Mini 1474: Desperado's Revenge (Game Over)

[JJcoolPants]

How many scum are in a typically in these kind of set up, by the way?

[Desperado]

The Third Votecount

RadiantCowbells - 3 (mnemonicdevice, theomoaner, Flench)
mnemonicdevice - 2 (RadiantCowbells, JJcoolPants)
evilpacman18 - 1 (N64Lord)
Flench - 1 (Feel It)
Feel It - 1 (Lucky2u)

Not Voting - 5 (Radioactive Wolf, sthar8, tybalt, jon_h61, evilpacman18)

With

13

players alive, it's

7

to lynch

Today's deadline is

Saturday, July 27th at 11:59pm Eastern Standard Time

Spoiler: Player Voting History

N64Lord: evilpacman18
Radioactive Wolf:
sthar8: evilpacman18 > Unvote
Feel It: Flench
Lucky2u: Feel It
RadiantCowbells: mnemonicdevice
tybalt:
JJcoolPants: mnemonicdevice
Flench: RadiantCowbells > JJcoolPants > RadiantCowbells
mnemonicdevice: RadiantCowbells
jon_h61:
theomoaner: mnemonicdevice > RadiantCowbells
evilpacman18:

Spoiler: Voting History

On Sat, July 7/13/2013 @ 9:12am,

RadiantCowbells

votes

mnemonicdevice

in Post 15
On Sat, July 7/13/2013 @ 9:29am,

mnemonicdevice

votes

RadiantCowbells

in Post 16
On Sat, July 7/13/2013 @ 10:05am,

N64Lord

voted

evilpacman18

in Post 19
On Sat, July 7/13/2013 @ 10:12am,

Feel It

voted

Flench

in Post 22
On Sat, July 7/13/2013 @ 10:13am,

theomoaner

voted

mnemonicdevice

in Post 23
On Sat, July 7/13/2013 @ 10:21am,

Lucky2u

voted

Feel It

in Post 26
On Sat, July 7/13/2013 @ 11:51am,

Flench

voted

RadiantCowbells

in Post 31
On Sat, July 7/13/2013 @ 1:13pm

theomoaner

voted

RadiantCowbells

in Post 35
On Sat, July 7/13/2013 @ 2:40pm,

sthar8

voted

evilpacman18

in Post 41
On Sat, July 7/13/2013 @ 7:17pm,

Flench

voted

JJcoolPants

in Post 61
On Sat, July 7/13/2013 @ 10:46am,

Flench

voted

RadiantCowbells

in Post 73
On Sat, July 7/13/2013 @ 11:03am,

JJcoolPants

voted

mnemonicdevice

in Post 74

[evilpacman18]

How many scum are in a typically in these kind of set up, by the way?

Almost certainly 3.

[Feel It]

Or 2 scum and a serial killer.

[jon_h61]

How many scum are in a typically in these kind of set up, by the way?

My best guess is three scum, with a possibility of a serial killer.

Still chilling with the wife. Will figure out who to buddy and who to vote later today.

[theomoaner]

@Mod: Thanks for the quote fix.

@Jon: Hi Buddy!

Don't vote me up if you think I'm town then.

If you think I'm scum, then by all means vote me, and in that case you shouldn't care about me self hammering because that's the optimal scum play to deny information.

What if your not sure and you want to use your vote to apply pressure to gain information?

I've played a game with Device before he... wasn't very useful to be honest. He acted scummy then claimed doctor when under pressure and got himself lynched the next day when he told us he protected one of the players he wanted lynched.

FeelIt or Mnemonic, what role did Mnemonic have in that game?

[theomoaner]

^ Hang on, Think I just found it and its ongoing so don't reply to that.

[sthar8]

Still meta-ing in between fits of productivity at work. If the Magic players slow down on the questions, I'll get some more up today.

FOS: jon- Chilling with your wife, or just chilling your wife? You know who would keep their wife in a refrigerator? A serial killer!

[JJcoolPants]

This is boring, let's pick it up pickitup pickitUUUPPPP

What are your scum reads right now sthar, flench, and pacman?

[JJcoolPants]

I'm sorry, i meant feel it not flench

[Lucky2u]

I've been lurking watching what was happening. I haven't gotten any strong scum feelings on anyone yet, and I disagree with my friend Judas (Radiant) on Mnuemonic. I've played with him before and I can't see anything different about him now then when he was town before. I'm tempted to vote theomoaner because I feel like if I have to stare at that avatar for a month, I might get it imbedded in my peripheral vision.

