Micro 28: Kingmaker Game Over

[uctriton00]

What is the disadvantage of knowing who the king is?

[uctriton00]

The kings still needs to kill somebody, RVS is fine. I'm assuming the mod will keep track of votecounts for us anyway, sans the "X alive, it takes Y to lynch" line, but still keeping the deadline alive.

Vote: Nachomamma8

Because it was meant to be, Nacho.

[uctriton00]

@Mod: maybe we bold our votes, keeping in line that they don't say Execute?

[uctriton00]

Geez wtf

[uctriton00]

I said "Geez wtf" at being quickhammered. I didn't even get to play.

I wanted to get the ball rolling by scumhunting.

[uctriton00]

And Klick and Empking, why do you not like my idea of voting?

[uctriton00]

If RVS can get the ball rolling in a standard format, I don't know why RVS can't work in this game. The King needs reads to work off of.

[uctriton00]

You

Me and you, fishy. *flaps penguin wings*

I've thought up a reason why the king should stay hidden: if the king outs himself, then people might not want to talk about him, since the eligible execution pool is reduced by one? That could be a reason to not out.

[uctriton00]

Nacho, go ahead and claim King and kill uct.

What's this one for?

[uctriton00]

I'm assuming the scum got to talk beforehand like in any other game.

Empking and Nacho a possible team? The setup only guarantees 1 assassin, but there could be up to 3.

[uctriton00]

I like my post very much, it's me putting my read out there.

[uctriton00]

The more I think about it, the more I think that if we don't have some kind of voting system or at least produce "serious" reads, you lose the essence of scumhunting that's commonly seen.

Without it, then I'm picturing everyone who is not the king just sitting here with thumbs in our butts, since we have no real power.

That being said, I think that confirms we should keep the king secret. Outing the king means the scum will pay zero attention to what the non Kings think, and won't respond to any kind of pressure. At least with a King (who is almost acting like a daykill vigilante) being secret, you have to fear who's toes you step on.

[uctriton00]

ATM I only see Nacho, Maverick and Rachmarie as leaning Town. UTC is null, but has spent most of his time in defense and talking about mechanics.

How do you get those town reads?

I don't think anyone has a town read. There's been no real finger pointing, no real pressuring, no real reacting. I'm incredibly frustrated as to how to begin scumhunting when knowing a "vote" doesn't mean diddly.

[uctriton00]

why do you believe that RVS/artificial spontaneity is the only way to get the ball rolling in a game?

moreover why do you assume that The King cannot produce his own reads?

May not be the only way, but it works.

And the King can produce his own reads fine, but the game is that we're supposed to all help get reads on the scum, in the case the King doesn't see it.

[uctriton00]

Maverick/Emp/Klick, why am I getting votes/mentions as possible scum? I don't want to play the entire Day 1 on the defensive, but I really don't want to die early either, so please ask me anything so I can convince you otherwise.

As for now I'm still don't have any scum reads on anyone. Just a lot of OMGUS against the three I've mentioned already.

[uctriton00]

Klick, what did you mean by Reck being obv king? Other than him saying "execute"

[uctriton00]

I guess there's nothing anti-town about sharing.

I picked Nachomamma8 first, and RachMarie second.

[uctriton00]

Empking I'm still not getting a clear answer from you. Looking at your ISO i don't think you've addressed it yet, as to why you think I'm scum.
#25 you call me scum
#28 you shoot down my idea of having voting
#30 you say I'm the one we should be focused on today

The rest are all speculations of the setup, i.e. who the King is. None of your ISO is "uct is scum because _______".

Vote: Empking

[uctriton00]

Talking about "who the king is" is not helping us get a good lynch/execution candidate.

This is the third time I'm asking you what you see in me being scum.

[uctriton00]

Lucidity will help in this case. Here is how I saw the game go from my perspective.

Game began, and I started with RVS. Voted Nacho, because we've won two games together as teammates. Then, for some reason, I get executed. I'm extremely frustrated. I've been looking forward to this game, and to be killed right in the beginning sucks. And, I didn't even get to do anything. I participated in RVS and wham, I was dead.

