Mini 1266 - My iTunes Mafia - GAME OVER

[Skenvoy]

*sigh* So, you've said
"I didn't see your posts."

And
"Actually, I did see them, but couldn't be bothered to amend my own post to include the new information, which is

the reason we have previews in the first place

.

@DV, just because you point out that what you've done is scummy, doesn't make it any less scummy. I'm adding him to my lynch pool, removing Oasis and DJ.

Looking like this: Fennin, Metabot, DV, noramp.

In that order.

PEdit: Wow, a heap of posts. I pretty much agree with what Gutter's said about DV. Noramp, you were scum in my list of reads a few pages back, and since then I haven't really commented on anyone apart from Fennin and people I've directly interacted with, because I've been trying to get a lynch on my number 1 scum suspect.

And actually, you were in my top 5 - along with DJ and Oasis, you were people I'd vote for if I had to, but weren't my top priority.

[Painted Face of Death]

Lol 4CoS at Painted for such a ridiculous comment on something that I already explained. If you actually bothered to ISO Skenvoy like I did you will see why Painted.

I really hope that stands for 4 Cans of Spam. But probably not. What does that mean?

[Guttersnipe]

I would like to mention that I agree with Painted's last post on p28.

[DeasVail]

FoS on everyone who doesn't take everyone seriously. I'm looking at you, gutter. And yes, I'm seriously FoSing Gutter.

Well I think I was pretty accurate in my suspect lists (considering I limited each person to three). If you'd like to provide possible theories as to how I was being manipulative with it, then please go ahead.

I don't really like insulting people, gutter. That's not how I do things (OMG I'm obvscum now) but if that's how you think things should be done, then fine.

Well I know it won't change anything, but I will say that I didn't mean to say that I didn't see Gutter's post until after I posted. I meant until after I started doing my post, but I don't expect you to believe me, so whatevs.
Please tell me how it's so scummy of me though. I've seen this kind of thing more in town than scum to be honest (There I'm being honest. I must be town!)

Clarifying: I didn't mean to manipulate anything with my post and thought I was being pretty obvious that it was limited because not every single player is an alt of mine (or are they?). If you can come up with how I might've been manipulating with it, please do.

Painted, you're actually right! I don't know why Gutter FoS'd me for that post!

[DeasVail]

4 Claws of Suspicion btw

[Painted Face of Death]

Painted, you're actually right! I don't know why Gutter FoS'd me for that post!

Right about what? (and you sound so surprised )

[DeasVail]

I was talking about the 4 cans of spam.

[Painted Face of Death]

I'm really confused but that's probably cause I'm super low on sleep. I'm right about the cans of spam but it's actually claws of suspicion? and what does that have to do with not knowing why Gutter FoSed you? You put those two sentences together in a paragraph as though they were related. Did you mean that if I were right, FoS would be a Filet o' Spam, and so you don't know why Gutter would give you one?

[Skenvoy]

Wait, what? You just said that you saw mine and Gutter's posts in the preview, but didn't change your post or comment on our's for whatever reason, and then you come around and say you didn't see them at all?

Well, let's see. Your most obvious 'manipulation' (not my word) was that you decided to put me down on Slandaar's list instead of you because you'll always choose the option that doesn't get you lynched.

[DeasVail]

Painted, I'm sorry you're confused, but I'll give you a piece of information that will make sense of it all.

Spoiler:

Skenvoy is scum.

PEdit: I don't get the first paragraph. I'll read after I post this and try and make sense of it. Regarding that "manipulation", it's not like Slandaar obviously suspected me more than you from his posts and I actually mentioned that I would be among the top suspects too if I was Slandaar's third. (It was actually intended for people to consider and correct) In any case, as town, I know that I shouldn't be lynched so why would it be necessarily scummy?

[DeasVail]

Skenvoy: I said I didn't see them until after I posted, then I said I saw them in the preview, then I said I didn't mean what I said first.

[Painted Face of Death]

I actually mentioned that I would be among the top suspects too if I was Slandaar's third.