[mnemonicdevice]

To clear my intentions, I voted Radiant cowbells as an OMGUS. her later posts made her seem even more scum, so that is where my vote stays.

[mnemonicdevice]

Flench, why so many vote changes already?

[Lucky2u]

OMGUS is never a good motive for town to do anything and I don't know why you are admitting to doing that. Don't make me change my opinion on you ONE post after I just made it.

[sthar8]

This is boring, let's pick it up pickitup pickitUUUPPPP

What are your scum reads right now sthar, flench, and pacman?

We'll get there tonight, I promise. The players are being needy.

[tybalt]

Alright, I'm here, sorry for being late. Doing a quick catch up.

[Radioactive Wolf]

It's sunday night and I am not going to read this game as closely as I should.

First impression is to VOTE: Feel It but I'll be back tomorrow night.

[N64Lord]

I need sweet, sweet, mouth-watering caaaakke! Ohhh...mmm..ohhh!!. Delicciouuuss!!!!!-gourmand guy, Paper Mario

Our activity is falling off, and when I look at theomancer's reaction to radiantcowbell; that gambit makes it extremely easy for people to make fluff posts, since there's a lot of easy anti town reads coming from this, and theomancer is even willing to make sure he brings my questions back to me, just in case he's accusing of tunneling on the jester. mnemoic's omgus is brought up for no clean reason whatsoever, but I don't think mnemoic will provide much information; especially if we allow people to demand justification of RVS.VOTE: theomancer Just think that the omgus was basically a normal random vote, except directed at a player who felt the need to kickstart the game with a pre-game claim followed by a strong vote, which makes it possible for oppurtunistic players to tunnel. This is what I expect from mnemoic based on meta.

I want to hear from people about theomancer and radiant, not more fencesitting, self aware, neutral, fluff posts. And don't flake out of the game, it's not a prod race.

[JJcoolPants]

^thank you, this is seriously fucking stale

aaanyway. I'm not a big fan of theo right now, but your case is kind of stretching it.

when I look at theomancer's reaction to radiantcowbell; that gambit makes it extremely easy for people to make fluff posts, since there's a lot of easy anti town reads coming from this, and

theomancer is even willing to make sure he brings my questions back to me, just in case he's accusing of tunneling on the jester

Is that really what you think?

-

Fit reads to evidence, not evidence to reads.

Unvote
Vote: Flench

For this, and his silly WIFOM-y reasons for joining the radiant wagon

[sthar8]

First off:

This is boring, let's pick it up pickitup pickitUUUPPPP

Our activity is falling off, (...) And don't flake out of the game, it's not a prod race.

^thank you, this is seriously fucking stale

Calm down kiddos. Thread's been open

two days

and we've already got 90-ish posts, despite it being a weekend for those of us on Earth. Hell, I worked 36 out of the last 48 hours. If I didn't have a coworker who took it upon himself to cover for me while I read mafia, I'd be way behind too. We're not even close to deadline, and we're getting good discussion in. I'll start pressuring lurkers Wednesday, after the guys who are busy on the weekend have had a chance to post. Possibly Tuesday night if my Scout meeting gets out early


Alright, now to business.

@JJ- after re-reading you, I've changed my mind. Show me yours, and I'll show you mine . I'll post my top 3 if you do.
Why did you pick that group of three to get suspicions from?

@N64- which posts (and posters, I guess) do you feel are "fluff posts?"

and theomancer is even willing to make sure he brings my questions back to me, just in case he's accusing of tunneling on the jester.

Can you clarify this? I'm not sure what it means.

@Theo- can you expand on how you feel about Cowbells?

@Radioactive Wolf- I look forward to hearing about that vote

@ RadiantCowbells- How about you play well instead? You're obviously capable of it.

It's not always optimal scum play to self-hammer. In fact, it's usually not. Plus, posted policy is extremely anti-town.

And if you're town, here are some things to consider before you make a petulant OMGUS self hammer:
1. Townies get voted to L-1 all the time. If you die, you can still win. It's in your best interest to let the rest of the town gather as much info from the lynch as possible.
2. Not all L-1 wagons end in a lynch. If you self-hammer, you're giving up on lynching scum before you have to. Examples: In the meta you referenced, on D2 lucky got voted to L-1 by the machinations of the ridiculously bad obvscum in that game (btw congrats on calling that game on day2, lucky). If he had self-hammered, the town would in all likelihood have missed on the Jason lynch. And in my ancient newbie here, we got to a day2 L-1 on an unhelpful townie. If he had self hammered, our cop wouldn't have been able to deliver a guilty on scum. Further, he shaped up his play on day3, and thanks to getting cop cleared, he won the game for us in LYLO. He actually said at one point:

But I'm also not a large enough asshole to hammer myself.

