Open 473: Jungle Republic GAME OVER

[Majiffy]

If there's support for it, I'd meander back to Sky. But that wagon felt dead as hell.

I'll go dig up the bullshit out of his post.

[Sky]

Stating intent to hammer.

Why do you think Aldus is scummy?

Also, what is your current opinion of ProHawk?

Chronic lurking. I know it's not a sure thing, but my last game a blatant lurker turned out to be scum and boy did it make me mad when we didn't lynch him. I also feel the post of substance he finally recently made was just him regurgitating other people's opinions.

And I can't believe you're asking the second question. I wish his wagon won, but it looks like it's not happening. I'm willing to compromise.

as we speak, he intends to hammer ...uh, ald's wagon? As in, "the sooner we can [not lynch me], the better. In a way, I understand that; it's the same thing I'm doing, only under pressure (there's a chance he'll be lynched otherwise. Not so for me), but that's null, as both town and scum want to stay alive.

If this was true I'd hammer right now.

As such, I suggest we pull 4nxiety, auspicious, and you, back onto the Sky wagon. Add me, uctriton would probably join, that's five. Convince Aldsukkel that Sky is the wagon opposite his, that's six. idk who'd hammer it though. Maybe Thor?

And you're gonna need to find another person because my fellow Californian, uct, thinks I'm town. Also, if you really wanna make this happen, you're gonna
A)Come up with a case and
B) Hurry because you guys might just cause a no lynch

Also, where is Thor?

[Majiffy]

Here ya go.

270: Majiffy refuses to make a case on Rob13 since he (Majiffy) prefers to lynch ProHawk, and he can make the case on Rob13 if/when Rob13 becomes scummier. Of course, what if it's Day 2 and Majiffy dies and Rob13 is scum? I don't like this "not worried about being NK'd" mentality. For bonus points, it is also an excuse to not give content.

Misses the point, then takes two opportunities to backhandedly discredit me.

So I get to Majiffy and Thor's big argument. Well, Majiffy won hands down, but does that make Thor scum? Not really. What is the scum motivation for Thor to make the initial statement (calling out people with weak PH votes)? Not very much, though I will grant that the vagueness could be scummy. However, it doesn't make sense for Thor-scum to let things get blown out of proportion relative to what the initial argument was even about. Why would Thor dance around Majiffy's questioning when the benefits to do doing so outweigh the cost of getting into such an extended argument?

Says he read and understood the argument, but then why ask questions that have already been covered? The whole scenario was pretty clear-cut. This is just a cop-out to avoid taking any actual stance.

My answer is that I really wanted to vote the Mod because he actually showed up in the vote counts, which was unexpected. Past that, there's nothing more to it.

This just seems really awkward although I'm not certain it's anything alignment dependent. It just really bugs me because I can't work out the logic behind it.

Maybe it's ATE. It's also true. I think when I defend myself I inadvertently dig a deeper hole, regardless of alignment.
If you think I

can

defend myself, then find some games where I came under heavy pressure and decide for yourself. Or I can find them for you, if you want. (I just don't know if you trust me to find them for you, since obviously I can cherry pick if I so choose.)

This is a pile of horse shit. I could elaborate on why if it isn't slapping you in the face, but I know it is to me.

Thor's 450 misreps Majiffy's case -- he states it as basically, "Majiffy is calling me scum for using the word "prove" and because he doesn't like my evidence," when it is quite clearly, "Thor is dodging around questions like crazy, which is not something that town does."

Reading on though, I find myself sick of the whole affair. It's something, but having it be THE topic of discussion, or even the only topic of discussion, grows rather dull, especially when I feel like Thor is repeating himself in posts like 495. Granted, people ask him to, but it doesn't make the game any more interesting.

Again he's coming back to giving the impression of understanding the argument... but then doesn't take any actual stance. I reckon he's (one of) Thor's partner(s) and that's why he keeps coming back to it yet doesn't actually nut up.

I could say a lot of things about this, but instead I'll just say that directing the Seer is PRETTY STUPID. Why would the Seer ever listen to you, when you could easily be scum?

And we're back to him backhandedly discrediting me; again works as a Thor-partner perspective.

So Whiskers, you can't make "heads or tails" of Majiffy vs. Thor but at the time you were also arguing with Thor to a lesser extent?

I'm really not buying it.

Lol, irony coming from the person who believes I "won hands down" and called Thor out for misrepping... and yet doesn't take a firm stance himself.

[Majiffy]

Also, where is Thor?

