Newbie 1379 (Game Over)

[fferyllt]

What in the world makes you think "town is in cahoots with scum." What sort of information are we withholding from you?

You aren't, ffery and pitoli have been avoiding my question about who will they lynch tomorrow when i flip town.
I said as much in my post (again you aren't reading)

If you flip town then tomorrow I somehow have to convince whoever's left that Ffery's scummier than me

and I am not-so-secretly dreading this

Same.

I was recently in a similar situation in a newbie game, though my slot was considerably more town-read because I'd had it since partway through day 1. I agonized over getting as much info as possible from my second guess on day 3 because I knew that as a claimed PR he'd have the upper hand on day 4. I chewed on every bit of available info for about 10 days before we lynched our first choice. He flipped scum.

This time, although I want all the data possible on the table, I'm trusting my gut more than I did previously. You look town to me. Future looked town to me when I read day 1 for the first time. If Sakura is town, then I will do my damnedest to get you lynched on day 4. And I think Sakura is scum.

We would both say the same thing as scum.

[pitoli]

Fuck now I'm paranoid again

[fferyllt]

Your avatar is perfect, then.

[pitoli]

Jk I never stopped being paranoid.

P-edit: HA yes.

[pitoli]

DoctorPepper/Edosurist ISO

These are some highlights I guess, but I would really appreciate you guys going back through these as well. Edos obviously didn't post a lot of content but when he did he was mainly pushing Future, which he could have partly been doing to defend his scumpartner. DP read Edos as "null leaning town" which I feel is a pretty convenient spot for a partner...

Actually, fuck it.

UNVOTE: DoctorPepper
VOTE: Antagon

You guys will probably buy Antagon-scum more than DP-scum at this point, I think. Pushing the wagon without being on it is a fucking great way to distance yourself from an easy town-lynch while blending in.

I really dislike this post. If you have a bigger scumread on DP, you should pursue it and possibly try to get others to see what you see.
By voting Antagon, you're doing multiple things.
1. You're giving up on a lynch because you think it'd be too hard. That's not a town mindset.
2. "You guys will probably buy Antagon-scum more" shows me that you're already pursuing his lynch... on page 4.

Also, calling multiple people scummy isn't necessarily scummy. If there's more to the read, then show us (forgive me if I missed it)
VOTE: Future

Edos's read on DP

About DP, I read him as town because I agree with his case on Saki, except that I've moved him (Saki)to null based on the OMGUS thing and his presentation.
Your case in 94 misreps him (DP).

DP's read on Edos

Edos has a whopping 9 posts in this game, hard to read him.

174 How has future avoided pointing out who is scummy, when he basically loudly stated that he thinks me and Antagon are scum and he's willing to be lynched just to try to get me lynched (logical fallacy right there, with deal with this more on your iso)? In fact, pointing out who he thinks are scummy is basicLly half of what he does in this game.

I agree with his sentiments on Future, but aside from that, nothing spectacular. Null leaning town.

I'm still for the Future lynch, though. Then we can go for DP. I'll have to think about Antagon some more.

[pitoli]

DoctorPepper/Slyther ISO

There's some more back and forth here as Slyther was more active. Slyther was pushing the Future wagon early on but had DP as his #2 scumread apparently.

Dr. P, why so defensive? Future has already moved away from his attack on you to focus on Ant. Shouldn't the logical course of action be to address people's current scum reads?

Slyther, theres really not anything wrong with attacking a bad case.

If I had to pick ONE, it'd be DoctorPepper. But I still don't want to lynch him. The only lead I've got on him is that he voted Saki non-RVS and didn't let go of that vote, while simultaneously dodging valid points and questions about why he voted Saki.

Exactly what points did I dodge? The points I answered before you said I was "so defensive" ? I dont get where you are coming from here Slyther.

NULL:

DoctorPepper - Doesn't really seem to be in the game much. With a total of not even twenty posts and one non-RVS vote on Saki which he's still holding onto. I'm not really sure what to make of this guy. He's my #2 scumread, but that's not saying much.

Quick assessment, Slyther is town and its quite obvious.

First tell, initiation of RVS. Yeah, a lot of people dont like RVS, but I actually liked his "Are you scum?" Question. If you get lucky, its has potential to get a slip and how one answers a seemingly innocuous question can (but not always is) alignment indicative.
I liked his early assessment of Saki, which I shall relate to the other players later on

Slyther questions everyone, so it shows he's not afraid to ruffle people's feathers, he shows a town mindset.
His case on Future, 131 was solid, it brought up a point no one else did when he noticed the weird phrasing of Future's 95

However. His posts 120 and 126 contradict each other (later explained, but still.)
The read lost bothers me. First, DDC is listed as town, yet Edos and I are null because of lack of participation, yet DDC hasnt posted a lot of substance and I have more posts.
Second, that weird ending statement on Future. No connection whatsoever. Its like it was made intentionally longer or something so it would look ggod. (science, you noticed that it was present, not why it was present)

Otherwise, town.

[pitoli]

Also, Slimer, why replace into a game if you're not bothering to contribute to your wincon >> c'mon now.

