookie uses his power on himself, which I fear, Empking may have done.

The enemy you know is better than the enemy you don't know.

Pedit: Am I really that nuts? :\ I'll shut up if you guys think my posts aren't conducive to scumhunting or helping the town.

[Oversoul]

are you claiming daytalk?

I'm not claiming anything. Where did you get the idea? O_o

[Oversoul]

Oh, that does look bad. I was just saying that as the scenario though.

[Oversoul]

Are you guys kidding me?

At this rate, Oversoul has a need to die.

Can you not be so obviously scum, Hiraki?

Once I flip town, I'll be expecting a lynch on your ass.

[Oversoul]

Are you guys kidding me?

At this rate, Oversoul has a need to die.

Can you not be so obviously scum, Hiraki?

Once I flip town, I'll be expecting a lynch on your ass.

With what case?

See how this starts Oversoul? You call me slightly scum, and say that I'm fine for a vengekill.

Now when you make the little slippy slip, you get angry and start calling me obv. scum and cracking under pressure.

The pressure of what? Oh right, my 5000 psi vote.

die.

Stop being so elusive.

And I already explained my "slip". It was supposed to be taken in as part of the scenario that I spent like 3 posts trying to explain. The fact that you immediately grabbed onto it suggests you want an easy mislynch.

[Oversoul]

I promise you I am not nuts.

[Oversoul]

I know what you were getting at its just the method you used to get there is somethin else.

Ok. As long as you comprehend what I was trying to say. Sometimes I... just don't know how to speak English. I am pretty sure I am dyslexic, but whatever lol

[Oversoul]

You are a Mafia Goon!

Each

night

, you may work with your mafia teammates (PLAYERNAMES) to decide who to kill. During the day, you have your voice and your vote only. You win when mafia is equal in number to town, or nothing can prevent the same.

Game thread is here: 12345

Unrelated:

Vote: Hikari

Why did you quote the Mafia Goon role?

*sigh*

At this point, Empking is established scum, most likely with the Bookie note on his head. Any smart Bookie would continually to place the note on Empking's head knowing that he would be lynched sooner or later.

I really don't like having to play into the scum's plan... :\

unvote, vote: Empking

Kill your damn Magikarp ass, ya scum.

[Oversoul]

Whoa whoa.

Empking is close enough to a lynch. We don't need to lynch him yet and lose a week of discussion.

If you care that much, why don't you unvote?

That was an odd thing to say, T-Bone. O_o

Also, after we lynch Empking, kill Hiraki.

[Oversoul]

Setting up lynches now, still with no reasoning against me.

Oversoulscum.

What is your reasoning? Stop trying to get me lynched in the hopes for a mislynch. After Empking is killed, you are next.

[Oversoul]

I am honestly surprised about the Hiraki flip. *sigh* I really wished Dram or T-Bone had the foresight to post their reads along with Ethos's read, unless I missed it. If I am not mistaken, Dram promised to post the reads, but his activity this game...

I feel like Yos's "slip" was not a slip and rather just a tired typo. You can see that he implied town with his second use of the word we.

Kanye's immediate jump on that slip is suspicious in my opinion, but I can't really tell discern anything from anyone this game. My reads have all been off and the activity has kinda made me lose interest. Ugh, so much WIFOM with this particular situation.

Bookie really screwed everything up, especially with the threat of a Mafia traitor (which I believe is in the game). I haven't seen anyone try and breadcrumb a cop ability and as a result there wouldn't be a need for a tailor. No one counterclaimed Emp that night so I am pretty sure there is no vigilante. I don't think there is a rolecop due to the apparent lack of actual power roles. It wouldn't make sense for there to be a role cop with a 3 man mason group + an innocent child or tree stump seeing as they prove themselves in the event of a L-1.

[Oversoul]

...

Why do you believe there is a mafia traitor with a bookie in play?

More importantly:

It is now Day 3. With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.

With 1 dead scum, even with a bookie, already how is this lylo under any normal mechanics?

Because the lack of other roles that are in the game mostly. What do you believe the scum team has? Also, how big would a scum team be in this game?

[Oversoul]

Wait, how did they get that 3rd kill last night? Does that confirm a Vig?

Also, I am inclined to vote Kanye for reasons stated in my earlier post toDay. I'll look over his iso.

[Oversoul]

Kayne has three votes by my count right now.
Chair has two.

Is there anyone here who strongly disagrees with one of those two being our lynch today?

I disagree with the Chair lynch. He hasn't done anything overtly scummy and Kanye's behavior towards Hiraki and Ethos is ugly considering their flips.

I looked at everyone's posts (those who are still alive) and it seems like everyone has made one bleh post that doesn't seem particularly town, but other than that I am pretty much at a stand still for reads. I don't know why I can't a read other than like 3 or 4 people, but it is annoying me.

[Oversoul]

I feel like Chair could be scum. If the bookie is multiple shot whoever dies today will have at least 1 scum partner on their wagon as there were really no clear people to lynch like Empking yesterday.

Sapo made a post that I wasn't comfortable with, but I can't find it at this moment. Hold on.

[Oversoul]

I think Ythan is obvtown, but someone or the other on this Ethos wagon is scum. And that someone is being terribly opportunistic. IIRC, people who piled on that Ethos dealie later included Hikari, Spyrex, KoC (though he changed it to Parabollocks), and Empking. So Empking, why are you voting for Ethos now?

I feel like this could have been a plan in order to raise suspicion against Empking, planning that he would claim Vig, wait lynch someone else, and then once the claim falls through, lynch him with the fact that he was already suspicious.

[Oversoul]

VOTE: Saporvirus

I don't have a wall or anything really, but I just feel like Sapo is scum.

My reads so far have been...

Town:
Idher
Mastin2
Yosarian2

Null-leaning town:
Kanyeknowsbest

Null:
Kunkstar7

Null-leaning scum:
Chair
MrZepher
Magister Ludi

Scum:
Sapovirus

Reasoning, gut mostly. I didn't like her post where she called Ethos's arguments strecthed and then the Empking buddying doesn't sit well with me after Empking's flip.

Also, she said Ythan was obvtown and then makes a standalone post saying she will look at Ythan again. Clearly one is ungenuine, but I can't tell which one.

Plus, she hasn't really tried to scumhunt this game. She made a few posts, but they were far and few between the one liners.

[Oversoul]

Seems I forgot Spyrex in that list. Initially I had him and Ythan as a possible scum buddy team due to their friendliness and tag teaming on the Ethos wagon, but Ythan's reaction towards me and a couple of other people made him more town. I put Spyrex as Null-leaning town.

[Oversoul]

1. Spyrex isn't on your list... >.>

2. I don't find Sapo's being willing to relook at Ythan scummy in and of itself. People have a right to change opinions, or be willing to double check if something seems off.

PREDIT'd.

Then she was throwing towniness around as if it was water with the obv town remark. I wouldn't care if she had said I think Ythan is town and then reevaluated, but she clearly did not put thought into Ythan or his slot when she put the obvtown and then said she needed to rethink it. That is my main gripe with that set of posts.

[Oversoul]

So you think it would be a town move to hammer the player who has posted once since I replaced in and last posted on monday with one vote on her, despite the fact I have espressed much greater suspicion on MrZepher and the saporo wagon exploded to L-1 in a day or so?

These aggressive mind games you play are too much for me.

Lurkiness is somewhat of a scumtell in that they avoid actually scumhunting and forging things.

[Oversoul]

I don't like Spyrex trying to push people back on the Chair wagon it feels a little bit like a booky.

Also, Amrun's father had a heart attack recently so she said her commitment to MafiaScum would be spotty at best.

[Oversoul]

...Except he's dead.

Awesome.

Fuck the amount of replacements in this game. I don't know who's who when I'm reading back though.

Hiraki, Ethos, Tbone, and Dramonic are all dead town.

Empking is dead scum.

Also, I just realized, why didn't the vig kill Emplong when he claimed? It would have been obvious that Emp lied given his flip the next day and it would have saved either Dramonic or Tbone provided they didn't get a bookie kill.

Lld, a bookie kill happens when at night the bookie chooses a player. Should the chosen player be lynched, scum get an extra shot that night.

Your lack of knowledge about it implies that you are not the bookie and most likely not scum. Then again, you could be playing a gambit.

[Oversoul]

Ebwop: Empking. Auto correct does not like his name.

And it would have saved one of the masons provided scum didn't get a bookie target lynched.

[Oversoul]

@Oversoul: I just got finished reading the OP with the roles. Maybe you should do the same. The vig is a #-shot, just like the bookie. So it would make sense that the vig wouldn't want to waste their kill on a players that would be confirmed scum the next day.

Thanks for the (rude) reminder.

[Oversoul]

Sorry about that~

I've got a massive splitting headache, and I'm a little edgy. :3

It's fine. I shouldn't have been peeved you reminded me. Didn't get much sleep and I just woke up so...


UNVOTE: until LLD develops reads and stuff

[Oversoul]

As for the point about ending the night early, it may bear some weight, but assuming that night ending early = no outstanding actions is in essence an attempt to outguess the mod. He said that the reason would be that he wasn't going to be here, so there's no reason that he wouldn't assume action not received yet = no action.

yes but when the mod says you have 72 hours to submit your night action, theres something very wrong when he arbitrarily cuts that time short before you have submitted your action. i do not believe that reck would do something like this.

@spyrex alright! im down.

unvote, vote: empking

Here's your scum with knowledge of the bookie shot.

@Kanye: The bookie shot was brought up that day as a legitimate concern. Why did you leave your fairly constant vote on Chair to vote this wagon, even with the potential for a bookie?

he was scum. the goal of the game is to lynch scum and there was no way in hell anyone was lynching chair over empking yesterday. yes, i initially resisted due to the threat of a bookie, but the lure of lynching scum was too strong. also you just called me scum for lynching scum, fyi.

Have you not heard of the term Bussing?

[Oversoul]

thats why bussing is most commonly a supplementary read.

Not sure if I like that logic to be honest.

[Oversoul]

Did I already bring up the point about, why didn't the Vig kill Emp the first night?

Chair, for 1 I am scared of another possible bookie shot lying on Kanye's head because as he pointed out he was the next most scummy player to a couple of people D1/D2 and I figure scum would rather go for something easy rather than try and begin a whole fabrication against someone else.

I do not like the "supplemental" bs that Kanye pulled, that is true and I don't like his interactions with Ethos or Hiraki at all D1, but I *really* don't want another bookie double shot.

One little thing that has been bothering me though is his 430, more specifically in response to Idher's scumread on KoC when he stated he would have liked a Hiraki vote AND and KoC vote. Unless he didn't mean voting them at that point (when he said he wanted to).

After looking at this iso, I am more inclined to vote him.. especially as LLD turned Sapo's slot into a less suspicious one. :\ Tbh I wish I could have died N1 instead of Ethos, I'm not much help.

[Oversoul]

Did I already bring up the point about, why didn't the Vig kill Emp the first night?

Chair, for 1 I am scared of another possible bookie shot lying on Kanye's head because as he pointed out he was the next most scummy player to a couple of people D1/D2 and I figure scum would rather go for something easy rather than try and begin a whole fabrication against someone else.

