Mini 1327: Murder in the Louvre- Day 6

[shos]

almos forgot, VOTE: CHARTER.

Mod, can we have a votecount, btw?

eh ninjad. sec.

[Yosarian2]

charter signed up his death now, lol. if I am an SK which is action-immune, as Zar can tell you, then how comes I was roleblocked and there were two nights in which I didn't kill?

you're making fun of yourself now.

Hmm. You're actually action-immune, huh? Interesting, I had forgotten that part of your claim.

Honestly, that makes your whole claim even more implausible, but it does make explaining the missing kill harder. Plus, as Nuwen just pointed out, if you actually were a SK, she's probably be trying to lynch you.

You know, we can figure this out tomorrow. Let's just lynch the mafia and see if that ends the game.

unvote

Vote:Nuwen

[shos]

In your next posts you can both explain why your top scum read (and the lesser scum read, Vi) is

not lynching the so-called SK when he has a vest

. Scum can't kill him. Scum can't affect his actions with their abilities. In your minds, scum should be happily lynching the so-called SK to avoid death-by-crosskill in this situation, right? So why are neither of your top scum-reads currently favoring a Shos lynch.

Oh, Vi is town. Right now I'm guessing that you're probably the last mafia in the game.

Your point is interesting. Perhaps you're more worried about a living town flavorcop for some reason? If your claim was a lie, you have good reason to want him dead.

are you kidding me?

It's Yos and Charter, guys

.

Yeah, nice try. I could have bought charter if you could have found a plausible way to explain away the ttracker thing; I could even buy you suspecting me to be a SK, but there's no way in hell town-Nuwen would actually think I'm scum with furcolow here, or that I'm mafia who claimed my own kill at the start of day 2 as some kind of stupid gambit, or that the mafia killed Elmo right after how day 1 ended. Not only is there no way you could believe all that, you're not even mentioning ANY of that, and just pretending that none of that is even a problem here.

Here's a plausible way. YOU shot the kill, and not charter. really, it's that easy. the night 1 call was probably a gambit indeed, and why wouldn't we think you were with furc?

Or, to put it another way, just to point out the absurdity of what you're claiming to believe here:

One more time, so everyone can hear it Parama: Yos is scum claiming vig. You think Yos is scum claiming vig. You, Parama, think Yosarian2 claimed out the scum kill as a vig bullet for no reason or hint of a track/whatever result on him.

btw, didn't furc out Zar as a tracker?

perhaps you could communicate somehow; perhaps he got the results and posted it in the quicktopic quickly before night ended.

either way - charter is scum for sure, we'll deal with you after he flips.

[Yosarian2]

Here's a plausible way. YOU shot the kill, and not charter.

Yeah, somehow I don't buy that theory, since I'm obviously not mafia and all that.

btw, didn't furc out Zar as a tracker?

perhaps you could communicate somehow; perhaps he got the results and posted it in the quicktopic quickly before night ended.

...what does that have to do with anything?

either way - charter is scum for sure, we'll deal with you after he flips.

Magus asked you why you think charter is scum. You didn't answer. i asked. You didn't answer. You haven't actually given a reason for any of your suspicions here.

[charter]

Follow the Yosarian

Unvote, vote Nuwen

[shos]

at the time, I sent Magua a message with my powers and said that. but now, all the reasons come from the last two-three pages.

[charter]

I haven't posted the last two or three pages, so that's clearly not the reason.

[Yosarian2]

Here, found the quote. Early in the day today:

If you had actually read what I'd posted, you'd be squirming to explain-away why a doc-protected slot on a night with no scum kill (N1 - Yos claimed out Elmo's death) remains alive today. Did a magical doc spring up or are you going to tell me that someone no-killed/avoided shooting a protect-confirmed slot this close to endgame to play WIFOM games.

Vi either has an SK-ish vest or controls the scum kill. I want it dead NOW.