Where did you mention that? I looked back and checked when I saw you say this, because I didn't remember it, and I still don't see anywhere where you said that you would be in the lynch pool if you had one more vote.

And I was confused about the cans of spam/claws of suspicion thing and what it had to do with the FoS.

[Outskirts Oasis]

I am very sorry for the lack of content recently. Real life has been a drag and I haven't been able to receive much free time due to school being difficult. Hopefully Thanksgiving week will help reduce the burden so I can get something in.

[DeasVail]

Ok, that's it. I'm going to decide on everyone's suspects/lynch-targets and thus our lynch pool (limiting to 3 per person)

DeasVail- Painted, Skenvoy, DeltaWave
Slandaar- DeltaWave, Fennin, Skenvoy (Wasn't sure whether it should be skenvoy or me for 3rd, but obviously I don't want to be lynched)
Skenvoy- Fennin, Metabot, Noramp
Guttersnipe- Painted, Skenvoy, IS,
Painted Face of Death- don_johnson, DeasVail
Outskirts Oasis- Skenvoy
Noramp- IS, Painted, Slandaar
Metabot-
Internet Stranger- DeasVail, don_johnson
Fennin- Skenvoy, Painted, don_johnson
don_johnson- IS, DeltaWave, Fennin
DeltaWave- Slandaar, DeasVail, Painted
[J]- Fennin

So, top ones are

Skenvoy (5)
Painted (5)
Fennin (4)

and also me if Slandaar still suspects me.

I may have made a mistake with the suspects or counting but I'm thinking Skenvoy, Painted, Fennin is our lynch pool

I was only trying to be helpful with this post as I and DJ had already suggested that people say their suspects and it was just getting ignored so I thought I'd work out who people's suspects were and come up with a possible lynch pool. I thought I was obviously open to corrections and I didn't think that the whole idea of me deciding who people's suspects would be taken so seriously, but my mistake.

And Sorry Painted, Gutter told me not to take you seriously. (Btw one of the answers is in bold above)

A small part of Gutter's FoS on me was taking you seriously by 4CoSing you, so if I had actually meant 4 cans of spam it would mean Gutter's FoS was void, but of course, I didn't actually mean 4 cans of spam.

[DeasVail]

Also I have a question to those suspecting me for my contradiction- What benefit was there for me if I was scum and intentionally lying about not having seen gutter's post.

[Slandaar]

I still suspect you DV.

Painteds a bad lynch, noone has really presented a case on him, this is one of the main issues with delta, he says painteds super scummy but cant show one reason why.

IF YOU SUSPECT PAINTED, SHOW WHY.

[DeasVail]

I think it's pretty obvious now that the lynch pool includes me, but 4 is too many I think, unless everyone thinks I'm scum now.

I think that DeasVail, Skenvoy, Painted, Fennin are the top suspects (correct me if I'm wrong), so maybe everyone should vote for one of us at least?

The spoiler is what I said about Painted in post 201. I also generally felt that he wasn't genuine, especially his suspicion of me early day 1 and him starting to think that Skenvoy was scum seemed like compensation for the defending. I could also see Slandaar and Painted perhaps both being scum, but that's leaping a bit far. Most of my suspicion comes from early game and although there's not much that I find really scummy in his recent play, there's not much that makes me think he's town either and post 508 is something I find scummy as I don't think it's true.

Spoiler:

Why I think Painted is scum:

- Post 31: Painted votes me, presenting three reasons which makes it look as if his vote is completely justified while most of it consists of complaining about my vote on skenvoy, which has nothing to do with my likelihood to be scum. (Note that he mentioned my lack of immediate vote justification as scummy) If the purpose of the vote was to question my actions, why did he present a) b) c) as if he had a case on me being scum? If he really thought I was scum, why is it based on such silly reasons? I think this indicates scum because it seems Painted was more concerned with attacking someone for the sake of attacking them (and looking town) than he was for whether I might actually be scum or not.