I do not like the "supplemental" bs that Kanye pulled, that is true and I don't like his interactions with Ethos or Hiraki at all D1, but I *really* don't want another bookie double shot.

One little thing that has been bothering me though is his 430, more specifically in response to Idher's scumread on KoC when he stated he would have liked a Hiraki vote AND and KoC vote. Unless he didn't mean voting them at that point (when he said he wanted to).

After looking at this iso, I am more inclined to vote him.. especially as LLD turned Sapo's slot into a less suspicious one. :\ Tbh I wish I could have died N1 instead of Ethos, I'm not much help.

empking wasnt vigged night 1 because there is nothing in the op that says there cant be two vigs. its extremely unlikely, but if i were the vig i would have held my shot night 1 as well.

re: my 430 please elaborate because i am really not sure what you are referring to.

You just reminded me. I already brought it up and LLD calmed my suspicions about that. I need a better memory.

In the beginning of the thread you said oh Hiraki stop being scum. You then made a passing comment about, oh if only I had a second vote it would go right on KoC.

I just find it odd that you need clarification on a scumread you already had...

[Oversoul]

Oversoul is, now and forever, either a mafia genius or town.

If it were me I'd be using the bookie hard and fast. Go down swinging, as it were.

Call it a bookied target or call it scum or what have you but this many wagons does not bespeak towns every which way.

Sadly I am too stupid to understand this complement (insult? probably. ) So no, I am not a mafia genius. Just (dumbass) town.

[Oversoul]

ebwop: Compliment

[Oversoul]

Or to make it make more sense:

My title? That came from me being sooo illiterate in a game that I misread my role in such a fashion that through my being silly I could ONLY be town.

It was beautiful.

Heh. That's funny. But I did check and I am town. Would it have made my play better if I was scum?

[Oversoul]

I'm not voting Chair because Chair isn't scum.

Why is that weird?

Hmmm.... I need to ISO Kunkstar now.

You won't find anything really. :/

I am also not going to vote chair as I don't agree with the cases that are against him.

[Oversoul]

I guess the vig and bookie were one shots. :/

VOTE: kkb may ethos have been right.

[Oversoul]

I guess the vig and bookie were one shots. :/

VOTE: kkb may ethos have been right.

-twitch-

I need to reread something...

If you are thinking I am scum you are sorely mistaken.

[Oversoul]

EBWOP:

Followed by a weak vote, using a dead confirmed town player as a justification.

I smell a bus.

Clearly Ethos was a dangerous player to scum as he wa killed night 1. If you are looking for discrepancies in my playstyle and attitude, you will find them. I am curious as to what the other players who have seen me as town think of your hunch.

[Oversoul]

EBWOP:

Followed by a weak vote, using a dead confirmed town player as a justification.

I smell a bus.

Clearly Ethos was a dangerous player to scum as he wa killed night 1. If you are looking for discrepancies in my playstyle and attitude, you will find them.

I am curious as to what the other players who have seen me as town think of your hunch.

So your way to save yourself is to Appeal to Authority?

UNVOTE: VOTE: Oversoul

Your complex mechanics of scum tells are lost on me. You are either scum or too lazy to read the thread to see that I am town in most of the players' eyes. That is why I made the comment. And my reasoning for my suspicions of Kanye in the beginning were because Ethos suspected him. After Ethos stated I was newb Townie and got into an argument with Ythan about my towniness he was basically golden in my eyes so I sheeped his opinion on Kanye. With Chair's flip I also think that Kanye would be scum evause he tried so hard to get Chair lynched.

[Oversoul]

UNVOTE:

VOTE: ludi

Because of my interactions with Ythan and his arguments between Ethos and Yosarian. That is why I feel Ludi is more scummy than Mastin.

[Oversoul]

Amrun has been suspicious of KoC for a while and she also has repeatedly claimed me as obvtown. MrZephyr I don't understand and neither do I for get KKB read.

I have more town reads on Mastin/Ythan than I do of KoC/Ludi that is why I feel Ludi deserves my vote. He is more scummy than Mastin.

[Oversoul]

Ebwop: For her

[Oversoul]

Was he super-townie or something? I didn't really read much of day one.

He was pretty townie. Most of the early part of D1 was Ethos vs Ythan + Spyrex over a post I made and Parabollock's actions.

You aren't helping your case by not reading arguably the most important day of the game.

[Oversoul]

We are a vig. I did not want to claim and don't think it has served any purpose. To spite you all, I won't tell you how many shots I have.

We didn't shoot n1 because we wanted to make sure emp was lying. N2, we really thought Hiraki was a traitor.

My suspects better watch their backs.

Can't remember if kunkstar claimed.

Popcorn: kunkstar

If he has claimed, then Oversoul is all that's left I think.


KANYE KNOWSBEST WHY THE FUCK ARENT YOU VOTING

YOU TOO WHOMEVER ELSE ISNT VOTING

-Amrun

He claimed treestump. And you are always a damn vig, Amrun.

I am a vt as I claimed Day 1.

[Oversoul]

My reads so far

Idher: Town
Kunkstar: Town
Mastin2: Town
MrZepher: Null
Magister Ludi: Scum
LLD: scum
KKB: null

[Oversoul]

My reads so far

Idher: Town
Kunkstar: Town
Mastin2: Town
MrZepher: Null
Magister Ludi: Scum
LLD: scum
KKB: null

Scum Reads: The person voting you and the person being strung up right now.

Also conincidentally the two largest wagons ATM.

Further, you forgot SpyreX on your list. AGAIN.

This is why you're a scum read.

And Spyrex I have as null, but I could see him flip scum especially with his Ythan buddying.

[Oversoul]

I feel fairly strongly that mastin is scum, though I actually feel stronger that MrZepher is scum.

Its been kind of hard to calibrate my read regarding that spot {Mastin} because she has been pretty incendiary and illogical towards me, so i've had trouble figuring out his alignment in my usual sense.

You're letting your emotions cloud your judgement...

I think he is following a certain wiki guide that ABR posted, but I don't know.

And why would he do that, though? He's been around awhile anyway. :s

[Oversoul]

Ludi, I voted you for 1386, 1388, and 1391 combine that with KoC's diehard trying to get Parabollocks killed and then joining the Untrod Wagon from out of nowhere after suspecting Idher and Para...

You're using AtE a lot with your dealings with Mastin and it is pretty distracting. Also, you're wasting your time trying to scumhunt me, which is another reason why I suspect you, but more so LLD for that same offence.

After looking at Saporo/LLD I am more inclined to vote her. Ludi, your replace in confidence that Zepher is scum has been eclipsed by Mastin pushing for your lynch and then his lynch. Do you find him that much more scummy?

UNVOTE:

[Oversoul]

Actually... Oversoul was just on the Zepher wagon right?

...

Unvote; Vote: Ludi

What wagon am I on? if anything, I would be returning to my original voting place for the day.

Reasoning why you chose Ludi over Mastin?

[Oversoul]

Ludi is L-1. Debating whether or not I want to hammer... *sigh* I hate making decisions like this. :\

I feel like LLD is scum given Saporo's play and her (LLD's) bad introduction into this game. But I also feel Ludi is scum. :\

[Oversoul]

ludi is def L-1. mastin, thoughts on lynch lambda vig ludi?

I think I would prefer this to be honest.

[Oversoul]

ludi is def L-1. mastin, thoughts on lynch lambda vig ludi?

I think I would prefer this to be honest.

You'd rather lynch outside the 1v1?

I'd rather have your alignment immediately. if Idher kills Ludi it would be the same for Mastin's plan regardless. IMO, LLD has more connections that can be examined after her flip than Ludi. Ludi has... Mastin and Zepher. And Idher.

[Oversoul]

Rather have LLD's flip now and then vig ludi. It accomplishes the same thing and then some.

[Oversoul]

oversoul - he

believed

i was scum as hard as he could after the chair lynch until some point today. it (unfortunately) showed in his reactions to me elsewhere but thats.. well.

hes still town despite his terrible decisions since i voted lambda.

Why is everything I do bad... and you guys never tell me so I can get better.

[Oversoul]

I guess the same could be asked of you.

I already did, still, why wouldn't you answer the question especially when you are on the verge of a lynch? It could only hlep you.

Um, yes? Why are you following mastins plan now when you voted oversoul all day?

Because she is scum. She joined the wagon thinking it would put you at L-1, but I had unvoted at that time.

Also, why don't you think LLD is scummy?

[Oversoul]

Why would I answer the question about why I prefer mastin over Ludi {me}? Well, I know my alignment is town, so I would prefer obviously mastins lynch over mine, especially since I think she is mafia. I think you may have meant another question.

I don't think LLD is scum because of the wagon yesterday, her actions, and some other things she is done.

Because Oversoul's actions after Kanye's LLD vote confirmed you as scum to me.

Erm, what?

She thinks you and I are a scum team.

[Oversoul]

That pretty much makes no sense. oversoul would not hop on me when mastin had mrzephers vote on him and had self voted, with oversouls vote as well Mastin would have been at L-2, and I would have placed Mastin at L-1 with no way to unselfvote without being incredibly scummy for it.

She's grasping at straws. She is scum. Now you see why I want her lynched and you vigged and not the reverse?

[Oversoul]

That pretty much makes no sense. oversoul would not hop on me when mastin had mrzephers vote on him and had self voted, with oversouls vote as well Mastin would have been at L-2, and I would have placed Mastin at L-1 with no way to unselfvote without being incredibly scummy for it.

The fact that he UNVOTED you when a NEW WAGON came up means what?

Oversoul, that's bullshit. You're trying to say that me calling you and ML scum together... makes me scum?

You unvoted prior to that, so that can't be your reasoning. Insert another coin and try again.

Because I felt that there is a possiblity that ML could be town and I still don't like your slot.

[Oversoul]

That pretty much makes no sense. oversoul would not hop on me when mastin had mrzephers vote on him and had self voted, with oversouls vote as well Mastin would have been at L-2, and I would have placed Mastin at L-1 with no way to unselfvote without being incredibly scummy for it.

The fact that he UNVOTED you when a NEW WAGON came up means what?

Oversoul, that's bullshit. You're trying to say that me calling you and ML scum together... makes me scum?

You unvoted prior to that, so that can't be your reasoning. Insert another coin and try again.

Because I felt that there is a possiblity that ML could be town and I still don't like your slot.

That's BULLSHIT.

THIS IS SCUM. SCUM.

Why? I could have hammered Ldi for the past hour. I have a sneaking suspicion that he might be town.

[Oversoul]

You presented a perfect reason as to why you should vote her.

[Oversoul]

Oh you guys are GREAT at this game.

Have fun getting endgamed by the scum everyone!

Not helping yourself with this post.

And you people have finally seen the light? Thank god.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: LLD

[Oversoul]

Oh you guys are GREAT at this game.

Have fun getting endgamed by the scum everyone!

Not helping yourself with this post.

And you people have finally seen the light? Thank god.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: LLD

Look at that scummy ass hammer.

Just give up already, you're dead. God.

[Oversoul]

Yep~! And I'm town.

What part of that don't you get?

Not until Reckoner says so.

Other than me and Ludi, who do you think is scum?

[Oversoul]

Forgive me if I forgot. No reason to be bitter now and stubborn.