Vote: Vi

Nuwen just declared out of the blue that the missing scum kill was because the scum tried to kill Vi and failed. This was *before* Vi claimed that yes, someone tried to kill her last night and failed. Even though there were two power roles alive the night before that would have made much more sense as kill targets, and even though if Nuwen and Vi were both town, the way they were tunneling on each other all game means there is zero chance that scum kills either of them.

Or, as Vi succinctly put it in her next post:

But, thanks for claiming scum!

But, even more then that, think about it. Why would scum try kill Vi, who was hell-bent on lynching Nuwen for the entire game? If Vi and Nuwen were both town, scum would wait until one of them managed to lynch the other, obviously. Only Nuwen would try to kill Vi last night.

[Yosarian2]

Eh, it's pointless asking shos for reasons; he's obviously just going to join whatever wagon is biggest, unless he's lying about his role.

[charter]

Good work. Slam dunk case on Nuwen.

[shos]

really, I knew already what you are talking about in ytour 'case' against nuwen - if you didn't read, I saw that one too and supported it against Vi. there was only one option missing there either way.
my case against you two is that you guys can't explain the missing kills and the double kill, and you're just fine with it. oh yeah, we'll lynch nuwen and THEN wonder if that's logical!..

the charter-sheeping-yos is new to me, and it isn't doing any good for charter. even if he isn't with you(unlikely), he'll just jump on any wagon that isn't him or his partner. and pages 81-82 is what I'm talking about - starting with post 2017, charter's posts are just plain bad. obviously you BOTH missed the fact that I'm immune, and of course Yos is right whatever he says.

"Good work. Slam dunk case on Nuwen."? seriously?

[Yosarian2]

really, I knew already what you are talking about in ytour 'case' against nuwen - if you didn't read, I saw that one too and supported it against Vi

You supported it...against Vi?

Nuwen knew who the scum tried to kill at the start of the day today, at a point when only scum could possibly have known that. How is that a point against Vi?

Anyway, shos, let me make this simple for you.

Nuwen is clearly scum. We are lynching her today.

If you were actually a bulletproof survivor, you wouldn't have any problem with us lynching scum, and would be glad to get on board. If you oppose it, then after she flips scum, we are going to assume you were lying and lynch you next.

[shos]

Yes, against Vi. Nuwen did not know anything. it is called SPECULATIONS. that post had a good point there - if bla bla bla happened and 'supposedly' confirms Vi as town, then why haven't scum shot Vi? a reason not to shoot Zar is acceptable since it seemed there are many ways to block a kill here, but Vi would be the obvious second target.

anyway - that was only partially correct, and that's why I let it go.

about that last part - opportunistic, innit? 'if you are indeed survivor you would not care'...that's bulls, lol, even if I were an SK i wouldn't care. and since town is the only thing that can kill me via lynch, there is no reason to give town reasons to lynch me. if we can even avoid a situation where they fear of me quickhammering with scum, the better. your 'we' is only you and charter, and your reason is crap, and you're both acting VERY wierd these last two pages, so yeah, you're going to be the one lynched, and not Nuwen.

se tu.

[Yosarian2]

Yes, against Vi. Nuwen did not know anything. it is called SPECULATIONS. that post had a good point there - if bla bla bla happened and 'supposedly' confirms Vi as town, then why haven't scum shot Vi?

How was Vi "confirmed town"? Just because she was doc protected? So, your argument is that Vi is scum because she's "confirmed town" and not dead, when no one ever said Vi was confirmed town?

Anyway, we know that scum tried to kill Vi last night, since, as you pointed out a few posts ago, there are no other mechanics to explain the missing kills. The interesting thing is, how did Nuwen know that? She never explained.

a reason not to shoot Zar is acceptable since it seemed there are many ways to block a kill here, but Vi would be the obvious second target.

The doctor was dead; he got lynched yesterday. Scum would have no way of knowing there was a second doctor. Why wouldn't they target Zar, or Charter, or one of the other major power roles?