- Post 38: An example of where Painted responds to my description of his actions as "overreacting" and "nitpicking" by questioning how my actions are any different. If he seriously suspected me of being scum, why would he defend himself by saying *well what I'm doing is no different from what you're doing*. Much more likely imo to be scum saying *well you're town and you're doing the same thing as me, so how am I scum* Additionally, the incorrect accusations indicate a lack of attention to my posts and reasoning, considering I was his top suspect.

- Post 45: Well now there's nothing wrong with me voting without immediate justification (pointed out by DJ) Reasons for voting me don't make much sense

- Post 47: No read at all on Skenvoy. Well, in that case, why not let her defend herself so we can try to work out whether she's scum or not? I think town are more likely to realise this than scum.

- Post 62: Dismisses what DJ says by saying he's either scummy or VI, when I didn't see anything to indicate that. Accuses him of confusion and misinformation. Painted just not responding well at all to suspicion on him. Recurring theme in painted's posts- tends to define me by my vote on Skenvoy even though I jumped off it pretty quickly when I found painted suspicious, seems to feel the need to continue his suspicion of me to not look scummy, so perhaps focuses on my vote on skenvoy which was such a small section of the game to sustain his suspicion on me. "looking at what's happened since [the skenvoy vote] I'm suspecting DV"- well that's strange considering all he has been able to mention about me that's apparently scummy is the skenvoy vote. Misrepresents my vote on skenvoy (weird coming from someone who complains about being misrepresented. If they truly felt they were, they'd more likely to try not to do it to others)

- Post 65: Still the focus on Skenvoy, explaining her actions even though he doesn't think she's town and doesn't actually know her reasons.

I can't really be bothered saying much more now (at this point in the ISO, I give up and think to myself: Well he might be a really scummy townie, but there's no question that he's really scummy)

[Slandaar]

That case is weak because it hinges on one point;

Did Painted genuinely think your accusation was scummy? if you think there is no way, then he looks scummy for sure. But I think he did think it was, even as scum hes not going to attack a point he thinks is legit is he... so he genuinely views your vote reason as terrible, from there his actions make sense from a town perspective.

[Slandaar]

Re Deltas case:

Scumtell: Slandaar flip flops extensively

Slandaar was apparently sure that we should lynch Fennin in 457. Then changes his vote to me in 559

Sounds more like opportunistic scum. Nobody was really biting on the Fennin case, so you might as well try out something on Delta, right?

Flip Flopping... thats 100 posts later, you never change your mind? Ridiculous accusation. I even have had Delta as scum for a while, so its not like i jumped from Fennin -> town read.

Scumtell: Slandaar has not been actively scumhunting

Look at Slandaar's ISO. Up until he started to suspect me, he took noncomittal "oh maybe so-and-so is scum" type posts. On the other hand, I've been actively questioning other people and using those questions to establish relationships. My scumhunting is effective; he's been doing nothing.

I could get a ton of quotes from our ISO's to show this as wrong, then show who really is the noncomittal one but eh, just ISO us both.

Scumtell: Attempting to manipulate the town.

In Post #581, Slandaar apparently tries to form some alliance with IS on the condition that IS votes for me.

IS thing was a joke obv.

Defense: My position on meta is consistent.

As I mentioned in my last post, I was being correct when I said I didn't know Slandaar's meta because I've never seen him play scum. Only town. I do not like meta-based arguments, but my argument is not based in meta. I made a few statements about meta as a side note. Yet another misrep by Slandaar.

Your meta stance changed from not willing to give a read using some meta to using meta to back your read. That is scummy.

The rest of the case is Delta thinking 12 hours has anything to do with my case which it doesnt, at all. Which is what i repeatedly said.

The only interesting point is the 1st one, but amusingly its my town tell so whatevers, you need meta on me to know if thats scummy or not. I find it easier to read people by looking at their reads on me. I know how town and scum generally view me, I also thought Delta might mention something interesting based on meta, but he refused, then uses meta later...

[Painted Face of Death]

Mod:

Can we

please

get updates on the vote counts and when the deadline is? We are now past the last official deadline you posted and I don't know if anyone else PMed you for an extension.

