In post 422, archaebob wrote:
As I sense most of us understand here, good scumhunting resists being formalized into “tells.” Each player has a unique personality and way of interfacing with this game; consequently, each scum slips in a slightly different way. Keeping this in mind, what follows is not an attempt to point out incontrovertible facts which “prove” that ace is scum. Rather, it is a narrative of ace’s behavior and corresponding thought process which bespeaks participation in the informed minority. As he defends himself, look not for logical consistency; scum always has it. Instead, try and reconcile everything he has done with the emotional fabric of a town player. Ultimately, you have to trust your intuition. It is the most powerful calculator in the universe.
The game starts, Wake is being a dumbass, lots of yelling, blah blah blah. We come to this post.
In post 153, theaceofspades wrote:wake. you don't read as scum to me. but you are seriously being a jerkwad right now. "not here to make friends" neither am I. but I am still able to be civil.
Being a jerk isn't good scumhunting.
I'm almost willing to lynch you
because I see your behaivor as detrimental to the town, even if you aren't scum.
As it is. You still don't smell like scum to me
, just asshole town.
Unless I get a scumread from someone else, I'm willing to lynch you
at deadline, just because you're what bob called you.
so please cool it, or else.
As ace will likely try to point out, there’s nothing inherently inconsistent about his reasoning. Wake’s behavior was indeed detrimental to the town, and I’ve myself made the case in various outlets that policy lynching the extremely unhelpful is sometimes necessary. What bothers me here is the wording, and the energy. “I’m almost willing to lynch you.” Who announces stuff like that? Well, really heady and overcautious players sometimes do, but we know that ace isn’t one of those. He answered “intuition” to my RQS question, and his sharp, unproofread, not infrequently sarcastic writing doesn’t draw up the image of someone who habitually builds geometric armor around themselves before acting. No, this is someone who is unconsciously giving themselves options ahead of time. Watch how he feels compelled to softly weave every contingency into the thread. It’s redundant; overexplained. “But I won’t lynch you at deadline if I get a scumread from someone else! That might happen! If I start to say I suspect someone else and I don’t still want to lynch you I’m not being inconsistent!” He senses internally that his reasoning is fabricated, and is shoring it up with tiny, unnecessary precautions. Where’s the teeth? He’s justifying himself to town-Wake instead of imposing himself to a faceless player who has thus far acted bizarrely. I suggest to you that this is because he already knows the roles.
i often announce stuff like that, that's where my thoughts wer. about "this" close to wanting him lynched. feel free to check the tiny bit of meta this account has. I know I've said almost those exact words before. Why should I be dogmatic when I myself am unsure? it's like your case is "ace isn't sure he wants to call wake scum straight up, so he must be scummy. Also, ITP i'm intuitive, impulsive and sarcastic (i'll interject that in my personal life, that is how I act, it's a layer of emotional armor so to speak, it allows me to deal with people nicely, despite the fact that I mistrust and dislike many of them)
The recklessness of this post sharpens the disconnect between the post we discussed above and his actual personality. “Ah screw it. Here’s a pseudo-plausible reason for just going for it. I’m gonna just go for it.” In a different setting a post
like
this could be a town tell. This one doesn't feel confident though. Here, when I try to combine this post with the one immediately before it into a continuous stream of emotional and intellectual activity, I can only see it as calculated. If he had noticed the PR hinting before, then why did he go to such great lengths to tell Wake that he thought he was town? He spent a lot of time making this fine distinction between wanting someone lynched for being anti-town and wanting someone lynched for being scum (which he adamantly insisted was NOT his reason for wanting Wake lynched). If the PR hinting rubbed him the wrong way, wouldn’t there have been a little more bite before? His attitude doesn't gel when you try to connect the dots.
wait what? my "actual personality?" i thought I was an non-proofreader, reckless seat of the pants damn the torpedoes, intuition driven sarcastic dude, so how is it a disconnect? i'm calculated now? your perception of my personality is changing rather strangely
In post 159, theaceofspades wrote:Wake88 wrote:In Mafia, my gameplay is simple. In a way I'm like a mirror. If you're going to be a jerk, be disrespectful, or be a sarcastic ass, I'll make life an unholy living Hell for you. Why? Because this is a game and I come here in part for entertainment.
In truth I'm one of the calmest, most calculated, and most deliberate players in Mafia. That's not always good when playing as a Townie, because there's a lot of thought going on behind the curtains.