Mod comes in and says "that was an illegal kill". I'm overjoyed. But now the game turned against me. Klick begins by saying that I'm next to die, because I slipped or something. Empking jumps on that bandwagon too.

In a handful of posts, you have three guys who don't like me already. Again, what in the heck did I even do? I didn't get to do anything in the game, and now I'm under a giant finger of suspicion.

Maybe it was my voting that I proposed? Was it "scummy" to do so? I try to logic it out to everyone, saying that voting will be pro town. That's how I've seen it done in every other game on this site (been here for 4 months), and it's the basic method of scumhunting. I'm spending 90% of the game on the defensive. Defending my idea of voting, and asking people what I did to see scummy.

But defense is useless for town. Offense wins you games. You get there, you build a read, you sit with it. You roll with it. You own it; that's your read. But you let your read change as the game goes. I've been in games where my reads were completely wrong, but the town had the right idea and I put my trust in them and I sheeped them, and I helped the town win by at least helping the bandwagons.

The rest of the game has gone in about "who the king is". Maybe we broke the game towards town somehow, because now the moderator shut it down.

So I began trying to produce reads. Play some offense. But apparently they're not working on anything. I've pointed the finger at Empking. And I've even put out the idea that it could be Empking defending his scumbuddy Nacho. But that post generated no reponse, and nobody else has cared about voting either. It's just Maverick voting against me of course, and I'm here defending. The only other offense is Nacho against guile. In fact during this reread, Nacho tells me to look at guile, and I didn't even notice it because I was so annoyed at my wagon. That's probably what put Nacho off on me; that I didn't go after the guile wagon even when he invited me to get on it. It looks like I'm defending a scumbuddy in him.

Point is I'm a town member. I seriously don't want to day on the first day.

That's sometimes not enough though; I was in a newbie game where a townie got lynched rather easily (not much suspicion on anyone else other than him) because he was acting scummy and "deserved it". There are people who in fact aren't good at "acting town", no matter their alignment.

[uctriton00]

But you let your read change as the game goes. I've been in games where my reads were completely wrong, but the town had the right idea

And with that I'm going to

Vote: Guile

I don't care if it looks like a sad bus attempt at some scumbuddy at the 11th hour. I'm town, and this is the town thing to do. I'm going to open up to the idea that my anger at Empking is just some kind of my personal omgus at him, and that Empking is a townie who just has a wrong read.

[uctriton00]

There's a difference between active lurking and being on limited access. The latter is a null read, so I don't know where Guile gets scum from that.

[uctriton00]

Making me king works since I'm town, but won't scum night kill me if they know that a townie is up for nomination?

[uctriton00]

Combine 206 with the mod's rule about not saying who you voted for or what not, makes me think the game has been broken in some manner.

If nobody knows who voted, and made "don't worry guys I'm the king" an individual wifom judgement if you want to believe the person or not, then the game would be balanced.

If this is all true, then likely, the people who were insistent on outing the king and outing the votes are most likely scum.

Jeebus.

[uctriton00]

I am currently on a bus that will get me home at approximately 4:30 central time. when I get home, I will execute rachmarie regardless of whatever the fuck she claims.

It's like an action movie

[uctriton00]

RachMarie likely planted the bomb on the bus, that's why Nacho hasn't made it home yet.

And I don't know why it's RachMarie. Last thing he said about her was that her defense of being scummy in general is similar to mine. If that's his reason for wanting to execute you, it explains why he wants me executed as well, as he doesn't "buy" our defense.

The execution hammer should be coming soon, and I expect to not be killed at night, and thus be killed by the King tomorrow as Nacho wishes; it'd be silly for scum to use their NK on me when I'm on the block. And as such, I'm down with the plan anyway. If I'm elected, I'll follow through with the Guile execution.

