NY 159: RUST game over

[PeregrineV]

So Angry bad for gambiting, but roflcopter's reaction was absolutely horrible. As soon as Angry claimed a guilty, ROFL had the worst nervous reaction.

Why, PeregrineV, do you say that?

I'm glad you asked.

If you are town, and someone claims a guilty on you, then you know they are lying. So they are scum trying to get you lynched. So you say so, and vote them. This was ROFL response:

well angrypidgeon do you agree to die when i flip town?

ps i know why there was no successful scum kill night one

So he immediately counters asking Angry if he is agreeing to die when he flips town? If scum just faked a guilty on you, why would you start bargaining with them?
The second sentence expands the bargain to share knowledge with the rest of the town. At that point to me it sounded like:


Post 988 continues speaking to Angry like Angry is just "misguided town", instead of the scum he has to be (because remember, you have a town role PM)

The vote finally comes, but by that time I read it as confusion and not wanting to make it a 1-one-1 with a town player. Which is a huge scum reaction.

The rest is more of the same.

Next, he's a JOAT also.
Then, he's a bulletproof JOAT.
Then, he's not used any abilities.
Then he has Roleblocking to use on Angry, who is scum (see reaction to guilty above).

When questioned, here is the response:

@Rofl- why was there no scumkill night 1?

because i am a jack of all trades and one of my abilities is

1-shot bulletproof

As in, you give that ability to someone else? Who did you give it to?

what? no. how do you get that from that? i just don't even.

i was bulletproof. it was a one shot ability. i did not get any confirmation on whether or not a shot was taken at me, but in light of the fact that i pushed through the lynch on the mafia goon and was still gunning for the mafia doctor going into night one it makes perfect fucking sense that they shot at me. and then there was no kill but the vig kill that night.

Just so we're clear, you are claiming to be 1-shot Bulletproof Town JOAT?

that is correct. i am a town joat. i have at least two 1-shot abilities. one of them was/is 1-shot bulletproof. i may or may not have used any other ability(ies) i have. since my lynch is going to get pushed through based on ap's "guilty" i will not claim these other abilities no matter what. i will say that none of my other abilities have thus far amounted to anything useful (but i thought that drawing a nightkill to my bp was pretty damn useful)

But, I just finished Mini 1382, with this neat little exchange:

I am a jack of all trades. I have four powers(joat).

I can only use my abilities twice(x shot).

It's really not that complicated. It's clearly normal.

There's nothing to gain by revealing the info. If I do reveal it, it could increase my liklihood to be night killed. Right now, only one or two people are calling for it, so unless there is some overriding reason(more people asking for it), I'm not going to do it.

So the Lake Villagers got in agreement and decided they could do without a monkey among the crowd. "No more Curious George look-alikes"! They yelled in unison.

And the death sentence was proclaimed, and before the Villagers all came to an agreement with the execution, MonkeyMan576 was choked to death.

MonkeyMan576

,

2-Shot Mafia Jack of all Trades

has been lynched on Day One.

It is now

Night One

and will last

Seventy Two

(72) hours, starting 15:45 New York Time (GMT-4).

Deadline

: October 6, 2012 3:45 PM New York Time. (GMT-4)

Countdown to deadline

: (expired on 2012-10-06 15:45:00)

So, worse claim/series of escalating claims/reaction ever.

And since then, he's been asked to claim multiple times, but hasn't.

This whole thing saddens me since I had a pretty townish read on rofl most of the first 2 days.

Vote: ROFLcopter

[AngryPidgeon]

^Possible good posting. I'll read when not at lunch. CKD/Rofl team is 100% possible. I was kind of doubting it in my mind since they have both claimed something. But CKD is still acting scummy as hell and if they are scum/scum then Rofl calling for a mass claim makes sense because he knew CKd could debunk my push.

[AngryPidgeon]

I mean honestly it does sound like Rofl knew I was gambiting but didn't expressly want to call me out on it since a CKD claim would flip the pressure on me.

[Rob14]

Note who are our JOAT claims.

CKD, rofl, and me. And yet rofl and CKD have both suggested JOAT is a theme of the game, so they must be relatively confirmed by being one. This hasn't sat right with me since Day 2, but it was a useless observation if only CKD was claiming JOAT in addition to me. Now that rofl is also claiming JOAT, it's something worth looking at.

If CKD flips non-JOAT (read: scum), then rofl is lying scum for this reason and his weird-ass reaction.

[AngryPidgeon]

CKD is almost certainly a JoaT, but I mean 1xTrack, 1x

JK

RB is totally possible for scum.