I know he picked up a new job and/or more hours at work, so that might partially explain his absence. Why he hasn't poked his head in AT ALL is another matter entirely.

[Majiffy]

Just checked in on it, appears Thor has been posting elsewhere as recently as the 30th in at least two other games whilst neglecting this one (last post on the 28th)

[Whiskers]

270: Majiffy refuses to make a case on Rob13 since he (Majiffy) prefers to lynch ProHawk, and he can make the case on Rob13 if/when Rob13 becomes scummier. Of course, what if it's Day 2 and Majiffy dies and Rob13 is scum? I don't like this "not worried about being NK'd" mentality. For bonus points, it is also an excuse to not give content.

Misses the point, then takes two opportunities to backhandedly discredit me.

Sorry if you feel insulted, mate, but how is this not accurate? I don't think any of us missed the point, but don't think we also didn't pick up that you're taking for granted the fact that you won't be nightkilled. Why? Because you're a werewolf.
Now, that's taking a strong stance. Maybe your tongue slipped. I caught it. Ald just decided to be the one to point it out.

So I get to Majiffy and Thor's big argument. Well, Majiffy won hands down, but does that make Thor scum? Not really. What is the scum motivation for Thor to make the initial statement (calling out people with weak PH votes)? Not very much, though I will grant that the vagueness could be scummy. However, it doesn't make sense for Thor-scum to let things get blown out of proportion relative to what the initial argument was even about. Why would Thor dance around Majiffy's questioning when the benefits to do doing so outweigh the cost of getting into such an extended argument?

Says he read and understood the argument, but then why ask questions that have already been covered? The whole scenario was pretty clear-cut. This is just a cop-out to avoid taking any actual stance.

Speaking for myself, yeah. You won that first argument. I get that just from reading how you were able to stay on the offensive, and Thor was fighting you every turn. That doesn't mean that I have any idea what you guys were actually arguing, or what it amounts to-- or that it even amounts to anything.
But yeah, he has a fucking stance: your pages-long argument with Thor was null.

My answer is that I really wanted to vote the Mod because he actually showed up in the vote counts, which was unexpected. Past that, there's nothing more to it.

This just seems really awkward although I'm not certain it's anything alignment dependent. It just really bugs me because I can't work out the logic behind it.

Let me take the time to say, Fuck yeah vote the mod. If modvotes count, it's probably worth it to lynch the mod, if only for the novelty.

Maybe it's ATE. It's also true. I think when I defend myself I inadvertently dig a deeper hole, regardless of alignment.
If you think I

can

defend myself, then find some games where I came under heavy pressure and decide for yourself. Or I can find them for you, if you want. (I just don't know if you trust me to find them for you, since obviously I can cherry pick if I so choose.)

This is a pile of horse shit. I could elaborate on why if it isn't slapping you in the face, but I know it is to me.

I can agree there-- I think he's doing a nice job of defending himself now.
Of course, you don't think so. You think all this stuff if scummy or something, which I guess would prove his point.

Thor's 450 misreps Majiffy's case -- he states it as basically, "Majiffy is calling me scum for using the word "prove" and because he doesn't like my evidence," when it is quite clearly, "Thor is dodging around questions like crazy, which is not something that town does."

Reading on though, I find myself sick of the whole affair. It's something, but having it be THE topic of discussion, or even the only topic of discussion, grows rather dull, especially when I feel like Thor is repeating himself in posts like 495. Granted, people ask him to, but it doesn't make the game any more interesting.

Again he's coming back to giving the impression of understanding the argument... but then doesn't take any actual stance. I reckon he's (one of) Thor's partner(s) and that's why he keeps coming back to it yet doesn't actually nut up.

Again, the argument amounted to

nothing

and I found myself nodding in agreement as I read this part of the post. I'm sick of it too. It's not actually useful, it's clutter, waste. It's something for scum to talk about because they don't want to talk about real issues. You want to find scum? Look for the people who told us to stop talking about the other things and "weigh in" on Thor vs Majiffy. Those people trying to stifle discussion? Yeah. They're mafia.

I could say a lot of things about this, but instead I'll just say that directing the Seer is PRETTY STUPID. Why would the Seer ever listen to you, when you could easily be scum?

And we're back to him backhandedly discrediting me; again works as a Thor-partner perspective.

So... OMGUS?
Anyway, I kind of disagree with him here. Directing the Seer is fine, I think... but that's theory and we'll talk about it later. The Seer taking the advice,

that's

stupid.

So Whiskers, you can't make "heads or tails" of Majiffy vs. Thor but at the time you were also arguing with Thor to a lesser extent?