In case night falls and we can't talk anymore, and in case I die at night:
There's too much Nacho kool aid passed around this group of players. If it gets down to the end, that's unfortunate that he ends up winning as scum, based on reputation.

[uctriton00]

The idea is that you die today, then either guile or I die tomorrow. The plan if I read it right is that I execute guile, and either he dies as scum, or I die by killing hero

[uctriton00]

Hehe

[uctriton00]

Well what I'm thinking is if guile really is the Hero, then it makes sense not to "kill" myself. It's either, die today, or die tomorrow.

Who would we execute instead of guile?

[uctriton00]

See that kind of statement right there makes me think you're town, guile

[uctriton00]

Nacho must feel like Batman right now.

[uctriton00]

Maybe we should have a vote on who we should kill today.

[uctriton00]

Bare with me, I'm not scum.

You think I'm scum though, but I'm not.

I just need to know two things:
1. If Guile is not scum, who the other scum is. Could it be Nacho? Or could it be a lurker like the 99% other players in this game?

[uctriton00]

2. Would everyone be ok if I execute Empking or Maverick instead

[uctriton00]

Everyone wants me to kill guile.

But does everyone here honestly believe Guile is scum? Are there people who don't think he's scum and would rather have me vote someone else?

[uctriton00]

Here are my options:

1. Kill Guile
a. Guile dies and flips scum
- I get a "clear" as promised by the town. And thus scum, kill me at night since they can't have a clear running around.
b. Guile flips hero, Triton flips villager, Nacho is humiliated.
- We earn nothing out of that scenario, and I'm dead.

2. Kill someone else

a. They die and flip villager
- I'm killed tomorrow because I didn't follow the plan
b. They die and flip scum
- I come off as a hero.

[uctriton00]

I won't take 10 days. But I'm not going to move until we hear from the missing players in the game.

[uctriton00]

Either way guile, you and I are dead with this "plan".

You know you're town, I know I'm town. And we may very well be two town members who are getting themselves killed.

If you're King, I die. Then you get night killed, because there's no point in having a clear run around.
If you're scum, you die. Then I get night killed, because there's no point in having a clear run around.

Guile, ask yourself, if you REALLY are town, is this in any sensible to you? Sacrificing your PR role? This isn't like killing counterclaimed cops which are guaranteed scums. This could very well end up in two townies dying. The only way to avoid two townies dying is, in fact, you not being scum in the first place.

[uctriton00]

The Hero role gets outed.

Why in the hell would scum not nightkill a proven townie?

[uctriton00]

guile when did you get so town?
sorry about yesterday. thanks for getting a PR.

Nacho, if you truly believe this statement, then do you not see why someone who knows they're a townie AND believes guile is a hero, would be unwilling to kill the hero?

Triton Townie: gonna kill myself by trying to kill the hero. We lose a villager, and scum kill the hero at night.
Triton Scum: gonna kill a town member right now anyway, there's no point because I'm day lynched tomorrow anyway.

As Triton Scum, what in the blue heck advantage do I have in waiting this out?

I'm town.

[uctriton00]

Nachomamma8: get out of my kingdom
uctriton00: no you get out

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZiY7EEVrZBU

uctriton00: you hate me don't you
Nachomamma8: always did
uctriton00: well I've always loved you

Execute: guile2015

[uctriton00]

Last reads:

It's probably Empking

Another read:

You can't let Nacho run the game like this at the risk of him being scum

[uctriton00]

Also the town owes uctriton an apology for throwing him under the bus.

RXK is my favorite player on the website

*penguin flap*

Nacho, I feel exactly like how Heath Ledger felt. I thought pairing with you would mean we own this game, but then you wanted me kicked out so I suicided myself for you in hopes of us winning.

I would have gladly shot you but my conscious prevented me from doing so.

[uctriton00]

And I wasn't trying to be scummy. Actually I was telling the truth in my defense post. Honestly I'm still new to online mafia, and playing in real life, I like coming in and being "yep it's this dude, let's all vote". That's how I do town.

[uctriton00]

And kudos to Empking for catching that AI slip.