[Oversoul]

Sprex hoping onto Ythan an Ethos bullshitting makes me think Mastin's slot is town.

And y'all can thank me later for LLD.

I was always suspicious of Spyrex.
VOTE: Ludi

Partial v/la so I won't be adding much content.

[Oversoul]

I am pretty sure it is Zepher.

[Oversoul]

(For the curious, the only part I modified is where you see "Oversoul and MrZepher", I had "*survivor's names here*".)

Oh, and just for the record--I went into last night heavily leaning towards kayne/oversoul being the nightkill, and whoever lived among them to be more likely than Zepher to be the last scum.

Did you seriously just imply that I wad scum?

[Oversoul]

I think Ludi was on to something. Zepher is most likely the last scum a d I have had a town read on your slot for a while. Who convinced Kunk to stump?

[Oversoul]

Sorry Ludi. I really thought everyone was right about your slot.

[Oversoul]

The key to winning this game is LLD. The scum didn't know her alignment, and she played with an arrogance, like Spyrex, that she wouldn't get caught. Her reads Are were discussion should start in my opinion.

[Oversoul]

Kunk, the scum at that point would just follow your plan and there wouldn't be any suspicion on them.

I think that Zepher is scum. One little tidbit that I think supports ZePher scum is Spyrex's "I would he surprise if scum" list. Combine that with his stupid reasoning for suspicion on me and LLD's nonexistent comments on him.

[Oversoul]

I do agree with it. However, Mastin's play toDay had been... Weird as fuck. His posts so far feel totally insincere.

[Oversoul]

Mastin's slot has been the most antitown by far... It doesn't make sense for Mastin to not be scum. He outted the masons and got you to stump early, which due to my stupidity for not checking, prematurely lynched Ludi. He has an air of defeatist around him and his play is noticeably different from the previous days. The only good thing about today is that Zepher already set foot down the path of trying to convince everyone that I am scum and it would look plenty scummy if he were to retract his opinion on me and my slot.

Also, let it be known that this is my first LyLo scenario so....

[Oversoul]

Um, wrong. My stumping reset the votes, so it required everyone to revote, which nullifies that point. Also, you can't reasonably call out both Zepher AND Mastin (unless I'm misunderstanding your Zepher comments).

What do you think about Empking's, Spyrex's, and reads on Mastin? Recap: Empking and Spyrex had Mastin pegged as obvtown, while LLD did not.

Ya. That part doesn't sit well with me either. I am inclined to believe Spyrex/Empking that Mastin is town especially that it was Ythan they were pegging as town. Ythan doesn't seem like a player you want suspicious of you. Then again, the same goes for Mastin. :/ this game had a couple of heavy hitters in my opinion. Anyway, Spyrex had literally all town on his "surprised if scum" list. The list included himself and Ythan. I can see adding himself, who wouldn't, and it be weird to have a random scum player (Ythan) on that list. Personally, LLD was probably pushing a mislynch on both Ludi as Mastin with having that slot as her number 1 scum pick. Remember, she made it before you stumped, and before both she and Spyrex were owned. It would be weird if she had both scum (Spyrex was not on her list, and Zepher) at such low levels, but that would probably be so that the scum don't accidentally hit her during the night. I am curious to see how Mastin's VCA goes, And I don't think they would be much help given the traitor role. But I am interested nonetheless.

[Oversoul]

Um, wrong. My stumping reset the votes, so it required everyone to revote, which nullifies that point. Also, you can't reasonably call out both Zepher AND Mastin (unless I'm misunderstanding your Zepher comments).

What do you think about Empking's, Spyrex's, and reads on Mastin? Recap: Empking and Spyrex had Mastin pegged as obvtown, while LLD did not.

Ya. That part doesn't sit well with me either. I am inclined to believe Spyrex/Empking that Mastin is town especially that it was Ythan they were pegging as town. Ythan doesn't seem like a player you want suspicious of you. Then again, the same goes for Mastin. :/ this game had a couple of heavy hitters in my opinion. Anyway, Spyrex had literally all town on his "surprised if scum" list. The list included himself and Ythan. I can see adding himself, who wouldn't, and it be weird to have a random scum player (Ythan) on that list. Personally, LLD was probably pushing a mislynch on both Ludi as Mastin with having that slot as her number 1 scum pick. Remember, she made it before you stumped, and before both she and Spyrex were owned. It would be weird if she had both scum (Spyrex was not on her list, and Zepher) at such low levels, but that would probably be so that the scum don't accidentally hit her during the night. I am curious to see how Mastin's VCA goes, And I don't think they would be much help given the traitor role. But I am interested nonetheless.

[Oversoul]

Ugh. Can you delete the second Post, Reckoner?

[Oversoul]

Those were general musings/stream of consciousness. My gut says that Mastin is scum and certain actions the (masonry outage and such), but the way the other scum have treated him makes me doubt that.

Did any of the conf scum say Mastin vs Ethos/Para was town v town?

[Oversoul]

What. The. Fuck. Mastin.

Not helping my damn read on you. >_>

[Oversoul]

If anyone was conf scum and said their interaction was TvT. That in addition to Spyrex's list basically confirms that Mastin is town.

[Oversoul]

So are we going to go with Kunk's plan or what?

[Oversoul]

/confirm!

It was swag's enthusiasm when confirming which made me think he was town. Everyone previously before him did boring "/confirm"; he added an exclamation mark.

This is re-inforced by SpyreX also doing a boring /confirm. Mask slightly dilutes this theory by having flipped scum.

Hey, Swag.

You've been browsing this forum for a while now. How's it going?

-Ether

This is a point against Swag, though.

/confirm

Sorry for the late reply, guys.

Also a safe confirm, with an (unnecessary?) apology for coming in late. This is actually quite a strong point against Oversoul, when you think about it--need to justify being late.

/confirm

Late to the party as usual.

However Quill doing the exact same thing suggests the opposite, that Quillford and Oversoul are not scum, because why would he move an identical move to his scumbuddy, the post below his scumbuddy?

:C Don't make fun.

Kinda gives me a scum tone, though I don't know why.

w00t! I started that Idher wagon.

One of Oversoul's main town-tells; why take credit for a wagon he'd inevitably get flak for if it went through?

Must get rid of all the hydras.

This, however, lessens that, in that it seems like an excuse more than anything else.

I think Oversoul is town too but how do you discern Swag is town?

This.

This has to be one of the most important posts in the entire game. But I'm too tired to tell whether it's Quillford confirming Oversoul as town and weakly bussing Swag/Zepher, or whether it's Quillford trying to make Oversoul look town while casting suspicion on Swag/Zepher.

Mastin, I am going to have to disagree with a few things. First, punctuation does not determine whether or not someone is scum and I am quite honestly surprised that /confirm! Would be a town tell for you.

I didn't give a justification for being late, I simply said I was sorry for being late. As my first game of mafia, I wanted it to be special.

Also, why are you counting Empking to be on his own wagon? I don't understand how that is bad or conducive to your theory about all scum being on one wagon.


Also, I agree with your last point. Quilford's post looks like a weak attempt at budding or perhaps trying to put pressure on Swag so that he would actually be active. Did Swag ever answer for his lurkiness? Also, given the role that is left is Bookie it would make sense for the player to want to blend in with the crowd and avoid suspicion of himself seeing as Bookie is a pretty powerful role.

Kunk, do you have any other opinions or do you just want me lynched?

[Oversoul]

Then it is Zepher. Good game scum.

[Oversoul]

Mastin's little schtick/ false alarm confirms Zepher as scum.

I am voting Zepher when I get to my computer. Any objections speak up now. I'll be back home in an hour or two.

[Oversoul]

*sigh*

One and a half days left, I've gone from being the scummiest player alive to confirmed town, if I hammer wrong then my reputation's ruined forever, I'm more unsure of myself than I've ever been before, Kunk is not being nearly as helpful as I was hoping he'd be, I'm essentially on my own, with no way out of this situation, I'm being distracted constantly...

...What could

possibly

go wrong?

Mastin, this is how it is gonna work. YOU win.

I am voting Zepher because after your post that caused Reck to get all flustered, the way other scum members treated you, your horrible play getting so many people killed (being the bookie that would be the most retarded thing to do) I am 95% sure that you are town.

If you are town and you vote Zepher with me, YOU will win.
If you are scum and you vote Zepher with me, YOU will win. Either way, YOU will win Mastin.


On the off chance that you ARE scum, well, good game. If your last few posts were a gambit, then fuck you to both you AND Reck. One to you because that would be some sneaky ass way to win as mafia, and one to Reck for allowing your slot to live.

Zepher has been pretty lurky, Spyrex's list, LLD's list, and the Yos wagon all point to Zepher being the final scum.

Mastin, you already had the chance to hammer ME. If you were scum, you would have taken that chance. You didn't. You are not scum because of that (if you are, that is annoying because the game could have ended a while ago and you would just be prolonging this game for the lulz, which is a dick move).

Zepher, your major fault was trying to convince Mastin of my scumminess. Had you gone for Mastin, who I was intially going to vote for Ludi's death, you probably would have won.

VOTE: MrZepher

Zepher IS the last scum.

[Oversoul]

I am going to make a wall analyzing all, yes, all of Zepher's posts.

Mastin, a coin flip is at this point very bad. Why leave it up to a 50% chance you will land on Zepher and win when you have. 100% chance if you vote Zepher anyway?

The fact that Zepher only addressed 2 points out of my most recent posts proves he has nothing to defend himself. Instead, he is trying to plant doubt into your mind by casting a shadow of suspicion over me.

My plea to Mastin was not a ploy, and Reck getting the roles mixed up is a lot different from this, Zepher. That was Reck's fault. He false alarm was Mastin's fault (I am assuming).

Either way, it helped

me

find the last scum as Mastin would have no reason to say what he said as scum.

Zepher, how did I propose a wincon for scum? Mastin is town and I only addressed Mastin in that post. Are you saying you think Mastin is scum now? and that part of your post doesn't make sense. Also, you have a habit of misrepping things.

It was never just you or me. It was always you, Mastin, or I. For me personally, it was always you or Mastin. Now, it is just you. You are not defending yourself or looking for scum because there are no more scum to bus or look for. It is just you left on the scum team.

I am doing this on my phone, but I will make the huge Zepher wall post when I get back to my computer.

[Oversoul]

About 1/10 of the way through with Zepher's iso. Heading out for Birthday shopping. I will recommence when I get back.

[Oversoul]

The Why Zepher Is Scum Post
by: Oversoul


I am going to analyze all of Zepher's post. Yes, I said all of them. I am also going to include the last 2 posts by Swag before he was force replaced as I feel they are pretty important too.

Shall we begin?

Could you give your reasons?

both me and hiraki.

Well Hiraki I was kind of following Idher, but I realize he isn't scum, and do you really need an explanation?

Swag admits to sheeping a now confirmed town player. No other reasons for his suspicions other than following a town player and then trying to use rhetoric to explain his suspicion of Parabollocks. Parabollocks for a while was the biggest wagon and Swag seems perfectly content with edging that wagon on. In fact, in his next post, he goes beyond the uselessness of this post and votes Para!