The only person who would have reason to kill Vi is Nuwen. And the only person who would have guessed that the scum tried to kill Vi would be the scum who tried to kill Vi; it's not at all obvious otherwise.

Anyway, all that is irrelevant now, since you're not even attacking Vi here. You are saying you think Vi is town, which means you believe her that scum tried to kill her last night and failed. So how did Nuwen know that, unless she's scum?

about that last part - opportunistic, innit? 'if you are indeed survivor you would not care'...that's bulls, lol, even if I were an SK i wouldn't care. and since town is the only thing that can kill me via lynch, there is no reason to give town reasons to lynch me.

[

Right.

You are defending scum right now, and there's absolutely no reason a survivor would do that. A bulletproof SK, on the other hand, would want to keep the mafia around for a while longer, especially since the mafia can't shoot the bulletproof SK and can only shoot townies.

[Vi]

Vote count that tastes like my forlorn desire for duck cooked in honey and garlic:

Nuwen (2) - Yosarian2, charter
Vi (2) - Magua, Zar
charter (2) - shos, Nuwen

No one yet - Vi

Four to lynch.
If deadline falls before a majority is achieved I will be forced to read emo poetry to you about my gastronomic impoverishment.

----

If we were bigger and brighter people I'd think this is you telling me you're jailkeeping me tonight, but

N1, Katsuki did not submit any action.
N2, upon replacing in, I protected chamber.
N3, I protected Zar.

You're not a jailkeeper. You would be voting for Charter right now because he supposedly actioned N2, right, or is that too much to ask for?

I hope by the time I get done catching up Nuwen is blasted for "fishing".

I travel restlessly along the hallways of the museum in the hopes of finding something to distract me from my lethargy. Not particularly interested by the human world, but the murder in the museum has piqued my attention into providing any aid possible I can to solve the mystery.

...You're a book. That makes about as much sense as La Gioconde bouncing from corner to corner like a cartoon from Banjo-Tooie. At least I have, you know, legs. And well-preserved perambulatory structures they are!

But regardless, I was talking about the flavor for your action.

Thank you for the link. I guess that makes sense with M. Recamier. And I have no idea what the abbreviation for Madame is offhand, actually.

Then, with Furcolow as Role Cop... The main point of this is that charter isn't auto-scum. Offhand I still want to say that charter is likely scum just based on play.

charter being cleared based on role stuff requires there to only be one scum left. I don't think this is a valid conclusion atm.

---

Hey Yos. I tried to say that shos was a Bulletproof Survivor with a fakeclaim and kind of almost kept a straight face. But now:

All three of

[Nuwen, Vi, shos]

tried to push a wagon on me, and the only reason for doing so is trying to force through a lynch on the person who only cares just enough about this game not to subject some poor soul to reading a terrible mess.

Try reading this while keeping a straight face. The "some poor soul" pretty much sells it as fake.

---

charter signed up his death now, lol. if I am an SK which is action-immune, as Zar can tell you, then how comes I was roleblocked and there were two nights in which I didn't kill?

Bulletproofs.

---

You know, we can figure this out tomorrow. Let's just lynch the mafia and see if that ends the game.

Except no. There's still an unaccounted-for kill from N3. Lynching a single person should not end this game.

In addition, if the setup IS 3 scum + 1 SK, and we lynch groupscum, and assuming both kills go through (okay, but seriously, work with me here) and are not crosskills, we wind up at 2-1-1. THAT seems like an autoloss.

I think that we should be moving to hit the SK Today. Obviously mislynching basically means we lose but lynching groupscum - even if it's so tempting and accessible - means that we're basically hoping I'm wrong about the setup.

---

What's really giving me pause about Nuwen-scum is that huge flurry of activity starting with her claimpost. But, looking back at what I said earlier, I'm willing to write it off.

