Mini 1390: Game Over

[nhammen]

Still searching for a replacement for Radelle.

Vote Count 1.9

TheTrollie(5): Idiotking, Deltabacon, Cheery Dog, Abaddon, kwll
Radelle(3): _Sherlock_, toxictaipan, Tommy
Abaddon(2): Slandaar, Radelle
JacobSavage(1): TheTrollie
kwll(1): JacobSavage

not voting (1): absta101

With 13 players alive, it takes 7 votes to lynch.
Deadline is in

(expired on 2012-11-17 17:30:00)

MOD you have trollie down twice with me having a single vote...I should counted with everyone else

Whoops. Fixed. I also reposted the corrected vote vount above.

unvote

I will still count this unvote of yours in the next vote count, unless you revote TheTrollie before then.

[absta101]

@Slandaar - That took you awhile to answer. I'm surprised.
---
VOTE: Kwll

I am afraid I am inclinded to side with you absta in this case,

Why "afraid"? Why not just "I agree"?

[JacobSavage]

As in I would like to be able to add something more to the discussion rather just hoping along with your case, but in this case i couldn't find anything more to add, hence why "afraid"

[TheTrollie]

ok, it seems my jacob thing isnt picking up steam. When I did my most recent round of ISOs it became pretty clear that I was wrong about Jacob, but i didnt want to divulge that till I gave ppl time to react to my vote. doesn't look like thats going anywhere

UNVOTE: JacobSavage

with that said my strongest scum read is now Abbadon for the reasons i mentioned earlier
VOTE: Abbadon

I gotta go back to toxic but i dont think ill have time to do that till thursday.

CD is starting to concern me. I cannot shake his LYLO post off as being the same unreasonable stuff i've seen from him and the other players like him in the past. Recognizing your own inability to scumhunt well, and acknowledging that you cannot shake off scum reads, AND all the while still having confidence to be on a large wagon doesnt sit well. I think its very possible that Cheery is setting himself up to be in LYLO with this post. He now has given himself the ability to live to LYLO as town. like, now if he is alive in LYLO he is setting it up to be that it is NOT because he is scum and thus could not be NKed, but instead because he is scummy.

@CD: if you think being alive in-and-of-itself goes against your win condition, why not vote yourself? I get this question is kinda dumb but if you dont trust yourself why in the world should we let you live?

I still contend that CD is a bad D1 lynch, but that post is bad no matter how u look at it.

[TheTrollie]

@ absta & Jacob. Sherlock and I have shared our reasons for thinking Kwll is more likely to be town based on his posts, yet you two assert that he is scum. What are your reasons? Could u tell us why you believe our analysis is mistaken?

[toxictaipan]

No. My version was correct.

"NO! I'M RIGHT!!" Really, that's the best you can do? Can you get anyone to agree with you?

with that said my strongest scum read is now Abbadon for the reasons i mentioned earlier

Explain your case against Abaddon to me, please. You only listed reasons with your reads, you didn't point to which posts were scummy.

@CD: if you think being alive in-and-of-itself goes against your win condition, why not vote yourself? I get this question is kinda dumb but if you dont trust yourself why in the world should we let you live?

Just when I get a town read on someone, they go and do something scummy to make me second-guess myself... Are you seriously suggesting that Cheery Dog should self-vote? I mean, seriously?

Preview Edit:
@TheTrollie: I've already explained to you why your analysis is bad. Now, I'm not convinced he's scum, but I'm definitely not clearing him based on such poor reasoning.

[TheTrollie]

@toxic, hence why I directed my question to absta and Jacob, and

not

to you. also I think i responded to your reason against townkwll

i explained my case. Explanations dont require walls, i do not have time to make a wall right now, plus, I dont think abbadon's scum case would really benefit by a wall. When i decide to procrastinate by spending tons of time on MS or when im done with my work ill show you examples of where abbadon does what i am saying he does, if that will really help you.

right, my point is that self-voting makes no sense, but that he is providing us with analysis that says "I am no good at this game and should not be kept alive to LYLO" I am not suggesting he self-vote, i am suggesting he try to improve his game rather than justifying his play by admitting he is incapable of playing to the town win condition.

[toxictaipan]

Your response to me about kwll was just as bad as the initial reasoning, because it was exactly the same as your initial reasoning. You're essentially saying town-aligned players don't try as hard as scum to provide coherent arguments because they don't have to. That's ridiculous and illogical. Do you find it scummy that I have better rhetorical skills than kwll?

I'm not asking for a wall, and you're absolutely right in that explanations don't require walls. That's why I fully expect you to be able to provide a concise case against Abaddon instead of a single sentence backed by no evidence. You can say he's scummy all you want for any reason you want, but if I don't know which posts you're talking about, good luck convincing me (or any logical person) he's scum. You said he backs off easily, piggybacks on other people's objections, and is reaching to make cases. I say, "Show me where."

[_Sherlock_]

I personally think that kwll is trying to play with the metagame; therefore, kwll is town.

Explain this to me; what do you mean by playing with the metagame?

Oops, that was supposed to be "not trying to play with the metagame."

I don't think kwll is purposefully playing against his meta from his other game; therefore, since he's not playing similar to that game, he's probably town.

[Deltabacon]

I really seriously don't like Kwll's posts, but something doesn't rub me the wrong way as much as Trollie's collective scumtells.

[nhammen]

Kinetic replaces Radelle effective immediately.

[Cheery Dog]

@CD: if you think being alive in-and-of-itself goes against your win condition, why not vote yourself? I get this question is kinda dumb but if you dont trust yourself why in the world should we let you live?

(because I don't know what I'm on about half the time)

I don't think me being alive goes against my win condition, it may just also go for other people's win conditions if I'm playing poorly. Which in my history of LYLO's is true.

If I were to selfvote because I doubt my own abilities this much, I'd be better off not playing the game and replacing out.

If you notice I orginally brought it up was because I thought you were wanting to have a weak townread on me to then flip if we both made it to LYLO. I'm seeing your whole thing as a towncred gaining idea for when I am lynched (which happens a lot as you say with players like me) and flip town.

[Kinetic]

Unvote

Reading.

[kwll]

the view I gave on Abaddon was one I came to my own conclusion which I listed post by post...Cheery, I feel like almost you are getting frustrated or losing hope. Not really anything in your post that specific screams it but it just feels that way from the tone of your post.

[Tommy]

absta101, what do you think of Deltabacon?

[Slandaar]

Note to self; meta kwll.

[absta101]

absta101, what do you think of Deltabacon?

Town.

[Tommy]

Why?

[toxictaipan]

@Slandaar: What is your current opinion regarding TheTrollie? Just did a quick ISO and didn't see a definite stance either way.

[Idiotking]

Blatant prod dodge. I'll try and make a more useful post sometime tonight. I want to revise my reads a bit, like Sherlock suggested, because I need to see who I actually want to pursue at the moment.

[absta101]

Why?

Mainly due to his voting pattern. He doesn't jump on large waggons.

Sorry, I was mistaken. He's a null read.

[TheTrollie]

It might be good to get a second pair of eyes on this, but I have a pretty strong town read on Delta based on our interaction regarding CD. ISO our interactions and find that chunk of posts (its pretty substantial). The way he stays with his argument seems genuine to me

[JacobSavage]

@trollie. Its a combination of two things, 1 I found his play similar to the game when he was scum. 2 he just gets me all rubbing in all the wrong ways.

[kwll]

@ slandaar...I dont get that statment. "meta kwll"

[nhammen]

Page bump.