3. You know your alignment. The mod knows your alignment. If you're scum, your partner knows your alignment. If you are getting voted to L-1 as town, it's because someone who doesn't know your alignment is mistaken about it. It's obvious to you that they're wrong, but they aren't operating on the same information as you are. It doesn't make someone dumb to draw an incorrect conclusion from incomplete evidence.

Not comfortable with a vote on anybody yet, but we're getting there.

[Feel It]

I'm sorry, i meant feel it not flench

Well, very early the game estimates but;

JJcoolPants- You seem town to me, making frequent posts, generating content.

RadiantCowbells- I think he's playing a town gambit

sthar8-town

theomoaner- He gives me scummy vibes, his scumhunting feels weak and forced.

Radioactive Wolf- Gonna look OMGUSy but he's made two posts, one confirming and another voting me without an explanation, either scummy or bad town play. Will have to see more to be sure.

Everyone else has felt null/not posted enough.

VOTE: theomoaner

[JJcoolPants]

I picked those 3 because I've seen them post, but not a whole lot helpful. Trying to spark some talk. And as for my reads? I am obviously thinking Flench right now, and as for the others: not sure. I figure it is best for me to leave it at that rather than bullshit 2 more reads just to get yours.

Sorry if I seem impatient, but its's frusrating to see only about half the players truly posting. You're right though, I'll back off.

[sthar8]

Fair enough. Do you think Flench is scum, or are you voting him for pressure? I'd be interested to hear about his autovote thing as I'm not sure what to make of it.

I'm reading mnemonic, n64, and epm very carefully right now.

[theomoaner]

#86, I think that Mnemonic is just newbie bad, and at this stage of the game using that as an excuse to wagon is just as bad.

Our activity is falling off, and when I look at theomancer's reaction to radiantcowbell; that gambit makes it extremely easy for people to make fluff posts, since there's a lot of easy anti town reads coming from this, and theomancer is even willing to make sure he brings my questions back to me, just in case he's accusing of tunneling on the jester. mnemoic's omgus is brought up for no clean reason whatsoever, but I don't think mnemoic will provide much information; especially if we allow people to demand justification of RVS.VOTE: theomancer Just think that the omgus was basically a normal random vote, except directed at a player who felt the need to kickstart the game with a pre-game claim followed by a strong vote, which makes it possible for oppurtunistic players to tunnel. This is what I expect from mnemoic based on meta.

I want to hear from people about theomancer and radiant, not more fencesitting, self aware, neutral, fluff posts. And don't flake out of the game, it's not a prod race.

Please get my name right, and please explain what exactly you mean by this. It would also be helpful if you would answer my questions, not just decide that I am scummy for asking them (if that is what you actually meant).
I would also suggest that you gain a clear understanding of the term tunneling before using it. Also check out what sheeping means

Edit: I'm aware that some of this has already been said, I was just going through the post in a line and dealing with anything that caught my attention.

@Theo- can you expand on how you feel about Cowbells?

I think that Cowbells is either the very definition of a powergamer, or is seriously trying to deflect any votes away from himself with cheap NLP ploys, does nobody else read this ->

But yeah, if I'm put to L-1 and I'm town I'll hammer.

Town shouldn't be voting me up.

As, If it's not going my way I'll ragequit, and the "

Town shouldn't be voting me up

" reads to me as "

if you vote for me you are clearly not town

".

It's all so anti-town, and regardless of what N64 thinks (if I understood that post correctly) town should not play anti-town, it confuses everything with noise.

Perhaps I'm just tunneling though

3. You know your alignment. The mod knows your alignment. If you're scum, your

partner

knows your alignment. If you are getting voted to L-1 as town, it's because someone who doesn't know your alignment is mistaken about it. It's obvious to you that they're wrong, but they aren't operating on the same information as you are. It doesn't make someone dumb to draw an incorrect conclusion from incomplete evidence.

Or 2 scum and a serial killer.

#95, third on a wagon too!

[sthar8]

I could see that as a legitimate conclusion from Cowbells' comments.

So do you think he's scum or anti-town? I've been leaning towards anti-town, thus my interactions with him. You had said his gambit looked scummy, and that town would have more analysis. He's posted a bit of that since then, and I was wondering how you felt about it.

Thank you for posting the sheeping link. I remember it as barning, and IIRC barning was pretty universally considered a scumtell back in the day. I find it suspicious at any rate.

I'm not sure what you're getting at with the quotes at the bottom of your last.