Micro 121: SS9 (Game over!)

[Blueberry]

Well, my opinion is more important to me.

[Cheery Dog]

@mod, should plurality lynches come into play on a super saint, who is killed?

The most recent person to vote for them who is still voting for them would be killed.

I realise what I actually meant to ask now, there is something in that line that still confuses me

If the last vote cast on a lynch wagon is removed before deadline, and that lynch still goes due to plurality, does it still count as the last vote before the super-saint was lynched?

[Wisdom]

"who is still voting for them". So no.

[Cheery Dog]

I'm just changing it to want I meant to ask in the first place.

(I'm going to stop asking questions that are already answered, obviously I still don't know the setup well enough.

[Wisdom]

Cheery, who is scum? Why aren't you voting scum and instead settle for null reads?

[Cheery Dog]

Slimer possibly, but not sure at the moment, mala is also a possibility as such I am voting her current.

Piety sure, you, lincolm and blueberry are town though.

I'm settling for null reads because scum reads haven't got past that stage yet. I think it's likely scum had ben discussing stratified for themselves in the scum qt instead of general strategizing with the town at the start of the game.

[Wisdom]

Don't you think some of the scum would try to participate in town's strategizing regardless?

[Cheery Dog]

Don't you think some of the scum would try to participate in town's strategizing regardless?

All depends on who actually is scum and how much you're been talking. I find lincolm and you town because of your large amount of early game posting, blueberry slightly less so, but his opinion on my post about not having correctly read the one thing I'm meant to know is about is just really town.

[Lincolm]

This is probably the worst post ever I've seen coming from you. I'm disappoint.

Originally, I didn't full read my own role PM (I just read my role and how to confirm), but I read the scum role PM in first page (to gain more information) and I read the wiki only, but I checked my role when Wicked posted about the plan if someone unvote in deadline. Meaning, everyone can do that mistake if they are lazy. (because I'm lazy also)

Somehow... Dunno... I like that random vote... Scum want to make a case then vote early as fast as they can then (so they not hammer), but I don't see that from Cheery. Well...

I don't think CDog would be so scummy if he was scum (fallacy, I know), and as such I don't think he's the best lynch. I'd maybe consider to have him be the hammerer.

So, you agree with Kmd's plan?

That's like the definition of 'too scummy to be scum', the logical fallacy. If somebody's scummy they are lynched.

I like that fallacy though. I ever once use that before. (In my first newbie game)

Don't you think some of the scum would try to participate in town's strategizing regardless?

I think yes. If not, scums cannot manipulate it. But, If I'm scum, I will discuss it first in QT but still post in thread about (fake) hunting scum, then after the other agree, we will begin posting about the plan. WIFOM thought.

[Wisdom]

So, you agree with Kmd's plan?

Yes, I think we all agree anyways. As I said, this plan is not something that kmd came up with, it existed already as a recommended way to deal with this setup.

[Lincolm]

So, you agree with Kmd's plan?

Yes, I think we all agree anyways. As I said, this plan is not something that kmd came up with, it existed already as a recommended way to deal with this setup.

I just got bad feeling about this plan... I feel I'm going to be manipulated... I'm not recommended it in LyLo. (Meaning, I'm still not full agree it)

[theslimer3]

The post 9 scumteam theory was a joke, for anyone who is not aware. I was hoping it would help get the ball rolling.

Post 12- Lincolm, why did you vote for me in this post? And do you feel that this vote was more helpful/productive than your vote for Kmd? If so, why?

maybe with all votes, put in parenthesis who you think should be killed if the lynch is on a supersaint. We basically have two chances to lynch scum each day. the lynch target could be scum. If not, they could kill scum. If we effectively have a second lynch count, we can control both chances by consensus.