I'm still calling charter obvious scum because he is obvious and scum.

shos-SK seems to be the only person who makes sense for the role. It's not Yos2 if charter's report is any indication (and unless charter and Yos2 are scumpartners I see no reason why they would be lying... though Yos and charter have been pretty blatantly together recently).

That leaves me saying that Yos2, Zar, and Magua are Town. Yos2-scum is tantalizing - and I've never seen him so engaged in a game before - but if he's not the SK, he has to be a one-shot Mafia Vig, which he chose to spend N1 on Elmo. :/ Zar has been under the radar and has a sketchy claim, but play-wise he's... not as bad as he was Day 1, ish. And Magua is the ex-lurker who is arguing with me over rather pointless things.

But are they all more likely to be Town than Nuwen and charter? ...Basically,

yes

, tbh. Still, the thought of Nuwen-scum bothers me on an intuitive level that I usually just throw away but etc. I'd rather lynch charter Today and see which partner gets sussed out Tomorrow.

But, at the same time, SK.

What's your take on this, Yos?

[charter]

Oh hey, Vi ignored the fact that I can't be scum by myself and then typed up a huge post where I'm scum by myself. Oh wait..

[Vi]

Oh hey, Vi ignored the fact that I can't be scum by myself and then typed up a huge post where I'm scum by myself. Oh wait..

Please do wait. I'm pretty sure I made it clear that I believe there were three scum and one SK at the start of the game.

Now if you will kindly shut the duck cooked in honey and garlic up in your mouth before I reach in and take it for myself because I'M HUNGRY and go back to lurking, etc.

[charter]

Well, it looks like it's going to be Yos, Magua, Zar, and myself as the only people who want to play town. I have no problem voting any of shos/Vi/Nuwen. My preference is shos then Nuwen, but whatever.

[charter]

Did Vi invent a post restriction at some point?

[Yosarian2]

charter being cleared based on role stuff requires there to only be one scum left. I don't think this is a valid conclusion atm.

(shrug) Eh. Yeah, I'm not real happy with his activity level this game.

The thing is, even if he's scum with someone else; I donno, say he's scum with Mangua, or someone. Logically even then, he should have been the one to do the kill, because Kats looked hella scummy and was an obvious tracker or roleblocker target.

I'm also having trouble seeing him as being scum with Nuwen, and I don't see how Nuwen could be town here.

I agree his overall play is pretty thin; he's been pretty inactive all game. If Nuwen somehow flips town, I'd be in favor of a charter lynch tommorow.

Hey Yos. I tried to say that shos was a Bulletproof Survivor with a fakeclaim and kind of almost kept a straight face. But now:

All three of

[Nuwen, Vi, shos]

tried to push a wagon on me, and the only reason for doing so is trying to force through a lynch on the person who only cares just enough about this game not to subject some poor soul to reading a terrible mess.

Try reading this while keeping a straight face. The "some poor soul" pretty much sells it as fake.

Eh, pretty much just looks like frustration to me. Nuwen's posts were almost impossible to understand; I think she was delibratly trying to fast-talk us there. Now imagine trying to catch up and read the past 5 pages, while at lynch -1 for reasons that nobody understnads.

charter signed up his death now, lol. if I am an SK which is action-immune, as Zar can tell you, then how comes I was roleblocked and there were two nights in which I didn't kill?

Bulletproofs.

Hmm. But the only claimed bulletproofs are you and shos, Of course, there could also be a bulletproof mafia godfather, I guess.

On a side note, if half the scum in this game are bulletproof, then my role really, really sucks, but ect.

You know, we can figure this out tomorrow. Let's just lynch the mafia and see if that ends the game.

Except no. There's still an unaccounted-for kill from N3. Lynching a single person should not end this game.

Yeah...probably true.

In addition, if the setup IS 3 scum + 1 SK, and we lynch groupscum, and assuming both kills go through (okay, but seriously, work with me here) and are not crosskills, we wind up at 2-1-1. THAT seems like an autoloss.

2-1-1 with a bulletproof Sk....would be really bad, yes.