[Painted Face of Death]

With 13 alive it takes 7 to lynch
Day 1 deadline is 8:00PM on Nov. 19

My mistake: we're not actually past it yet. I forgot that you updated it. Still, it's closing in and I'd like to know if anyone else has asked for more time. Also, will you tell us who asked for more time or is that a secret?

[Slandaar]

Painted, if you are voting DJ, move your vote.

DJ is not being lynched.

You are wasting your vote and considering you are worried about deadline, you should realise this and be looking to move onto a wagon with some chance of being a lynch.

OR, you could try and push the wagon.

Why are you doing neither?

[Internet Stranger]

Im going to call out Noramp and Fennin.

They are swooping in, shitting all over somebody, then flying away keeping a low profile. The less they post, the less there is to go by on them. Does anyone not find it peculiar that everyone's top suspects are the people posting the most?

Gutter was in this same flyby shitter category, but he has actually made an effort in the last few pages.
Sken and Painted are in a similar category.

I dont know why DJ is posting less all of a sudden. Its like he aroused all sorts of chaos and now he sits back and watches Deas and Delta/Slandaar squirm.

What the fuck happened to [J]??
Meta and Oasis are also non-active, but I think scum tend to hide in the middle group more.

Deas has changed his behavior from scummy to a victim and I dont know if its genuine or deliberate.
A scum partner is likely to be in the mid level posting range of (Painted|Sken|Noramp and now DJ), thats usually where they like to hide.

[Guttersnipe]

DV changed his attitude because he was attacked by someone who isn't a complete outlier (i.e. you or PFoD), and now he's having to face the possibility that he might swing today.

FoS on everyone who doesn't take everyone seriously. I'm looking at you, gutter. And yes, I'm seriously FoSing Gutter.

omgus

Well I think I was pretty accurate in my suspect lists (considering I limited each person to three). If you'd like to provide possible theories as to how I was being manipulative with it, then please go ahead.

It was manipulative because you generalised people's lists, selectively excluding the targets that were least helpful to your goals (it doesn't matter if your goals were perfectly in line with those of a theoretical townie). You left half of my list off* so that you could then say at the end of your post that the top targets were Skenvoy and Painted (or whoever, I'm not bothered to check just this second). You even came out and said that you specifically left yourself off - EVEN if you said it straight out it's STILL manipulative and biased.

I don't really like insulting people, gutter. That's not how I do things (OMG I'm obvscum now) but if that's how you think things should be done, then fine.

When IS threw a load of crap at DJ, DJ stuffed it right back at him. Your very calm and non-defensive attitude toward IS's (serious) accusations against you is clearly designed to de-fang his attack. If you don't defend, and no one else becomes involved (note: now that I am involved as well I see you've leapt into the defense, at last, like I was saying in my first sentence), it won't escalate and you will easily survive IS's attack by ignoring it.

Admittedly this is something I could see someone doing as town, but that doesn't change the fact that the purpose of it is to manipulate the reactions of others (i.e. by reacting to the attack at the lowest possible level you cause people not to become suspicious of you/notice the attack/etc)

Well I know it won't change anything, but I will say that I didn't mean to say that I didn't see Gutter's post until after I posted. I meant until after I started doing my post, but I don't expect you to believe me, so whatevs.

Ok, no big deal.


*See above, but imo the point stands.

[Noramp]

IS you are my main suspect and I would not classify you as being one of the people who post the most. I also would not classify it as shitting on people and running away. DJ and I have both brought up the fact that that is exactly what you do. This is the second time you are using something to declare someone scummy when you are in fact the one guilty of it. You claim DV changed his playstyle under pressure when you also changed your playstyle when people called you out. Now you are saying people are swooping in, shitting on people then disappearing. You have made baseless claims against DJ and have been asked repeatedly to substantiate these claims to which you have simply ignored our pleas. Few if any of your posts have contained actual content. All you say is that DJ is trying to manipulate us with his cult leader tendencies. You are trying to scare town into believing that DJ is only taking care of himself while you are our knight in shining armor for taking the blinders off of our eyes.

You all need to consider why you don't suspect IS. From the very beginning he has been belligerent for no reason and super defensive. These are not town tendencies.