Para, you've made a lot of unbiased posts, and not very smart moves. You're trying to cover yourself up too hard. Obvious scum is obvious. VOTE: Parabollocks

Um, what? Para was flailing town and was actively trying to scumhunt. Swag is trying to make out that his wagon was more than flailing town and implies that he is scum trying to cover himself. Very little reasoning, and he never explains what reasoning he did give. This post is clearly bandwagoning on the biggest wagon at the time.

Now onto Zepher!



First things first. When you have less posts than the moderator... you're doing something wrong. His post count ALONE shows that Zepher is an active lurker and his posts along with my analysis will bolster this claim.

Hey guys, sorry I've been at a camp all day.

I've been busy all week so I'm going to speed read through this ASAP to make sure I have everything down.
I'll post content as soon as I do that

His replace in post. Nothing wrong with this, after all, he has a busy life and just replaced into a game.

JK. I'll have to post tomorrow.

I'm fucking exhausted and can't retain the information I feel I should be retaining.
I think I have a couple of reads but they're strange and either I don't want to attempt to explain them half-mindedy and risk misrepresenting my own opinions,
Or posting and then realizing that I wasn't seeing anything of what I was seeing.
(I see mastin is in this game (OH HAY), he should understand the importance of being coherent while attempting to post more than anybody else I know)


tl;dr: I'm going to bed. I'll post tomorrow. Chao.

First failed commitment.

He goes on to explain why he has not provided us with any comments stating that he is exhausted from his day and doesn't feel like he is reading this game correctly. Fine, I can understand that. However, blatantly withholding his reads because he feels like he will get flack for them is overly cautious. Townies can reason with a whole lot more leeway. Zepher is acting like he doesn't have this leeway. I wonder why?

Then he goes and buddies up to Mastin. Potential plan from the beginning? Perhaps.

unvote

didn't realize I was voting

Sorry guys, just woke up.
get on it now.

I HAS ALL THE BEING BEHIND IN EVERYTHING RIGHT NOW.

What the hell is this supposed to mean. More fluff that doesn't contribute anything other than the fact that he may not like his predecessor's vote. 3rd post promising content and none has been supplied so far.

I'll save my reads for tomorrow since it's almost deadline.

Some points still relevant to today:

Interesting vig claim,
I'm excited to see mastin, but it's unfortunate that he's replacing a slot that I have no reason to believe is town.
Idher's play is interesting in a bad way

Hiraki and KKC are okay
Swag is not a good vig

Actually upon further (ISO) analysis I'm going to change that to Hiraki needs to be the vig
KKC would make me sad in the pants because I would have to work to get Hiraki the rope tomorrow.

Also, I'm okay with an Untrod lynch.
The flip will help my reads, plus he hasn't said much of anything useful in terms of playing like town.

Vote: Untrod Tripod

Save your reads so you can see who is dead or alive tomorrow? Gotcha. You have promised content and this is not content. This is a summary of minor points in the game and you holding back your reads because it is so close to deadline screams, I want to see who will be or alive tomorrow so I can adjust my reads accordingly.

His opinion on Empking's claim? Interesting. That is it. It is merely interesting. He goes on to say that Idher's play is interesting in a bad way, yet he doesn't explain why either are

interesting

. Scum faking content when he realized he needed to post something? Definitely.

Hiraki and KKC are okay. Okay. Okay, for what? For a vig shot, they are okay as in townie? And of course you wouldn't want Swag to get vigged, but you give no other reason other than saying it isn't a good vig shot.

Then he goes with stream of consciousness and deliberately changes his opinion on Hiraki (he will do the same for me and KoC in the future btw when we are both "townier than null"). He gives no reasons as to why Hiraki would be a good vig shot other than after looking at his iso, he thinks Hiraki is a good shot.

He makes a childish comment saying that if KKC (pretty sure this is KKB) will be a bad vig shot because he will then have to work to get Hiraki lynched. Oh, he will actually have to do something for the first time in this game. GREAT!

He is okay with an Untrod lynch. For what reason? He never explains ANYTHING and he says the reason that Untrod is a good lynch is the fact that it will help his reads. Newsflash buddy, what fucking reads will it help? How are we supposed to know what it will help and what it won't help? Zepher at this point, is bullshit and is only getting scummier by the minute.

Zepher: Why are you saving your reads? What possible benefit is there for that?

Because we won't get anywhere right now if I post them and we decide to go with them (not saying that we will, I don't feel like we have the discussion time to deal with them right now). I'm not even that entirely confident with them, this game is so weird.
I'd rather be in a position where I'm more confident in my reads, and we have a flip to help me with that before I put them up.

It saves from distraction where there would be no use for me to put them up now.
It'd be wasted effort on my end since my reads WILL change over the course of the night phase anyways.

They will change over the course of the night? OF COURSE they will. That is no reason to be scared and cautious about not posting your reads. You give a half assed answer to not posting your reads stating the obvious (they will change) and acting really paranoid. Reads are going to change. It is a fact of the game. Why be so scared about it? You just want help from your scum buddies in the QT seeing as you are the most important member of their team, the Bookie.

Null leaning town (actually a little more than leaning). Why?

I mean, he's playing strange, but it's consistent weirdness that I'm blaming on his posting style.
He's playing town enough for me to pass him off for today's lynch, at least until he says something I can't ignore and I double that's going to happen within the next....
20 hours?

PREDIT:
UGH. Fine. Making me waste my time...

Spoiler: Watch List

Main watch list
Dramonic - Null leaning scum
Mastin2 - Probably Scum (Ythan vs Ethos conflict)
KKB - Scum (Is null, but gut makes it lean scum.)
Idher - Null leaning scum (gut read mostly, I find some of their posts strange, but I can't be fucked to find them as of this post)
Hiraki - Scum (Hasn't said anything usefull)
Ethos - Probably town (Ythan vs Ethos conflict)
Empking(as of the vig claim)- Null, leaning somewhere (as of vig claim, WAS just null).


Secondary watch list
Untrod - Scum
KoC - Already listed
Yosarian2 - Null leaning scum, may change
T-Bone - Null

Passing Glance
Sapo - Null leaning town
Spyrex - Town
Chair - Town
Oversoul - Null, newb town
Kunkstar - Null

The watch list goes as thus
Main list: People who that I'm closely watching everything they do/say.
Secondary list: People who I'm paying attention to, but more in terms of how the interact with others
Passing: People who I'm not paying much attention to because they've played town enough; this can change at any point

Also this is a new system for me; I know it's flawed, It's just a system of organization so if it bothers you for whatever reason, take it with a grain of salt.

THe first part of this post is in reference to KoC in a question that Ethos asked. He also makes a prediction that KoC will indubitably make a comment that he cannot ignore and will change Zepher's opinion on KoC. Why are you setting things up so early, Zepher? He doesn't give any real reason for his opinion on Zepher other than his posting style... stop providing no content.

Oh, you did, but you did it begrudgingly. And you actually had to work! WOW!

Notice his little warning after his reads, clearly a message to say that he is not liable for any misgivings. Planning, overcautious, fake, take your pick this post is it.

He has Untrod as scum in this read without any other indication that he thought Untrod was scum other than that his flip will help his reads and that he agreed with an Untrod lynch. Wagon hopper much? Also, perhaps the most damning aspect of his post is the fact that he listed all three masons as a different read. THIS CLEARLY SHOWS THAT ZEPHER IS NOT ACTIVELY READING THE THREAD AND IS JUST MAKING SHIT UP.

Also note how all of his reads at this stage of the game are the opposite for where we are now. The reasoning for most of his null/scum reads? Gut. Great reason. Just gut. My favorite read? The null leaning somewhere read on Empking. What is that supposed to say to us? We cannot read your mind and the vig claim should have at least put Empking at null leaning town. Wait, let me guess, you want to wait until tomorrow to see how your reads will change?

Also interesting is that he has Spyrex as town. Now, I wouldn't mind this as Spyrex was kinda towny at this point, but for his position in the whole Ythan vs Ethos conflict, it would make Spyrex scum (he has Mastin/Ythan as scum because of that conflict and Ethos as town). Interesting... oh wait. I am turning into him.

I only caught one of the Mason claims (T-Bone), so I wasn't sure who all was claiming.
Thanks for clearing that up though.

(I did read the thread, but I was doing this weird half/skim thing once my reads started kind of settling)

Besides, Masons are a POSSIBLE role. Obviously I'm still going to be paying attention to what you guys are posting until one of you flips. Duh.

Um, no? You admit to not reading the thread. You don't care about this game and your posts reflect it. You are putting little to no effort into this game at this point and you just expect us to know that. Give me a freaking break. Why don't you have Empking as more than just null leaning somewhere since Vig is a POSSIBLE role? You really think that the whole scum would have made a gambit to out themselves as a 3 person mason group?

That was a mistake on my part missing that, and I'll have that figured out shortly.

T-bone was null because I didn't know who he was masons with, so I wasn't sure how to take it.

Backpedaling after his mistake. Nice. Ya, I don't know what to make of a mason claim either other than... oh wait, with the way they have been playing they are probably town.

I trust the mason claim, at least until I have justified reason to believe otherwise.
I feel like Dram could actually contribute though.

Oh, you trust the mason claim now? Okay. After you had botched reads that someone pointed out to you? Really nice backpedal. Your comment about Dram? Well, it involves a little story about this pot and a kettle. Maybe for another day.

ho shi---

I seemed to have forgotten about the existence of this game over the course of this night phase...
That being said, I feel like I can give Emp BoD in not submitting the kill.

As per my negligence to do so prior to the day I'll have to reread during my

V/LA: This weekend from Friday to Monday

catch the discounts while they're hot zzzzzz

Yet another promise to reread this game (which you obviously have NOT been doing) and a grand ass distancing attempt.

Scummy thing number 1), trusting Empking to not submit the kill, yet not trusting the Mason group for claiming? YA WTF IS THAT
Scummy thing number 2), what need was there to say you forgot about this game other than distancing. Scum only have one role that actually does something during the night and that is the Bookie role. You are (now clearly) distancing yourself from the role of Bookie itself so early in the game.

Yay more inactivity from Zepher! yay!!

Just checking, thanks.

I mean it's not like we have a list of the role PMs that went out or anything...

Oh wait.

This is your first post after you promised to reread on a 5 day Vacation. Massively underwhelming don't you think? Aside from the snarkey attitude, this post does nothing and looks like an attempt to actually contribute.

that's a little less than 5.5:1 scum to town, how is that LYLO?
Silly goose.

I find Yos' slip damning, and Idher's potential chainsaw damning.
Sorry I've been gone. Fun weekend; totally worth it.

I'm almost too lazy to look for questions directed at me. Rereading shortly.

You find those things damning, yet give no reason as to why they are damning? Cool. You are just looking to jump onto the Para wagon that your predecessor had hoped would succeed. You also are trying to plant the seed of doubt into everyone's mind about Idher, which for the most part was a very towny person.

You are "almost" too lazy? Ok. And why are you rereading now when you promised to do so over your V/LA?

Entering theory world

This isn't really related to Zepher perse, just me thinking about something Mastin said.