I'm really not buying it.

Lol, irony coming from the person who believes I "won hands down" and called Thor out for misrepping... and yet doesn't take a firm stance himself.

Seriously, what stance was he supposed to take? He took the only viable one: he can now firmly say that that was a pointless waste of time and that you're both stupid.

I'd like to answer Ald here, too, even though I may not be able to do so coherently: I couldn't figure it out. I tried, when I argued with Thor. I understood a little piece of it, but not the whole thing. The argument changed in little pieces and I can't keep track of what was being argued at any one time. I could have argued further with Thor, but it basically would have required me to start from the beginning and have the same conversation-- only, I'd have played by Thor's terms, so it would have come out totally different.

[ProHawk]

Sorry, have been a little busy the past couple days.

I am happy with an Aldus lynch. I suspected him earlier in the day after his OMGUS vote on me, and his lurking without wanting to be replaced or playing only confirmed my suspicion.

RE: Majiffy's Points - How do you suppose that my votes for my scum-reads is equivalent to being survivalistic? Should I just vote for a non-wagon whom I don't have a scum-read on or even a non-wagon that I think is scum?

Me following-the-leader? I tried to take the lead with Whiskers and it turned out bad for me. People here don't like my reads/ideas so why should I throw myself to the wolves again? I am more than willing to contribute, but I don't need to get myself lynched for being overly aggressive again.

I already stated I would be willing to compromise on a Sky lynch, but Aldus is equally as fine.

Whiskers, why did you refute most of Majiffy's points against Aldus? Do you really believe Majiffy is a wolf?

[Majiffy]

Misses the point, then takes two opportunities to backhandedly discredit me.

Sorry if you feel insulted, mate, but how is this not accurate? I don't think any of us missed the point, but don't think we also didn't pick up that you're taking for granted the fact that you won't be nightkilled. Why? Because you're a werewolf.
Now, that's taking a strong stance. Maybe your tongue slipped. I caught it. Ald just decided to be the one to point it out.[/quote]
Firstly, I didn't make any statement about d1/d2/d3, etc. Any assumption about survival is flat out incorrect, and any inference based upon that assumption is conjecture.
Secondly, the bit about not giving content is poisoning the well. I was already giving plenty of content, and was focusing my energies elsewhere. Why spread myself too thin for what I viewed to be a lesser cause?

And while we're at it, if you "caught it", why didn't you vote me? Why didn't you bring it up earlier?

But yeah, he has a fucking stance: your pages-long argument with Thor was null.

What is this I don't even.
I took a stance with Thor; Thor is scum. What is Aldu's stance? Can you tell me? Can you point it out?

Let me take the time to say, Fuck yeah vote the mod. If modvotes count, it's probably worth it to lynch the mod, if only for the novelty.

I just feel like the whole thing is silly and a waste of time/effort/posts

I can agree there-- I think he's doing a nice job of defending himself now.
Of course, you don't think so. You think all this stuff if scummy or something, which I guess would prove his point.

Wait so it's now a valid argument to set yourself up into a no-lose scenario? "Oh yeah I'm always scummy looking when I defend myself!" "But he's scummy looking!" "Well that's cuz he's defending himself!"

What is this garbage?

Again, the argument amounted to

nothing

and I found myself nodding in agreement as I read this part of the post. I'm sick of it too. It's not actually useful, it's clutter, waste. It's something for scum to talk about because they don't want to talk about real issues. You want to find scum? Look for the people who told us to stop talking about the other things and "weigh in" on Thor vs Majiffy. Those people trying to stifle discussion? Yeah. They're mafia.

The argument amounted to nothing? Are you fucking kidding me? What about pretty much every point Thor eventually conceded to me? What about his proven lying and dancing around the issues? What the fuck.

Seriously, what stance was he supposed to take? He took the only viable one: he can now firmly say that that was a pointless waste of time and that you're both stupid.

1) He says I won the argument hands-down
2) He says Thor misrepped a number of times during the argument
3) ???
Obviously the stance he's supposed to take is that Thor is scum. But he does not.

I'd like to answer Ald here, too, even though I may not be able to do so coherently: I couldn't figure it out. I tried, when I argued with Thor. I understood a little piece of it, but not the whole thing. The argument changed in little pieces and I can't keep track of what was being argued at any one time. I could have argued further with Thor, but it basically would have required me to start from the beginning and have the same conversation-- only, I'd have played by Thor's terms, so it would have come out totally different.