EDIT: Aceofspades, i suggest you look at what started this. If you won't, then I can't help you.
started "this"? what this are you referring to?
your dickness?
or your unnecessary PR hints. cause it's the latter that I'm voting for. The other stuff is personal and not related to my vote.
(well maybe a little)
In post 165, theaceofspades wrote:I have no clue why you have such a superiority complex. And right now.
I've seriously decided I don't care if you're scum or not. you're just so unhelpful that I would much rather you be gone.
Again, there’s nothing wrong with these on the surface. But why bring it up? It’s just off center somehow in tone and intent.
what do you mean why bring it up? he asked about my thoughts on him thats' what they were. He was sufficiently a hinderence that town would be helped by lynching him WHETHER OR NOT HE WAS SCUM! also, i'm calculated now? I agree that's how I do things, i tend to both over-think and over-explain, but before you said I was impulsive. Which is it? Generally in mafia I may say a bit to much, because people have a habit of jumping down your throat if you don't qualify your statements. Also, I was taught to never use all-ness statements
In post 202, theaceofspades wrote:I disagree with bob's case on me.
my opinion on wake has changed several times. simple as that. The point mainly being. I don't really don't want to vote him because he doesn't read like scum. But being distracting hurts the town a great deal, in that it gives scum more opportunity to lurk. so i'm willing to lynch him for distracting behavior unless it stops. especially since I don't have a strong scum read on anybody.
I don't like the squilly wagon. because the only bad stuff in his posts is that they are so few. which is just as likely to be an honest mistake as it is to be scummy.
Nic Cage is the only slightly scummy person that I see as of now. i'm of the opinion that he and wake both came out badly from the whole paranoia thing. i'd be willing to vote him assuming that wake makes a very convincing claim.
aptil, salmonella, and anti hero all read town to me. all else are null.
hodge and squilly are in extreme need of posts. though hodge said he'd post sometime today i believe.
assuming wake claims one of two roles i'd be very sure he is scum we'll see
P-edit. ninjad by a buttload of posts. okay PR claim......i'll accept that. a claim of VT or doctor i would have been suspicious to me.
Antihero wrote:Alright, who was the third person Al was asking me about... Wake?
Yeah, Wake's town. A gambit like that coming from scum? I don't believe that.
you're probably right having seen the claim. especially since I know I did something similar to wake's "ruse" a long time ago.
so i'll say this then
@wake. i'm okay with what you do pending the results of it. i'm a bit put out with your method. but oh well.
UNVOTE: wake
i wanna hear from nic before I vote him though.
Do you think Wake is scummy for those PR hints or not? Yeah you say your opinion has changed, but it hasn’t changed very organically. I also don’t find your later explanation of why Nic came out badly from that exchange very satisfactory. And I feel like I'm watching you calculate almost everything you write. For example, why would you bring up that wake's claim might cause you to suspect him if it's one of two roles? Aren't you worried at all that Wake might notice that and think more carefully about his choice? If I was town and I knew that there was a role Wake could claim that would be extremely suspect to me, I would want to keep my mouth shut and see if he fell into the trap. I'd be excited to spring it on him when he overstepped. But no. Instead you went with "here's a little preview for why I might suddenly start to suspect Wake again if he does this one narrowly defined thing we'll see." We'll see? I think we have, and a lot more than you'd like us to.
just because I haven't posted my every whim doesn't mean my thinking hasn't changed. Each post is a snapshot of what I think at that moment. There are no posts about suspecting aptil, i considered aptil scummy for a bit, but I changed my mind before I posted again. It's not necessary to write out all the thoughts I have since disregarded. same principle here. This isn't my diary.
Maybe that's what you'd do, but I feel it puts more pressure on someone to tell them you have definite expectations, especially if they don't know what they are, as it happens he'd already claimed, so it was moot. but the point is, be telling him he had two "bad" answers, wouldn't have made it easier for him to avoid them then if I'd kept my mouth shut, perhaps he wouldn't have claimed at all, but that seems unlikely. Instead, it would place more pressure on him, and make him more likely to slip as scum, as town he would have no pressure, because he would tell the truth either way. ( i hope, can't imagine why he'd lie as town)
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That should do for now. Please nobody try to respond to this if your name isn’t theaceofspades. If you want to critique my case for using bad logic you’re welcome to scumhunt me later. Right now we need the full extent of his reaction and defense.