I agree with this. If we can execute this strategy effectively, then we essentially have eight lynches to kill three scum. Two ideas I'd like to add about lynching procedure;
1. If we are lynching player A, then we have to choose player B to hammer under the assumption that player A is town. Just as an example, if player B is the next most popular candidate for death mostly because he seems connected to obvscum player A, then it would not make sense to have player B hammer. There's one other interesting idea I had regarding how to determine the player that hammers, but I still need to think about it- also it would be a more effective idea in later days.
2. We need to be fairly quick in deciding who we lynch. I see two situations which could turn out badly if we cannot reach a decision in time. a.) A mafia goon on the end of the largest bandwagon unvotes just before deadline to cause the death of the next-to-last voter. b.) Somebody refuses to hammer not long before deadline.

I personally believe we should have our lynch decided 3 or 4 days before deadline.


Post 16- Lincolm, you say there is at least one scum on your bandwagon (Cheery Dog, Kmd, Lincolm, Blueberry). Why did you say that? The only serious non-Lincolm votes on this bandwagon were from Kmd and Blueberry- are you saying you think at least one of those two people are mafia?

Post 17- I'm not a fan of this post from Blueberry. Firstly, how did the quotes from Lincolm imply that he was mafia? Secondly, what kind of answer were you expecting?

I believe the ones who were fast to call it a joke are the most likely ones to be scum though - town could have let it go to see the reactions. On this note, Blueberry and kmd are the ones who instantly treated it as a joke, with kmd not only calling it a joke, but including it in reasons in order to vote you (Lincolm).

Other things about kmd:

-The inclusion of the last paragraph in 13 looks pre-prepared, something that he had thought of posting in his first serious post.

-kmd was the first one to start the "Why (name)?" chain - Why did you need to ask for explaining regarding a RVS vote?

Wisdom, I have a hard time believing that you believe in the first paragraph of this quote, considering Kmd's vote for Lincolm was in part due to Lincolm's reaction to my joke. Also, can you elaborate on the bolded point, please?

Post 40- Cheery Dog, my point was that Lincolm's vote looked strange because there was a space between the word 'vote' and the colon. People use vote tags all the time. I've revealed that my scumteam theory was not serious.

Post 52- Wisdom, why do you find Lincolm suspicious? Also, you've switched your vote from Kmd (the person who started the bandwagon on Lincolm) to Lincolm. Do you think they are both mafia?

@Cheery Dog- You say Wisdom is suspicious for agreeing with a point that you only half support. Can you explain why that is? You and Wisdom had a conversation about it on page 3, but I did not understand your arguments.

Post 83- It bothers me that I don't know who Huntress suspects. Huntress, who do you suspect? Also, why is eagerness from Wisdom suspicious?

Post 86- Kmd4390, do you think it's suspicious that Lincolm took my post 9 seriously? Also, why ignore Cheery Dog's similar view?

My plan for town to control hammers is the kind of thing where scum might go to a QT and say "hey we have to shoot this down. Someone vote him". I'm disturbed that it's not even being discussed. I'm guessing the other scum won't talk about my plan negatively because they don't want to be too obvious and all in agreement in thread.

How likely do you think this is? Also, do you see Wisdom and Lincolm as potential partners? Or are they just individually suspicious to you?

Woah I just realized that this is a 3 scum in a 9 player game that has town vengekills. This is over poweredly scumsided O.O

I disagree with this completely. If we use the supersaint mechanic as a second lynch, then we basically have eight lynches to hit three mafia.

@theslimer3- Do you suspect anyone other than Lincolm?


Some thoughts-
I think Lincolm is probably town. I've seen scum fake fearlessness before, but Lincolm's self vote and response to the pressure seems a little over the top to be a scum gambit. I believe that he doesn't care about the negative attention. I would like to know who he suspects and would like a response to my questions, but as of right now I'd be surprised if he turned out to be scum.

Cheery Dog's fake hammer was pro-town but I'm hesitant to call him town because IIRC I've only ever seen scum do the same thing. However, I think it is townish how, later on, Cheery Dog discredits his own fake hammer- if he was trying to look like town, then I don't see why he would do that. Overall, neutral leaning town.