[Sakura Hana]

The "information" you were withholding is your backup scumread, as in, who you were going to lynch tomorrow, now from the info i've gathered i'm fairly sure it's possible that ffery is scum with pitoli coming 2nd now.
VOTE: ffery
Regardless if i die today, please kill ffery tomorrow.

[fferyllt]

The "information" you were withholding is your backup scumread, as in, who you were going to lynch tomorrow, now from the info i've gathered i'm fairly sure it's possible that ffery is scum with pitoli coming 2nd now.
VOTE: ffery
Regardless if i die today, please kill ffery tomorrow.

What leads you to conclude that I am more likely scum than pitoli? Where's your case?

[Sakura Hana]

PoE, pitoli's less likely scum due to the back and forth with DP on D1, and I think i've already explained why Saki's not a good option either, if you're not scum then that means i'll have to decide between Saki and pitoli, from which then i'd pick pitoli, unless Saki makes me change my mind.

[Sakura Hana]

Tho if someone had thought I was the only possible scum without leaving room for someone else then I would have known for sure they were scum, because scum doesn't care about forming backup reads or taking stances, they just want mislynches, the fact that pitoli accused me for trying to get her stances is the major point of why i'd lynch her tomorrow if you're town.

[fferyllt]

One of the reasons I read the game and immediately thought something wasn't right about Edos was simply the tone of his posts.

I played with him once before in a Newbie game that we both replaced into. Here's his ISO from that game: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... ser_select

His posts are thoughtful and the reads are fluid as he catches up with the game. At first I thought that comparing this game to a replace-in/catch-up would be a bad idea, but then I realized that every time he came back to the thread he was essentially doing a catch-up.

So, let's look. In the bisquick game he made 12 posts. In that time he moved his vote around twice, and his final vote turned out to be on scum. He made observations about several players. His posts were long, with example quotes. He was often rushed, but provided good analysis. He pushed players with strong questions, including people he was townreading.

And in this game, he made 16 posts. The posts look superficially similar, but when you read them, you find that the analysis is mostly superficial. I liked that early on he declared Saki obvtown, but IMO any experienced player not making that call would look pretty damn suspicious. In this game, he didn't push at players as hard. Aside from his RVS vote, he put an early vote down on Future and never changed it. He wasn't using his vote.

I'm going to look at a couple more games of each alignment to see if that vote-stickyness is a feature of his scum game.

[fferyllt]

Here is a Newbie game where he played from the start: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... ser_select

He was town. 21 posts, vote more fluid.

It took a while to find a scum game http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... ser_select

One thing that stands out in this ISO is he apologizes for inactivity, which is reminiscent of this game.

[Sakura Hana]

Yeah, but he didn't replace out that game due to RL reasons, other than that, I agree with you, but this slot is town, that's all I know, I don't know why he did X or Y or why he acted like that on D1, and I'm certainly not going to question it either, if you want to folow that go ahead, I won't complain, but you're dying tomorrow anyways.

[Zaicon]

Vote Count 3.8

Sakura Hana (2):

fferyllt, Saki

pitoli (1):

Karnage

fferyllt (1):

Sakura Hana

No Vote (2):

pitoli, theslimer3

With 6 alive, it takes 4 to lynch!

The deadline is Tuesday, July 9, at 8:00 PM CDT, which is in (expired on 2013-07-09 20:00:00).

[fferyllt]

Yeah, but he didn't replace out that game due to RL reasons, other than that, I agree with you, but this slot is town, that's all I know, I don't know why he did X or Y or why he acted like that on D1, and I'm certainly not going to question it either, if you want to folow that go ahead, I won't complain, but you're dying tomorrow anyways.

If there is a tomorrow. Which I doubt, if you are lynched today.

If there is a tomorrow and I am lynched, then town loses.

[Sakura Hana]

I wouldn't mind getting lynched, I'm getting tired of this anyways because nothing's happening to begin with. So we lynch me today and ffery tomorrow?

[Saki]

I wouldn't mind getting lynched, I'm getting tired of this anyways because nothing's happening to begin with. So we lynch me today and ffery tomorrow?

ayup

[Sakura Hana]

ok then
VOTE: Sakura Hana

[fferyllt]

UNVOTE: sakura

I don't know why you would do that if you are scum.

Rethinking.

[fferyllt]

You put yourself at L-1.

[fferyllt]

I don't know why you would do that as town either.

Your bandwagon gives us information.

[Sakura Hana]

Because it's decided that we lynch me today and lynch you tomorrow? or are you having second thoughts on that plan

[Sakura Hana]

From my PoV the only people on my b/w are unconf. townies so i dont know whether the conf. ones pitch in or not will render more information.

[fferyllt]

Because it's decided that we lynch me today and lynch you tomorrow? or are you having second thoughts on that plan

If you are actually town, it's rarely a good idea to self-vote even in a situation like this one. Your not voting and forcing someone else to make that move

is information

that town otherwise won't have going into tomorrow.

Whatever we decide today, it's not written in stone. The final votes and the night kill will tell us things about the final scum.

Though, I don't see the final scum disapproving of a plan for a townie lynch tomorrow.

And if you are town, then pitoli is scum.