[AngryPidgeon]

So he immediately counters asking Angry if he is agreeing to die when he flips town? If scum just faked a guilty on you, why would you start bargaining with them?

THIS. I was having trouble quantifying it when I pointed it out, but its very heavy appeal to fear. If rofl genuinely felt he was town and I am scum, then why would he appeal to me and not the town?

[PeregrineV]

I mean honestly it does sound like Rofl knew I was gambiting but didn't expressly want to call me out on it since a CKD claim would flip the pressure on me.

I don't understand what you mean here.

[malpascp]

He just said the same thing you did.

Already told you what I think about this.

[PeregrineV]

Rob & fake Gunsmith stuff-
More acceptable if town, because it creates WIFOM among the scum. He's already claimed a PR, and if he's town and scum can't kill him, then that's their problem.
It would have been nice to just let the claim ride and gets Malp's real reaction instead of mentioning the vig "out" you gave him. But, you claim Malp is town becasue of his reaction. What do you think of ROFL's reaction? How does it compare to Malp's?

[Rob14]

Working on my CKD wall...wait for it...

NOW!

[PeregrineV]

He just said the same thing you did.

Already told you what I think about this.

You said this.

AP. You are pretty much screwed. Don't do that gambit. Just die. Please.

P-Edit: @rofl: didn't read lol
stuff AP quoted from rofl is correct IMO, Rob is town.

Yes this is a Pre-Edit again: AP is scum. I'm placing my vote now. Rob is town, rofl could be hard bussing but dunno.

Vote: AngryPidgeon

This says nothing.

First sentence, you are talking to Angry like he's town.
By the last sentence, you say he's scum.

Feel free to add reasons etc in there.

[AngryPidgeon]

Malp, were you aware that you are voting conf-town?

[AngryPidgeon]

I mean honestly it does sound like Rofl knew I was gambiting but didn't expressly want to call me out on it since a CKD claim would flip the pressure on me.

I don't understand what you mean here.

I'm saying imagine you are rofl and you are town. AP declares that you are conf-guilty and pushes you. What do you do? What did rofl do?

[PeregrineV]

I mean honestly it does sound like Rofl knew I was gambiting but didn't expressly want to call me out on it since a CKD claim would flip the pressure on me.

I don't understand what you mean here.

I'm saying imagine you are rofl and you are town. AP declares that you are conf-guilty and pushes you. What do you do? What did rofl do?

Yes, that's the whole point of 1275.

Also, 1280 good.

[AngryPidgeon]

Oh, you quoted my other post in 1281, Im dumb.

I'm saying if rofl/ckd are a team then Rofl would KNOW I was lying and would KNOW that a CKD claim would make me look bad.

[malpascp]

Who the hell is conf-town and why do you think my first sentence was directed to town-AP?

[AngryPidgeon]

Im conftown. Cheery Gunsmith'd me. So either make a SK case on me despite their being no NKs to validate that, make a maf doctor case on me despite the Zabriel flip, or vote someone not me.

[Rob14]

ALL HAIL THE MIGHTY CKD WALL!

vote Demon Core

for the stick in my ass.

(insert some sort of I told you so line here)

First vote on potential scum-buddy. This is really minor, but I often do this as scum and I've seen many others do it as well. It registers as a ping on my scumdar.

I think I can see it now.

VOTE: zabriel

Wow. Miller claim already.

Seems legit. BC=Obvtown

.

I was mostly commenting on how he was claiming miller in first post, and that's like one of two schools of thought on how to play Miller. But it was so to the letter it was just kind of funny.

I also wasn't sure if it was a legit claim or not.

These two posts do not equate.

Yeah, sure it looks like he's backing off since i took heat. He's attempting to distance himself from me.

Zab, can you please explain these two posts?

BC, can you please explain what you mean by "distancing"? I have only heard this term in reference to scum distancing themselves from another.

what is he distancing himself from?

Zab's crazy suspicious posts register as "hey, can you please explain this?" giving his scum-partner a chance to explain away his scumminess while BC is automatically implied to be scum due to word choice. It's an inconsistent standard of how much pressure is applied for how much scumminess is showing. Of course, the conf-scum is getting off easier than the conf-town on his standard.

why would Zabtown "distance" himself from someone he doesnt know is scum?

why would anything BC(you)town do "implicate" Zab?

these two terms are not sitting right with me.

waiting on an answer from Zab

also

unvote

Keeps questioning word choice and keeps trying to get Zab to explain himself away instead of building a case against him or voting to apply pressure and force an answer. Not typical town behavior.

uhhhh?

I claim miller.
Zab says "yeah, BC is legit town"
Then when Zab gets confronted about his statement, he backs off because he knows he could be lynched because of my poor play.