Blueberry looks pretty scummy. If you read him in isolation, you'll see he's been active. However, he's pretty much coasted by on his Lincolm vote, asked questions, and hasn't really given any other thoughts since. I also had issue with his post 17.

Wisdom looks even more suspicious. His vote for Kmd4390 seemed poorly justified and his vote for Lincolm looks opportunistic. Also, I find it strange that he has suspicion of both Kmd4390 and Lincolm given their interactions.

Having said that, I'm going to

Unvote. Vote: Wisdom

.

Other than Lincolm, atm, not really. His beginning move sucked all my attention to him.

When you called out Blueberry for confirming last, what did you exactly mean by it? There's different reasons for people to want to call out non-confirmed last.

I voted Blueberry for confirming last... for lack of a better reason. Usually at game start I would make a weak accusation regarding a previous post but there were none. I'm aware of the fact that scum have day talk and thus no motivation to prolong the confirmation stage, but I was also just anxious for the game to start- I haven't played in months. Why do you ask?

I'll be honest,

I didn't read anything

. And if I didn't read the game thus far (got bored) then I'd mess this game all up xD

Dx

I read it this time

, I swear

...did you or did you not read the thread?

Yes, I meant that I didn't read it at first, then I got bored and read it >.>

Personally, I do see lincolm as scum for the self vote and asking for the hammer vote because it's extremely EXTREMELY antitown. Not only will scum not be stupid enough to hammer, town is the most likely to and if he's scum, he's relying on someone to point this out and use it against ourselves. So we can only lose at the lylo.

You are too exaggerated it. Why it is anti-town? If I'm town and the hammer town, it isn't. And everyone already post and no one point that out. Do you think quickhammer not gonna happen? Boo. I see many Micros done this a lot. Also, this is nightless, if no one hammer, the game is not going anywhere.

Why you don't think I will unvote?

Effing game is so freaking overpowered it's crazy.
I don't think we should lynch Lincolm just yet. I want to know what the HELL he's thinking for having such a scumplay. Either he's still acting nubbish or he didn't read the setup as well as we all should have (I sure didn't)

Woah I just realized that this is a 3 scum in a 9 player game that has town vengekills. This is over poweredly scumsided O.O

^Isn't this acting nubbish? Tell me why I'm acting nubbish because I don't do it.

I'll admit myself to being a bit nubbish. Hell, I've messed up at least 3 games alone xD
But as far as scum goes, tell me what do we get out of 2 town deaths? If someone hammered you, the only person that would have been was a townie. That's you dead, and him dead. Day 2. No good info, no strong leads, just you messing around and suicide bombing (assuming that you're town to even pull such a stunt)

Why it is anti-town? If I'm town and the hammer town, it isn't.

It's not anti town for town you to have another town killed?

Having dead town is as anti-town as you can get.

Exactly.

So Lincolm, who is scum? I see signs of suspecting kmd in your post but you didn't vote him.

My top scumread is Kmd and Slimer. No change about that. I still doubt with my other read.

I don't like vote in this setup. I like to hammer them if nobody want, even in LyLo. And if I'm in L-1, no one should hammer me except them.

Vote in this setup just give me bad feeling everywhere.

Elaborate. What about me really does make me this scummy person you're trying to percieve everyone to see.

My current reads:

Lincolm is town. Not only his play looks really different than his scumplay, the whole thing with being at L-1, being cool and everything clearly shows he's going for helpful reactions. His last post further convinces me - he knows scum will vote early to avoid hammering, so he doesn't want to vote yet - he offers to hammer if one of his two scumspects reach L-1. Is this just words? I don't think so, it seems genuine. The cases people have made on him are bullshit, and the only thing I agreed with for a while was his stopping of CDog's fakehammer test - but on second thought that's null.

theslimer3 is probably scum. His play reminds me of his scumgame. His constant "omg this setup is so scumsided" is more likely to come from scum-slimer than town-slimer; town-slimer is usually more innocent, less setup-evaluating, more scumhunting. Not much content from him so far either, so I'll give him a chance to impress me.