Mastin, you said that Swag's eagerness to start the game with his "/confirm!" post says that he is towny. With the only role that is left, Bookie, I can see why he would be eager to start this game. He gives no indication that he is eager to play this particular flavor, because, there isn't any flavor. And he doesn't give any particular reason to play this game because of the playerlist. Unless you think he was very happy to be a vanilla towny like Zepher has claimed, I am doubting the eagerness is because he was actually eager. It had to be about his role.

Weird how the very first thing I see when I check in is a vote on me, interesting.

I said POTENTIAL chainsaw, meaning it only means something to me if/when Yos flips scum.
I "avoided" the Empking wagon while I was around because it seemed silly to lynch somebody who obviously (at this point) had a bookie on them.
I'm currently re-reading because I honestly have barely any idea of wtf is going on, and I'm disinclined to start making arguments without educating myself on the happenings of the game.

I'm going to have to fight an uphill battle trying to convince all of you I'm town purely because of Swag's terribad play, and I already realize that my continued absence during the game doesn't help at all.

Also, I don't feel at that Idher is obv town at all, so it's weird that you say that.
I'm at work right now, and can continue my re-read later, so if you don't mind...

Again with that interesting bullshit. God. I don't understand his point about the potential chainsaw as I don't know the specifics to a chainsaw gambit. If anyone could clarify that for me, it would be greatly appreciated.

Why would you put avoid in quotation marks? You didn't "avoid" you avoided. Cognitive Disonance? Also, he contributes nothing new here as the possibility of Empking being Bookied was brought up before anyway. He gives us another promise to reread. Zepher how many times have you reread this damn game? I am going to assume a lot with how many times you say you will reread, but your posts are massively disappointing with how many times you have supposedly reread this game.

You are damn right you are going to have an uphill battle. This is the first time you address Swag and you again state the obvious that his play was bad. We all know that his play was bad. He barely contributed anything and the same could be said for you at this point. You are a spouting regurgitation with all of your reads.

He continues his Idher suspicion but never really clarifies why he feels that Idher is not town and he says it is weird that someone would call someone else obvtown when... I am pretty sure 2 people had done the same for me. Why are they not suspicious/weird for calling me obvtown?

To be fair, it's a gut thing. Idher's posts just seem strange.
A lot of the things in this game seem strange right now; hence why I'm making the effort to read it again.

I thought I had posted about my disinterest in voting Empking. Apparently I didn't.
My defense becomes moot.

Day 1 I didn't exactly want to kill the claimed vig, Idk who would honestly. It's not good form to lynch claimed PR's day 1.
Day 2 I gave him the benefit of the doubt (BoD) in not submitting an action because I've actually done that before, but that was only supposed to be a temporary place for me to sit on the matter. I would have rather tried to find other scum in that instance (despite my signature lol) considering the high likelihood of losing 2 town players.

Also, if you recall when I replaced in, it was close to the end of Day 1 (whether I had a choice in that or not is questionable) scumhunting wasn't exactly an option that close to the deadline; I had to decide whether I thought UT was scum or not; he seemed a better choice at the time than Emp or Yos (and obv no lynch wasn't going to happen, nor was it a viable option)
I went V/LA shortly after Day 2 began, before I could involve myself in any discussion; only being able to check in for 2-3 minutes at a time and having to monitor 2-3 games made it difficult to try to post, so I opted to lurk and try to post when I got back thinking it would still be day 2. It's day 3 obviously and I don't have shit compared to the flips and whatnot, so I need to rework some things.
For once I'm gonna have to bust out the pencil and paper. I'm playing so fantastically this game, if you can't already tell /sarcasm.

Yay. More unsubstantiated reasoning behind Zepher's reads. At least he comes clean that he was basically not paying attention to this game, but it took some goading to get this answer out of him. Scumhunting wasn't an option? Are you kidding? Scumhunting is always an option. It doesn't matter entirely when you are wrong if you are town, but you do seem to care.

He makes a different promise, busting outing the pen and paper, for whatever reason, but so far all of his promises have fallen flat on their faces. Useless fluff post that does nothing for the game other than show that Zepher is digging in and getting defensive.

Stopped at Page 20. Decided I should start writing notes and had to go back to get post numbers and such. Plus I'm a busy guy.
I'M WRITING FUCKING NOTES WTF///

anyways, there's a large wall incoming, hopefully a vote, but I'd rather discuss first since it's like 3 people I could put my vote on at any given time
Wall should be up sometime tomorrow evening/night.
I can't post from work anymore; I actually got in trouble today for that so.....

Excuses, excuses.

Contributes nothing and continues on that trend of wanting and promising to give information, but he hasn't. In this case he can't because, well he is at work and already got in trouble for posting stuff. He makes a bold statement promising a wall that well, is long overdue for the amount of promises and rereads he has done. Again, this post offers literally nothing to the game and each time he posts this I am beginning to think it is a prod dodge.

NOT BEFORE I GET MY WALL UP. FOOL.
I'm not missing out on another day lol.

For the record, I disagree with a chair lynch.

He takes a stance on the Chair lynch saying that his wall is coming. I actually expect him to produce some form of a wall, because well, it would be suicide to say "My wall is coming" and have it never show up. Still little value in this post.

!~//

WALL.

//~!

Scum: Saporovirus, Mastin, Yosarian
Other scum: Kanye, Idher, Kunkstar
Null: Spyrex, Chair
Townier than null: KoC, Oversoul

The following explanations are in ISO format, purely because it was easier to actively form my thoughts that way.
These are the notes that I basically just copy pasted from MS Word and edited a little so they don't look like a mess.
There are real post numbers in the ISO now so I didn't wanna garble up my notes with links and whatnot.

Spoiler:

Saporovirus

(The mask)

• #349 Just comes off as scummy to me. I don’t see very many town implications for just hopping in and voting somebody and not at all commenting on what’s just happened.
• #446 Sapo replaces in.
• #452-455 Fluff? Check. Scum-hunting? Definitely absent.
• #539 seems to be :goodposting:
• #540 on the other hand is not
• #632 Uhm what? I think you forgot to post your reasoning for that vote.

Mastin2

(ythan)

• #148 Twisting Para’s post to make it seem scummier than it really was
• #158 no explanation? Okay.
• Ethos vs Ythan was not TvT. At this point, with Ythan’s approach to that argument and what in my opinion looked like intentional instigating (wrong word but w/e) I’d suffer to say Ythan is on the scum half of the argument.
• #484 (Yosarian) This basically points out one of the reasons why I don’t think Ythan/Ethos’ exchange was TvT; Ythan responds to/defends from this very poorly.
• #581 Ythan making Ethos’ claim look scummy is noted
• #656 This looks bad on Ythan.
• #666 is poor defending
• #667 is OMGUS
• YAY MASTIN REPLACES IN NOW. This re-read became significantly less abrasive.
• I feel like Mastin has been awfully quiet this game, but he’s also been quite V/LA soooo…. /null opinion

Knight of Cydonia

• #350 Wall that I didn’t bother to read. Skim says it agrees with me at least somewhat; end with a Para vote which I can’t argue with currently…

KanyeKnowsBest

• #159 No reason as to why ythan is town? Okay. @Para, if it look like a duck and it sounds like a duck….
• #318 Town boner for Ythan... right; Also it’s not town to try to justify fluff. Who the fuck does that? Oh noes he got mad because he’s early, is he scum because he thought he could suffer through a little more (You totally misrep that whole thing for no reason)
• I agree meta arguments are generally bad.
• #430 :goodposting: town points, but this is one of very few.

Idher

• Comments on the validity of wagons without actually ever giving reasoning; defended parabollocks very early (as soon as the wagon started picking up day 1)
• Pushing really hard on Hiraki scum… what for?
• #153 town points for explaining Hiraki scum
• #449 uhhhhhhh yeah. This doesn’t look good on idher.
• #534 Not explaining any of the statements in this post is noted, especially since Idher is soft defending flipped scum.
• #626 Not sure how to take this post. It was correct, but it can also come from role fishing scum. It’s a null point currently until I figure it out.
• #833 Setup speculation based on mod meta? Hmmmmm, not sure if I feel like this a viable thing to base opinions off of…
• #930 I just realized that I find Idher’s “matter of fact” way of posting to come off as very scummy when it lacks definite explanations.

SpyreX

• Decent points throughout the game for town points; but I disagree with quite a few.
• Took Ythan’s side during the argument; but I can see town doing that as well.
• I can’t tell where he fit into the Ythan v Ethos argument; hence why he sits null.
• #635 Same opinion as Idher’s #626
• #671 suggest that SpyreX could be scum with Ythan/Mastin

Chair

• Chairs just sit there. Can’t put a read on inanimate object.
jk
Chair is surprisingly…. Null…. Not too townie but not scummy… hmmmm
Oversoul
• Null tells all over his ISO that I can’t be bothered to post right now; giving him the benefit of the doubt as his being a noob, but even then hasn’t done anything outstandingly scummy compared to other players
• The “HA I started the Idher wagon” thing is a null tell at best; I don’t understand how people can take it otherwise.

Kunkstar7

• Page 15 and NOTHING from Kunk. Nice.
• #405 uhhhhh…. :safeposting:?
• #481 Seems town to me +town points

Yosarian2

(Parabollocks)

• #74 Parabollocks pull out of RVS by saying Ythan is trying to hard, obviously stretching where it wasn’t necessary
• #81 When that doesn’t go well he blames it on bad reaction fishing, and then changes his vote
• #84 Gives bad reasoning for voting for Oversoul
• #123 Bone calls out para’s actions, para proceeds to have nothing to say.
• #140/#142 fluff
• #344 lists Ythan and Idher as town…. Interesting… Kanye as scum… hmmmmm
• #352 Obvious OMGUS is obvious, immediately followed by terribad defense of said OMGUS, which get called out later.
• Para replaces out. Cool.
•

Ok, so why are you voting me? The guy I replaced was an idiot, but he wasn't scum.

lol. I know this feeling….
• #484 I like this post.
• #920 Hiraki was so obviously NOT town. I have no idea why you’d say that.

Any questions?

He finally posts his wall. :cries: Thank goodness.

Judging from his reads he has literally no correct scum reads except for Sapo. I like how he has both KoC and I as townier than null, yet proceeds to vote both of us in late game with out any valid reasoning. His reasoning for Sapo is annoying. I hate it when people just list the post number and make YOU look for the reason why it is a bad or a good post. That seems counter productive for a town person to do and is definitely harder for people to read the reasoning as to why someone is scummy. A definite sign of his laziness that he publicly admitted when it came to this game.

His reasoning for saying people are scummy and what not is going along with the curve. He calls Ythan out for his accusations against Ethos and Para, but again, all of this has been said before. There are very few original opinions in his reads. I can give him the benefit of the doubt because that usually happens when you are behind with reads as people will point out the same things before you, but his promises are long overdue. All of his explanations for his reads are one liners to things and like I said, they weren't original one liners. Definitely looks like he is trying to coast throughout the game.

Uh, yeah. I have 30 posts in this thread. You picked out a whole 1 in your ISO. Really?

Reeeally?

I read through the game and picked out things that stood out to me.
To be honest I wasn't giving too much attention to you since you were a town read early on.
You haven't said anything particularly scummy and you're making an obvious effort to scumhunt.