There are a lot of things that could happen to prevent that, though. We have a claimed doc; he might stop a kill. Or both scum groups might target him, or might both target the same person. Or the Sk might kill a scum. Ect.

I guess I just don't think the setup was 3-1. 2-1 or 3-with-a-scum-oneshot seems more likely.

Honestly, I just keep going back and forth on shos; I'm not even 100% sure that there is a Sk in this setup. His claim and his play are just so scummy, though...yeah, I wouldn't be opposed to a shos lynch today, especally if he's refusing to help us lynch scum-Nuwen.

I think that we should be moving to hit the SK Today. Obviously mislynching basically means we lose but lynching groupscum - even if it's so tempting and accessible - means that we're basically hoping I'm wrong about the setup.

What's really giving me pause about Nuwen-scum is that huge flurry of activity starting with her claimpost. But, looking back at what I said earlier, I'm willing to write it off.

Honestly, she didn't really look suspicious to me UNTIL that point. From my pov, it's like you stopped suspecting her just at the moment she finally started to act scummy. :/

Everything she's said in the last few pages just really reminds me of "brilliant scum scrambling to cobble together some kind of plausible theory for someone else being scum". The whole way she's talking about the Furcolow thing also is making me wonder if she's annoyed that her partner fakeclaimed so poorly.

That leaves me saying that Yos2, Zar, and Magua are Town. Yos2-scum is tantalizing - and I've never seen him so engaged in a game before

If it helps explain my sudden increase in activity, the school I work at just ended for the year so I'm off until I find a summer job, lol.

But are they all more likely to be Town than Nuwen and charter? ...Basically,

yes

, tbh. Still, the thought of Nuwen-scum bothers me on an intuitive level that I usually just throw away but etc. I'd rather lynch charter Today and see which partner gets sussed out Tomorrow.

But, at the same time, SK.

What's your take on this, Yos?

I think Nuwen is way more likely to be scum then charter is. Charter hasn't done a lot of obviously town things, but I can't see Nuwen acting the way she did today as town. She really seems to be inventing theories out of thin air to try to talk her way out of a corner, and is consistently ignoring inconvenient facts.

I keep going back and fourth on shos. His role claim is so absurd...yeah, if there's a SK, it's him.

Letting Nuwen live her just seems so wrong, though. I can't help but think she's a bigger threat. I also think that she's likely to be the last member of her scum group here, just because I'm not sure who's likely to be a partner of hers at this point.

Meh. If we're really not going to lynch Nuwen today, I could get behind a shos lynch. You know, though, that if you let Nuwen live, you're going to regret it, right?

[Yosarian2]

Did Vi invent a post restriction at some point?

Yeah, she claimed that somehow the price of surviving the kill attempt last night is a post restriction today.

Frankly, I'm so far beyond trying to figure out what is and isn't a plausible role in this game, I'm just taking it in stride.

[Zar]

Wall of interactions between Furcolow and Vi:

Spoiler: Lots of quotes

Remark about Parama's "scum claim"

What exactly is he case on Parama, again?

He made posts that sounded opportunistic when shos was being wagoned.

Don't forget the claiming scum part.

that was obviously a joke

Claiming to not want to vote Vi for meta reasons:

Vi, why did you wait until 52 to vote shos? Why not vote in 48?

I think Vi is scum. She has done nothing but push easy lynches on Shos and Parama, who, despite her claims, is not obvscum.

Unvote, Vote Vi

Yos and Nuwen, what is your read on Vi?

unvote on this for meta reasons

Speculative alignment based on hypo-town shos flip:

im fine with quilford
his spazzing and flailing is near shos level
i support either of the two wagons
Vi pushing against shos has me thinking he might be town if she is mafia

Fencesitting on vi Vote:

shos has been way more active and can be held accountable
i'll give Vi the benefit of the doubt

Slowly going off the fence:

Vi's looking scummier
UN is now my strongest town read

Discrepancy on the read + Vote

So you think Vi is scum? I had a townread on her, but I'm feeling like some pressure there would be nice. I'm tired of her defenses, honestly, and am wondering if she's just trying to buy town cred

unvote;
vote: vi

I isod Nuwen, and I'm just now seeing it. There are much better candidates.