Are you using Metas to determine scum? You should know that my first scum game was forever ago, and probably Lincolm's last time with you shows something differen't. Though I don't really know him all that well.

And maybe KMD is his scumbuddy and the only reason he wants to hammer him is because he feels safe. You seem to only be thinking in a one track mind, like you always do. Same old wizzy :'3

So here it is my read :

Wisdom is town. I already get it from post #32. Based on meta related also, he is a thinker. When he said :

-The inclusion of the last paragraph in 13 looks pre-prepared, something that he had thought of posting in his first serious post.

If he is scum, he won't say this. This is how a thinker town aware with someone plan.

Wicked is town. I like his post #103. Somehow I fine that pretty genuine, especially when he explain more about the plan and when he asked to Huntress. About the plan, if I am scum, I won't say that. He calculate the bad conditions. That's very good.

I don't know too much about Mala, Huntress, and Blueberry... (well, blueberry's account have been made for lynch)

I still doubt about Cheery thought. That fake hammer seems not planned before, he just got that idea in that time (meaning I think he is town). But for me that fake hammer really really bad (meaning I think he is scum). Dunno...

Kmd is scum. I like he mention the plan in #13, but he didn't calculate bad conditions after that. Somehow I find it scum want to manipulate town and that proved in his post #86. Will tell all of you all of bad conditions.

Slimer is scum. His post #98 isn't genuine. Somehow that post feel already prepared before. Almost likely what he said in there is what Kmd said. He didn't see other people, except me. And based on meta related also. What I know, Slimer is reckless and simple person, not post like that.

I actually was being reckless in that first post, I thought I was putting you
at L-1 for no reason and to see the reactions of other people. That didn't really go so well, per say. If I hadn't read, I'd be shot off as completely oblivious to your whole "LETS KILL A TOWNIE!!!!" scheme.

Slimer possibly, but not sure at the moment, mala is also a possibility as such I am voting her current.

Piety sure, you, lincolm and blueberry are town though.

I'm settling for null reads because scum reads haven't got past that stage yet. I think it's likely scum had ben discussing stratified for themselves in the scum qt instead of general strategizing with the town at the start of the game.

Go on o.o

UNVOTE: if I haven't already.


So guys, lets all play the scum game. I'll say something about cats, and you've gotta find out if that cat is black or not. If you're wrong, you're scum. If you're right, you're scum. If you're scum, you're still scum. Anyone interested?

[Wisdom]

@Lincolm
For now, I believe we should vote who we believe is scum, and only when we decide who are the scummiest will the plan come into play. So don't worry too much about it yet.

pedit: ffs slimer, can't you selectively quote? Gonna read now

[theslimer3]

[Wisdom]

Yeah okay. slimer is scum.

[theslimer3]

Wrong cat, wizzy, it was actually a black one. Now you're scum :c

[Malakittens]

What. Reading Slimers posts was ...

He's defending himself, but Lincoln from Wisdom. Also next time if you are going to use a long quote can you put it in a spoiler or the post number with a link. It made the post seem longer than it actually was.

[Wisdom]

He actually quoted the whole of kmd's post just to answer to one small line.

[theslimer3]

I'll learn to work on tHat later tHen. I'm not really all tHat good witH CatHing up in games

[Wisdom]

slimer, the newbie card only works once. You have played enough games now, so don't act like a newbie. It won't save you.

[theslimer3]

And How am I being nooby, exaCtly?

[Wisdom]

What is your opinion on everything that has happened other than Lincolm's "gambit"?

[theslimer3]

Oh would you look at the time, gotta go catch a plane o.o

[Malakittens]

Uh. So Wisdom asks you a question and you dash off. Interesting. Reminds me of when I asked him a question during last game and got him to replace out. >.>

[Wisdom]

^Does this mean you think he's town?