And do you know why it kept changing? Because Thor is scum and has to keep rephrasing the question and conversation so he doesn't get pinned for having fucked up as he did.

BUT FOR SOME FUCKING REASON, NO ONE ELSE SEEMS TO UNDERSTAND THAT.

[Majiffy]

RE: Majiffy's Points - How do you suppose that my votes for my scum-reads is equivalent to being survivalistic? Should I just vote for a non-wagon whom I don't have a scum-read on or even a non-wagon that I think is scum?

Me following-the-leader? I tried to take the lead with Whiskers and it turned out bad for me. People here don't like my reads/ideas so why should I throw myself to the wolves again? I am more than willing to contribute, but I don't need to get myself lynched for being overly aggressive again.

1) No, sidelining your votes is bad. But it just seemed like your scum reads and your votes trended more towards convenience than conviction. That being said, the wagon that's on you {Aldu, Sky, someone else I can't remember} is absolutely abysmal, so you're probably town.

2) I feel like just because you got burned on a disagreeable read, you shouldn't now settle for just sitting passively to the sidelines. In fact, that just looks scummy as fuck in my eyes. Stop it.

[Thor665]

Unvote: Whiskers
Vote: Sky

Later people will complain that I didn't post comments on anything that was said since my last time posting.
I would counter with - the vote contains a lot of information, and not much of any worth was said, so...

[Thor665]

I will clarify that I do still support a Whiskers lynch if people wise up.
I oppose the Ald lynch now.

[Majiffy]

The prodigal beard returns.

Why do you oppose the Aldu lynch?

[Thor665]

Because of the way you are pushing him and the way Whiskers is defending him.
Don't get me wrong - his posting is bad, but the relationships look better for him.

[Majiffy]

Are you planning on doing any legitimate scumhunting in this game or are you just going to try to skirt by as long as possible before people wonder why you're still alive?

[4nxi3ty]

Which of his posts are good? I don't see a lot to like in that iso.

the tone in posts 29, 38, 41, and 49 by ald; in particular his comment about not agreeing with thor's case yet not jumping to scum accusation for a difference in logic.

What makes you think

town are more likely

than scum

to care about what people think

about them?

Not sure your question translates to what I said. I'm talking about Sky not being dodgy when I ask him direct questions.

this is what you said:

And

town reactions as in he actually gives a damn about what people think of him

and cares to defend himself. Read them yourself and develop a gut feeling on them.

now, answer the question.

unvote,vote: sky

[Majiffy]

2 days and 6 hours remain.

Sup with this Aldu counterwagon growing so close to deadline?

[4nxi3ty]

If there's support for it, I'd meander back to Sky. But that wagon felt dead as hell.

[Majiffy]

If there's support for it, I'd meander back to Sky. But that wagon felt dead as hell.

That was prior to Whiskers' terrible defense of Aldu and Thor's return and subsequent vote. I'm getting a bit turned off of the idea with him involved.

[uctriton00]

now, answer the question.

His reactions come off as him caring about defending himself, instead of dodging them. I mean how much simpler can I put that? Are you saying that scum do that too? No **** scum do that too, but townies don't act dodgy.

[uctriton00]

I would counter with - the vote contains a lot of information

Such as

[Majiffy]

but townies don't act dodgy.

So are you saying that you'd be willing to lynch Thor?

[Josh Lyman]

Twelfth Votecount

L-1 Alduskkel: (6) Human Destroyer, ProHawk, Tajun, uctriton00, Majiffy, auspicious
Human Destroyer: (1) Whiskers
ProHawk: (3) Alduskkel, Sky, Rob13
Sky: (2) Thor665, 4nxi3ty

Not placing a Vote:

12 alive equals 7 to lynch

Deadline for Day One: (expired on 2013-02-03 22:50:36)

Sorry for the lack of votecounts. I seem to have wandered off and apparently got lost. Slightly. Won't happen again.

[Sky]

now, answer the question.

His reactions come off as him caring about defending himself, instead of dodging them. I mean how much simpler can I put that? Are you saying that scum do that too? No **** scum do that too, but townies don't act dodgy.

This so much. I've been trying to drill in this in but y'all don't get it.

Lynch me fine. You'll all just look scummy for voting with zero scummy evidence.

Also, you two making that list minute change. I sure as shit hope you get me lynched or get online before the deadline because I will not be happy with a no lynch.

[uctriton00]

but townies don't act dodgy.

So are you saying that you'd be willing to lynch Thor?

Today, no.

[Majiffy]

But tomorrow?