It's not the same kind of distancing between scum partners in my opinion. It's more of me being a leper and no one wants to be connected to me, town or scum.

this doesnt make any sense...IF you are telling the truth and you get lynched (flipping town)...why would Zab be worried and change his stance to "I am not sure if the claim is legit"? it seems to me, he would keep his stance. as town that doesnt make any sense. now if Zab knew you were scum and if you were lynched (flipping scum) he WOULD distance himself from you with that post.

Now he begins implying that if BC is town, then Zab is probtown while if BC is scum, then Zab is probscum. This sets the stage for a lynch on BC to get info. It's an attempt to get a BC flip of town and get Zab some cred that he doesn't deserve. He does things like this in earlier posts I quoted too - he always says "IF BC is scum, THEN Zab is probably distancing" or something like that. It all moves towards a lynch of BC, but he's not really pressuring his scum-partner Zab at all because the BC-flip would make his "case" against Zab nonexistent.

I am not sure why I am not understanding what exactly you are saying. I dont know if you are back tracking or if I am completely misunderstanding you.

"The only thing that

i have done

that

would make people believe

that Zab and I are on a scum team together is if we had pre-game talk and came up with this huge ass gambit about me claiming miller. "

What

have you done

, in this game,

to make people believe

that you and Zab have had pregame talk?

More word-choice nonsense.

to me it is sounding like slips. but I just cant imagine "slips" being this obvious.

I agree that if one flips scum, the other is probably scum...

More of what I mentioned earlier. Note how this helps scum since they know the alignments.

Scenario #1: We lynch BC first, flips town. No case remains on Zab.
Scenario #2: We lynch Zab, flips scum. Well, if one is scum, the other MUST be scum, so we lynch BC-town the next day. If Zab's going to get lynched anyway for his suspicious shit, this is the best possible scenario for scum - it means an informationless mislynch on Day 2.

well my gut says vote BC...

I actually took Zab's "miller...OBVtown" post a different way (will explain after he answers my question)..

want Zab to answer my question first before I decide who to vote.

Still giving Zab chance after chance to explain himself and he even directly hints that he expects Zab's response to dismiss all of the evidence against him. He basically already has his conclusion of Zab-town and is looking for evidence to fit it rather than gathering evidence to form a conclusion. The process of scum-hunting is all backwards. Major scum-tell IMO.

Not quoting ISO #11 because it's super long and will take up space, but he votes BC and then says, exact quote, "when he flips scum, Zab your next." [which the grammar nazi in me must point out is the wrong use of "your"]. This is just another example of the stuff I've said earlier.

Claiming Miller i guess.

It really feels like you're trying to put words in my mouth now.

wait what? I am not putting fucking words in your mouth I trying to understand what the fuck you are saying.

btw "claiming miller" in no way links you to "pregame scum chat with Zab"....I think you are backtracking, I caught you in at least one slip, and now you are trying a different tactic by discrediting me?

what words am I putting in your mouth? quote the post.

I said it feel's like your putting words in my mouth.

yeah thats what I thought

so you cant quote the post that makes you "feel" like I am putting words in your mouth?

fuck nevermind, I have a feeling that I am going to get another dodge or backtrack or strangely worded reply sending me into another vortex of of shit.

also I want to meta something BC said.

WAY over-emotional. Upon his first contact with BC questioning his motives, he reacts in a strangely angry way. Scummy.

this Zab lynch is too fucking easy...a wagon built up on him based on a sarcastic remark?

bullshit.

AP I am curious, am I still scum when/if he flips town? I would like to know before the day ends?

Woah, wait a second here. Wasn't Zab "next" once we lynched BC just a moment ago? Now, when he faces actual pressure, you're against his lynch? Welcome, folks, to Scum City!

Gosh you are a ball of noise. You should bus DemonCore.

If BC flips scum then that makes you less scummy. Lol, are you implicating that BC and I are a team? Because I sure did an excellent job of getting any towncred out of that scenario!

VOTE: Curious Karma Dog

NM, bus yourself.

thank you, that wasnt so hard now was it.

or maybe it was, because I got that vote now didnt I...

Don't even try to claim that was a OMGUS vote. He's been consistently saying you seemed scum since he caught up with the thread. You're being over-aggressive and coming across very badly for it right now.

lol, did I say it? he HAS been attacking me...but it was only after I pressured him to answer a question he avoided twice I got the vote....thought it was funny.

He heavily suggests OMGUS, probably hoping someone picks it up. When I call him on the nonsense, he backs off and says that he never said it was. It's oddly inconsistent.