Mind telling me what exactly makes my wall "stink of skimming".
And it's at the town's best efforts to try to :goodpost:, it's not my say whether I did or not in my post.

What the fuck. I can't even be fucked to read anymore of Zepher's posting. After getting to endgame with him it is obvious that he is scum. Everyone, I encourage you to read Zepher's iso and see the coasting, lurking, skimming, not scumhunting, etc. ZEPHER'S POST REEK OF IT.

Noted that he has a town read on KoC at this point and that he recognizes KoC is scumhunting. I can't say the same for Zepher at this point.

The question he asks KoC is blatantly fishing for pointers in order to change his wall next time (I don't think he ever posts another wall?).

He gives a vague answer to another post about :goodposting:. What the fuck is that? What makes a post a :goodpost:? You never clarify really or answer that question directly.

Um, he was town. He's dead, we know his alignment. Also, I was saying he was town all game, it was pretty clear from his posting.

I guess that you missed how that was supposed to be a past tense statement. Hiraki had a pretty crappy way of playing town. I think it was an awesome vig shot.
It wouldn't have been beneficial for town to have him in a LYLO situation anyways.

Anyway, it's bizzare that you would do an ISO on me and then not mention all the actual important stuff I did, like how when I replaced in I was at lynch -2, and I defended the other main suspect (Ethos, town), the #3 suspect (Hiraki, town), and instead went after Quilford (scum) who only had one vote on him at a time. You know, the stuff that townies actually look at when they're trying to figure out someone's alignment, like how did they intearact with known scum, how did they react under pressure, did their actions seem to be pro-town or anti-town, ect.

How is your slot being at L-2 supposed to matter to me when I think you're scum? As far as I'm concerned you should have been lynched already.
Defending Ethos could have just as easily been scum defending town to look more town when the person they're defending flips town.
Though I suppose it would look worse had you started defending AFTER Ethos claimed mason. Noted.

It wouldn't be so bad if you looked at all that and then created a case that I was distancing or something, but it seems like you just skimmed through my posts, ignored everything that actually mattered, picked out a few things you could attack me on, and then called me scum.

Finding scum does matter. As far as I'm concerned I have a good chance at having found scum.

The rest of your post is pretty terrible, too. The day 1 scum wagon on Empking that forced him into a bad claim was pushed by Îdher, me, Saporovirus, and kunkstar7, and you just called ALL of us scum, which is just beyond absurd. You didn't even mention the day 1 quilford/ empking wagon in ANY of your ISO analysis. What kind of townie tries to read and analyze the whole game but ignores the sucessfull wagon-to-a-claim made against a scum?

Yeah.... that's a fail on my part. Sorry.

On further analysis:
Kunk- voted Empking only; from what I see he didn't actually push anything. He didn't even post a reason for voting Empking.
Sapo- tried to start a wagon on Empking but didn't even vote until after he claimed. Didn't even originally post a reason with suspecting Empking from what I see.
Idher- Came in asking why Empking wasn't dead yet; didn't say anything until after Emp claimed, and chose to agree with it.
Yos- You only voted Empking as filler until you could attack Ythan's slot again. You originally stated some decent reasoning for your vote on Quilford, then didn't pursue it afterwards.

I see no obvious town tells in this.

I actually agree with Zepher on the Hiraki shot. He does have a weird way of playing. From a game that I was scum with Hiraki, he seemed to be playing the same way and that is why I wanted Hiraki to get shot.

The second quote he asks a dumb question.. If Yosarian truly was scum he would not have risked his life (being at L-2) to defend another popular lynch candidate as it would look scummy. It is funny how you automatically assume that Yos is scum especially given the fact that you only focused on the bad aspects, as Yos said, of Para/Yos.

"Ya, sorry, forgot about that..." Are you kidding me!? How do you forget something like that? You clearly do not have your head in the game because you are not trying to hunt for scum. You are faking your reads and you are lurking. You get mad that Yos had a filler vote and yet you forget something as important as analyzing the people on the Empking wagon? Are you serious? If Yos thought that Hiraki and Ethos were town wouldn't it make sense for him to go against the person who stated that Ethos wasn't town?

You don't see any obvious town tells, but I don't see any scum tells. Now that I have hindsight I can see why those people acted the way they did, but I guess that skews my view right now. :\

lol

Scum: Most scummy
Other scum: Slightly less scummy

Sorry, I felt like I was being clever; I guess I should have clarified better.

Fluff. Again. For the umpteenth time.

I'm alive.
Will post content shortly?

Another distancing attempt trying to look surprised that he is alive. You messed up your punctuation though.

Also, why is you posting content in question and your life not? Cognitive Dissonance.

First things first, I realized during work today that my read on Yos was entirely confirmation bias based on Para's completely anti-town behavior.
I'm reconsidering his read. For now he sits null, and quite frankly makes some things look a lot better.

Ludi apparently doesn't have any reason to think I'm scum so Kanye's willingness to sheep sans the vote seems scummy.
Will be looking into this.

Mastin seems to be playing like town Mastin..... Still debating as to whether or not this is a good thing, but I appreciate that he's able to read me better than anybody else here.

NOW you reconsider Yos's alignment. Okay. He takes all of the I think Zepher is town with joy and accepts that hoping to ride that towniness. What was wrong when I did that when you do it right here, Zepher?

Why are we still arguing about whether or not to lynch empking yesterday which seems to have no value in finding scum today.

MrZepher is scum. Ask if you want cool cat reasons.

The fact that you didn't give your reasoning when you voted and you didn't give reasons after only tells me that you were only stalling so you could try to scrounge up some forlorn case to paint me as scum

.
Right.

At this point I know that you either
1. Don't have a case
2. Don't have a very good case

That really wouldn't bother me if it weren't the fact that you're trying to cook up a wagon under me on top of that.

tl;dr Ludi is scum.

In terms of other things being talked about in recent pages,
I'm okay with a Sapo lynch; Her ISO is filled with fluff, one-liners, and votes without reasoning.
I see no reason to think play like that comes from town.

I'm not sure about the Chair lynch; I may not be understanding the points against him.

Bolded = the little Pot and the little Kettle story.

He is willing to say that Ludi is scum after saying that he thinks KoC is town because Ludi is trying to get a wagon started on him. OMGUS anyone? Come to think of it. You used this reason to paint Yos/Para as scummy because Para used OMGUS. WOW. Did I tell you guys about the Pot and the Kettle yet? No? Well it is right there.

He still holds his distant opinion on a chair lynch, but expresses interest in a lynch if someone can point out valid points against him. He is legitimately going after Sapo and she was legitimately scummy, but I feel like he is going after another scummy towny like he was going after Para/Yos.

....

All those good Zeph feelings? Gone.

I was like... what?

Then I realized it's probably because I'm wary of the Chair wagon.
I'm reading through your little interaction and both of your ISO's.
I was just making it known that apprehensive zephyr is apprehensive.

Spryex coaching Zepher? I think so. Zepher at this point is less useful than Spyrex. No one has really expressed interest for Spyrex in my opinion and Zepher already used his ability on the Empking bookie shot so he is basically a goon now.

Spyrex's interaction with Zepher here could be damning and I think Spyrex was trying to lead people into a Zepher lynch later on with the claim to say "Ha, I knew there was something suspicious about his play!" /tinfoil

Although, in this post it looks like he is going to vote Chair anyway especially after Spyrex called him out. Good guess on why you thought Spyrex was suspicious of you, though.

I mean if this isn't proof enough that he wants me lynched, then IDK what's going to convince you.

It wouldn't seem scummy to me if he didn't keep holding out his reasons to say I'm scum,
I understand that there's a little bit of OMGUS in that, but still, it doesn't change the fact that it's scummy.

I have Sapo listed as scummy for (partially) the same reason, so I don't understand what's so different here Spyrex.

Am I missing something there? Does that solve your qualms?
In the meantime I'll just leave this here.

Vote: Saporovirus

I've already previously stated my reasoning for thinking Sapo is scum.
Also she hasn't posted in forever I don't think...

Finally puts his money where his mouth is with regards to Sapo. He again expresses concern about Ludi being scummy saying that Ludi's tunneling is what makes him scummy. Withholding reasons that you are scummy? No. Using reasons that you don't think paint you as scummy? Yes. Misrep.

More Spyrex interaction trying to get Spyrex off a Chair wagon and onto a legitimiately scummy player's wagon.

Why isn't Mastin's tunneling of Ludi indicative that he is scum, Zepher?

ALSO:

V/LA Till whenever this Sunday is.

Yay....

The fact that you're still a fresh enough young buck that literally going you're voting for me thus scum is, in fact, scummy as all getout.

That fine, I understand that, but not exactly what I'm saying.
I'm saying it's only scummy because he has yet to post any sort of valid reason to have a vote on me.

It's like me putting on a vote on you and saying
"I have my reasons"

Does that not seem at all odd to you?

I definitely think that Spyrex was attempting to bus Zepher here and that is not what happened with regards to Ludi and his votes for you, Zepher.

You don't think his reasons are valid? Oh, they are automatically scummy for posting invalid reasons. Ok. Well, sorry to break it to you, but town are going to post invalid reasons to vote for people all the time. Why this surprises you is beyond me and you are getting defensive again.

1120 is too big and confusing for me to look at with all of the quotes.

Just realized that Ludi is bringing up the same points and since Ludi isn't scum I feel more confident in Zepher scum now.

Your lighthearted bit in that post strikes me as odd, how are we supposed to perceive tone and other indicators of a joking manner? We can't. This is text. It is best to be as straightforward as you can. I am probably going to be hit with the same reasons that Ludi is scum by Zepher, but I feel I have brought up some new points.

Also, you did mention that your predecessor was scummy, but only in passing. You literally made one comment that was 2 lines long among other information and you are using that against Ludi? Forgive him if he forgot since you seem to forget a lot of things as well. Tl;dr for that part of 1120? Pot - Kettle.

Why do you think I tend not to bother making them, anymore?

(I really do hate building walls.)

You just trolled anyone you've ever played in a game with ever.
I lol'd

//obvious fluff

At this point in the game I think fluff should be out of the question yet he is content with posting it as long as he points it out. Definitely a prepared defense of his actions.

1. Spyrex isn't on your list... >.>

2. I don't find Sapo's being willing to relook at Ythan scummy in and of itself. People have a right to change opinions, or be willing to double check if something seems off.

PREDIT'd.

Then why the fuck was there a problem with you and posting your reads when you first came in? Seriously. If you don't find it scummy that people can change their reads or that reads do change, why the fuck didn't you post your reads when people asked you to. This is a stark change in opinion and play AFTER Empking was bookied. He has not fear anymore because he is basically a goon now and he served his team well with the extra kill.

Checking back in.
Will /realpost later.

Good to know. Blatant prod/activity dodge.

I hope Ludi at some point realizes that he's starting to tunnel me a bit.
At least Yos has a reason to think I'm scum, and he was rational enough to realize that there's not enough support for a zepher lynch today.

TBH I still haven't reviewed much of this Chair case.
I will say that I don't find a lack of towntells incriminating on Day 3.
Will examine that cases presented when I stop being so damn busy with my life zzzzzzzz

SpyreX and his bookie shenanigans are.... not coming off as towny....