The only time Vi addresses Furcolow on D1 is this one:

I'm tired of

[Vi's]

defenses, honestly,

...I've defended myself? I know I don't remember anything for longer than 24 hours but I'm pretty sure I haven't done much of that.

Third vote on Vi, cuses no reaction from her.

unvote;
vote: Vi

third time's a charm

Vi disses my Furcolow vote on D1.

I am remarkably out of "u suk" pictures already. My years on the Internet have been wasted.

Strike two anyway.

We better try to agree on the lynch, we can't still be on the Rainbow Voting here.

Tier 1:
Would Gladly Lynch:
Uberninja, Pirate, Furcolow

(4) UberNinja : shos, Nuwen, Yosarian2, Katsuki,
(...)
(1) Furcolow: Zar,

Reverses my question.

@Zar 996: I don't really see any reason to believe Furcolow is scum atm. But that's not as important as the fact that you claim to think otherwise.

Vague response to question about Furcolow.

Do you think

[Furcolow's]

behavior is pro-town?

I don't see why not.

No more comments about either on this day.

[Zar]

@Mod add the missing [/spoiler] tag at the end of that post please.

[shos]

Zar, I see nothing interesting in those quotes.

@Vi: just how many BPs do you think there are? if I am an SK and Yos is town, then there should be now FOUR missing kills. meaning both me and the mafia failed to kill on two different nights. spare that thought.
~~

about nuwen: once again, she did not KNOW those stuff, she suspected them. hasn't it ever happened to you that you guessed something correctly? for example, charter&yos scumteam?

~~
from now on I'd like everyone who votes someone to give his opinion of how the setup is built. example:
Yos, charter, and furc are scum; Yos is 1-shot scumvig. shos is BP survivor.
N1 Yos did not waste his vigshot and killed elmo with the mafia kill and fakeclaimed. N2 he wasted his kill so there were 2 kills. N3 the mafia kill was blocked by Vi.

that's it.

[Vi]

@Yos2: No, really. Look at 2040, 2042, and 2043 again and tell me those come from Town. Those posts are so wrong that they can't come from any kind of realistic misunderstanding.

You seem to be under the impression that if Nuwen flips Town, we get another Day. Provided there is not a Mafia 1xVig (which would be you) lynching Town here means we hit the end of the line regardless of whether there are one Mafia or two. I continue to be dazed at how you don't seem to grasp this.

I don't feel any comment about when Nuwen started and stopped acting scummy is necessary.

I wish I had some duck cooked in honey and garlic.

I really feel like you're trying to sell me this Nuwen lynch with a remarkable amount of specificity, Yos.

---

@Zar: The only thing I'm getting out of that wall is a sense of frustration. I mean, I know the wall isn't for me per se, but the day after Furcolow flipped scum in this game I happened to wind up reading a FurcoTown game and was embarrassed at how different the play was and how I should have caught it a long time ago. OMGIS, etc. I wish I could say or do more about it.

---

@Vi: just how many BPs do you think there are? if I am an SK and Yos is town, then there should be now FOUR missing kills. meaning both me and the mafia failed to kill on two different nights. spare that thought.

Well, we know I blocked at least one kill, and if Nuwen's mouth is to be believed, two. But both of those were non-SK kills because Nuwen, etc.. There isn't really a good explanation for where the other kills would have gone, since the other known Bulletproof is you.

about nuwen: once again, she did not KNOW those stuff, she suspected them. hasn't it ever happened to you that you guessed something correctly? for example, charter&yos scumteam?

Most of the time when this happens it's because they have inside information. It's actually quite a damning scumtell.