I am now so fucking frustrated, I sort of want to be taken to a point of a claim, as a big fuck you to AP...oh shit, did I just soft claim after one vote? take me to -1 and find out. (note: I realize this is an immature and probably anti-town attitude to take, so punish me)

ObvScum right here. He suggests he's a PR and actually wants to claim. Why would town WANT to claim? No reason.

dont play dumb..

you would only be rolling in town cred AFTER a BC flip. maybe a vig would target BC to see...or with two miller claims, the town might lynch BC to see....and look, "BC is town and I defended him"....

This post was talking to AP, by the way. But seriously, what happened to being sure BC was scum? If BC is as scummy as opportunistic CKD was saying he was earlier, why is he willing to deal in this hypothetical? It's because he knew BC was town all along.

ISO #37 is his vote on DC. It's also long, you can look in his ISO for it if you want. Nothing inherently suspicious about it.

DC claimed cop....I dont believe it.

I will take the hammer.

unvote, vote DC

so now that you are dead....DC, were you really a cop?

Silly attempt to get a DC that was going to inevitably be lynched to admit being scum in thread. If it had worked, he would be rolling in town cred. When Taz ruined it in subsequent posts, he gets really, really angry as indicated in ISO #39-#41 (look them up). Due to the crazy emotion and attempt to get town cred when DC was going to be lynched anyway, most likely, I consider this exchange a tad scummy.

if you are town,

in the future, if you see someone making a "mistake"..especially someone who have been playing over 5 years, before you jump in to express how on top of the game you are, take a moment, and see what happens. do you see the value of what I trying to do, be it a small chance, was still a chance?

And if you weren't convinced before, look at that last line. He practically begs for an acknowledgement of his town cred from his latest stunt. Town wouldn't need to do that.

first I am also a jack of trades with two one shot abilities (sort of confirms rob's claim)

one was a tracker, which I used. this person did not target zab last night. do not want to say who...yet. I would like to see who you said first...if you name this person, than you are lying. I will claim after, for this person can confirm if I am lying or not.

the other..I will keep to myself. (I would provide if it "countered" anything currently in the game)

Claims JOAT and says it confirms my claim (implying that my claim would also confirm his, kind of). This sits very wrong with me for reasons I explained a few posts back.

The rest of his ISO are short posts that build on each other, which I can't be bothered quoting. The highlights include trying to get a Lynch all Liars policy going (which would include AP and me, two of the strongest town reads for the entirety of the game). Note what isn't in his ISO - any acknowledgement of my past cases/pushes against him. He doesn't want to address them because they're correct. Town could address and explain motivations behind their actions. He can't, because his actions aren't town motivated.

AND THUS ENDS THE CKD ISO!

Note a few things from DC's ISO (yeah, there's more, sorry, I promise not to use quotes):

ISO #0: Votes CKD. Pings for the same reason as CKD's ISO #0. The fact that they both did it makes it seem sketchy to me.

Before ISO #18, he has CKD as potentially scum. At post #18, he flip-flops on this with no explanation and puts CKD in his town reads. Makes no sense. Note that he did the EXACT same thing, also with no reason, to Zab in ISO #19. He didn't flip-flop from scum to town or town to scum on ANY other players at this time. Just Zab and CKD. Hmm.

[AngryPidgeon]

Spoiler:

[malpascp]

I'm more freakin conf-town than that. With this many town PRs and prob scum PRs, and fake-claims and shit, that doesn't make you conf-town at all. You are pushing too much on the fact that I MUST assume you are a SK.

Will analyze "mighty wall" and etc. Later. I got quick-lynched in another game and I'm tired already. Don't ask me stuff.

P-Edit: AP loading that image almost made my laptop crash. Please don't make my laptop crash.

[AngryPidgeon]

I. have. a. Gunsmith. Negative. On. Me.

[AngryPidgeon]

You only wish you were that conftown

[TheReverend]

If AP is scum then so surely is cheerydog. Can't see it myself, unless they think both of them can cruise to the end dripping on town cred. Only takes a lynch of one to nail them both, so doesn't seem very optimal. I'm happy AP is town.

I'd like to know how malp is conf town, because I haven't got the slightest fucking clue what he is.

[Rob14]

Now that I've walled CKD, we need approx. three more votes on him.

Cheery is town, AP is town, Rev is probtown.

[PeregrineV]

Now that I've walled CKD, we need approx. three more votes on him.

Cheery is town, AP is town, Rev is probtown.

ckd is not scum. i promise.

What about this?


Also, I'd like CKD to come in and respond. There's no reason to lynch this quickly.