Also,

Unvote: Lady Lambdadelta

I should have done that earlier; I thought I did.

Yay more laziness and he is still content with posting fluff. He does some mild bussing here with Spyrex, but never really gets into the reasons as usual.

He acts hypocritical with calling Ludi a tunneler and then remaining silent when Mastin does it right back to Ludi later in the game. He still hasn't reviewed the Chair case when he made two posts about not liking it and implying that he would? HE STILL ISN'T PAYING ATTENTION TO THE THREAD GUYS.

He unvotes Sapo's slot and recognizes that he forgot to unvote it.

He is purposely putting these stream of conscious remarks into the thread so people will feel comfortable with him and his actions. If he truly was towny he would not need to prepare these defenses ahead of time as he would have nothing to fear in terms of suspicion.

Wait, where did Mastin call LL scum?
What I got out of it is that he sees Kunkstar scum

I could be blatantly missing something though.

It wouldn't surprise me either bud. Fluffernutter.

Wut.

The way I read it, if that wasn't a TvT interaction that's all on Kunk.

He isn't paying attention and clearly misread and misinterpreted Mastin's post. He tries to put scumminess on the most scummy towny, which at this point was Kunk EVEN THOUGH HE HAD A HARD ON EARLIER FOR SAPO/LLD.

Also... SpyreX is suspiciously missing from that list.

If you think this is a scum tell, then you're NOT reading things in context.
Fix that.
He already corrected the SpyreX thing.

Also, why are we voting Kanye right out of the night phase?

Oh there is the hard on for LLD. From LLD and Spyrex's flip that post looks like LLD is trying to pander off an Oversoul-Spyrex team, which is what I thought Zepher was going to do but he defended me here. Pretty sure this is his first post in reference to me since his wall post.

Wait, wait wait.

So what do we do if Ludi flips town?
Tomorrow Mastin's going to go after SpyreX with some ridiculousness that says "Oh well SpyreX can be scum independently of Ludi" or something, and avoid the lynch on himself.

OR

There's no bookie today, so any lynch is free game BUT should we lynch either Mastin or Ludi, the other will be bookied tomorrow based off of today's gambit.

AND/OR

Mastin and SpyreX are possibly scum together.

I call scum gambit.

Vote: Mastin2

Discuss.

(also, I'm really tired, so please correct me on any flaws in this logic)

Puts a little disclaimer at the bottom so that he again, won't be suspicious for this post. He is probably not a confident scum player like Spyrex and LLD and it looks like it from his posts in comparison to theirs.

Anyway, he votes Mastin believing that this is a gambit and that Mastin will try to pull something tomorrow if Ludi flips town. Why the sudden change of heart with regards to Ludi, Zepher? You definitely felt that he was tunneling you and was scummy for it, why not just go along with it? He is trying to set up a Mastin mislynch for when Ludi DOES flip town and planted a seed of doubt into everyone's mind about the gambit that Mastin did pull. I am almost positive that the scum were blind sided by the Spyrex vig shot, I certainly was as he wasn't sticking out as scum to me. I am also pretty sure that everyone felt Zepher/Spyrex were going to be the sleeper cell scum members and the Zepher/Spyrex reactions are looking like late game bus for town cred.

I'm a Mason. Obv. (jk)

Yaaaay magister is strawmanning my posts again

If you cared to pay attention to what I say ever, I don't have a valid argument against you.
If I did, it's purely out of OMGUS and thus why I didn't have my vote on you (for at least most of, if not all) Day 3. (OMGUS is NOT a valid reason to vote somebody. period.)
If you're going to continue to pursue me as scum, you're 1 wasting you're time because I'm a

Claim: VT

(Popcorn: Mastin)

and 2, going to need to come up with better arguments than a weak ISO skim and a bunch of strawmanning.

Unvote

Need to reassess some things here.

If you cared to pay attention to this game at all you would realize that Ludi was right. You aren't doing much of anything and I am surprised that you even lived to this far into the game. You are reusing your same arguments against Ludi stating that he has weak iso skimming when you have done that the entire game. You choose to NOT believe Ludi's claims against you and thus you think they are wrong. Try to actually defend yourself instead of attacking the person attacking you. That definitely seems like a scum tactic to make out the person who is pursuing your lynch is more lynch worthy than you and saves you the hassle of trying to defend yourself from claims that are true and that you don't have any valid reason for doing as scum.

All of Zepher's posts are coming off as premeditated especially during late game.

Zephyr, why the hell are you voting for mastin?

I'm not anymore o.o...

6 hours pass and 11 new posts are added and that is all you have to say? Really.

You're flailing SO hard right now.

No, i'm not. I think you are voting me for completely made up reasons. You are not clear at all. I would like you to bullet point, or number, in a single post, the reasons you think I am scum and the actions you think I have taken that are more likely to come from scum than town. I haven't seen anything from you, and I want it.

The irony of this post hurts me.

You still haven't contributed anything since that other horrible fluff post.

Catching up on the last couple of pages. Content possibly after.

Why is content always a possibility with you? If you seriously cannot devote the appropriate amount of time to large don't join one, especially don't replace into one. This is just another fluff post and that is 3 in a row right now.

Content should always be on a townies mind because they have a motive to post. To kill and catch scum. Your posts lack motive. They lack activity and they are not looking for scum imo. You don't display townie traits.

Don't see anything resembling a question I feel I need to answer at this place and time.
If you want to wagon me and then argue about whether or not Mastin can be scum independently of my flip then by all means, go ahead.

PREDIT:
With a treestump in the setup, I'd see it as more likely to have a 2-shot bookie, 2 goons and a mafia traitor on the scum side; 3 masons, a 2-shot vig and a stump and however many VTs make up the rest of the count. 3-shot bookie if there's no traitor.
I don't see how with with the the currently claimed roles you can derive that there's a rolecop. Wouldn't balance well IMO unless there was another town PR.
Tailor wouldn't exist unless there's a cop, and I have yet to find a reason to believe that there's a cop in this game.

That all being said, I don't understand why you assume that there IS a rolecop, yet none of the nightkills have flipped a PR, or some other telling reason to think that there is a PR. I'd like to know more on why you think there is one.
At the same time, I'm speculating setup which I will avoid basing an argument off of.

PREDIT PREDIT:
@SpyreX
Maybe that's what Idher wanted scum to think >.>

Remember, Vig isn't a role one of the heads isn't familiar with....

What the fuck? Why the fuck would there be a 2 shot bookie if there is a 2 shot Vig especially after Ether stated that bookie shots are not used up if they fail? That would be totally overpowered for the scum and not fair for the town at all.

You are doing some mighty fine rolefishing looking for PR that you think you might have missed and it is clearly obvious.

It is interesting that you would choose to give so much WIFOM into this set up and how accurate your prediction about the scum team is. We have a bookie, we have 2 goons, and we have a traitor. And you got mad at Ludi for possibly having insider knowledge....

More speculation and promise to do something later from you. Classic.

Also, voting off the Mastin gambit is probably muy bueno.
Ludi is still likely scum though.

Mind explaining why you now think that the gambit is a good idea when you expressed great concern that Mastin was pulling a gambit and attached a flipped goon to Mastin when Mastin first presented the gambit? You are just happy that you get to see Ludi die because you are fearing for your life and when he does flip town you will be very happy because another towny will die with that leading to 4 deaths for scum's favor. That is why it is muy bueno.

I'm here, but I can't post now. I caught Kanye's question.

Also, where the fuck did SpyreX get all the PoE nonsense from?
Mind explaining that a bit?

And basically confirming night kills and vig shots looks bad.

Ya. Cognitive Dissonance here. You wouldn't have to be scared of a nightkill/vig shot confirmation if you were actually town. You are again counter bussing Spyrex because he mentioned your name in another post in an act to distance yourself if Idher does choose to shoot one of you.

And basically confirming night kills and vig shots looks bad.

what?

Poor choice of words on my part, I was tired as shit. I was talking about where he said

...
Idher is dead tonight. However, there's NOTHING that can prevent that shot. So, I say one of LLD, Zeph, Kunk get lynched and the other shot. Personal preference is LLD lynch and Zeph shot by a small margin over kunk.
...

I didn't like this, and not because It's me getting shot, it just feels like SpyreX is psuedo-starting a vigpool.

As for my reads....
uhhhh lessee

Likely Scum:
Mastin
Ludi
SpyreX - I haven't taken my own time to evaluate this. I'm taking from other people's arguments and forming an opinion here.

Maybe Scum?:
LLD
KKB

Null:
Kunkstar - Idk what it is about his claiming tree stump that I'm just like... hmmmmm.... He's more town than scum, but still.

Town:
Oversoul
Idher

Towny point for not saying that you were tired in your original post, but you still aren't town. I like how Idher is now town after you said she clearly wasn't obvtown despite many people saying that Idher was town. Also I like I how I am town here and that Spyrex is scum because of other people's opinions when you have made passing potshots at him numerous times. You are pushing the Ludi/Mastin gambit so that you can get 2 extra deaths because of the gambit and more nightkill shots.

Your null on Kunkstar...? What the fuck? Why would scum do that. It is easily verifiable and you are just trying to spread as much doubt and confusion into this game as you can in your sleepy lurky skimmy way. Definite bus on Spyrex from this post.

Also, maybe scum? for LLD when you had a very strong suspicion and even voted for her when it was Sapo? Stop the flip flopping which you have done A LOT this game.

It's either or, I just don't want to take part in Mastin's gambit at the moment, not until I get a better sense of what's going on here.

Fluff post. Expressing concern at the gambit, yet labeling the people involved as scum? If you thought that they were scum, you would go along with it. This is also in direct contradiction to your "mastin gambit = muy bueno" post. Probably a distancing attempt, I can't tell other than that it is awkward given his previous statements about the gambit and the people involved.

It's either or, I just don't want to take part in Mastin's gambit at the moment, not until I get a better sense of what's going on here.

So wait.

You believe that one of Mastin and Ludi is scum. Just one.

And you want to lynch OUTSIDE the 50/50 (from your perspective) in favor of another lynch?

No, I was kind of explaining why my vote isn't on either of the two at the moment...
I'm not necessarily in favor of another lynch at the moment, I just want to make sure that I'm putting my vote on the right person, get it?

It's because of my post #1513 that you're like "wait, wut?", right?
That was in response to I believe KKB's vote on me. While I think voting off the wagon has information, I'm pretty sure ONE of the two is scum
I have no idea of which one is more likely scum. Mastin is being... Mastin.... so it's hard to tell.

I can feel how not coherent my thoughts are here.

So make them coherent? If you realize that they are not properly thought out please make them clear. All you are doing is making things confusing. Maybe you want that. Wait. You do.

You give a dumbass reason to vote one of them stating that Mastin is well being himself. What is that supposed to mean? That isn't the first time you have used that type of cop out remark either. When one of them doesn't flip scum, you were going to use this post as back up to say well the other MUST be scum and get an additional lynch and nightkill.

Someone got hotfoot scoop scoop.

Unvote, Vote: Zepher

really?

I don't even have to explain how terribad this is.


Also, I asked you a question.

Not like you explain why anything else is bad anyway. Definitely thinking scum bussing from Spyrex. You like the word terribad don't you? Because everything is so obviously bad that it doesn't garner a reason to say it is bad right?

The last bit is definitely an attempt to try and look town. It failed.

Posting to let you know I'm here.

I'll read when I get a chance. What I've skimmed is ridiculous

OH hey. I haven't seen one of these posts before. WAIT. Your iso is RIDDLED WITH THEM.

What you've skimmed is ridiculous? No, the fact that you are still skimming is ridiculous.

Uhhhh...

I'm going to go back and look at Ludi and SpyreX

Good thing because it all leads right back to you.

This post shows that scum were not ready for Spyrex's death evidenced by the Uhh....

Right. I was thinking at the end of the day when LLD flipped that they could have already known she was a traitor, and they were attempting to lynch her to gain town cred.

I'll look into them too.

lolWIFOMlol

how the hell would they know that? You are DELIBERATELY trying to cast doubt and suspicion on ANYONE who was on the LLD wagon. Oh wait, that includes you. You just distanced yourself from a scumspicion that you have had from the beginning of your time in this game. WHAT THE FUCK IS THAT?

Apparently there was a rolecop in the set-up (even though I don't see how that would at all make sense)

I saying they could have rolecopped Sapo or LLD and found out lol.

WIFOMWIFOMWIFOM

I'm dancing around like a ballerina you are tiptoeing this issue so hard. This brings me into MASSIVE tinfoil/WIFOM territory though.

Ready the tinfoil!

Earlier you said that there was a 2 shot bookie, 2 goons, and a traitor with a stump, 3 man mason group, and 2-shot vigiliante. That is surprisingly accurate given that traitor still wasn't confirmed in this set up yet. A little hunch that I have is that you may have actually been a 2 shot bookie and that you gained 2 extra kills. One from the Empking wagon and one from a different wagon. Your team shot LLD and learned that she is in fact the traitor which would account for your suspiciously accurate claim and the dumb ass WIFOM bit here. Only someone with insider knowledge would make a WIFOM post like that. TOWN HAS NO WAY OF KNOWING WHETHER OR NOT AN EXTRA BOOKIE SHOT FAILED. THAT IS COGNITIVE DISSONANCE.

I don't see a reason not to.

Fluff. Again.

if youre not convinced recall that spyrex has the opportunity to hammer ludi yesterday. lets wrap this up fellas.

I didn't notice this

Vote: Ludi

You don't notice a lot of things don't you? *sigh*

You could do both lol

Fluffffffffffffffff

Vote: Ludi

More fluff.

lol

fluff.

Wait... that would make...

DAMMIT MASTIN.

Ludi's reasoning for this post is exactly solid. SCUM TRYING TO LOOK TOWN BY SAYING THEY ARE SAD ABOUT A MISLYNCH.

Read for yourself. Why do you want me to hold your hand? I've already given you multitudes of reasons why each of these players are scummy and should be lynched one and then two.

I helped speed lynch LLD, who flipped mafia, and I didn't push on chair, who flipped town.

I'm not sure what mastin has done to give you a town read, but so be it. If you don't want to decide between then, lynch them both we me.

That's WIFOM bullshit. Scum could have easily done this intentionally to pull out of their pocket and we already discussed this at the beginning of the day (well not really, but it was brought up)

I'm not changing my vote Ludi. Sorry.

Vote: Ludi

WHAT? COGNITIVE DISSONANCE!! TOWN HAD NO WAY OF KNOWING WHETHER OR NOT LLD WAS ACTUALLY TOWN OR TRAITOR. You are infusing that bs reason too much for my liking and it is definitely cognitive dissonance.

The fuck.

Quite frankly, I'm pretty sure Oversoul should be dead by now.
He's been the only close to confirmed this entire game, yet he hasn't once died.

Also, OF COURSE THE EMPKING WAGON WAS SCUM DRIVEN. IT WAS BOOKIED.
I wouldn't expect any less than every scum in the game to have been on that wagon.
It would have benefited them to distance at least a little.

Mastin is being "I just fucked up. OMG." Mastin (which means he's town), as opposed to "I messed up, BUT..." Mastin (which would mean he's scum)
They may SEEM similar, but there's a distinct difference. Town Mastin is willing to take a step back and see wtf just happened.

By what I'm going to blatantly point point out as flimsy PoE it would have to be Oversoul.
The only real super solid suspicion I have comes from SpyreX's comments blatantly calling Oversoul either fresh town, or crafty scum.

This is where I'm sitting right now.

Biggest mistake post right here. Trying to convince others of my scumminess when it is way easier to convince me of other's scumminess. I am a gullible person, but the fact that you went after me rests my case.

You are the bookie and yet you aren't on the Empking wagon. That is distancing in itself because why wouldn't a bookie bus his own target? Well, all of the scum have flipped and there is no bookie yet and you are fond of distancing as I have said.

You yourself even stated that it is flimsy PoE that it would be me. You aren't even sure it is me. Your solid suspicion is my connection with Spyrex who I called out as a possible traitor? You called me a newb town, as did many people. How would that make sense that I was crafty scum? You have gone with the grain and purposefully tried not to step on anyone's toes. You acted cautious and always gave a predetermined reason for posting the way you did. You also lurked quite a bit. You had the most to lose on the scum team as the bookie.

I'm alive and reading what I missed

Oversoul, you can't be like

Mastin isn't town, OH [this] is helping my TOWN READ on you
OH, well Mastin COULD be confirmed town.

uhhhhhhhhhh....
I'm heavily exaggerating here, but the way you're choosing to broadcast your Mastin read (without any sort of explanations other than just blatantly saying it) comes off as kind of scummy to me.

Biggest Pot and the biggest Kettle converge. Once again. You have broadcast your feelings opinions quite a bit. Why are you all uppity when I do it?

Doesn't look like it.

Mastin wants to do his thing, which is fine.

Seriously? Fluff in a LyLo? You could at least try to make a case against me instead of putting the veil of doubt over my head.

When the deadline approaches 2 days, I'm voting Oversoul if we haven't reached a better conclusion.
Just throwing that out there now.

I read Mastin's post, and I'm going to try to make what I can of it when I have time.

Again. A preemptive explanation for an action. You do this a lot. It screams premeditated, planned, faked, and forced. You also are almost always strapped for time and needing to try and understand a post or needing to reread a post. That isn't going to cut it in LyLo.

Sorry.

That's a big fancy gambit you've thrown down there Kunk.
I assume that you've concluded that it's either me or Oversoul then?

Anyways, it doesn't look like there's much time left till deadline, and I said I would if no other appropriate options came up.
I know my role pm, Kunk is confirmed, and Mastin is about as close to confirmed as he's going to get for me.

Vote: Oversoul

You don't even claim to be town in this post lmao. You simply state, I know my role, which you are assuming that everyone will think is town. That is the weakest process of elimination I have ever seen. I don't even know why you brough Kunk into this when he is really not involved (other than determining that Mastin is not scum when he didn't hammer me). YOU EVEN GAVE A REASON BEFORE WHY YOU WERE GOING TO VOTE ME AND YOU GIVE ANOTHER ONE? YOUR REASONS ARE WEAK. MINE ARE NOT. YOU HAVE NO REASONS THAT IS WHY. YOU ARE SCUM AND IT IS GOOD GAME BECAUSE OF THAT.

Then it is Zepher. Good game scum.

WTF is that shit?
You're not going to vote for yourself.

The problem with Kunk's gambit is that it means Either you or me are scum.
The fact that you posted this in itself, without admitting to that possibility is terribad to the max.

Mastin's little schtick/ false alarm confirms Zepher as scum.

I am voting Zepher when I get to my computer. Any objections speak up now. I'll be back home in an hour or two.

I don't understand how that at all led to me being the last scum.
We've already seen how Reck has messed up things as remotely important as role flips (like flipping a rolecop when there isn't even on in the setup, at this point there's only the bookie, because if there was ALSO a rolecop the game would have been over after yesterday's flip.)

Oversoul's pointing out that I should have gone after Mastin also seems pretty bad.
His saying Mastin will win no matter what is also bad, intentionally presenting a wincon for scum just to spite me is in no way town.

Ugh. This game.

Of course I am not going to make the town intentionally lose by voting myself. What shit is that? I said GOOD GAME SCUM because YOU ARE SCUM. I FOUND THE LAST SCUM AND IT IS YOU. I don't need to have any more dealings with you because I know your a scum and anything you try to do is automatically ill will towards the town.

Of course Kunk's gambit has proven that is either you or me, that is fact. Reck and Mastin's little fail has also proven that. Try adding new information into your posts instead of rehashing things that have been said.

I did not do this to spite you and honestly I have no idea where that comment came from. You were pretty much under the radar for the whole game and I didn't suspect you until Ludi flipped town. I don't hate you and I don't dislike you, but I do think that you are scum and that by the very definition of the word puts us at odds against each other.

My plea to Mastin was to vote you because I know you are scum. After reading this giant ass wall I hope he realizes that you are scum too.

There you have it folks. The reason why Zepher is scum.

The spoiler doesn't seem to be working. :\ Here it is.

[Oversoul]

Did you stay up all night? Mastin, persevere. I have confidence in you. And would you look at that. Lurker scum Zepher isn't here when it is so close to deadline.

[Oversoul]

Omg those posts came out of nowhere. Hold on I am reading.

[Oversoul]

Ok. I am an idiot lol. Didn't realize that Zepher had posted at 3:03 my time and I have read all of your posts on the last page Mastin. Is there anything you would like clarified in my wall? I think we still have a few hours, don't quote me on that though.

Zepher, you could at least try to defend yourself instead of saying only scum make walls this close to deadline. How does that even make sense? You still latch on to the scummiest Looking aspect of the post completely ignoring anything else I said. If that isn't strawmannig I don't know what is.

[Oversoul]

Are you there Mastin?

[Oversoul]

We won Mastin! Yay. I knew you would choose the right dude.

Champagne and strawberries for the town!

Woot

[Oversoul]

Mastin, no one is going to rag on you (maybe Ludi) because town just won.

[Oversoul]

First time other than Marathon that I was in 3p LyLo.

And is it really that bad of an idea to post a wall that close to a deadline? I didn't think so. :/

[Oversoul]

Sleep now Mastin. I have one's Reck. When everyone else is awake you can enjoy your spoils.

[Oversoul]

Pmed reck*

[Oversoul]

I'm not that big of a dick, Mastin lol.

I am being sincere and legit. I told you, YOU would win noatrer what if you voted Zepher.

[Oversoul]

Oh and will

someone

read my wall? ._. I was so happy with it and now it is useless.

[Oversoul]

A 3-shot bookie? Holy shit. Did he ever successfully bookie anyone except for Emp?

And what do you mean I didn't understand the implications of what Mastin did? I was going to ask everyone to claim bookie and then see who Reck modkilled, but I think that would have been cheap.

[Oversoul]

I realized that. I wanted the same chance, but no one wanted to do it and it was after Mastin's fail.

Mastin's melodrama is what took me by surprise. It wasn't normal for him from what I had seen so I was suspicious.

[Oversoul]

And LLD We gotcha.

[Oversoul]

I agree about the Bookie being terrible this game. I am really surprised he didn't put it on Ludi the second to last day.

Touché, LLD.